The Qur'an is the word of God Almighty

[AVG-JOE]

Ignoring nonsense is easy........

​

It sure makes putting the ancient religious stories in to proper perspective a whole lot easier.

 

[Sunni Man]

sura 71.16 And has made the Moon a light therein, and made the Sun a lamp.
These verses show Muhammad calls the Moon a light, which makes clear he did not know it was reflecting the Suns light. He clearly regards the Sun and Moon as separate sources of light, one for the day and the other for night.

You really need to step back and read what the Surah actually says.

It calls the Sun a "lamp", meaning that it has its own source of self generated illumination.

And only refers to the moon as a "light", which could mean many things, including reflection.

Heck, in the english language we refer to "walking in the moon light" or being able to "read a book by the moon light". ......

 

[Dajjal]

Some words from God Almighty (the Qur'an):


"Blessed is He Who made constellations in the skies, and placed therein a Lamp and a Moon giving light"

"Nay, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers."

''We made from water every living thing."

It is believed in Islam that all the sciences originate fom the Qur'an. One who is accustomed to read from it and ponder on its meanings will be able to derive from it all that he wants.

Wait a minute, you said in another thread that you need the saints of Islam to interpret the Quran for you, and you should not read it for yourself.

 

[Hollie]

Some words from God Almighty (the Qur'an):


"Blessed is He Who made constellations in the skies, and placed therein a Lamp and a Moon giving light"

"Nay, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers."

''We made from water every living thing."

I speak as someone who is correcting you.

Claiming that you're "quoting" gawd almighty is really dishonest.

In terms of what Uthman eventually cobbled together which eventually became a book called the Koran, we need to understand that Uthman's Koran was entirely a book written by men. I understand your worship of the Koran doesn't allow you a truly objective approach, but you shouldn't presume that others will unquestioningly accept your claims.

Excepting islamist dogma, we have nothing to connect the koran with authorship from anyone except a mere mortal: Uthman. Now this is an obvious problem for you since we know that the author of the koran sutured together material from many sources and did so long after the death of the religions’ inventor. What we don’t know is what was contained in the material excluded from Uthmans’ Koran.

The Qur'an existed before eternity, before creation, it is the uncreated word of Allah Almighty (God Almighty). God revealed to Muhammad step by step, as events occured in his life. When the first revelation came to him, he was 40, peace be upon him and his family. The Qur'an was revealed to him during a timespan of 23 years. It was the Archangel Gabriel who was in charge of bringing the revelation to Muhammad, at each time. Then it was only after Muhammad's death that the Qur'an was assembled and put together to form one single book. It was during the rules of Abu Bakr and Uthman. Both of them were, like Muhammad and all his Companions, holy and heavenly.

I speak as an Infidel.

Nonsense. Islamism began with Muhammud in the 7th century AD. There was no such religion prior to his invention of it. Every other religion that has had a significant following has left both archeological and documentary affirmation of its existence that can be traced to within plus or minus a couple of centuries of its origin. Islam’s apologists are the only one’s making the claim that the faith “was always here”. It’s a shame that your vacuous claim is absent any evidence supportive of your claim. The fact is, there is no evidence at all for Islam's existence prior to it’s invention by Muhammad.

The other Abrahamic faiths existed prior to Muhammud. But Islam clearly did not. The point is that there is no Islam without the religions inventor: Muhammud. He formulated the elements and selected those features it would steal from Christianity, Judaism and Arab culture. One only has to look at his life and cultural examples to see the unique components that are features of the politico-religious ideology. He is the only source for the compilation of writings that were eventually assembled into a “koran”. Without Muhammud, Islam would have remained was it originally was. An obscure sect practiced only by a small number of Arab tribesmen. Before Muhammud, there was no such thing as Islam. This is demonstrated by documentary evidence and historical record.

