This is why we have gun crime, democrats fight longer sentences for gun criminals. Why?

[hazlnut]

A republican governor is trying to increase the prison sentences for actual gun criminals, criminals who actually use guns in crime, rather than innocent, law abiding gun owners who make clerical errors. Democrats are fighting him.....

Maryland governor proposes "truth in sentencing" rules for gun crimes - Hot Air

What Governor Hogan is focusing on is the relatively light sentences that persons convicted of gun crimes receive, many of whom do no time in jail at all. And those who are sentenced to prison frequently wind up doing only a small fraction of the time. The Governor is asking for some “truth in sentencing” which will ensure that criminals know that the city is serious and that they will pay a steep price for their crimes. (Baltimore Sun)

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The majority of the murders involve gang members as both the perpetrator and the victim. And on average, these shooting victims have themselves been arrested ten times previously. How on Earth do criminals have that many contacts with the legal system and not wind up being taken off the battlefield?

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Getting the Democrat controlled municipal government of Baltimore to go along with the plan will be tough enough. But now Hogan is going to be dealing with a recalcitrant Attorney General (also a Democrat) who will apparently be trying to undermine the reforms. This all reeks of politics and none of it is doing a thing to help the citizens of Baltimore who are essentially living in a war zone.

Please show us where it says Dems are "fighting longer sentences"… or prove your thread title has some basis in reality.

Or admit you lied.

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

What's your answer pussyboy, sit around the campfire, bake cookies, and sing songs with criminals?

My answer is actually pretty simple. We do what the europeans and Japanese do.

1) Don't let average citizens have guns to start with.

Unconstitutional.

 

[2aguy]

Letting violent gun criminals out in less that 3 years isn't locking these people up. If you let them back out, it doesn't matter how many you put in jail.

Well, if you let them out in three years with no job prospects and no attempt to train them for life after jail, yeah, they'll probably go back.

But the system is designed for that. Sorry you don't get that. The Prison INdustrial Complex is playing you, son! They need short sentences so they can get more work out of these people. A lifer isn't going to work very hard in prison industries, but a guy who hopes to get out in three will.

Sorry......we are talking about violent criminals who use guns to commit crimes, not people caught with a few ounces of pot.....moron.......

 

[2aguy]

What's your answer pussyboy, sit around the campfire, bake cookies, and sing songs with criminals?

My answer is actually pretty simple. We do what the europeans and Japanese do.

1) Don't let average citizens have guns to start with.
2) Only put them in jail if they really need to be there.
3) When you put them in jail, make sure you are actually reforming them, not just throwing them out long enough to come right back and still be a cog in the Prison Industrial Machine.

And you are wrong....

1)

Japan

Japan: Gun Control and People Control



Do the gun banners have the argument won when they point to these statistics? No, they don't. A realistic examination of Japanese culture leads to the conclusion that gun control has little, if anything, to do with Japan's low crime rates. Japan's lack of crime is more the result of the very extensive powers of the Japanese police, and the distinctive relation of the Japanese citizenry to authority. Further, none of the reasons which have made gun control succeed in Japan (in terms of disarming citizens) exist in the U.S.

The Japanese criminal justice system bears more heavily on a suspect than any other system in an industrial democratic nation. One American found this out when he was arrested in Okinawa for possessing marijuana: he was interrogated for days without an attorney, and signed a confession written in Japanese that he could not read. He met his lawyer for the first time at his trial, which took 30 minutes.

Unlike in the United States, where the Miranda rule limits coercive police interrogation techniques, Japanese police and prosecutors may detain a suspect indefinitely until he confesses. (Technically, detentions are only allowed for three days, followed by ten day extensions approved by a judge, but defense attorneys rarely oppose the extension request, for fear of offending the prosecutor.) Bail is denied if it would interfere with interrogation.

Even after interrogation is completed, pretrial detention may continue on a variety of pretexts, such as preventing the defendant from destroying evidence. Criminal defense lawyers are the only people allowed to visit a detained suspect, and those meetings are strictly limited.

Partly as a result of these coercive practices, and partly as a result of the Japanese sense of shame, the confession rate is 95%.

