The rightwing certainly hates liberals/democrats, but they can't seem to defend the GOP

[FA_Q2]

This figure relates to amnesty of illegals having lived in the US for years. As far as actual border security goes, deportation was up under Obama.

Not even according to left-wing Snopes it isn't:

However, that statistic is somewhat misleading, as a significant portion of it was due to a change in the way “deportations” are defined that began during the Bush administration, not in the actual number of persons turned out of the U.S. As the Los Angeles Times noted, if not for that change in definition about what constitutes a “deportation,” the Obama administration likely would not have been a record-setting one in this area:

The number of people deported at or near the [U.S.-Mexico] border has gone up — primarily as a result of changing who gets counted in the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency’s deportation statistics.

The vast majority of those border crossers would not have been treated as formal deportations under most previous administrations. If all removals were tallied, the total sent back to Mexico each year would have been far higher under those previous administrations than it is now.

Until recent years, most people caught illegally crossing the southern border were simply bused back into Mexico in what officials called “voluntary returns,” but which critics derisively termed “catch and release.” Those removals, which during the 1990s reached more 1 million a year, were not counted in Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s deportation statistics.

Now, the vast majority of border crossers who are apprehended get fingerprinted and formally deported. The change began during the George W. Bush administration and accelerated under Obama. The policy stemmed in part from a desire to ensure that people who had crossed into the country illegally would have formal charges on their records.

In the Obama years, all of the increase in deportations has involved people picked up within 100 miles of the border, most of whom [had] just recently crossed over. In 2013, almost two-thirds of deportations were in that category.

Were More People Deported Under the Obama Administration Than Any Other?

Lol I'm curious. Why didn't Obama just reverse Bush's order?

?

This is irrelevant. The FACT is that claims of Obama's deportation numbers are not accurate when compared with presidents before him. That is a fact - period. No matter how many times you try and deflect from your last incorrect claim.

 

[Billy000]

It's been discussed a billion times here. Will one billion and one clue you in?

You can't explain it and you know it. You'll say "they cut taxes!" And then I'll say "only for the wealthy and trickle down economics has proven to be a complete joke." Then you'll say "well they get rid of regulations!" And I'll say, regulations have an insignificant effect on job loss for the lower classes.

I guess if you're a bigot who hates gay people, maybe that's a reason to vote R. At least be honest about it.

I understand you are at a disadvantage (obvious handicaps), but W cut taxes for everyone and revenue continued to climb.

Regarding regulations, how many employees do you have? Have you hit the magic 50 number yet?

No, revenue climbed in raw dollars. The actual measure of valued revenue decreased under Bush. You do understand inflation right?

I absolutely understand inflation. 9/11 and poor planning in the south, in particular the chocolate city, as their mayor called it, stalled the effects. Revenue over his tenure was up.

Federal Receipt and Outlay Summary

No, see that link is measuring raw dollars. It doesn't make sense to say that because raw dollars are at an all time high, that the value of revenue increased. It has to be computed as a percentage of GDP. In 2000, revenue as a percentage of GDP was at 20%. In 2007, it was at 15%.

 

[Billy000]

This figure relates to amnesty of illegals having lived in the US for years. As far as actual border security goes, deportation was up under Obama.

Not even according to left-wing Snopes it isn't:

However, that statistic is somewhat misleading, as a significant portion of it was due to a change in the way “deportations” are defined that began during the Bush administration, not in the actual number of persons turned out of the U.S. As the Los Angeles Times noted, if not for that change in definition about what constitutes a “deportation,” the Obama administration likely would not have been a record-setting one in this area:

The number of people deported at or near the [U.S.-Mexico] border has gone up — primarily as a result of changing who gets counted in the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency’s deportation statistics.

The vast majority of those border crossers would not have been treated as formal deportations under most previous administrations. If all removals were tallied, the total sent back to Mexico each year would have been far higher under those previous administrations than it is now.

Until recent years, most people caught illegally crossing the southern border were simply bused back into Mexico in what officials called “voluntary returns,” but which critics derisively termed “catch and release.” Those removals, which during the 1990s reached more 1 million a year, were not counted in Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s deportation statistics.

Now, the vast majority of border crossers who are apprehended get fingerprinted and formally deported. The change began during the George W. Bush administration and accelerated under Obama. The policy stemmed in part from a desire to ensure that people who had crossed into the country illegally would have formal charges on their records.

In the Obama years, all of the increase in deportations has involved people picked up within 100 miles of the border, most of whom [had] just recently crossed over. In 2013, almost two-thirds of deportations were in that category.

