The Right Flames the Volt

[flacaltenn]

Just thought I'd infect this thread with a third party opinion that contains <gulp> facts.....

In Defense of the Chevy Volt - Rick Newman (usnews.com)

And a quick update.....
Time with Volt: 2 months, 2 days
Mileage: just over 2,000
Gas used: 2.7 gallons (still has 6.3 gallons of dealer gas in it)
Last time engine turned on: Hmmmmm. Can't remember, but I'm thinking maybe 3-4 weeks ago.

Yeah -- all those wonderful testimonials -- while the rest of us are bombarded with dozens of TV/Radio per week telling us we have to pull our phone chargers out of the wall when not in use..

All so you superior earth-savers can wire your house with extra 2.5 KW circuits to feed your coal-fired baby for 6 or 8 hours.

What'da'ya' think would happen if 4 Million of these went into garages in Cali next week?

Think the lights are dimming NOW? You gotta ask -- what problem are we solving? and what needs to happen FIRST.

 

[GHook93]

Everyone right or left should be rooting for the Volt, Leaf, Model S and the electric car!!!

I like this piece

For those with short commutes, it could be months between fill-ups.

 

[flacaltenn]

Which is it ECO-NAUTS???

Are we so short of electricity that we have to pull chargers out of the wall and replace all our lightbulbs to CONSERVE ---

OR

We have SOOO MUCH electricity that we should ENCOURAGE folks to be adding 2.5KW circuits to their house and charging their cars for 6 or 8 hours a day..

Who's confused here? Which are we wasting --- The $MILLs on the Conservation Campaign --- or the SUBSIDIES for EVs?

You folks need a meeting to resolve this mixed message...

 

[GHook93]

I read that. Good OpEd.

So much for the right's claim to be "pro-business".

So they don't stop at the gas station,but instead need to visit the coal mine. Be honest about energy,requirements,they don't run on pennies a day.

I prefer coal over oil? I perfer stationary sources (which are easier to fuel, more efficient by far and a better long term solution)!

 

[flacaltenn]

I read that. Good OpEd.

So much for the right's claim to be "pro-business".

So they don't stop at the gas station,but instead need to visit the coal mine. Be honest about energy,requirements,they don't run on pennies a day.

I prefer coal over oil? I perfer stationary sources (which are easier to fuel, more efficient by far and a better long term solution)!

Your EV is cleaner and less of health hazard running off of gas than it is getting fed from the wall in your garage.

 

[flacaltenn]

Don't want this thread to go dark before I get an answer to this from all those enthusiastic EV fanantics.

I REALLY REALLY REALLY need an answer to this one....

Which is it ECO-NAUTS???

Are we so short of electricity that we have to pull chargers out of the wall and replace all our lightbulbs to CONSERVE ---

OR

We have SOOO MUCH electricity that we should ENCOURAGE folks to be adding 2.5KW circuits to their house and charging their cars for 6 or 8 hours a day..

Who's confused here? Which are we wasting --- The $MILLs on the Conservation Campaign --- or the SUBSIDIES for EVs?

You folks need a meeting to resolve this mixed message...

BTW --- I'm NOT on the RIGHT -- and THIS is NOT flaming...

 

[ScienceRocks]

If the battery could hold 3 times the energy and was around a third the price. Would the volt be economical?

 

[Old Rocks]

Don't want this thread to go dark before I get an answer to this from all those enthusiastic EV fanantics.

I REALLY REALLY REALLY need an answer to this one....

Which is it ECO-NAUTS???

Are we so short of electricity that we have to pull chargers out of the wall and replace all our lightbulbs to CONSERVE ---

OR

We have SOOO MUCH electricity that we should ENCOURAGE folks to be adding 2.5KW circuits to their house and charging their cars for 6 or 8 hours a day..

Who's confused here? Which are we wasting --- The $MILLs on the Conservation Campaign --- or the SUBSIDIES for EVs?

You folks need a meeting to resolve this mixed message...

BTW --- I'm NOT on the RIGHT -- and THIS is NOT flaming...

You can buy a 5.8 kw of solar panels for $6200. Use a grid parrallel invertor, and you have power for both your home and charging your car. The EV is also a very large battery, could serve as such in a weather disaster when the grid is down.

But, of course, it is far easier to stand out in left field doing the neener-neener number than to look at the real engineering oppretunities presented by the developments in batteries and EV's.

 

[flacaltenn]

Don't want this thread to go dark before I get an answer to this from all those enthusiastic EV fanantics.

I REALLY REALLY REALLY need an answer to this one....

Which is it ECO-NAUTS???

Are we so short of electricity that we have to pull chargers out of the wall and replace all our lightbulbs to CONSERVE ---

OR

We have SOOO MUCH electricity that we should ENCOURAGE folks to be adding 2.5KW circuits to their house and charging their cars for 6 or 8 hours a day..

