The Nuking of Nagasaki: Even More Immoral and Unnecessary than Hiroshima

[Unkotare]

What an absolute load of crap. "All the Japanese people I have spoken to" = fabricated bullshit. Pilots dropping incendiary bombs unable to BBQ because of the smell of burning flesh - as they flew by high and fast = poor fiction. Kids 'training' with bamboo spears was meant to be propaganda for domestic consumption to bolster rapidly waning public support for an obviously lost cause. That you are still swallowing propaganda that wasn't even meant for you over 70 years ago suggests you are a remarkably gullible buffoon.

YOU LYIMG PIECE of human excrement, the Japanese REFUSED to surrender I have documents to prove it, they also cut bamboo and made bamboo spears fpr the civilian population to human wave attack the invaders that is NOT propaganda they were training them to do it.

Dementia has overtaken you, Rain Man. We've been through all this several times before.

Ya and all you have are opinion pieces while I have ACTUAL Government documents.

Go review the old threads, Rain Man.

 

[Unkotare]

The Japanese were crazy back in the day.

The A bomb droppings cured them of that affliction.

You NEED to believe that.

 

[Taz]

Fuckng nips sneak attacked us, we should have nuked their whole worthless country.

 

[sparky]

Pearl was inevitable , the OSS (former CIA) was all over having FDR ignore it as a prelude to WW2

~S~

 

[RetiredGySgt]

What an absolute load of crap. "All the Japanese people I have spoken to" = fabricated bullshit. Pilots dropping incendiary bombs unable to BBQ because of the smell of burning flesh - as they flew by high and fast = poor fiction. Kids 'training' with bamboo spears was meant to be propaganda for domestic consumption to bolster rapidly waning public support for an obviously lost cause. That you are still swallowing propaganda that wasn't even meant for you over 70 years ago suggests you are a remarkably gullible buffoon.

YOU LYIMG PIECE of human excrement, the Japanese REFUSED to surrender I have documents to prove it, they also cut bamboo and made bamboo spears fpr the civilian population to human wave attack the invaders that is NOT propaganda they were training them to do it.

Dementia has overtaken you, Rain Man. We've been through all this several times before.

Ya and all you have are opinion pieces while I have ACTUAL Government documents.

Go review the old threads, Rain Man.

I don't need to I was in them, you have NEVER linked to an official source just memoirs with no actual facts and opinion pieces. Try actually linking to Official documents LIKE I HAVE.

 

[sparky]

James Byrnes and the Atomic Bombing of Japan

https://www.history.com/news/macarthur-vs-truman-the-showdown-that-changed-america

Truman’s decision not only ended MacArthur’s military career, it ended the president’s political career as well, setting the stage for the subsequent presidency of Dwight Eisenhower. In the first 24 hours after the president’s announcement, the White House received more than 5,000 telegrams—three-quarters of them backing the popular MacArthur, who had been named the greatest living American in a 1946 poll. “In the wake of the firing, Truman’s popular approval rating set a record not matched before or ever since—22 percent—lower even than Nixon’s at the depth of the Watergate scandal,” Brands says. After what the historian calls “political suicide,” Truman did not even pursue his party’s nomination in 1952.

~S~

 

[Unkotare]

What an absolute load of crap. "All the Japanese people I have spoken to" = fabricated bullshit. Pilots dropping incendiary bombs unable to BBQ because of the smell of burning flesh - as they flew by high and fast = poor fiction. Kids 'training' with bamboo spears was meant to be propaganda for domestic consumption to bolster rapidly waning public support for an obviously lost cause. That you are still swallowing propaganda that wasn't even meant for you over 70 years ago suggests you are a remarkably gullible buffoon.

YOU LYIMG PIECE of human excrement, the Japanese REFUSED to surrender I have documents to prove it, they also cut bamboo and made bamboo spears fpr the civilian population to human wave attack the invaders that is NOT propaganda they were training them to do it.

Dementia has overtaken you, Rain Man. We've been through all this several times before.

Ya and all you have are opinion pieces while I have ACTUAL Government documents.

Go review the old threads, Rain Man.

I don't need to I was in them....

= you know you're full of shit, you doddering old fool.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

YOU LYIMG PIECE of human excrement, the Japanese REFUSED to surrender I have documents to prove it, they also cut bamboo and made bamboo spears fpr the civilian population to human wave attack the invaders that is NOT propaganda they were training them to do it.

Dementia has overtaken you, Rain Man. We've been through all this several times before.

Ya and all you have are opinion pieces while I have ACTUAL Government documents.

Go review the old threads, Rain Man.

I don't need to I was in them....

= you know you're full of shit, you doddering old fool.

Really? Prove me wrong.

 

[whitehall]

It's interesting to note that the Bushido crazies holding out in a bunker in Tokyo could have been taken out easily with the nuclear option but the insane strategy at the time was to keep incinerating civilians until the crazies gave up. We wouldn't dream of such a concept today but somehow we tend to justify it in the (not so) distant past because democrats were in charge and democrats wrote the history books.