Were More People Deported Under the Obama Administration Than Any Other?

Lol I'm curious. Why didn't Obama just reverse Bush's order?

?

This is irrelevant. The FACT is that claims of Obama's deportation numbers are not accurate when compared with presidents before him. That is a fact - period. No matter how many times you try and deflect from your last incorrect claim.

Well see it does actually. Bush's hardline approach is what led to his deportation numbers being more.

 

[JBond]

It's been discussed a billion times here. Will one billion and one clue you in?

You can't explain it and you know it. You'll say "they cut taxes!" And then I'll say "only for the wealthy and trickle down economics has proven to be a complete joke." Then you'll say "well they get rid of regulations!" And I'll say, regulations have an insignificant effect on job loss for the lower classes.

I guess if you're a bigot who hates gay people, maybe that's a reason to vote R. At least be honest about it.

I understand you are at a disadvantage (obvious handicaps), but W cut taxes for everyone and revenue continued to climb.

Regarding regulations, how many employees do you have? Have you hit the magic 50 number yet?

No, revenue climbed in raw dollars. The actual measure of valued revenue decreased under Bush. You do understand inflation right?

I absolutely understand inflation. 9/11 and poor planning in the south, in particular the chocolate city, as their mayor called it, stalled the effects. Revenue over his tenure was up.

Federal Receipt and Outlay Summary

No, see that link is measuring raw dollars. It doesn't make sense to say that because raw dollars are at an all time high, that the value of revenue increased. It has to be computed as a percentage of GDP. In 2000, revenue as a percentage of GDP was at 20%. In 2007, it was at 15%.

Nope. GDP is dependent on government spending. Let's go back and look at the actual money raised, adjusted for inflation.

 

[Billy000]

You can't explain it and you know it. You'll say "they cut taxes!" And then I'll say "only for the wealthy and trickle down economics has proven to be a complete joke." Then you'll say "well they get rid of regulations!" And I'll say, regulations have an insignificant effect on job loss for the lower classes.

I guess if you're a bigot who hates gay people, maybe that's a reason to vote R. At least be honest about it.

I understand you are at a disadvantage (obvious handicaps), but W cut taxes for everyone and revenue continued to climb.

Regarding regulations, how many employees do you have? Have you hit the magic 50 number yet?

No, revenue climbed in raw dollars. The actual measure of valued revenue decreased under Bush. You do understand inflation right?

I absolutely understand inflation. 9/11 and poor planning in the south, in particular the chocolate city, as their mayor called it, stalled the effects. Revenue over his tenure was up.

Federal Receipt and Outlay Summary

No, see that link is measuring raw dollars. It doesn't make sense to say that because raw dollars are at an all time high, that the value of revenue increased. It has to be computed as a percentage of GDP. In 2000, revenue as a percentage of GDP was at 20%. In 2007, it was at 15%.

Nope. GDP is dependent on government spending. Let's go back and look at the actual money raised, adjusted for inflation.

Uh I mean I guess you aren't wrong, but I'm not sure what your point is. Okay look, go to that link and see the column that says revenue as a percentage of GDP. Look at how it was affected under Bush's years.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Then maybe if I repeat this one more time you will begin to get it. GOP voters have NO problem explaining why the poor and middle class should vote republican! You just must not be listening to the right places. They should vote republican so that they have greater opportunities for getting OUT of staying poor or in the lower middle class. Poor and middle class people vote democratic mainly because they want to STAY that way and want the government to continue to administer to their lives through government programs.

No government program ever raised a person out of poverty. Freedom, autonomy, self-actualization and hard work do. Democrats want big government to run your life. Republicans believe people are better at making their own decisions and running their lives themselves.

lol what are you even talking about? Republicans do nothing to provide opportunities to the poor.

Republicans nor Democrats are supposed to create opportunity for the poor. The poor are supposed to create opportunities for themselves like every other class of citizen.

However, the Republicans are trying to make things better for everybody including the poor. We are trying to slow down and stop illegal immigration which the Democrats are against. Immigrants (legal) and illegal take American jobs which keeps our pay scales low. We have cut funds for food stamps. Getting people off of government dependency is the best thing you can do for the poor or anybody else.

What have the Democrats done for the poor? Well, they fought against School Vouchers which gives access to better schooling for some poor people. They've increased taxes on tobacco products statistically used by the poor and middle-class. They've promoted single-parent households which is directly related to poverty. Now out-of-wedlock birth rates are 70% in black communities.

 

[Harry Dresden]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

you are driving a point home?.....how many righties here do you think you have converted billy?.....

