CDZ Two options...the European model of self defense, and the American model of Self defensse.

And we see the devastating effect of knives, clubs and other weapons in UK and Europe.
So, what is the rate of murder in the US compared to "UK and Europe". Is it too difficult to check the stats?
Several years ago ... my oldest son ... and his wife and their baby .... had an episode that involved firearms and saving them from harm and/or death.
You don't get it, do you? Guns beget guns. That's what we are trying to tell you.
The were living in the South Tacoma area, a place known for having a higher than average crime rate.
And why is it that the US has so many "Higher than average crime rates"?

THE BOTTOM LINE here is that the US doesn't give a stuff about its citizens so jobs are scarce, pay is low, and crime & poverty is high. "Just get a gun" and fend for yourself!
 
So, what is the rate of murder in the US compared to "UK and Europe". Is it too difficult to check the stats?

You don't get it, do you? Guns beget guns. That's what we are trying to tell you.

And why is it that the US has so many "Higher than average crime rates"?

THE BOTTOM LINE here is that the US doesn't give a stuff about its citizens so jobs are scarce, pay is low, and crime & poverty is high. "Just get a gun" and fend for yourself!


The decision to take a life is not correlated to criminals using guns......there are lots of guns in the hands of criminals in the U.K.....they choose not to commit murder with them, often shooting people below the waist rather than the chest or head...

You don't get it, do you? Guns beget guns.

You would have to explain this then...

Over 27 years, from 1993 to the year 2015, we went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 19.4 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2019...guess what happened...

New Concealed Carry Report For 2020: 19.48 Million Permit Holders, 820,000 More Than Last Year despite many states shutting down issuing permits because of the Coronavirus - Crime Prevention Research Center


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.


This means that access to guns does not create gun crime........

Why do our democrat party controlled cities have gun crime problems?

1) the democrat party keeps releasing violent gun offenders...they have created a revolving door for criminals who use guns, and will release even the most serious gun offenders over and over again....why? Probably because they realise that normal people don't use their guns for crime, so if they want to push gun control, they need criminals to shoot people.....so they keep releasing them....

2) The democrat party keeps attacking the police.....driving the officers into not doing pro-active policing, cutting detective forces so that murders go unsolved..........
 
So, what is the rate of murder in the US compared to "UK and Europe". Is it too difficult to check the stats?

You don't get it, do you? Guns beget guns. That's what we are trying to tell you.

And why is it that the US has so many "Higher than average crime rates"?

THE BOTTOM LINE here is that the US doesn't give a stuff about its citizens so jobs are scarce, pay is low, and crime & poverty is high. "Just get a gun" and fend for yourself!


And why is it that the US has so many "Higher than average crime rates"?

1) in 2015, the democrat party decided to attack the police....forcing police to stop doing their jobs...allowing criminals to commit crimes without police to stop them...


2) the democrat party decided to release violent criminals from jail and prison regardless of how many crimes they commit, in particular regardless of the gun crimes they commit......
 
The gun death rate in the US is nearly 100 times the gun death rate in England. We should be doing what they are doing.
The U.S. has the 32nd-highest rate of deaths from gun violence in the world: 3.96 deaths per 100,000 people in 2019. That was more than eight times as high as the rate in Canada, which had 0.47 deaths per 100,000 people — and nearly 100 times higher than in the United Kingdom, which had 0.04 deaths per 100,000.Mar 24, 2021
So what? Murder victims would be just as dead if they were killed with a different kind of weapon.


Are Americans just inherently more violent and murderous than the rest of the world?
No. Other parts of the world that are just as impoverished as our poor areas, are just as violent as our poor areas.


So according to you, they have no need to fear gun violence. That makes them nutbags that don't need to carry a gun, but do it anyway. Right?
Free Americans don't do things out of need. We do things because we choose to do them.


Sounds about right until you actually look at the numbers.
If we are murdered, there is a 75.304% chance it will be with a gun.
People who are murdered with other kinds of weapons are just as dead.


Higher crime rates, including murder rates around the world are tied to the same thing. Poverty and inequality. Studies have shown this to be true whether it be a town or entire country, the higher the poverty and inequality rates, the higher the crime rates.
Yes!!! Exactly!

Guns have nothing to do with how many people are murdered. It's all about poverty and inequality.


Can't argue with success. What they do works.
That is incorrect. They have low murder rates because of their strong social safety nets. Their gun laws are not a success in any way.


75% of our murders are done with guns. Yes, they relate to the high murder rate.
This statement contradicts your earlier statement about poverty and inequality.

It is your statement here that is wrong. Guns have nothing whatsoever to do with our high murder rate.
 
Maybe China can eliminate Seattle , Portland , SF and LA
If they do, the US military will eliminate China.


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Gun owner, But last years numbers for gun deaths 38,658 is to many, even if you deny that number, half of that is almost 20 thousand dead. Some thing has gone very wrong.
Murder victims would be just as dead if they were killed with a different kind of weapon.


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Should we repeal all the common sense gun legislation we have on the books now?
Yes. Because obviously the term "common sense" is code for "blatantly unconstitutional".


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The case that you "need a gun to defend yourself" is weak.
No one in America is making such a case. Only European serfs have to convince their lord that they have a legitimate need for a gun.

A free American simply chooses to have a gun and never bother to justify himself to anyone.
 
