Us Veteran And Aid Worker Could Be Jihadi John's Next Victim

[TheOldSchool]

No boots on the ground = No winners.

You guys are right let's send our troops over!!!

So how many U.S. casualties would you say is acceptable? 10, 20, 30 thousand?

 

[Rikurzhen]

The media should not be reporting on ANYTHING by Jihadi John.

All I want to hear about him is when he is killed.

So sorry, no boots on the ground...

No boots on the ground = No winners.

What prize does the winner get?

 

[TheOldSchool]

What prize does the winner get?

Nothing. A shitload of sand and a bunch of oil for Russia and China. Just like last time.

What do you think?

 

[Hossfly]

No boots on the ground = No winners.

You guys are right let's send our troops over!!!

So how many U.S. casualties would you say is acceptable? 10, 20, 30 thousand?

No boots on the ground = 10, 20, 30 thousand casualties here, eventually, initially.

 

[TheOldSchool]

No boots on the ground = 10, 20, 30 thousand casualties here, eventually, initially.

K gotcha. You can go back to hiding under your bed in the fetal position now.

 

[Physics Hunter]

The media should not be reporting on ANYTHING by Jihadi John.

All I want to hear about him is when he is killed.

So sorry, no boots on the ground...

You drinkin bro?

No. Thinkin'.

You should try it, if you can.

 

[Hossfly]

The media should not be reporting on ANYTHING by Jihadi John.

All I want to hear about him is when he is killed.

So sorry, no boots on the ground...

No boots on the ground = No winners.

What prize does the winner get?

Winner gets to live. That's what war is about. I don't want to be fighting ISIS in downtown Dallas. Capiche?

 

[eagle1462010]

I liked those videos. Blowing shit up is cool. The problem is that blowing shit up is not a military strategy. Sure, it kills people, it destroys weapons, but what goal is sought and achieved.

-What should we do?
-Let's go and blow shit up.
-Awesome.

That's US foreign policy at the moment.

Killing the enemy, which is ISIS currently is blowing shit up. aka Killing them.

One side or the other has to win in Syria......too many have died for any other outcome. Taking out both sides would leave a vacuum afterwards which is dumb as well. ISIS are pond scum and Assad is a lesser version of pond scum.

Either way, we don't receive any long term benefit from killing them other than revenge for beheading our people.

Iraq.......The strategy should be to destroy the enemy even if it includes putting back the troops. To allow it to go down after the price already payed is stupid............but at the same time this forces us to remain afterwards.........

This whole area is a Giant Clusterfuck. Always has been and always will be.

I've lived and worked throughout MENA, so believe me, when you say that whole area is a Giant Clusterfuck, I'm right there with you.

To Iraq. Keep in mind the following:

Many people have strong misgivings about "wasting" resources (loss aversion). In the above example involving a non-refundable movie ticket, many people, for example, would feel obliged to go to the movie despite not really wanting to, because doing otherwise would be wasting the ticket price; they feel they've passed the point of no return. This is sometimes referred to as the sunk cost fallacy. Economists would label this behavior "irrational": it is inefficient because it misallocates resources by depending on information that is irrelevant to the decision being made. Colloquially, this is known as "throwing good money after bad". . . . .

A second example is R&D costs. Once spent, such costs are sunk and should have no effect on future pricing decisions. So a pharmaceutical company’s attempt to justify high prices because of the need to recoup R&D expenses is fallacious. The company will charge market prices whether R&D had cost one dollar or one million dollars.[8] However, R&D costs, and the ability to recoup those costs, are a factor in deciding whether to spend the money on R&D.

The sunk cost fallacy is in game theory sometimes known as the "Concorde Fallacy",[9] referring to the fact that the British and French governments continued to fund the joint development of Concorde even after it became apparent that there was no longer an economic case for the aircraft. The project was regarded privately by the British government as a "commercial disaster" which should never have been started, and was almost cancelled, but political and legal issues had ultimately made it impossible for either government to pull out.
​

What does it take to fix Iraq. It doesn't matter what we've already spent, that blood and treasure is done with. Desiring to prevent men from dying in vain is going to have a cost of more men dying. How many future lives have to be sacrificed in order to justify past lives lost?

I don't see a way to salvage Iraq. ISIS is an organic outgrowth of what some people in the region actually want. It's also what many Muslims in the West also want, hence the flow of Western Muslims to join ISIS. What's going on in the region needs to be fixed by those with the greatest interest in fixing. Those people are staying on the sidelines because Americans are willing to die to fix the problems. Better to let American boys die fighting to fix Iraq/Syria than good Muslim boys. So long as Americans are willing to have the blood of their sons spilled, Muslims won't fix their own back yard.

I understand your point and agree with pretty much all of it. But the long term picture is the radial movement itself.........The same movement that created the environment for going to War to Begin with.

Radical Islam is an external threat and ISIL could well be another element on the Terrorism problem This problem has spread around the globe and at some point we have to take the gloves off and make them pay a severe price for their actions in the region and the possible after effects of allowing them to win the region.

I, like you, am tired of our boys dying on foreign battlefields along with the high cost of fighting wars. But I understand that global Jihad is still on the table in the hell hole called the middle east.

I'm for taking off the gloves, and taking their butts out again. I'm also ticked at the Iraqi military for running instead of fighting when ISIL showed up after we had trained and armed them.

It all sucks.

