Vermont Going To Single Payer By 2017. Kicking Health Insurance Companies Out

[Fishlore]

In its original form, ACA provided for a government operated insurance company whose policies were to be sold on the exchanges. Congress mandated that the corporation must run on premiums only with no taxpayer subsidy of any kind. It was also required to operate under exactly the same mandates and regulations as every other company selling policies under ACA. The idea behind the plan was to ensure market competition in the many areas where only one or two companies were writing policies. A number of conservative politicians crowed about how the efficiency of private sector competition would allow for-profit companies to easily defeat the bloated, incompetent and wasteful federal bureaucracy in its attempt to sell insurance in the private market.

So, what happened? The lobbyists for the insurance industry who were writing large parts of ACA for the GOP took one look at the idea and shouted "Whoa!" They knew that a government program playing under the same rules but without the million dollar salaries and shareholder profits would easily out-compete the for-profit companies.

The Vermont program had its genesis at that moment. Eventually, as the costs of private insurance under ACA rise high enough, the nation will again turn to the government option as the way to transition to single payer. This will come on the national agenda in ten years or so.

 

[Pogo]

In its original form, ACA provided for a government operated insurance company whose policies were to be sold on the exchanges. Congress mandated that the corporation must run on premiums only with no taxpayer subsidy of any kind. It was also required to operate under exactly the same mandates and regulations as every other company selling policies under ACA. The idea behind the plan was to ensure market competition in the many areas where only one or two companies were writing policies. A number of conservative politicians crowed about how the efficiency of private sector competition would allow for-profit companies to easily defeat the bloated, incompetent and wasteful federal bureaucracy in its attempt to sell insurance in the private market.

So, what happened? The lobbyists for the insurance industry who were writing large parts of ACA for the GOP took one look at the idea and shouted "Whoa!" They knew that a government program playing under the same rules but without the million dollar salaries and shareholder profits would easily out-compete the for-profit companies.

The Vermont program had its genesis at that moment. Eventually, as the costs of private insurance under ACA rise high enough, the nation will again turn to the government option as the way to transition to single payer. This will come on the national agenda in ten years or so.

Yup, Joe Lie-berman, nose-deep in Big Pharma/Big Insurance money, hacking the public option to death. Thanks a lot, Joe.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Seriously?????? Health industry hasn't proved to be a failure, where did you come up with that one.
You have to take the gullible award for the week, Jake....or you like socialized medicine....that's so conservative of you.

Of course it is. It has created a system that is not affordable and accessible with quality care for all Americans. It has created its own death panels. Western nations live longer, cheaper, and more healthily than we do.

This has nothing to do with "socialized" medicine, it has to do with the American health care's failure to take care of Americans while getting rich by denying health care.

Why don't you get the debt totals from socialized healthcare, Jake of those other western nations. It's crushing them. Canada is allowing private clinics again because they can't handle the wait times.
I believe it's Germany who's doctors offices have to close until they get their government allocation to open up again.
They aren't living longer because of their healthcare, Jake. True story
Probably cheaper because the debt keeps rising because of their healthcare....even with the high taxes they have. I don't think you're gullible, I just think you are ready to embrace socialism.

Why don't you get the debt totals, because it is your propaganda that you are preaching.

Your ignorance of Western national health care is appalling.

And your deflection from our health care industry's problem here is noted.

Vermont is doing what it is doing because of the failures of our private health care system.

We had from 1994 to 2006 to fix it, and we didn't.

Tough that.

 

[JakeStarkey]

In its original form, ACA provided for a government operated insurance company whose policies were to be sold on the exchanges. Congress mandated that the corporation must run on premiums only with no taxpayer subsidy of any kind. It was also required to operate under exactly the same mandates and regulations as every other company selling policies under ACA. The idea behind the plan was to ensure market competition in the many areas where only one or two companies were writing policies. A number of conservative politicians crowed about how the efficiency of private sector competition would allow for-profit companies to easily defeat the bloated, incompetent and wasteful federal bureaucracy in its attempt to sell insurance in the private market.

So, what happened? The lobbyists for the insurance industry who were writing large parts of ACA for the GOP took one look at the idea and shouted "Whoa!" They knew that a government program playing under the same rules but without the million dollar salaries and shareholder profits would easily out-compete the for-profit companies.