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Do your studies include the racial aspect of slavery on the 2nd amendment?
No such aspect.


If not, why?
Probably because he was studying history and not progressive fiction.


The 2nd amendment was a concern to southern states not as a means for gun control as both Native-Americans and African-Americans were not allowed to own guns. The second amendment was for militias to put down any uprisings by either of those groups.
Militias were intended to enforce law and order no matter who was challenging the peace.


BTW the "right to bare" arms as we have now has only been around for about 10 years.
That is incorrect. The right to keep and bear arms has been around for thousands of years.


To answer your strawman question,
I did not see any strawman question.


Stop the blather and educate yourself.
Reading progressive fiction is hardly an education.


....as part of a well regulated militia....
People also have the right to use their arms for the private defense of their homes. And also to protect themselves when out traveling away from home.


to keep slave revolts down...
Only in the sense that the militia was meant to confront all challenges to law and order.
 
And we see the devastating effect of knives, clubs and other weapons in UK and Europe.
Any "Wild West" state in the USA has mostly to do with gangs and drug cartels.

Guns don't always have to be used/fired to have an effect.

Several years ago, while my oldest son was going to college after getting out of the Army, he and his wife and their baby first born had an episode that involved firearms and saving them from harm and/or death.

The were living in the South Tacoma area, a place known for higher than average crime, but it was where he was doing college. One late afternoon in Summer time they were headed home and he stopped at the local 7-11 to buy his wife a pack of cigs. As he exited the store and approached his vehicle, the car parked next to him on the driver's side, had a person in the front passenger seat open his door, blocking my son's path.

One would think that person was exiting the vehicle, but no, just wanted to harass and provoke my son, block his passage. The car was occupied by four "disadvantaged" black utes, and several other black persons loitering in the parking lot began to circle in towards the "confrontation" that was brewing.

My son, as usual was packing concealed carry and while keeping his gun hand free and ready to draw, his other hand was in his jacket pocket fingering the pepper spray. The ute blocking my son's passage continued with inane and increasingly provocative dialogue.

Inside my son's Escalade was his wife, in the front passenger seat, and their baby daughter in the back. His wife was looking around, gauged the developing situation, and reached into her purse and pulled out her pistol, holding it out in clear view in front of her, pointed to the ceiling.

The window on the driver's side was down so she had heard the dialogue exchange and looking at the threatening ute holding the door to block my son, she said;
"Shut the f**k up and let him get in our car!

Suddenly the ute became very civil and pulled his door out of the way. The crowd circling in began to back away. My son was able to enter his vehicle and quickly depart.

There's a couple of lessons here but I'll wait to see if you, or others, are sharp and honest enough to see what they are. BTW, my son is a combat vet whom had served in Iraq before coming home to attend college and start a family.
The stats dont lie. Guns make you less safe.
 
..... Any "Wild West" state in the USA has mostly to do with gangs and drug cartels.
Really? Golly! So, all of those men, women and children who get blown to bits at kindergartens, primary schools, junior high schools, high schools, colleges, universities, post offices, churches, road rages and shopping malls are (sorry .... 'were') gang or drug cartel members? :disbelief:Hmmm, you learn something new every day!.
 
So, what is the rate of murder in the US compared to "UK and Europe". Is it too difficult to check the stats?

You don't get it, do you? Guns beget guns. That's what we are trying to tell you.

And why is it that the US has so many "Higher than average crime rates"?

THE BOTTOM LINE here is that the US doesn't give a stuff about its citizens so jobs are scarce, pay is low, and crime & poverty is high. "Just get a gun" and fend for yourself!
The thing is the murder rate of the UK is about what it was in 1950 before all their draconian gun bans and regulations

The murder rate in the US is about the same as it was in 1950 despite more guns in the hands of more people.

The differences between the 2 countries in murder rates therefore cannot be attributed to gun laws or gun ownership since both have had a neutral long term affect on murder rates.

It's just far too simplistic to boil down the many complex differences between the UK and the US societies to gun laws
 
The stats dont lie. Guns make you less safe.
Lies damn lies and statistics

The facts are that the murder rate of the UK is about what it was in 1950 before all those gun laws you love so much

The murder rate in the US is about the same as it was in 1950 despite more guns in the hands of more people

Only simpletons think gun laws are the only differences between the US and the UK.
 
Lies damn lies and statistics

The facts are that the murder rate of the UK is about what it was in 1950 before all those gun laws you love so much

The murder rate in the US is about the same as it was in 1950 despite more guns in the hands of more people

Only simpletons think gun laws are the only differences between the US and the UK.
And the facts are that the Uk is a lot safer thaan the US with all of its guns. All of Western Europe is safer.
 
How far can you throw or shoot a stairway or a ladder?
If you put the ladder or stairway on an ICBM you can launch it far enough to hit Russia.


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And the facts are that the Uk is a lot safer than the US with all of its guns. All of Western Europe is safer.
I doubt that you can prove this claim. There are all sorts of dangerous devices in Europe. Look at all the cars and trucks for example.
 
If you put the ladder or stairway on an ICBM you can launch it far enough to hit Russia.
I thought you wanted to shy away from the discussion of guns ... but here you are helping to prove that guns are the most dangerous of all. Maybe you need to think a bit harder before you respond.
 

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