 

[mikegriffith1]

Anyone who does any serious, balanced reading on the Pacific War will learn the following facts:

* Most of Japan's leaders, military and civilian, did not want war with the U.S.

* Japan's leaders offered very reasonable concessions to try to get FDR to lift his draconian sanctions, which were crippling Japan's economy.

* The majority of Japan's leaders opposed the hardliners in the Army, but the hardliners were a powerful faction in the government that was sometimes beyond the immediate control of the government.

* Even some of the hardliners did not want war with the U.S. They, like many others in the government, wanted to invade Russia or to focus on French Indochina and the Dutch East Indies.

* At every turn, FDR aided the hardliners and impeded the moderates in the year leading up to Pearl Harbor.

* Similarly, at every turn, Truman aided the hardliners and impeded the moderates in the months leading up to Hiroshima.

* The Soviets were thrilled when the U.S. and Japan went to war. When Stalin was assured that Japan would not attack Russia, he was able to move hundreds of thousands of troops from his eastern front just in time to halt the German advance on his western front.

* The Soviets did not want Japan to surrender to the U.S. until Soviet forces were able to attack the Japanese army in Manchuria.

* Whether because of incompetence, and/or anti-Japanese bias, and/or the influence of the numerous Soviet spies and sympathizers in their administrations, FDR and Truman carried out Soviet aims in Japanese-American relations in the months leading up to Pearl Harbor and in the months leading up to Hiroshima.

* The Soviets were able to gather sufficient forces and equipment to invade Japan's northern and central Kuril Islands, in addition to invading Manchuria, thanks to Truman's stalling on the Japanese surrender. If the Soviets had not met such fierce resistance in their assaults on the Kuriles, such as at the Battle of Shumshu, they might have followed through with their plans to invade Hokkaido, one of Japan's four main home islands. According to some sources, the Soviets were about to carry out their planned invasion of Hokkaido when Truman suddenly awoke from his stupor and realized what a blunder it had been to stall the Japanese surrender so the Soviets could join the war against Japan. Eisenhower had warned Truman against involving the Soviets, and, supposedly, Truman warned the Soviets not to land on Hokkaido. That's one version. Another version is that the heavy losses the Soviets incurred at Shumshu persuaded them to focus on the Kuril Islands and to abandon their plans to invade Hokkaido. It might have been a combination of both.

* Truman and his inner circle knew from Japanese intercepts that Japan's civilian leaders, including the emperor, wanted to surrender, and that the only real sticking point was the emperor's status in a surrender. Numerous military and civilian officials told Truman that if he would just assure the Japanese that the emperor would not be deposed, they would surrender on acceptable terms.

* Japanese rule in Korea, Taiwan, and Manchuria, though not up to Western standards, was certainly better than Soviet rule, Chinese Communist rule, and Nazi rule. Anyone with adequate knowledge on this subject who had to choose to live in one of the above areas would choose to live under Japanese rule in a heartbeat, hands down.

 

[Unkotare]

Kids 'training' with bamboo spears was meant to be propaganda for domestic consumption to bolster rapidly waning public support for an obviously lost cause. That you are still swallowing propaganda that wasn't even meant for you over 70 years ago suggests you are a remarkably gullible buffoon.

 

[JoeB131]

And neither is an 11 year old with a vest, nonetheless as we see in Afghanistan and Iraq peace is unobtainable.

Different time. But never mind.

You don't kill another batch of tens of thousands of civilians of an enemy who you know wants to surrender and who is virtually defenseless and starving. That is just basic human decency, and it is sad that you can't grasp that.

again, you are applying modern sensitivities to people back then. After Pearl Harbor and 4 years of people being subjected to propaganda like THIS

Nobody was particularly concerned about the Japanese 'humanity".

Again, read Hildi Kang's book Under the Black Umbrella: Voices from Colonial Korea, 1910–1945. k.

I don't waste my time on shit. The Japanese were bastards during World War II.

 

[JoeB131]

* Japanese rule in Korea, Taiwan, and Manchuria, though not up to Western standards, was certainly better than Soviet rule, Chinese Communist rule, and Nazi rule. Anyone with adequate knowledge on this subject who had to choose to live in one of the above areas would choose to live under Japanese rule in a heartbeat, hands down.

If that were the case, then why did so many Chinese fight so hard against the Japanese, but amazingly, the Communists are still in power.

Enough with the Fascist Propaganda. We get it. Like most Trumpkins, you are still sorry the Axis lost the war.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Does it HURT to be that stupid, Joey?

 

[Ernie S.]

Unfortunately, yes. We had to inflict massive casualties in order to break their will to fight

Um, no, they were already willing to surrender. We just refused to let them do it on their terms until Russia entered the war and we realized we might have to share the spoils of war.

