The Official Zimmerman Trial Verdict Thread

[RKMBrown]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

Oddly the appropriate response is to pummel back. Then when the fight is over shake hands. That's the way we used to do it.

 

[RKMBrown]

For all we know, TM did get what he deserved. My belief is that he initiated a fight and was very violently beating GZ. And a man doesn't scream like that if he's not in some serious danger.

If GZ was a man... I don't think we'd be talking about this.

And how are you defining "man" in this context?

In this context, I'm defining man as a person that would not have had to kill the teen to disengage in the fight with the teen.

 

[RKMBrown]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

I believe he's subscribing to the lowbrow notion that a "man" is a violent thug who beats people bloody, rather than using a gun to defend himself. In this particular calculation, Trayvon Martin, as portrayed by the defense counsel, would be a "real man", rather than the trashy, uncivilized brute most civilized people would view that portrayal to be.

No. Beating on GZ was not a manly act either. No honor in beating on a person who won't fight back.

 

[KissMy]

If GZ was a man... I don't think we'd be talking about this.

And how are you defining "man" in this context?

In this context, I'm defining man as a person that would not have had to kill the teen to disengage in the fight with the teen.

What should a "man" do to disengage a fight with the teen????

 

[KissMy]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

I believe he's subscribing to the lowbrow notion that a "man" is a violent thug who beats people bloody, rather than using a gun to defend himself. In this particular calculation, Trayvon Martin, as portrayed by the defense counsel, would be a "real man", rather than the trashy, uncivilized brute most civilized people would view that portrayal to be.

No. Beating on GZ was not a manly act either. No honor in beating on a person who won't fight back.

So GZ should be punished more because TM did an unhonorable unmanly unlawful beating of GZ???

 

[Cecilie1200]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

Oddly the appropriate response is to pummel back. Then when the fight is over shake hands. That's the way we used to do it.

That sort of asinine "cracker culture" is EXACTLY why Trayvon and other teens/young men are nasty thugs these days. Congratulations on being part of the problem instead of part of the solution.

 

[Cecilie1200]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

I believe he's subscribing to the lowbrow notion that a "man" is a violent thug who beats people bloody, rather than using a gun to defend himself. In this particular calculation, Trayvon Martin, as portrayed by the defense counsel, would be a "real man", rather than the trashy, uncivilized brute most civilized people would view that portrayal to be.

No. Beating on GZ was not a manly act either. No honor in beating on a person who won't fight back.

Which implies that there is some occasion when you believe there IS honor is beating on a person.

 

[RKMBrown]

And how are you defining "man" in this context?

In this context, I'm defining man as a person that would not have had to kill the teen to disengage in the fight with the teen.

What should a "man" do to disengage a fight with the teen????

First, he should have some training in fighting, so that when he's in a fight he does not have to kill someone to defend himself. If he has no training... stay in the truck. Went out anyway? ok just push him off. Tell him the cops are on the way.. and walk away. He had the ability to scoot them to the sidewalk then off again but not the ability to disengage? I can think of dozens of ways. Elbow, knee or fist to the groin. Thumb to the eye socket. There's a good spot just above the clavical that you can press your thumb on and move him back. There's acting like a crazy guy. All he had to do was stay disengaged for a couple min the cops were on the way.

 

[Gracie]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

Oddly the appropriate response is to pummel back. Then when the fight is over shake hands. That's the way we used to do it.

Ah man...that world is long gone, unfortunately. Still...if someone is pummeling me and I am trying to pummel back but I am getting light headed from my head being pounded and I don't know this guys intentions on when or even IF he stops AFTER I pass out..you can bet your butt if I have a gun on me, I am going to use it.

 

[25Caliber]

I believe he's subscribing to the lowbrow notion that a "man" is a violent thug who beats people bloody, rather than using a gun to defend himself. In this particular calculation, Trayvon Martin, as portrayed by the defense counsel, would be a "real man", rather than the trashy, uncivilized brute most civilized people would view that portrayal to be.

No. Beating on GZ was not a manly act either. No honor in beating on a person who won't fight back.

So GZ should be punished more because TM did an unhonorable unmanly unlawful beating of GZ???

It depends on your definition of the word "unhonorable". If trayvon is kicking a guys butt that is trying to pull a gun on him then I would call that self defense in an honorable way.

I know I know, GZ doesnt say it happened that way, but if Trayvon were here..he would and he would use GZs own words to do it.

He would say I punched him because i thought he was going for a weapon and then I continued to punch him because he kept going for it on his hip when he was on the ground...

GZ would have a tuff time defending that based on his own words in tapes where he describes reaching just before being punched and then again when the gun is exposed during the struggle on the ground....thats the way Trayvon would put it if he were able to and the jury would put 2 and 2 together pretty quick...hmmmm. 1) Stange man following in the dark, 2) when asked why? 3) he reached for a phone that wasnt there, 4) got hit, and 5)continued to get hit when he went for the gun...6) eventually the kid wasnt able to keep him from getting the gun and the adult grabbed and without warning shot him in the chest. The adult never identified himself, and never defused the situation earlier knowing full well this was a teen...he said so to the 911 dispatch.