The Vermont program had its genesis at that moment. Eventually, as the costs of private insurance under ACA rise high enough, the nation will again turn to the government option as the way to transition to single payer. This will come on the national agenda in ten years or so.

And the private sector greed will be the reason for it. Tough that.

 

[hipeter924]

The cornerstone to the Vermont system was industry greed and corruption.

Tough that.

Now it's socialism. They really will have to depend on the government, now. Not like there is no greed and corruption in our government, huh Jake? Tough that

Meister, the health industry has already proven to be failure, due to its own corruption and greed.

We will see if the state can do better. Lucky that.

Yep, if I was a foreign investor I would be laughing at 'stupid Americans' all the way to the bank, while taking full advantage of UHC back home.

 

[Meister]

Of course it is. It has created a system that is not affordable and accessible with quality care for all Americans. It has created its own death panels. Western nations live longer, cheaper, and more healthily than we do.

This has nothing to do with "socialized" medicine, it has to do with the American health care's failure to take care of Americans while getting rich by denying health care.

Why don't you get the debt totals from socialized healthcare, Jake of those other western nations. It's crushing them. Canada is allowing private clinics again because they can't handle the wait times.
I believe it's Germany who's doctors offices have to close until they get their government allocation to open up again.
They aren't living longer because of their healthcare, Jake. True story
Probably cheaper because the debt keeps rising because of their healthcare....even with the high taxes they have. I don't think you're gullible, I just think you are ready to embrace socialism.

Why don't you get the debt totals, because it is your propaganda that you are preaching.

Your ignorance of Western national health care is appalling.

And your deflection from our health care industry's problem here is noted.

Vermont is doing what it is doing because of the failures of our private health care system.

We had from 1994 to 2006 to fix it, and we didn't.

Tough that.

I'm on a tablet this evening, can't do the linking, but did a Google on the subject, and there is serious problems in Europe, so I can only assume that you're too fragile to look up the truth, jake.
As for your premise with Western Healthcare....you are the ignorant one.
I never said our healthcare before obummercare was perfect, but it could have been tweeked for those without, not overhauled for the sake of government control.
You really are a socialist....at the very least with healthcare....probably just scratching the surface with you.

 

[Gadawg73]

Most people do not have health insurance because they spent their $$$ on something else and expect someone else to pay for their health insurance.

Friend of mine just bought a new Ford truck and a new GMC Acadia. $72,000 CASH.
He and his wife have NO health insurance. .

"Friend of mine" in no way equates to "most people". That's a blatant fallacy right there.

"Most people" who don't have HI it's fair to say don't have it because they can't afford it. In this country it's been priced out of reach for a disintegrating middle class. And then along come the apologists for the disintegrative forces to keep them down... which frankly is a sycophancy that gives me the urge to

Related:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TWuO5dBYjo"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TWuO5dBYjo[/ame]

OK, if they can not afford it then they need to get an extra job.
Called responsibility.

 

[Pogo]

Why don't you get the debt totals from socialized healthcare, Jake of those other western nations. It's crushing them. Canada is allowing private clinics again because they can't handle the wait times.
I believe it's Germany who's doctors offices have to close until they get their government allocation to open up again.
They aren't living longer because of their healthcare, Jake. True story
Probably cheaper because the debt keeps rising because of their healthcare....even with the high taxes they have. I don't think you're gullible, I just think you are ready to embrace socialism.

Why don't you get the debt totals, because it is your propaganda that you are preaching.

Your ignorance of Western national health care is appalling.

And your deflection from our health care industry's problem here is noted.

Vermont is doing what it is doing because of the failures of our private health care system.

We had from 1994 to 2006 to fix it, and we didn't.

Tough that.

I'm on a tablet this evening, can't do the linking, but did a Google on the subject, and there is serious problems in Europe, so I can only assume that you're too fragile to look up the truth, jake.
As for your premise with Western Healthcare....you are the ignorant one.
I never said our healthcare before obummercare was perfect, but it could have been tweeked for those without, not overhauled for the sake of government control.
You really are a socialist....at the very least with healthcare....probably just scratching the surface with you.

I'm still not sure what Meister's point is here; it seems to keep landing on "you're a socialist".

-- And?

Some things are socialized in any government structure, even ours. Public libraries are socialism. Public parks and the Smithsonian are socialism. National highways are socialism. NOAA and NIH and the CDC and the FDA. And of course Social Security and Medicare. All established by We the People to promote the general welfare. Ya gotta come up with a little better argument than an unexplained insinuation or the same tired old "that'll never work".