Oh every single one of them if not most. They are just in denial. That's their own problem.

i think the one who posted this post is the one in denial....just sayin....

 

[Borillar]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Any decent person hates you fascist democrats. You seek to enslave people under a fascist authoritarian dictatorship. You're really not nice people,

Yeah, the party that brought us the DHS, TSA, DEA, War on Drugs, War on Terror, no knock raids, warrantless wiretaps, the Patriot Act, trans vaginal probes, etc is the "freedom" party and we're the fascists. Please.

 

[Borillar]

This figure relates to amnesty of illegals having lived in the US for years. As far as actual border security goes, deportation was up under Obama.

Not even according to left-wing Snopes it isn't:

However, that statistic is somewhat misleading, as a significant portion of it was due to a change in the way “deportations” are defined that began during the Bush administration, not in the actual number of persons turned out of the U.S. As the Los Angeles Times noted, if not for that change in definition about what constitutes a “deportation,” the Obama administration likely would not have been a record-setting one in this area:

The number of people deported at or near the [U.S.-Mexico] border has gone up — primarily as a result of changing who gets counted in the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency’s deportation statistics.

The vast majority of those border crossers would not have been treated as formal deportations under most previous administrations. If all removals were tallied, the total sent back to Mexico each year would have been far higher under those previous administrations than it is now.

Until recent years, most people caught illegally crossing the southern border were simply bused back into Mexico in what officials called “voluntary returns,” but which critics derisively termed “catch and release.” Those removals, which during the 1990s reached more 1 million a year, were not counted in Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s deportation statistics.

Now, the vast majority of border crossers who are apprehended get fingerprinted and formally deported. The change began during the George W. Bush administration and accelerated under Obama. The policy stemmed in part from a desire to ensure that people who had crossed into the country illegally would have formal charges on their records.

In the Obama years, all of the increase in deportations has involved people picked up within 100 miles of the border, most of whom [had] just recently crossed over. In 2013, almost two-thirds of deportations were in that category.

Were More People Deported Under the Obama Administration Than Any Other?

Lol I'm curious. Why didn't Obama just reverse Bush's order?

Why would he? The new definition of deportation only helped him BS people like you. DumBama and his minions ran to the MSM and lied about his success on immigration; making claims that were non-factual; never giving Bush any credit for the change in the definition of deportation.

If he reversed Bush's definition of deportation, it would only reveal that he's done less than his predecessors and not more.

Lol if the bullshit narrative was true that democrats want an open borders, that's exactly what he wouldn't have done.

Then why you guys so against the wall?





.

Because it's a boondoggle.

 

[Borillar]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Then maybe if I repeat this one more time you will begin to get it. GOP voters have NO problem explaining why the poor and middle class should vote republican! You just must not be listening to the right places. They should vote republican so that they have greater opportunities for getting OUT of staying poor or in the lower middle class. Poor and middle class people vote democratic mainly because they want to STAY that way and want the government to continue to administer to their lives through government programs.

No government program ever raised a person out of poverty. Freedom, autonomy, self-actualization and hard work do. Democrats want big government to run your life. Republicans believe people are better at making their own decisions and running their lives themselves.

lol what are you even talking about? Republicans do nothing to provide opportunities to the poor.

You poor, mindless twit. Opportunities don't come in more government programs, opportunities come in the form of less encumbrances for keeping you poor, for those willing to work their way out of poverty.

I went to college via the GI bill. I financed my house with a VA loan. In a few years, I'm going to start collecting Social Security, after putting into it for 50 years. Medicare too. Government programs helped me in the past, are helping me now, and will help me in the future, just as they have helped countless others. All these programs, which repugs want to cut.

 

[danielpalos]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

All they do is project, and blame their problems on the left. Nothing but repeal really is, just plain worth-less, in the non-porn sector.

 

[toobfreak]

"Borillar, post: 17651252, member]: 37510"I went to college via the GI bill. I financed my house with a VA loan. In a few years, I'm going to start collecting Social Security, after putting into it for 50 years. Medicare too. Government programs helped me in the past, are helping me now, and will help me in the future, just as they have helped countless others. All these programs, which repugs want to cut.