The jury could ponder that...and then couple that with the kid (minor) being followed by a stranger in the dark and rain and you can at least see how maybe one juror might agree with him. I would bet all. Illegal use of a firearm...how many years for that?

 

[RKMBrown]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

Oddly the appropriate response is to pummel back. Then when the fight is over shake hands. That's the way we used to do it.

That sort of asinine "cracker culture" is EXACTLY why Trayvon and other teens/young men are nasty thugs these days. Congratulations on being part of the problem instead of part of the solution.

This one time... a teen was getting verbally picked on by a group of teens on a HS school bus. Not by me. The teen decides to start a fight with someone and choose me. I ducked his punches, he charged, I pulled his head down put him in a headlock and pinned him. Let him get the fight out... shook his hand afterwards and told him I hadn't been one of the guys picking on him but it was a good fight and if anyone did pick on him again they would have to fight me too. No one picked on him again.

 

[MeBelle]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

Oddly the appropriate response is to pummel back. Then when the fight is over shake hands. That's the way we used to do it.

This is very interesting.

They pummel each other equally with the same amount of wounds that GZ shows in the photos, right after the fight.

After they are done they shake hands.

Trayvon goes home. His Father sees him all messed up.

What would Mr Martin do at this time?

Tell you what I would do.

I'd call the police about the adult that beat up my minor.

Assault of a minor.

 

[RKMBrown]

I believe he's subscribing to the lowbrow notion that a "man" is a violent thug who beats people bloody, rather than using a gun to defend himself. In this particular calculation, Trayvon Martin, as portrayed by the defense counsel, would be a "real man", rather than the trashy, uncivilized brute most civilized people would view that portrayal to be.

No. Beating on GZ was not a manly act either. No honor in beating on a person who won't fight back.

Which implies that there is some occasion when you believe there IS honor is beating on a person.

Yes ma'am. I used to wrestle in HS and Col, played a lot of football, and also was into Judo. There can be honor in a fair fight. For you that might be nerf bats? I also hunt game.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Oddly the appropriate response is to pummel back. Then when the fight is over shake hands. That's the way we used to do it.

That sort of asinine "cracker culture" is EXACTLY why Trayvon and other teens/young men are nasty thugs these days. Congratulations on being part of the problem instead of part of the solution.

This one time... a teen was getting verbally picked on by a group of teens on a HS school bus. Not by me. The teen decides to start a fight with someone and choose me. I ducked his punches, he charged, I pulled his head down put him in a headlock and pinned him. Let him get the fight out... shook his hand afterwards and told him I hadn't been one of the guys picking on him but it was a good fight and if anyone did pick on him again they would have to fight me too. No one picked on him again.

I'm sorry. Was this supposed to somehow impress me, rather than making me look at you with the intense disdain of a civilized person in the presence of a Neanderthal?

 

[Cecilie1200]

No. Beating on GZ was not a manly act either. No honor in beating on a person who won't fight back.

Which implies that there is some occasion when you believe there IS honor is beating on a person.

Yes ma'am. I used to wrestle in HS and Col, played a lot of football, and also was into Judo. There can be honor in a fair fight. For you that might be nerf bats? I also hunt game.

Sorry about your tiny penis.

 

[Gracie]

I see guys beating on each other all the time. But in a ring. Still..what is the difference? They are beating each other up for sport. Some beat others up because they are bullies. Most wind up getting killed if they pick the wrong victim.

 

[RKMBrown]

You mean a man should lay there and get pummeled?

Oddly the appropriate response is to pummel back. Then when the fight is over shake hands. That's the way we used to do it.

Ah man...that world is long gone, unfortunately. Still...if someone is pummeling me and I am trying to pummel back but I am getting light headed from my head being pounded and I don't know this guys intentions on when or even IF he stops AFTER I pass out..you can bet your butt if I have a gun on me, I am going to use it.

Understood. This is sexist but, I'd be applauding you for shooting this teen and would not have expected you to be able to fight the teen football player off. More particularly I'd be in a Rage over what the teen did.

 

[RKMBrown]

That sort of asinine "cracker culture" is EXACTLY why Trayvon and other teens/young men are nasty thugs these days. Congratulations on being part of the problem instead of part of the solution.

This one time... a teen was getting verbally picked on by a group of teens on a HS school bus. Not by me. The teen decides to start a fight with someone and choose me. I ducked his punches, he charged, I pulled his head down put him in a headlock and pinned him. Let him get the fight out... shook his hand afterwards and told him I hadn't been one of the guys picking on him but it was a good fight and if anyone did pick on him again they would have to fight me too. No one picked on him again.

I'm sorry. Was this supposed to somehow impress me, rather than making me look at you with the intense disdain of a civilized person in the presence of a Neanderthal?

I see, so I should have let him beat on me and shot and killed him rather than put him in a head lock.

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

Question for TM advocates:

If it could be shown that GZ did not stalk TM and that he did not initiate the physical conflict, would you still want GZ convicted?

 

[jon_berzerk]

this thread has drifted into the surreal --LOL