For those few defendants who dare to go to trial, there is no jury. Since judges almost always defer to the prosecutors' judgment, the trial conviction rate for violent crime is 99.5%.
Of those convicted, 98% receive jail time.

In short, once a Japanese suspect is apprehended, the power of the prosecutor makes it very likely the suspect will go to jail. And the power of the policeman makes it quite likely that a criminal will be apprehended.

The police routinely ask "suspicious" characters to show what is in their purse or sack. In effect, the police can search almost anyone, almost anytime, because courts only rarely exclude evidence seized by the police -- even if the police acted illegally.

The most important element of police power, though, is not authority to search, but authority in the community. Like school teachers, Japanese policemen rate high in public esteem, especially in the countryside. Community leaders and role models, the police are trained in calligraphy and Haiku composition. In police per capita, Japan far outranks all other major democracies.

15,000 koban "police boxes" are located throughout the cities. Citizens go to the 24-hour-a-day boxes not only for street directions, but to complain about day-to-day problems, such as noisy neighbors, or to ask advice on how to raise children. Some of the policemen and their families live in the boxes. Police box officers clear 74.6% of all criminal cases cleared. Police box officers also spend time teaching neighborhood youth judo or calligraphy. The officers even hand- write their own newspapers, with information about crime and accidents, "stories about good deeds by children, and opinions of
residents."

 

[2aguy]

What's your answer pussyboy, sit around the campfire, bake cookies, and sing songs with criminals?

My answer is actually pretty simple. We do what the europeans and Japanese do.

1) Don't let average citizens have guns to start with.
2) Only put them in jail if they really need to be there.
3) When you put them in jail, make sure you are actually reforming them, not just throwing them out long enough to come right back and still be a cog in the Prison Industrial Machine.

Wrong....still...Britain...banned and confiscated guns...their gun crime is increasing.... a lot....because their social welfare state can no longer create adult men....too many teenage girls raising young males.....

1)

Crime rise is biggest in a decade, ONS figures show

Ministers will also be concerned that the country is becoming increasingly violent in nature, with gun crime rising 23% to 6,375 offences, largely driven by an increase in the use of handguns.

Gun crime in London increases by 42% - BBC News

Gun crime offences in London surged by 42% in the last year, according to official statistics.


The Met Police's figures showed there were 2,544 gun crime offences from April 2016 to April 2017 compared to 1,793 offences from 2015 until 2016.
Knife crime also increased by 24% with 12,074 recorded offences from 2016 to 2017.

Violent crime on the rise in every corner of the country, figures suggest

But analysis of the figures force by force, showed the full extent of the problem, with only one constabulary, Nottinghamshire, recording a reduction in violent offences.

The vast majority of police forces actually witnessed double digit rises in violent crime, with Northumbria posting a 95 per cent increase year on year.

Of the other forces, Durham Police recorded a 73 per cent rise; West Yorkshire was up 48 per cent; Avon and Somerset 45 per cent; Dorset 39 per cent and Warwickshire 37 per cent.

Elsewhere Humberside, South Yorkshire, Staffordshire, Essex, Hertfordshire, Kent, Wiltshire and Dyfed Powys all saw violence rise by more than a quarter year on year.

 

[2aguy]

Eighty thousand or so. And they possess over 100,000 guns according to the Japanese police. All of them illegal, of course. I wonder how the most strictly policed island ever, got that many illegal guns

1) Source.
2) So 80,000 guns, and yet Japan has only a handful of homicides with guns a year.

How Japan has almost eradicated gun crime - BBC News

Japan has one of the lowest rates of gun crime in the world. In 2014 there were just six gun deaths, compared to 33,599 in the US. What is the secret?

If you want to buy a gun in Japan you need patience and determination. You have to attend an all-day class, take a written exam and pass a shooting-range test with a mark of at least 95%.

There are also mental health and drugs tests. Your criminal record is checked and police look for links to extremist groups. Then they check your relatives too - and even your work colleagues. And as well as having the power to deny gun licences, police also have sweeping powers to search and seize weapons.