 

[Dajjal]

The Qur'an existed before eternity, before creation, it is the uncreated word of Allah Almighty (God Almighty). God revealed to Muhammad step by step, as events occured in his life. When the first revelation came to him, he was 40, peace be upon him and his family. The Qur'an was revealed to him during a timespan of 23 years. It was the Archangel Gabriel who was in charge of bringing the revelation to Muhammad, at each time. Then it was only after Muhammad's death that the Qur'an was assembled and put together to form one single book. It was during the rules of Abu Bakr and Uthman. Both of them were, like Muhammad and all his Companions, holy and heavenly.

Contrary wise I think I have already give evidence that the Quran is largely copied from the bible. Here is another piece I wrote on the subject.

Muslims are fond of saying that the quran is a miracle, because it was dictated by an illiterate Arab who had no access to the bible. Therefore it must have come from God. The quran itself even says it must be from God, Because it confirms all the previous messages. But how would Muhammad know that if he had never heard the bible.
In fact there is a hadith in which Muhammad sends for the Torah to have it read to him, to decide the fate of a Jew and Jewess for committing adultery, and because the Torah says the punishment is stoning Muhammad had them stoned. This proves he knew the bible well.
Here are three verses in the quran that mention the psalms of the bible by name.

004.163 We have sent thee inspiration, as We sent it to Noah and the Messengers after him: we sent inspiration to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob and the Tribes, to Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and solomon, and to David We gave the Psalms.
017.055 And it is your Lord that knoweth best all beings that are in the heavens and on earth: We did bestow on some prophets more (and other) gifts than on others: and We gave to David (the gift of) the Psalms.
021.105 Before this We wrote in the Psalms, after the Message (given to Moses): My servants the righteous, shall inherit the earth."
In any case the quran mentions the Torah, or the books of Moses and Abraham at many verses; Here are some references.
sura 3.48 sura 4.54 sura 11.17 sura 11.110 sura 19.41 sura 17.2 sura 17.4 sura 23.49 sura 25.35 sura 40.53 sura 41.45 sura 45.16 sura 46.12 sura 53.36 sura 87.19 sura 28.2 sura 32.2 sura

The Greek bible was readily available long before Muhammad's time, and it is well know that Muslim raiders took many manuscripts along with other plunder.
What is even more obvious is that the greater part of the quran quotes bible story after bible story, and many of these quotes are about Jewish old Testament myths that are obviously no part of real history, and their source can only be Jewish scribes that invented them to promote their own agenda.
There has been much work done on bible criticism, and some of it to show that the story of Noah's ark, and Jonah and the whale, and Adam and Eve, and the drowning of Pharaohs army, and such stories, have no foundation in reality. But the quran claims them all as a previous message from God.

 

[Hollie]

sura 71.16 And has made the Moon a light therein, and made the Sun a lamp.
These verses show Muhammad calls the Moon a light, which makes clear he did not know it was reflecting the Suns light. He clearly regards the Sun and Moon as separate sources of light, one for the day and the other for night.

You really need to step back and read what the Surah actually says.

It calls the Sun a "lamp", meaning that it has its own source of self generated illumination.

And only refers to the moon as a "light", which could mean many things, including reflection.

Heck, in the english language we refer to "walking in the moon light" or being able to "read a book by the moon light". ......

You Koran thumping converts are a hoot. Uthman's Koran is so full of nonsense regarding the natural world, only you desperate convert wannabe's would attempt to support it.

Let's examine the muhammudan "universe", shall we?

The Arabic word sama’ refers not to the “universe” (of which the Qur’an betrays no knowledge whatsoever) but to one or more of seven solid domes that Muhammad believed sheltered the Earth below.

Al Qur’an 002.029
"It is He Who hath created for you all things that are on earth; Moreover His design comprehended the heavens, for He gave order and perfection to the seven firmaments; and of all things He hath perfect knowledge."

Al Qur’an 041.012
"So He completed them as seven firmaments in two Days, and He assigned to each heaven its duty and command."
These seven heavens are solid objects; this can be shown in several ways. For starters, they stand as barriers that both protect (as does a roof) and contain.