Who's confused here? Which are we wasting --- The $MILLs on the Conservation Campaign --- or the SUBSIDIES for EVs?

You folks need a meeting to resolve this mixed message...

BTW --- I'm NOT on the RIGHT -- and THIS is NOT flaming...

You can buy a 5.8 kw of solar panels for $6200. Use a grid parrallel invertor, and you have power for both your home and charging your car. The EV is also a very large battery, could serve as such in a weather disaster when the grid is down.

But, of course, it is far easier to stand out in left field doing the neener-neener number than to look at the real engineering oppretunities presented by the developments in batteries and EV's.

And this $10K Investment -- charges my car at night for the next days commute --- how?

I really don't want to be in the energy generation business. Which is what you're gonna argue we should all do to finance our EVs.. (bad financing venture -- guaranteed to get you further into debt without actually solving pollution or Global Warming).


BTW -- you really didn't answer my question above ^^^^ previous post.. Which is it Rocks? Need to conserve? or Everyone should buy an EV right NOW?

 

[Old Rocks]

Flatulance, are you senile? Did you see the grid parrallel referance? Perhaps that is something that you don't understand?

So, you don't want to be a producer. Just sit at home, and accept whatever price the electricity cost you. Fine, that is your choice. Others of us see the advantage of being both a producer and a consumer of electricity.

Tell me, have you purchased all your vehicles for cash? Never financed any of them? So what is the differance between financing and EV and a ICE powered vehicle?

The path I outlined is conserving. The amount of electricity those panels would generate during the day would pay for all that you would use in your home and vehicle, unless you are just profligate in your use of energy. So owning an EV and a 5+ kw sytem actually adds to the amount of electricity available on the grid.

 

[PredFan]

From what I've heard, the Volt is quite capable of flaming itself thank you!

 

[Old Rocks]

From what I've heard, the Volt is quite capable of flaming itself thank you!

Heard, but not researched. Ah well, what is one to expect.

 

[ScienceRocks]

From what I've heard, the Volt is quite capable of flaming itself thank you!

Heard, but not researched. Ah well, what is one to expect.

I wonder what will be said when the volt around 2016(maybe later) gets the new battery tech: 3-5 times the density of energy and 1/3rds the cost.

Can you imagine the volt going 200 miles just on battery power.

 

[flacaltenn]

Flatulance, are you senile? Did you see the grid parrallel referance? Perhaps that is something that you don't understand?

So, you don't want to be a producer. Just sit at home, and accept whatever price the electricity cost you. Fine, that is your choice. Others of us see the advantage of being both a producer and a consumer of electricity.

Tell me, have you purchased all your vehicles for cash? Never financed any of them? So what is the differance between financing and EV and a ICE powered vehicle?

The path I outlined is conserving. The amount of electricity those panels would generate during the day would pay for all that you would use in your home and vehicle, unless you are just profligate in your use of energy. So owning an EV and a 5+ kw sytem actually adds to the amount of electricity available on the grid.

But NOT at the correct times of the day.. What you're suggesting is that the folks who overpaid for the EV go into HOC for another $10K so that they can become energy barrons to finance their "fill-up" at night from a BELEAGURED coal plant that is SOO inadequate, the Govt is spending BILLIONS to get us to conserve.

None of that makes sense -- unless YOU'RE senile.. Which is evident if you say "the path I outlined is conserving" and in the next sentence say -- ".... actually ADDS to the amount of electricity on the grid"..

Never DID answer that simple question I posed did Ya? You wanna tell people how easy it is to IGNORE the hypocrisy and the double talk about "alternatives" and Conservation..

Which is ROCKS??? We've got MORE THAN ENOUGH electricity to encourage EV Adoption en masse?
OR

We have to pull the chargers out of the wall when not in use, ban light bulbs and turn our thermostats off???

Maybe if you could resolve that mixed message for me --- I'd be more inclined to say a nice word about your silly plan..

 

[Old Rocks]

Flatulance, really dumb. First, the highest load, and highest prices, on the grid is during the day, when solar is contributing. Second, the wind does not blow at night? Hydro doesn't work at night? Ah well, one does not expect real logic from those defending the indefensable.

 

[flacaltenn]

You can't or you won't answer that simple question.. You're "solution" does nothing except create a bubble in supply for 6 hours a day -- leaving the other 18 actually WORSE off as EV adoption increases the load demand.

All you've done is offered a "guilt solution" that puts EV owners into the energy business with a poor financial return. Leaving the hard problems of how to sustain the grid 24/7/365 to others.

Not a good answer.. Anyone ELSE??? Wanna take a whack at what problem we're solving here?