 

[Pogo]

Most people do not have health insurance because they spent their $$$ on something else and expect someone else to pay for their health insurance.

Friend of mine just bought a new Ford truck and a new GMC Acadia. $72,000 CASH.
He and his wife have NO health insurance. .

"Friend of mine" in no way equates to "most people". That's a blatant fallacy right there.

"Most people" who don't have HI it's fair to say don't have it because they can't afford it. In this country it's been priced out of reach for a disintegrating middle class. And then along come the apologists for the disintegrative forces to keep them down... which frankly is a sycophancy that gives me the urge to

Related:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TWuO5dBYjo"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TWuO5dBYjo[/ame]

OK, if they can not afford it then they need to get an extra job.
Called responsibility.

^^ Sociopath.

Had you watched the video you would have seen the issue is expense, not "getting another job" for medication that costs sixty thousand fucking dollars for a single dose. And you would have further seen that while supplemental assistance is available, that woman showing in the link makes too much money to qualify. So the one solution that would work for her is for one or both of them to quit working.

So much for your "responsibility". You guys who can't bend over far enough for the Corporatocracy at the expense of the common citizen put me in need of some medication myself.

 

[Gadawg73]

In its original form, ACA provided for a government operated insurance company whose policies were to be sold on the exchanges. Congress mandated that the corporation must run on premiums only with no taxpayer subsidy of any kind. It was also required to operate under exactly the same mandates and regulations as every other company selling policies under ACA. The idea behind the plan was to ensure market competition in the many areas where only one or two companies were writing policies. A number of conservative politicians crowed about how the efficiency of private sector competition would allow for-profit companies to easily defeat the bloated, incompetent and wasteful federal bureaucracy in its attempt to sell insurance in the private market.

So, what happened? The lobbyists for the insurance industry who were writing large parts of ACA for the GOP took one look at the idea and shouted "Whoa!" They knew that a government program playing under the same rules but without the million dollar salaries and shareholder profits would easily out-compete the for-profit companies.

The Vermont program had its genesis at that moment. Eventually, as the costs of private insurance under ACA rise high enough, the nation will again turn to the government option as the way to transition to single payer. This will come on the national agenda in ten years or so.

Who sold you that pile of bull shit?
ACA is government subsidizing private insurance companies only. There is no "government operated insurance".

DUH

 

[Gadawg73]

"Friend of mine" in no way equates to "most people". That's a blatant fallacy right there.

"Most people" who don't have HI it's fair to say don't have it because they can't afford it. In this country it's been priced out of reach for a disintegrating middle class. And then along come the apologists for the disintegrative forces to keep them down... which frankly is a sycophancy that gives me the urge to

Related:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TWuO5dBYjo

OK, if they can not afford it then they need to get an extra job.
Called responsibility.

^^ Sociopath.

Had you watched the video you would have seen the issue is expense, not "getting another job" for medication that costs sixty thousand fucking dollars for a single dose. And you would have further seen that while supplemental assistance is available, that woman showing in the link makes too much money to qualify. So the one solution that would work for her is for one or both of them to quit working.

So much for your "responsibility". You guys who can't bend over far enough for the Corporatocracy at the expense of the common citizen put me in need of some medication myself.

$60,000 for one dose of a drug?

And you want taxpayers to fund that scam?
You believe everything you hear and read.
And claim I am the "sociopath".

As soon as we pay quack prices for drugs at 60K a dose the sooner this country is bankrupt.

 

[Gadawg73]

Blank check health care has to end.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Been treated in the military, in Europe and in Canada.

Nothing to be afraid of, guys, except the truth.

Your problem, not mine, because this is happening and will continue to happen.

American private insurance industry made it happen.

 

[Katzndogz]

Single payer has worked for the VA let's see if it works the same way for VT.

 

[Gadawg73]

Single payer works in some countries.

I want a split system.
If you do not pay for your own health insurance then your company can opt to put you in single payer market.
Same with all government employees.

Or you can purchase your own private health insurance from a private health insurance company with your voucher from your company and/or your own cash.

That would solve the problem fast.
Everyone that rides on the back of someone else to pay for their health insurance takes what they get.
No cry babies.

 

[Pogo]

OK, if they can not afford it then they need to get an extra job.
Called responsibility.