You are overlooking that VA programs are a different set from general programs as they apply only to a very small subset of society so can be made to work differently, and the other big thing: YOU WERE WILLING TO USE THEM TO WORK YOUR WAY OUT OF POVERTY. Food stamps, welfare and the like do not help you out of poverty. They just allow you to die more slowly. They make the poor, poorer. You can get a house refinance loan as a VET that no one else can get. Better rates, easier terms. They are designed to get vets back on their feet, other government programs with very few exceptions are NOT.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Then maybe if I repeat this one more time you will begin to get it. GOP voters have NO problem explaining why the poor and middle class should vote republican! You just must not be listening to the right places. They should vote republican so that they have greater opportunities for getting OUT of staying poor or in the lower middle class. Poor and middle class people vote democratic mainly because they want to STAY that way and want the government to continue to administer to their lives through government programs.

No government program ever raised a person out of poverty. Freedom, autonomy, self-actualization and hard work do. Democrats want big government to run your life. Republicans believe people are better at making their own decisions and running their lives themselves.

lol what are you even talking about? Republicans do nothing to provide opportunities to the poor.

You poor, mindless twit. Opportunities don't come in more government programs, opportunities come in the form of less encumbrances for keeping you poor, for those willing to work their way out of poverty.

I went to college via the GI bill. I financed my house with a VA loan. In a few years, I'm going to start collecting Social Security, after putting into it for 50 years. Medicare too. Government programs helped me in the past, are helping me now, and will help me in the future, just as they have helped countless others. All these programs, which repugs want to cut.

Nobody wants to cut your programs, just make them more efficient and self-supporting. If you live the average age in the US, you will get ten times more out of Medicare than you put in. A major surgery can cost over 100K. As for the GI bill and VA, you earned that when you served your country.

So it's not a question of whether these programs help America or not, it's a question of their sustainability continuing the path we are on now.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

All most on the right can do is hate: whether it’s immigrants, gay Americans, or women, much of conservative dogma is predicated on fear and hatred of those who dare to be different, who dare to dissent, and who dare to express themselves as individuals.

The bane of conservative authoritarianism will likely destroy this country.

 

[HenryBHough]

The best DEFENSE is a goof OFFENSE.

That in mind, I count it as a day wasted should I fail to offend --- nnnnnaaaayyyy-----SERIOUSLY PISS OFF a liberal.

Two is better.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Any decent person hates you fascist democrats. You seek to enslave people under a fascist authoritarian dictatorship. You're really not nice people,

Yeah, the party that brought us the DHS, TSA, DEA, War on Drugs, War on Terror, no knock raids, warrantless wiretaps, the Patriot Act, trans vaginal probes, etc is the "freedom" party and we're the fascists. Please.

So how many of these programs effected you, anybody in your family, anybody you worked with, anybody where you lived?

 

[Billy000]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Then maybe if I repeat this one more time you will begin to get it. GOP voters have NO problem explaining why the poor and middle class should vote republican! You just must not be listening to the right places. They should vote republican so that they have greater opportunities for getting OUT of staying poor or in the lower middle class. Poor and middle class people vote democratic mainly because they want to STAY that way and want the government to continue to administer to their lives through government programs.

No government program ever raised a person out of poverty. Freedom, autonomy, self-actualization and hard work do. Democrats want big government to run your life. Republicans believe people are better at making their own decisions and running their lives themselves.

lol what are you even talking about? Republicans do nothing to provide opportunities to the poor.

Republicans nor Democrats are supposed to create opportunity for the poor. The poor are supposed to create opportunities for themselves like every other class of citizen.

However, the Republicans are trying to make things better for everybody including the poor. We are trying to slow down and stop illegal immigration which the Democrats are against. Immigrants (legal) and illegal take American jobs which keeps our pay scales low. We have cut funds for food stamps. Getting people off of government dependency is the best thing you can do for the poor or anybody else.

What have the Democrats done for the poor? Well, they fought against School Vouchers which gives access to better schooling for some poor people. They've increased taxes on tobacco products statistically used by the poor and middle-class. They've promoted single-parent households which is directly related to poverty. Now out-of-wedlock birth rates are 70% in black communities.

Let me ask you this simple question about the poor bettering their own lives. Since decent paying jobs are in short supply in today's economy and raising the min wage isn't an option, how can millions of people get better paying jobs when inevitably they can't get them because they are so competitive? Also, who is going to do all those vital service jobs that currently pay shit?

 

[iceberg]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

then since calling people who disagree with you "idiots" seldom if ever works, maybe you should try a different tactic.

 

[iceberg]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Then maybe if I repeat this one more time you will begin to get it. GOP voters have NO problem explaining why the poor and middle class should vote republican! You just must not be listening to the right places. They should vote republican so that they have greater opportunities for getting OUT of staying poor or in the lower middle class. Poor and middle class people vote democratic mainly because they want to STAY that way and want the government to continue to administer to their lives through government programs.