The protective nature of this roof is shown in verses such as:
Al Qur’an 021.032
"And We have made the heavens as a canopy well guarded: yet do they turn away from the Signs which these things (point to)!"

And the fact that they are solid is also shown by references to pieces of the heavens falling and potentially injuring residents of the earth.
Al-Qur’an 034.009

"See they not what is before them and behind them, of the sky and the earth? If We wished, We could cause the earth to swallow them up, or cause a piece of the sky to fall upon them. Verily in this is a Sign for every devotee that turns to Allah (in repentance)."

In fact, they are so substantial that it is even conceivable to climb up onto them using a ladder.
Al Qur’an 006.035

"If their spurning is hard on thy mind, yet if thou wert able to seek a tunnel in the ground or a ladder to the skies and bring them a sign,- (what good?)."
And finally, the heavens are apparently heavy enough to require physical supports of some sort. Contrary to some Muslim claims, the Qur’an acknowledges that such supports are required, but also explains that they are invisible.
Al Qur’an 013.002

"Allah is He Who raised the heavens without any pillars that ye can see; is firmly established on the throne (of authority); He has subjected the sun and the moon (to his Law)! Each one runs (its course) for a term appointed. He doth regulate all affairs, explaining the signs in detail, that ye may believe with certainty in the meeting with your Lord."

The authors here take it as obvious that the heavens require support of some kind. But their emphasis is on their invisibility, not their actual absence.

To further expound on the nature of the seven heavens, we need additional help from the hadith. Here we learn the distances between each heaven, as well as what is on the other side of the furthermost.
Sunan Abu ADawud Book 40, Number 4705:

Narrated Al-Abbas ibn AbdulMuttalib:

"I was sitting in al-Batha with a company among whom the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) was sitting, when a cloud passed above them.
The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) looked at it and said: What do you call this?

They said: Sahab.

He said: And muzn? They said: And muzn. He said: And anan? They said: And anan. AbuDawud said: I am not quite confident about the word anan. He asked: Do you know the distance between Heaven and Earth? They replied: We do not know. He then said: The distance between them is seventy-one, seventy-two, or seventy-three years. The heaven which is above it is at a similar distance (going on till he counted seven heavens). Above the seventh heaven there is a sea, the distance between whose surface and bottom is like that between one heaven and the next. Above that there are eight mountain goats the distance between whose hoofs and haunches is like the distance between one heaven and the next. Then Allah, the Blessed and the Exalted, is above that."

Ignoring the giant mountain goats which are never mentioned in the Qur’an itself, the outermost heaven lies beneath a sea that is as deep as the distances between adjacent heavens. That Allah’s “throne” is above such waters is mentioned in the Qur’an as well as the hadith.
Al Qur’an 011.007

"He it is Who created the heavens and the earth in six Days - and His Throne was over the waters - that He might try you, which of you is best in conduct. But if thou wert to say to them, 'Ye shall indeed be raised up after death', the Unbelievers would be sure to say, 'This is nothing but obvious sorcery!'"
There are however no mentions of galaxies, quasars, galaxy clusters or empty space. Simply water, a throne, and Allah himself.

Additional details concerning the individual heavens are found in the accounts of Muhammad’s “night journey.” Rather than quoting at length, readers are referred to Sahih Bukhari Volume 9, Book 93, Number 608 for the long version. But here are the key points.

Each of the seven heavens is populated by multiple angels and a few other folks as well. These heavens are entered through doors in the solid domes, each with an angelic guard and each populated by a resident prophet. For example, immediately above the dome of the first heaven is where Muhammad met Adam, and discovered (in the absence of true geographic knowledge) the sources of the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. The second heaven is the home of the Prophet Idris. Aaron is in the fourth heaven, Abraham the sixth, and Moses the seventh.

So, what can we conclude?

When the koran mentions the “heavens” it is not referring to the universe, or to outer space. It is referring to the solid domes of the “firmament” that Muhammud believed covered the earth.

And what shape was the earth?