The criminals in Japan aren't going through any of those steps...moron...the Japanese Yakuza are more interested in making money, not killing each other over facebook posts......but when they want to kill each other, like they did in 2006 for 7 years of gang war.....they use guns and grenades.....both illegal....

 

[2aguy]

A republican governor is trying to increase the prison sentences for actual gun criminals, criminals who actually use guns in crime, rather than innocent, law abiding gun owners who make clerical errors. Democrats are fighting him.....

Maryland governor proposes "truth in sentencing" rules for gun crimes - Hot Air

What Governor Hogan is focusing on is the relatively light sentences that persons convicted of gun crimes receive, many of whom do no time in jail at all. And those who are sentenced to prison frequently wind up doing only a small fraction of the time. The Governor is asking for some “truth in sentencing” which will ensure that criminals know that the city is serious and that they will pay a steep price for their crimes. (Baltimore Sun)

-----

The majority of the murders involve gang members as both the perpetrator and the victim. And on average, these shooting victims have themselves been arrested ten times previously. How on Earth do criminals have that many contacts with the legal system and not wind up being taken off the battlefield?

-----


Getting the Democrat controlled municipal government of Baltimore to go along with the plan will be tough enough. But now Hogan is going to be dealing with a recalcitrant Attorney General (also a Democrat) who will apparently be trying to undermine the reforms. This all reeks of politics and none of it is doing a thing to help the citizens of Baltimore who are essentially living in a war zone.

Please show us where it says Dems are "fighting longer sentences"… or prove your thread title has some basis in reality.

Or admit you lied.

Dip shit.....

California Democrats hate the gun, not the gunman – Orange County Register

Now that Democrats have supermajorities in the California state Legislature, they’ve rolled into Sacramento with a zest for lowering the state’s prison population and have interpreted St. Augustine’s words of wisdom to mean, “Hate the gun, not the gunman.”

I say this because, once they finally took a break from preaching about the benefits of stricter gun control, the state Senate voted to loosen sentencing guidelines for criminals convicted of gun crimes.

Currently, California law requires anyone who uses a gun while committing a felony to have their sentence increased by 10 years or more in prison — on top of the normal criminal penalty. If enacted, Senate Bill 620 would eliminate that mandate.

The bill, which passed on a 22-14 party-line vote, with support only from Democrats, now heads to the state Assembly for consideration.

Republicans and the National Rifle Association have vowed to campaign against it.

Why have Democrats suddenly developed a soft spot for criminals convicted of gun crimes? The bill’s author, state Sen. Steve Bradford, D-Gardena, says that he was motivated to write the bill after a 17-year-old riding in a car involved in a drive-by shooting was sentenced to 25 years in prison, even though he claims that he wasn’t the one who pulled the trigger.

and for all those anti-gunners who want to know where criminals get guns....well...this law lowers the prison time for those who give guns to criminals.....

Why is that?

Prop. 57, for example, very deceptively and fundamentally changed the definition of what constitutes a “non-violent” offense.


supplying a firearm to a gang member,

l
felon obtaining a firearm,

discharging a firearm on school grounds

 

[2aguy]

A republican governor is trying to increase the prison sentences for actual gun criminals, criminals who actually use guns in crime, rather than innocent, law abiding gun owners who make clerical errors. Democrats are fighting him.....

Maryland governor proposes "truth in sentencing" rules for gun crimes - Hot Air

What Governor Hogan is focusing on is the relatively light sentences that persons convicted of gun crimes receive, many of whom do no time in jail at all. And those who are sentenced to prison frequently wind up doing only a small fraction of the time. The Governor is asking for some “truth in sentencing” which will ensure that criminals know that the city is serious and that they will pay a steep price for their crimes. (Baltimore Sun)

-----

The majority of the murders involve gang members as both the perpetrator and the victim. And on average, these shooting victims have themselves been arrested ten times previously. How on Earth do criminals have that many contacts with the legal system and not wind up being taken off the battlefield?

-----


Getting the Democrat controlled municipal government of Baltimore to go along with the plan will be tough enough. But now Hogan is going to be dealing with a recalcitrant Attorney General (also a Democrat) who will apparently be trying to undermine the reforms. This all reeks of politics and none of it is doing a thing to help the citizens of Baltimore who are essentially living in a war zone.