Um no. Russia entering surely would have crippled them further militarily, but it would have solidified their resolve to fight on. What the bombs did was to prove that continuing meant the complete and utter destruction of Japan. It demoralized them.
THAT is how you win a war. You can beat them on the battle field all you want, but patriots will join the fight until the last man. You must completely demoralize an enemy to win a war. We did that in Japan, and we have decent relations with them. We refused to destry the will of the people in Korea, Viet Nam, Afghanistan and Iraq. How'd THAT work out for us?
Screw what the world thinks of us. If we have to go to war, we can't be afraid to win.
We will never make all countries like us, no matter how much foreign aid we give or how many concessions we make. We may, however, be able to make them respect us, or failing that, FEAR us.

 

[Picaro]

lol another retarded Pity Party for vile murdering Japs. lol I guess next we get to hear about 'The Misunderstood Jeffery Dauhmer: Philantropist and Research Physician".

 

[Picaro]

Does it HURT to be that stupid, Joey?

Mexican meth is a curse.

 

[JoeB131]

Um no. Russia entering surely would have crippled them further militarily, but it would have solidified their resolve to fight on. What the bombs did was to prove that continuing meant the complete and utter destruction of Japan. It demoralized them.

NO, the bombs proved we could bomb their cities... Russia in the war meant they weren't going to get a favorable peace treaty.

That's why they surrendered. Very little to do with the bombs, we had been bombing them for months.

THAT is how you win a war. You can beat them on the battle field all you want, but patriots will join the fight until the last man. You must completely demoralize an enemy to win a war. We did that in Japan, and we have decent relations with them. We refused to destry the will of the people in Korea, Viet Nam, Afghanistan and Iraq. How'd THAT work out for us?

Actually, what we had in World War II was other people doing m ost of the fighting and dying. Americans just don't have the stomach for War.. particularly wars against people who weren't bothering us to start with

Did you sign up for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq? Didn't think so.

Screw what the world thinks of us. If we have to go to war, we can't be afraid to win.
We will never make all countries like us, no matter how much foreign aid we give or how many concessions we make. We may, however, be able to make them respect us, or failing that, FEAR us.

Or we could learn to mind our own fucking business... that would work, too.

You see, here's my thought. We have a universal draft. Not only do the children of the rich get NO EXEMPTIONS like they did in Korea and Vietnam (but not WWII) but we put them all in an elite airborne unit that will be the first deployed to any war zone.

Bet you the rich who run this country will suddenly discover how much they LOVE, LOVE, LOVE peace when their kids are the ones coming home in the body bags.

 

[sparky]

Ya and all you have are opinion pieces while I have ACTUAL Government documents.

But not from ACTUAL top military>>>

The War Was Won Before Hiroshima—And the Generals Who Dropped the Bomb Knew It

Adm. William Leahy, President Truman’s Chief of Staff, wrote in his 1950 memoir I Was There that “the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender.… in being the first to use it, we…adopted an ethical standard common to the barbarians of the Dark Ages. I was not taught to make war in that fashion, and wars cannot be won by destroying women and children.”

&&&

The commanding general of the US Army Air Forces, Henry “Hap” Arnold, gave a strong indication of his views in a public statement only eleven days after Hiroshima was attacked. Asked on August 17 by a New York Timesreporter whether the atomic bomb caused Japan to surrender, Arnold said that “the Japanese position was hopeless even before the first atomic bomb fell, because the Japanese had lost control of their own air.

&&&
Adm. William “Bull” Halsey Jr., Commander of the US Third Fleet, stated publicly in 1946 that “the first atomic bomb was an unnecessary experiment…. It was a mistake to ever drop it…. [the scientists] had this toy and they wanted to try it out, so they dropped it…”




&&&

Fleet Adm. Chester Nimitz, Commander in Chief of the Pacific Fleet, stated in a public address at the Washington Monument two months after the bombings that “the atomic bomb played no decisive part, from a purely military standpoint, in the defeat of Japan…”


&&&


Gen. Dwight Eisenhower, for his part, stated in his memoirs that when notified by Secretary of War Henry Stimson of the decision to use atomic weapons, he “voiced to him my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives…” He later publicly declared “…it wasn’t necessary to hit them with that awful thing.”

&&&


Even the famous “hawk” Maj. Gen. Curtis LeMay, head of the Twenty-First Bomber Command, went public the month after the bombing, telling the press that “the atomic bomb had nothing to do with the end of the war at all.



~S~

 

[elektra]

The person you are trying to convince is yourself.

View attachment 273942
Convince you of a fact, I would have more luck trying to convince the neighbor's cat. Some discussions are only for the intelligent.

You took a pic of some books. That is just so sad.

Not as sad at your frustration for not being able to burn them.

I have many facts. If you actually engaged in discussion you would find anything you cut/paste from the internet I have the book the cherry picked internet quote came from. If I dont have the book I will buy it.

Google, it is only through the control of information, the censorship, the propaganda, and or fake news that Democrats retain power.

Here a user shames another for using anything other than the Google which controls the results to dictate what we are to beleive.