 

[Dajjal]

What the Quran really says the earth is flat and the sun orbits it in a semi circle, the sun is then reset at dawn under the earth. See verse 36.38 and the hadith Bukhari vol4, book 54, no 421

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Some words from God Almighty (the Qur'an):


"Blessed is He Who made constellations in the skies, and placed therein a Lamp and a Moon giving light"

"Nay, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers."

''We made from water every living thing."

I speak as someone who is correcting you.

Claiming that you're "quoting" gawd almighty is really dishonest.

In terms of what Uthman eventually cobbled together which eventually became a book called the Koran, we need to understand that Uthman's Koran was entirely a book written by men. I understand your worship of the Koran doesn't allow you a truly objective approach, but you shouldn't presume that others will unquestioningly accept your claims.

Excepting islamist dogma, we have nothing to connect the koran with authorship from anyone except a mere mortal: Uthman. Now this is an obvious problem for you since we know that the author of the koran sutured together material from many sources and did so long after the death of the religions’ inventor. What we don’t know is what was contained in the material excluded from Uthmans’ Koran.

The Qur'an existed before eternity, before creation, it is the uncreated word of Allah Almighty (God Almighty). God revealed to Muhammad step by step, as events occured in his life. When the first revelation came to him, he was 40, peace be upon him and his family. The Qur'an was revealed to him during a timespan of 23 years. It was the Archangel Gabriel who was in charge of bringing the revelation to Muhammad, at each time. Then it was only after Muhammad's death that the Qur'an was assembled and put together to form one single book. It was during the rules of Abu Bakr and Uthman. Both of them were, like Muhammad and all his Companions, holy and heavenly.

^LOL.

God never revealed anything to the pedophile Mohamud. That degenerate madman heard voices in his filthy head and other simpletons accepted his inconsistent raving lunacy as the revealed word of God.

If the Creator of the Universe had shared Holy insights with Mohamud via an archangel, there wouldn't be so many inconsistencies and mistakes in the qu'ran.

It is an absurd fairy tale with a lot of bile and filth buttressing it.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Islam is a godless cult. It is a political tyranny posing as a religion; Islam is the manifestation of pure, unadulterated EVIL!

Now... here's a clue: Look at the map and isolate the regions where Islam has been prevalent the LONGEST...

Don't know?

I'll make it easier for ya... Find the largest DESERTS ON EARTH... the places where its HARDEST TO FIND FOOD... Where WAR IS CHRONIC. And you can rest assured that you're looking at a place controlled by ISLAM!

If it's a pile of shit, odds are a Muslim is on and/or in it.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Two of the prettiest women I see on a regular basis are Muslims. They are pretty well Westernized. Some fundamentalist jihadists would either veil them up or stone them, no doubt, were they living in some poor Islamic controlled nation. But they aren't. They live in the American Constitutional Republic with our cherished Freedom of Religion.

I have known many Muslims. Most are perfectly nice, agreeable, solid folks. I have no problem acknowledging them as friends and colleagues. I have less than nothing against Muslims. I loathe the hideous "faith" we call "Islam."

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Two of the prettiest women I see on a regular basis are Muslims. They are pretty well Westernized. Some fundamentalist jihadists would either veil them up or stone them, no doubt, were they living in some poor Islamic controlled nation. But they aren't. They live in the American Constitutional Republic with our cherished Freedom of Religion.

I have known many Muslims. Most are perfectly nice, agreeable, solid folks. I have no problem acknowledging them as friends and colleagues. I have less than nothing against Muslims. I loathe the hideous "faith" we call "Islam."

Islam is Evil. The Muslim is, therefore, the personification of evil. One cannot separate the Evil of one's ideas, from the evil of those who carry the idea.

I've known some 'nice' "Liberals"... that doesn't mean that I tolerate them or allow them into my home, or that I will do business with them, where such can be avoided.

They're evil and their existence on this planet is no difference than the existence of any other infectious disease.