Are we so short of electricity that we have to pull chargers out of the wall, turn down our thermostats and replace all our lightbulbs to CONSERVE ---

OR

We have SOOO MUCH electricity that we should ENCOURAGE folks to be adding 2.5KW circuits to their house and charging their cars for 6 or 8 hours a day..

 

[martinjlm]

Which is it ECO-NAUTS???

Are we so short of electricity that we have to pull chargers out of the wall and replace all our lightbulbs to CONSERVE ---

OR

We have SOOO MUCH electricity that we should ENCOURAGE folks to be adding 2.5KW circuits to their house and charging their cars for 6 or 8 hours a day..

Who's confused here? Which are we wasting --- The $MILLs on the Conservation Campaign --- or the SUBSIDIES for EVs?

You folks need a meeting to resolve this mixed message...

Don't need a meeting, just good old' common sense. The recommendation for people to unplug wall warts and use lower energy bulbs is to save the CONSUMER money, because there is a trickle of electricity consumed with the wall warts plugged in. And let's face it......the newer lightbulbs give off the same light while consuming less energy (resulting in a few extra pennies in your pocket). It does not reflect or even suggest a shortage of electrical capacity. Electricity is like Doritos.....they can make more.

At the end of the day, the bump in my electricity bill is at most $40 per month. I save that in gas in a week.

FWIW.....currently over 4,900 miles on 3.2 gallons of gas (still on original tankful from dealer) plus $40 electricity x 5 months. Works for me.

As for the "what would would happen if 4 million EV's plugged in at the same time?.....". Not even worth considering given that it is not possible. The auto industry doesn't have the capacity to produce enough EVs to get 4 million in the hands of customers, assuming customers even want them. So let's not get focused on eliminating an option based on a scenario that is not even possible. By the time the industry is capable of providing vehicles at that volume, there will be substantial upgrades to the grid that would handle the volume available.

 

[flacaltenn]

Which is it ECO-NAUTS???

Are we so short of electricity that we have to pull chargers out of the wall and replace all our lightbulbs to CONSERVE ---

OR

We have SOOO MUCH electricity that we should ENCOURAGE folks to be adding 2.5KW circuits to their house and charging their cars for 6 or 8 hours a day..

Who's confused here? Which are we wasting --- The $MILLs on the Conservation Campaign --- or the SUBSIDIES for EVs?

You folks need a meeting to resolve this mixed message...

Don't need a meeting, just good old' common sense. The recommendation for people to unplug wall warts and use lower energy bulbs is to save the CONSUMER money, because there is a trickle of electricity consumed with the wall warts plugged in. And let's face it......the newer lightbulbs give off the same light while consuming less energy (resulting in a few extra pennies in your pocket). It does not reflect or even suggest a shortage of electrical capacity. Electricity is like Doritos.....they can make more.

At the end of the day, the bump in my electricity bill is at most $40 per month. I save that in gas in a week.

FWIW.....currently over 4,900 miles on 3.2 gallons of gas (still on original tankful from dealer) plus $40 electricity x 5 months. Works for me.

As for the "what would would happen if 4 million EV's plugged in at the same time?.....". Not even worth considering given that it is not possible. The auto industry doesn't have the capacity to produce enough EVs to get 4 million in the hands of customers, assuming customers even want them. So let's not get focused on eliminating an option based on a scenario that is not even possible. By the time the industry is capable of providing vehicles at that volume, there will be substantial upgrades to the grid that would handle the volume available.

Greetings..

If the object of the constant Govt nagging about pulling chargers, turning off the lights, pushing down the thermostat and hiring "green" contractors to insulate was to save us money -- we wouldn't need so many dollars spent on programs and TV/Radio Ads to do the right thing. Would we? The money being saved is a LOT LESS because of the cost of the nagging programs and subsidies.

It is CLEARLY done in a belief that restricting NEW power generation is gonna save the planet. There's even a term for that belief -- NEGAwatt generation. Thus we will NEVER be incentiventize to create ADEQUATE generation to consider EVs as a viable option if making electricity RARE and EXPENSIVE is preferred to making it CHEAP and PLENTIFUL..

An EV user is adding 15 to 20% to their usage off the grid. An inescapable fact. While I'm supposed to be a good citizen and live in the cold and the dark..

Which message is it? I've got nothing against shifting transportation energy to the grid. But I'd prefer we build out a Hydrogen infrastructure for transport or a massive addition of nuclear. Because no one wants to build a build a semiconductor plant in Silicon Valley when the state puts industry on rotating outage schedules.

Think you still need that meeting...

 

[martinjlm]

....

Think you still need that meeting...

only if I believe about a third of what you posted. I don't. Meeting adjourned.

 

[Moonglow]

When Reagan bailed out Chrysler, he had the military use the dodge truck in the army. It was a piece of junk, just like the 70's models the starter magneto would never catch until you tried to start it for several minutes.