The way to solve the problem is to invert the Bush logic of "We fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over there" into "We fight them here so that we don't have to fight them over there."

Follow the principle here, and I'll paint it in very simple black and white terms, if we have no Muslims in America then we don't have to worry about any Islamic terrorism in America. From this end of the spectrum we jump to the other end, if we have a lot of Muslims in America, then we have a lot of Islamic attacks in America.

Our problem is our own Muslim population and Muslim visitors. The threats we face come from within this group, not some illiterate goatherders who are fighting on a battlefield in Syria.

It's sheer idiocy to be fighting wars with Muslims in the Middle East, riling up Muslims all over the world, and then inviting Muslims to come to America as both refugees and immigrants.

I would agree with you on limiting immigration from the middle east as we are inviting the enemy to dinner by doing so............But that would not end the problem.

We cannot win this via isolationism...........This is global in nature and we have assets outside this country. In order to safe guard these assets and our people who travel abroad, we must be proactive in policy versus reactive. Which means killing some of these people from time to time. I'm really not into nation building. I don't care what they think of us, as if they hate us today they'll still hate us tomorrow. If we kick ISIL's ass into the infernal regions of hell they can not come back to fight us on another day because they are dead.

Those who we helped save, in Iraq or mainly the kurds will not hate us for killing their enemies on the battlefield. They may not like us after we leave but they may be less inclined to want to conduct terror attacks against us because we saved them.

How many more hate us because we hit ISIL.......how many more would like us for saving them from ISIL.........Is it more........or is it less.................I simply don't know.

 

[Rikurzhen]

The media should not be reporting on ANYTHING by Jihadi John.

All I want to hear about him is when he is killed.

So sorry, no boots on the ground...

No boots on the ground = No winners.

What prize does the winner get?

Winner gets to live. That's what war is about. I don't want to be fighting ISIS in downtown Dallas. Capiche?

Then insure that you have no Muslims living in Dallas. Capiche?

 

[Physics Hunter]

The media should not be reporting on ANYTHING by Jihadi John.

All I want to hear about him is when he is killed.

So sorry, no boots on the ground...

No boots on the ground = No winners.

We can create losers with air power, but we cannot, often, get one man that is intent on being deceptive.

 

[Hossfly]

No boots on the ground = 10, 20, 30 thousand casualties here, eventually, initially.

K gotcha. You can go back to hiding under your bed in the fetal position now.

Yup, that's how wars are fought under Generalissimo Obumble. Hope and change.

 

[TheOldSchool]

No. Thinkin'.

You should try it, if you can.

Thinkin'?

Your posts indicate otherwise.

 

[eagle1462010]

End the ROE's and the losses aren't large.............Tell the politicians to STFU and let the military do it's job without BS rules and PC rhetoric.........The military know how to win a war...........Politicians know how to lose one.

 

[TheOldSchool]

Yup, that's how wars are fought under Generalissimo Obumble. Hope and change.

I'm still waiting to hear what acceptable casualties are from you.

 

[Physics Hunter]

No boots on the ground = 10, 20, 30 thousand casualties here, eventually, initially.

K gotcha. You can go back to hiding under your bed in the fetal position now.

You need to break that mirror.

 

[Rikurzhen]

I would agree with you on limiting immigration from the middle east as we are inviting the enemy to dinner by doing so............But that would not end the problem.

We cannot win this via isolationism...........This is global in nature and we have assets outside this country. In order to safe guard these assets and our people who travel abroad, we must be proactive in policy versus reactive. Which means killing some of these people from time to time. I'm really not into nation building. I don't care what they think of us, as if they hate us today they'll still hate us tomorrow. If we kick ISIL's ass into the infernal regions of hell they can not come back to fight us on another day because they are dead.

Those who we helped save, in Iraq or mainly the kurds will not hate us for killing their enemies on the battlefield. They may not like us after we leave but they may be less inclined to want to conduct terror attacks against us because we saved them.

How many more hate us because we hit ISIL.......how many more would like us for saving them from ISIL.........Is it more........or is it less.................I simply don't know.

A Caliphate is like Communism, a disastrously inefficient way to organize a society. As liberals dream of communism, Muslims dream of a Caliphate. As the fall of the Soviet Union burst the dreams of communists everywhere, the cold reality of the failure of a Caliphate will also put to rest the dreams of Islamic Supremacy. So long as those dreams are thwarted, they will never die. What you're proposing is an eternal war of whack-a-mole.

 

[TheOldSchool]

You need to break that mirror.

You need to put the bong down.

 

[Hossfly]

The media should not be reporting on ANYTHING by Jihadi John.

All I want to hear about him is when he is killed.

So sorry, no boots on the ground...

No boots on the ground = No winners.

We can create losers with air power, but we cannot, often, get one man that is intent on being deceptive.

No war can be won by air or sea power alone. That's a given.Gotta root 'em out on the ground.

 

[TheOldSchool]

No war can be won by air or sea power alone. That's a given.Gotta root 'em out on the ground.

So... like 20,000 casualties over 10 years. While China and Russia stay out of it and spend their time increasing their influence in the world and then become the major benefactors of the U.S's hard won efforts in the middle east just like last time.

That's a great idea.

 

[Physics Hunter]

No. Thinkin'.

You should try it, if you can.

Thinkin'?

Your posts indicate otherwise.

I would not be just a nothin',
My head all full of stuffin',
...

By the way, have you stopped beating your dog?