To tolerate it, is tantamount to suicide.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Meh. Islam is a dopey religion. It is largely founded upon nearly psychotic notions and violence and bigotry. I have no use for it. But if a woman or a man happened to have been born into a Muslim family and raised as a Muslim, then they are likely to remain Muslims. Maybe some of them adapt and accept the parts of Islam that aren't utterly vile.

But it ridiculous to reject anybody merely on the basis of having been born a Muslim.

Muslims are not the problem. The jihadist version of Islam which incorporates all the crazier, more vile, murderous, bigoted and psychotic crap in the qur'an is the problem.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Meh. Islam is a dopey religion. It is largely founded upon nearly psychotic notions and violence and bigotry. I have no use for it. But if a woman or a man happened to have been born into a Muslim family and raised as a Muslim, then they are likely to remain Muslims. Maybe some of them adapt and accept the parts of Islam that aren't utterly vile.

But it ridiculous to reject anybody merely on the basis of having been born a Muslim.

Muslims are not the problem. The jihadist version of Islam which incorporates all the crazier, more vile, murderous, bigoted and psychotic crap in the qur'an is the problem.

Well I thanked you for your comment, as I believe that it is heartfelt, open and honest. And I do not want to argue with you, or to seem antagonistic toward you.

I would only add that THAT mindset, which seems to reasonable, was the one of most of the people who lived in the nations which long ago succumbed to Islam. And if you're ever standing in court, trying to argue that the Muslim who slammed into your car owes you another car, and the 'judge' sits in front of a Koran expressing his 'understanding of the will of Allah' and that understanding is that because you're NOT Muslim you're not entitled to just compensation from the individual who stole your possessions... remember that you're being screwed by folks who were born to Muslim parents, were raised Muslim and like to remain so.

 

[ninja007]

Islam cannot be from God because the prophet of Islam, Muhammad, did not pass God's first test for a prophet. Deuteronomy 18:21-22 tells us that God will authenticate those He sends as a prophet by having them perform signs. Muhammad gave no sign as required by God.

 

[Sunni Man]

Islam cannot be from God because the prophet of Islam, Muhammad, did not pass God's first test for a prophet. Deuteronomy 18:21-22 tells us that God will authenticate those He sends as a prophet by having them perform signs. Muhammad gave no sign as required by God.

The Quran was the " sign" that Muhammad gave to the people which proved he was a prophet of G-d. .......

 

[ninja007]

lol, no...

 

[Sunni Man]

Muhammad was the prophet chosen by G-d to give mankind the Quran. ......

 

[Truman123]

There is no war. I'm not inclined to violence. Nor do I want anyone harmed.

I just know what the Spirit convicts me yo say. I know the power of the atonement of Jesus Christ. I've seen the healing and light it brings to people and I known God is not silent nor has prophesying ceased because I have r received the Spirit of prophesy that told me that Jesus is who He claimed to be.

I also know the power the Bible and the Book of Mormon have to bring men to Christ. Especially the Book of Mormon. It was written to persuade men to come to Christ and teaches His doctrine more plainly than even the Bible. How can I not share these beautiful things and encourage men to come to the Savior? How I not have hope or deny the light it brings to the lives of so many.

I don't think our friend here has seriously read the bible. Nor do I think He has read the Book of Mormon. So I'm going to invite him to do so. I invite you to do so as well Hollie. Read the Book of Mormon and take the challenge and God will prove to you that He is and that it's true.

The book of Mormon was written by a convicted fraud.


Does that not raise some questions for you?

 

[irosie91]

Muhammad was the prophet chosen by G-d to give mankind the Quran. ......

The CALIPH is the successor to muhummad-----his very voice and authority on earth------(see bigbadbagdaddy)
Since the caliph is the current "muhummad"----nasty comments about that bloody bastard------are considered
BLASPHEMY----a capital crime- (watch more heads rolling
around in the dust)

 

[Hollie]

Muhammad was the prophet chosen by G-d to give mankind the Quran. ......

Mo' was a self promoter who invented a politico-religious ideology that was largely stolen from other religions. ......