No government program ever raised a person out of poverty. Freedom, autonomy, self-actualization and hard work do. Democrats want big government to run your life. Republicans believe people are better at making their own decisions and running their lives themselves.

lol what are you even talking about? Republicans do nothing to provide opportunities to the poor.

Republicans nor Democrats are supposed to create opportunity for the poor. The poor are supposed to create opportunities for themselves like every other class of citizen.

However, the Republicans are trying to make things better for everybody including the poor. We are trying to slow down and stop illegal immigration which the Democrats are against. Immigrants (legal) and illegal take American jobs which keeps our pay scales low. We have cut funds for food stamps. Getting people off of government dependency is the best thing you can do for the poor or anybody else.

What have the Democrats done for the poor? Well, they fought against School Vouchers which gives access to better schooling for some poor people. They've increased taxes on tobacco products statistically used by the poor and middle-class. They've promoted single-parent households which is directly related to poverty. Now out-of-wedlock birth rates are 70% in black communities.

Let me ask you this simple question about the poor bettering their own lives. Since decent paying jobs are in short supply in today's economy and raising the min wage isn't an option, how can millions of people get better paying jobs when inevitably they can't get them because they are so competitive? Also, who is going to do all those vital service jobs that currently pay shit?

let me ask you another question -

these vital service jobs that don't pay - maybe the "talent" available is too much watering down the wages they can earn as said job. people said all along there's only so much room in fast food and it was NEVER MEANT TO BE A CAREER.

yet people forced it cause it was easier to bitch for more $$$ than spend time/effort into learning something worth more on the marketplace.

now even those jobs are going to automation and they have even less jobs.

no one said it was easy. but sit there and try to tell me there are not gov programs available that will help people learn a new trade or career - go ahead.

i'll wait.

the desire to succeed has to be in someone before they ever will anything else is subject to the masses all fighting for what is left.

 

[Billy000]

GOP voters can't explain WHY the poor and middle class should vote republican, but they themselves as poor and middle class earners vote R anyway.

Am I a broken record? Hell yeah. Someone has to drive this point home. Idiots only learn through repetition.

Then maybe if I repeat this one more time you will begin to get it. GOP voters have NO problem explaining why the poor and middle class should vote republican! You just must not be listening to the right places. They should vote republican so that they have greater opportunities for getting OUT of staying poor or in the lower middle class. Poor and middle class people vote democratic mainly because they want to STAY that way and want the government to continue to administer to their lives through government programs.

No government program ever raised a person out of poverty. Freedom, autonomy, self-actualization and hard work do. Democrats want big government to run your life. Republicans believe people are better at making their own decisions and running their lives themselves.

lol what are you even talking about? Republicans do nothing to provide opportunities to the poor.

Republicans nor Democrats are supposed to create opportunity for the poor. The poor are supposed to create opportunities for themselves like every other class of citizen.

However, the Republicans are trying to make things better for everybody including the poor. We are trying to slow down and stop illegal immigration which the Democrats are against. Immigrants (legal) and illegal take American jobs which keeps our pay scales low. We have cut funds for food stamps. Getting people off of government dependency is the best thing you can do for the poor or anybody else.

What have the Democrats done for the poor? Well, they fought against School Vouchers which gives access to better schooling for some poor people. They've increased taxes on tobacco products statistically used by the poor and middle-class. They've promoted single-parent households which is directly related to poverty. Now out-of-wedlock birth rates are 70% in black communities.

Let me ask you this simple question about the poor bettering their own lives. Since decent paying jobs are in short supply in today's economy and raising the min wage isn't an option, how can millions of people get better paying jobs when inevitably they can't get them because they are so competitive? Also, who is going to do all those vital service jobs that currently pay shit?

let me ask you another question -

these vital service jobs that don't pay - maybe the "talent" available is too much watering down the wages they can earn as said job. people said all along there's only so much room in fast food and it was NEVER MEANT TO BE A CAREER.

yet people forced it cause it was easier to bitch for more $$$ than spend time/effort into learning something worth more on the marketplace.

now even those jobs are going to automation and they have even less jobs.

no one said it was easy. but sit there and try to tell me there are not gov programs available that will help people learn a new trade or career - go ahead.

i'll wait.

the desire to succeed has to be in someone before they ever will anything else is subject to the masses all fighting for what is left.

How hard is this to get? A can-do attitude isn't the issue. It's about the actual availability of decent playing jobs. And yeah, learning new skills would be ideal, but poor single moms don't have the time and money for it.