^^ Sociopath.

Had you watched the video you would have seen the issue is expense, not "getting another job" for medication that costs sixty thousand fucking dollars for a single dose. And you would have further seen that while supplemental assistance is available, that woman showing in the link makes too much money to qualify. So the one solution that would work for her is for one or both of them to quit working.

So much for your "responsibility". You guys who can't bend over far enough for the Corporatocracy at the expense of the common citizen put me in need of some medication myself.

$60,000 for one dose of a drug?

And you want taxpayers to fund that scam?
You believe everything you hear and read.
And claim I am the "sociopath".

As soon as we pay quack prices for drugs at 60K a dose the sooner this country is bankrupt.

Without knowing anything about the drug, I'm sure it IS a scam. That's the point here. This is the corporate puppeteer you and your ilk shill for at the expense of the common citizen with a dismissive "get another job".

Yeah well fuck that. Get another system and stop enabling the your masters the profiteers.


"Sociopath" has nothing to do with "what one hears and reads". It mean you lack the capacity for empathy. And if it's not obvious, no that's not a good thing.

 

[Gadawg73]

^^ Sociopath.

Had you watched the video you would have seen the issue is expense, not "getting another job" for medication that costs sixty thousand fucking dollars for a single dose. And you would have further seen that while supplemental assistance is available, that woman showing in the link makes too much money to qualify. So the one solution that would work for her is for one or both of them to quit working.

So much for your "responsibility". You guys who can't bend over far enough for the Corporatocracy at the expense of the common citizen put me in need of some medication myself.

$60,000 for one dose of a drug?

And you want taxpayers to fund that scam?
You believe everything you hear and read.
And claim I am the "sociopath".

As soon as we pay quack prices for drugs at 60K a dose the sooner this country is bankrupt.

Without knowing anything about the drug, I'm sure it IS a scam. That's the point here. This is the corporate puppeteer you and your ilk shill for at the expense of the common citizen with a dismissive "get another job".

Yeah well fuck that. Get another system and stop enabling the your masters the profiteers.


"Sociopath" has nothing to do with "what one hears and reads". It mean you lack the capacity for empathy. And if it's not obvious, no that's not a good thing.

"you and your ilk"

Punk

 

[HenryBHough]

Relatives living in Vermont say this was instituted by New Yorkers who have been buying up property in Vermont to escape the city on weekends and to have a place to vote for a second time. Taxes in Vermont, especially on rural farm properties, have become so outrageous that real Vermonters are taking the money and leaving for Florida. Property tax won't pay for the socialized medical system and New Yorkers will avoid income tax on money they earned in the city so will largely get a free ride if they can find a doctor or hospital still open in Vermont.

 

[Pogo]

$60,000 for one dose of a drug?

And you want taxpayers to fund that scam?
You believe everything you hear and read.
And claim I am the "sociopath".

As soon as we pay quack prices for drugs at 60K a dose the sooner this country is bankrupt.

Without knowing anything about the drug, I'm sure it IS a scam. That's the point here. This is the corporate puppeteer you and your ilk shill for at the expense of the common citizen with a dismissive "get another job".

Yeah well fuck that. Get another system and stop enabling the your masters the profiteers.


"Sociopath" has nothing to do with "what one hears and reads". It mean you lack the capacity for empathy. And if it's not obvious, no that's not a good thing.

"you and your ilk"

Punk

It's Scots. Look it up.

 

[Pogo]

Relatives living in Vermont say this was instituted by New Yorkers who have been buying up property in Vermont to escape the city on weekends and to have a place to vote for a second time. Taxes in Vermont, especially on rural farm properties, have become so outrageous that real Vermonters are taking the money and leaving for Florida. Property tax won't pay for the socialized medical system and New Yorkers will avoid income tax on money they earned in the city so will largely get a free ride if they can find a doctor or hospital still open in Vermont.

Hardly -- if you had property in Vermont, why on earth would you want to go to Florida, let alone live there?

No, this is home grown. I've still got close friends with rural farm property and they told me about this years ago. Nor do they have tax issues; they're actually expanding their property. FWIW.

But there's always a member of the Ilks Club willing to step up to the plate and bellow "it'll never work". Whether it's a health care system, a green energy project, any kind of social advancement at all, neither snow nor rain nor gloom of night will stay the naysayers from their self-appointed rounds...