Please show us where it says Dems are "fighting longer sentences"… or prove your thread title has some basis in reality.

Or admit you lied.

and here....



The Left’s Phony War on Guns, by Kevin D. Williamson, National Review

Chicago has Wild West levels of homicide.

(Worse, in fact; the criminality and violence of the ungoverned West has been greatly exaggerated, and some of those old cow towns had lower per capita crime rates back when they had no formal government than they do today.)

Do you know what kind of crime illegal possession of a firearm is in the state of Illinois?

It is a misdemeanor.

A 2014 study conducted by the Chicago Sun-Times found that in most cases, Cook County judges handed down the minimum sentence for gun possession, and in most cases, the criminals ended up serving far less than that, doing only a few months.

Those charged with simple possession had an average of four prior arrests; those charged with the more serious crime of being a felon in possession of a firearm had an average of ten previous arrests.
Ten arrests, and the eleventh is for a gun-related crime.
One wonders how many undetected crimes are covered by such criminal careers.


Many in Illinois have argued that, given the state of crime there, stiffer sentences are warranted.


A bill was introduced to that end, and it was opposed by Democrats who argued that stiffer sentences for those actually committing crimes with guns would “unfairly target African-Americans,” as the Sun-Times put it.


The NRA, to its discredit, opposed that bill, too, arguing that the penalties for simple possession in absence of other criminal activity were too stiff.
But that’s an argument for liberalizing Illinois gun laws, not for forgoing the punishment of criminals.
The NRA did support harsher punishment for felons in possession of firearms, and for the use of firearms in crimes. Democrats have generally opposed them.

Read more at: The Left’s Phony War on Guns

 

[2aguy]

A republican governor is trying to increase the prison sentences for actual gun criminals, criminals who actually use guns in crime, rather than innocent, law abiding gun owners who make clerical errors. Democrats are fighting him.....

Maryland governor proposes "truth in sentencing" rules for gun crimes - Hot Air

What Governor Hogan is focusing on is the relatively light sentences that persons convicted of gun crimes receive, many of whom do no time in jail at all. And those who are sentenced to prison frequently wind up doing only a small fraction of the time. The Governor is asking for some “truth in sentencing” which will ensure that criminals know that the city is serious and that they will pay a steep price for their crimes. (Baltimore Sun)

-----

The majority of the murders involve gang members as both the perpetrator and the victim. And on average, these shooting victims have themselves been arrested ten times previously. How on Earth do criminals have that many contacts with the legal system and not wind up being taken off the battlefield?

-----


Getting the Democrat controlled municipal government of Baltimore to go along with the plan will be tough enough. But now Hogan is going to be dealing with a recalcitrant Attorney General (also a Democrat) who will apparently be trying to undermine the reforms. This all reeks of politics and none of it is doing a thing to help the citizens of Baltimore who are essentially living in a war zone.

Please show us where it says Dems are "fighting longer sentences"… or prove your thread title has some basis in reality.

Or admit you lied.

This Democrat...from my original post.....moron.....for one example....

The Republican governor met for about an hour in Baltimore with elected officials, including Mayor Catherine Pugh, Maryland Attorney General Brian Frosh, Baltimore State’s Attorney Marilyn J. Mosby and City Council President Bernard C. “Jack” Young, all Democrats, as well as Baltimore Police Commissioner Kevin Davis and acting U.S. Attorney for Maryland Stephen Schenning.

------------------


He’s not going to have an easy time of it. Maryland’s Attorney General, Brian Frosh, came out right after Hogan’s remarks and contradicted most of them. He claims to never have agreed to any sort of truth in sentencing law and immediately pivoted to blaming their crime problem on…. Donald Trump.

----

Getting the Democrat controlled municipal government of Baltimore to go along with the plan will be tough enough. But now Hogan is going to be dealing with a recalcitrant Attorney General (also a Democrat) who will apparently be trying to undermine the reforms.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Well, if you let them out in three years with no job prospects and no attempt to train them for life after jail, yeah, they'll probably go back.

