US Credibility Crash as world swings to support Russia

[odanny]

My argument is to MYOB....You still don't have one.

Just what I thought, ya got nuthin'.

 

[Oddball]

That just broke the irony meter.

Only a fool can do that. Take a bow.

Do you even know WTF you're blabbering about?

 

[Oddball]

Just what I thought, ya got nuthin'.

I have more the "you're a Putin lover", which isn't an argument, faggot.

 

[Oddball]

Keep carrying water for Putin, it suits you being a water boy for a murderous dictator.

Not an argument, warmonger faggot.

 

[odanny]

I have more the "you're a Putin lover", which isn't an argument, faggot.

You got nothing, other than slurping Putin.

No argument, and no clue.

I accept your surrender.

 

[Oddball]

You got nothing, other than slurping Putin.

No argument, and no clue.

Still not an argument, faggot.

 

[odanny]

Do you even know WTF you're blabbering about?

You clearly don't, not that anyone expects you to.

 

[odanny]

Still not an argument, faggot.

I've only given you facts, which you can't refute.

You lose.

Again.

 

[rightwinger]

Well. . . at this point, the west has shown, it cannot be trusted.


So, with this in mind. . . I am afraid, Russia is no longer willing to negotiate with us. It now sees us as an existential threat to them.
It had repeatedly pleaded and begged with us, for acceptable terms, and we had continually violated and betrayed it, starting with our promise to Gorbechev not to expand NATO passed the Elbe River. This is just a fact.

Like our own native Americans, we have broken promise after promise to the Russians, and they have no faith we will keep our agreements with them anymore.

US, UK, France Promised USSR Not to Expand NATO East of Germany, Newly Discovered Document Proves

21 Feb 2022 - A newly discovered document provides more evidence that Western governments broke their promise not to expand NATO eastward after German reunification. Notes from a 1991 meeting prove that the US, UK, France, and Germany assured the Soviet Union that NATO would not expand east. ...

www.transcend.org

". . The 2+4 negotiations were talks in 1990 that allowed for the reunification of Germany, featuring capitalist West Germany and socialist East Germany (the 2) along with the United States, Soviet Union, Britain, and France (the 4).

Chrobog’s comments in the notes, therefore, confirm that the Western powers had promised the USSR in 1990 that they would not expand NATO eastward after German reunification.

Further clarifying this fact, the document adds that there was a “general agreement that membership of NATO and security guarantees [are] unacceptable” for countries east of Germany.. . ."

Putin has made it necessary to expand NATO
How is that working out for Putin?

Why doesnt Russia make peace on Ukraines terms

Withdraw all troops to previous borders including Crimea
Pay reparations for all damages incurred from their invasion
Be accountable for war crimes

Seems reasonable

 

[Oddball]

I've only given you facts, which you can't refute.

You lose.

Again.

blablablablabla

You still have no argument to refute, McFaggot.

 

[odanny]

blablablablabla

You still have no argument to refute, McFaggot.

My my, all triggered and sweaty, foaming and frothing.

It's okay, buddy.

 

[Kruska]

As someone mentioned earlier, was this a pinky promise?

It actually written down in German protocols - (independent of the Bush "Baker" administrations promises) regarding the talks held - 14th to 16th June 1990, in Caucasus between former German chancellor Kohl and Gorbachev (termed the miracle of Caucasus) - regarding the Soviet Unions permission towards German reunification and allowing for NATO troops (respectively the Bundeswehr) to set up shop in former East-Germany. (This was numerous times reported in ALL German MSM outlets at the time) incl. the armament reduction of NATO, the reduction of the Bundeswehr from 575,000 to 380,000 and to reform NATO policy. Germany then payed 5 billion DM to the Soviet-Union. But since then the protocols has been kept under closure by the German government.

Those cited talks between Gorbachev, Genscher and Baker in Paris (November 19th 1990) - were held after the Kohl and Gorbachev meeting in the Caucasus.

 

[Couchpotato]

Was it a pinky promise?

As someone mentioned earlier, was this a pinky promise?

No but you two stay stupid.

NATO Expansion: What Gorbachev Heard | National Security Archive

Western leaders gave multiple assurances against NATO expansion to Gorbachev in 1990-1991 according to declassified American, Russian, British, Germans documents

nsarchive.gwu.edu

 

[odanny]

So Putin was never promised anything? Apparently, these promises were made to Gorbachev in 1990, and apparently, these alleged "promises" were not in writing, as confirmation that NATO would not expand into countries under Soviet occupation.

Are there signed documents that verify this? Or was this, as you say, just a "promise"?

"Promises" really don't stand the test of time, do they?

 

[Couchpotato]

So Putin was never promised anything? Apparently, these promises were made to Gorbachev in 1990, and apparently, these alleged "promises" were not in writing, as confirmation that NATO would not expand into countries under Soviet occupation.

Are there signed documents that verify this? Or was this, as you say, just a "promise"?

"Promises" really don't stand the test of time, do they?

Good to know you don’t think the US or other western nations should stay true to their word……

 

[odanny]

Good to know you don’t think the US or other western nations should stay true to their word……

Life isn't fair, just ask any Ukrainian.

 

[Couchpotato]

So Putin was never promised anything? Apparently, these promises were made to Gorbachev in 1990, and apparently, these alleged "promises" were not in writing, as confirmation that NATO would not expand into countries under Soviet occupation.

Are there signed documents that verify this? Or was this, as you say, just a "promise"?

"Promises" really don't stand the test of time, do they?

We don’t make agreements with individual leaders of nations and abandon them when those individuals are no longer in power. How would that work out for the US seeing as we can turn the Presodency over every 4 years.

 

[Couchpotato]

Life isn't fair, just ask any Ukrainian.

No one said it was. As evidenced by your lack of innate intelligence. Life has indeed been unfair to you.

 

[odanny]

No one said it was. As evidenced by your lack of innate intelligence. Life has indeed been unfair to you.

Speaking of lack of innate intelligence.....

 

[José]

Originally posted by McRib
Life isn't fair, just ask any Ukrainian.

After 30 years begging NATO to stop just to find the military alliance breathing down her neck it was high time to tell the diplomats to shut up and let the russian bombs do the talking.

If anything Russia was too patient and tolerant.