The unspoken moral dilemma of socialists

[Onyx]

But freedom does not equal Liberty.......

Mostly agreed.

Absolute liberty is freedom.

 

[jc456]

Not hard to figure out why.

They don't want to discuss this!

I personally have found it next to impossible to engage in a sustained conversation with a liberal about the immorality of taxation.

Also how liberal policies are usually backed by corporations. That is another they do not like to talk about.

They don't believe in individualism, it takes a village. All one needs to know

 

[Onyx]

They don't believe in individualism, it takes a village. All one needs to know

Statism is anti-individual in general.

The very concept of a people's state is collectivism at its best.

 

[owebo]

But freedom does not equal Liberty.......

Mostly agreed.

Absolute liberty is freedom.

There is no such thing as absolute Liberty....Liberty is a constructed created by free men. I could not get to where I am without you, but I can not stay where I am with you......

 

[jc456]

Jails? What do you do with offenders.

Offenders of what?

If someone tries to violate your personhood or property, then you shoot them. Simply stated and simply done.

See it starts to snowball and corruption follows why two parties isn't enough. Trump is that outlet and millions love it. It's about time in my life.

Nothing I could say would teach you in this regard

Americans will have to learn the Trump lesson the hard way, or at least ignorantly cling on to a false success story like liberals do with Obama's "change."

No, you don't get it. There is always someone in charge. Always! People who are in charge can turn corrupt without rules. Dude, your world is make believe

 

[Onyx]

At the time, perhaps a muslim state.....depends on what different decisions countries would have made at the time in light of our chaos.....

I do not like to laugh at the opinions of other individuals, but

Apparently the Muslim globalist threat was real in 1782 as well....

 

[Onyx]

There is no such thing as absolute Liberty....Liberty is a constructed created by free men.

Liberty is a social construct, and so is the state. That does not mean they are non-existent.

Freedom is a clear conceptualization, which is the absence of control. That means absolute liberty, whether it is a social construction or not.

I could not get to where I am without you, but I can not stay where I am with you......

Not sure what you mean.

Could you explain?

 

[owebo]

At the time, perhaps a muslim state.....depends on what different decisions countries would have made at the time in light of our chaos.....

I do not like to laugh at the opinions of other individuals, but

Apparently the Muslim globalist threat was real in 1782 as well....

Check your ignorance....

 

[jc456]

They don't believe in individualism, it takes a village. All one needs to know

Statism is anti-individual in general.

The very concept of a people's state is collectivism at its best.

Every individual must contribute period. To allow lazy is death to a society. It's happening today driven by only one party and trying to create more. Like a king and his army control over the masses.

 

[Onyx]

No, you don't get it. There is always someone in charge. Always!

I agree.

That is why the free people should be in charge, and attempted oppressors should be buried.

People who are in charge can turn corrupt without rules

They will turn corrupt with rules as well.

What, do you honestly believe people are going to restrain themselves simply because a piece of paper tells them so?

I believe in rules as well, so not sure what your point is there.

Dude, your world is make believe

On the contrary, yours is broken.

It has failed for 5000 years and the clock towards global destruction is still ticking.

 

[owebo]

There is no such thing as absolute Liberty....Liberty is a constructed created by free men.

Liberty is a social construct, and so is the state. That does not mean they are non-existent.

Freedom is a clear conceptualization, which is the absence of control. That means absolute liberty, whether it is a social construction or not.

I could not get to where I am without you, but I can not stay where I am with you......

Not sure what you mean.

Could you explain?

Government is of Liberty....Liberty is not of government....

Once again, freedom DOES NOT EQUAL Liberty.......they are two completely different things....

 

[ScienceRocks]

Dumb liberterians would allow this country to completely fall apart.
-No food or safety standards
-No safetynet as in ssi or unemployment
-No investment into our roads, bridges or much of anything
-No education for our children

No nothing

They'd have us looking like Africa or the poorer parts of india.

Anti-civilization is what they're. Sub-human shit.

 

[owebo]

No, you don't get it. There is always someone in charge. Always!

I agree.

That is why the free people should be in charge, and attempted oppressors should be buried.

People who are in charge can turn corrupt without rules

They will turn corrupt with rules as well.

What, do you honestly believe people are going to restrain themselves simply because a piece of paper tells them so?

I believe in rules as well, so not sure what your point is there.

Dude, your world is make believe

On the contrary, yours is broken.

It has failed for 5000 years and the clock towards global destruction is still ticking.

So, if free people were in charge, people would then not be free?

 

[Onyx]

Every individual must contribute period.

I agree.

Freedom takes responsibility. It takes an army to keep humanity from subjugation.

To allow lazy is death to a society.

Statism creates dependence.

The state might as well be the epitome of laziness.

Like a king and his army control over the masses.

At the end of the day, that is what you are supporting.

You can fool yourself into believing you can control power without power, but that is just fantasy make believe.

 

[jc456]

No, you don't get it. There is always someone in charge. Always!

I agree.

That is why the free people should be in charge, and attempted oppressors should be buried.

People who are in charge can turn corrupt without rules

They will turn corrupt with rules as well.

What, do you honestly believe people are going to restrain themselves simply because a piece of paper tells them so?

I believe in rules as well, so not sure what your point is there.

Dude, your world is make believe

On the contrary, yours is broken.

It has failed for 5000 years and the clock towards global destruction is still ticking.

It's been tried and why we have a constitution.

 

[ScienceRocks]

If liberty is about abolishing civilization. Well, that goes against all logic and reason.

Ones personal freedoms must be within reason.

 

[ScienceRocks]

It is unmoral to give up on civilization.

 

[jc456]

Every individual must contribute period.

I agree.

Freedom takes responsibility. It takes an army to keep humanity from subjugation.

To allow lazy is death to a society.

Statism creates dependence.

The state might as well be the epitome of laziness.

Like a king and his army control over the masses.

At the end of the day, that is what you are supporting.

You can fool yourself into believing you can control power without power, but that is just fantasy make believe.

No it's not. I have to have a majority and at present working on that. Thanks Donald

 

[Onyx]

Dumb liberterians would allow this country to completely fall apart.
-No food or safety standards

I believe in safety standards, but not the state.

How can that be?

-No safetynet as in ssi or unemployment

I believe in financial security, but not the state.

How can that be?

-No investment into our roads, bridges or much of anything

I believe in the importance of maintaining infrastructure, but not the state.

How can that be?

-No education for our children

I believe in public education but not the state.

How can that be?

They'd have us looking like Africa or the poorer parts of india.

On the contrary, many individuals in the third world have been scored as having higher net happiness and greater values than those in the first world.

Anti-civilization is what they're. Sub-human shit.

Modern civilization is the most inhuman of all its generations.

Our conception of civilization should burn.

 

[Onyx]

No it's not. I have to have a majority and at present working on that. Thanks Donald

You will never have majority rule. Never has it existed either.

To think a second ago you were lecturing me about make belief.