But the system is designed for that. Sorry you don't get that. The Prison INdustrial Complex is playing you, son! They need short sentences so they can get more work out of these people. A lifer isn't going to work very hard in prison industries, but a guy who hopes to get out in three will.

Sorry......we are talking about violent criminals who use guns to commit crimes, not people caught with a few ounces of pot.....moron.......

I don't think it matters to him. A criminal is a criminal. Whether a hardened, cold-blooded murderer, or a pathetic druggie, JoeB131 will take that side against that of decent, law-abiding citizens.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Wrong....still...Britain...banned and confiscated guns...their gun crime is increasing.... a lot....because their social welfare state can no longer create adult men....too many teenage girls raising young males.....

Same thing that is happening in some significant subsets of the American population, with the same underlying cause, and the same consequences.

 

[Skull Pilot]

A republican governor is trying to increase the prison sentences for actual gun criminals, criminals who actually use guns in crime, rather than innocent, law abiding gun owners who make clerical errors. Democrats are fighting him.....

Again, we lock up 2 million people in this country and we have another 7 million on probation and parole.

If arresting people and imprisoning them was an answer, we'd be there by now.

Again I have to tell you we are imprisoning the wrong criminals.

We keep nonviolent people in prison because of some failed alleged war on drugs while we let violent pieces of shit walk in and out of prison through a revolving door.

Locking people up only works if you lock up the violent criminals and keep them locked up.

But hey why would we want to target laws so actual criminals are the only ones paying the price when we can target people who don't break laws ?

 

[Skull Pilot]

What's your answer pussyboy, sit around the campfire, bake cookies, and sing songs with criminals?

My answer is actually pretty simple. We do what the europeans and Japanese do.

1) Don't let average citizens have guns to start with.
2) Only put them in jail if they really need to be there.
3) When you put them in jail, make sure you are actually reforming them, not just throwing them out long enough to come right back and still be a cog in the Prison Industrial Machine.

Prison isn't for reform it's punishment and that punishment should be severe.

People who will never use a gun to commit a crime shouldn't have their rights taken away because some asshole pulls a gun during a robbery

Want to stop gun crime?

Anyone committing a crime while in possession of a firearm get a mandatory 25 years with no parole
Anyone who fires a gun in the commission of a crime gets life no parole whether or not anyone was killed.

You will never understand that the only people responsible for gun crimes are the pieces of shit committing the crimes and not the law abiding citizen who just happens to own a firearm

 

[Conservative65]

What's your answer pussyboy, sit around the campfire, bake cookies, and sing songs with criminals?

My answer is actually pretty simple. We do what the europeans and Japanese do.

1) Don't let average citizens have guns to start with.
2) Only put them in jail if they really need to be there.
3) When you put them in jail, make sure you are actually reforming them, not just throwing them out long enough to come right back and still be a cog in the Prison Industrial Machine.

1) If you don't think I should have guns, come and try to take them.
2) If they commit a crime, they should be there
3) The only one that can reform a person is the person.

We both know you're not man enough to do #1 and too stupid to understand #2 and #3.

 

[Conservative65]

What's your answer pussyboy, sit around the campfire, bake cookies, and sing songs with criminals?

My answer is actually pretty simple. We do what the europeans and Japanese do.

1) Don't let average citizens have guns to start with.

Unconstitutional.

Joe's already stated he hates the Constitution.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Eighty thousand or so. And they possess over 100,000 guns according to the Japanese police. All of them illegal, of course. I wonder how the most strictly policed island ever, got that many illegal guns

1) Source.
2) So 80,000 guns, and yet Japan has only a handful of homicides with guns a year.

How Japan has almost eradicated gun crime - BBC News

Japan has one of the lowest rates of gun crime in the world. In 2014 there were just six gun deaths, compared to 33,599 in the US. What is the secret?

If you want to buy a gun in Japan you need patience and determination. You have to attend an all-day class, take a written exam and pass a shooting-range test with a mark of at least 95%.

There are also mental health and drugs tests. Your criminal record is checked and police look for links to extremist groups. Then they check your relatives too - and even your work colleagues. And as well as having the power to deny gun licences, police also have sweeping powers to search and seize weapons.

Japan is also a police state with few rights and little due process.