What gives us the right?

[Redfish]

Sure it is, he made the assertion not me, but it is true. You either favor the government dictating how people should leave or you do not.

The government of the USA should only tell people in the USA how to live, not the rest of the world.

That doesn't make sense though. Why should it be able to tell me how to live but not some citizen in Russia? Because of where someone is randomly born?

At least we have shown that you actually have no problem with governments controlling people you just seem to have more respect for russian citizens than american.

OMG, time for your paxil. better take it with a shot of vodka because you have clearly lost your powers of comprehension this morning.

 

[Rocko]

Until the interests of the USA were being threatened, we should not get involved. Selling supplies to one side is far different from getting involved militarily.

BTW, how were we "going into WWII" before Pearl Harbor?

So as long as they were just killing off the Jews no need to be involved? No speaking out against the atrocities? Just "shhhhhh" until they piss on us?

How many genocides in Africa have we gotten in the middle of? Did we get into the China/Tibet conflict? Did we get in the middle of the China/Japan conflict before WW2?

We are not even consistent in our moral outrage, which makes it even more disengenuous.

So, because we haven't always been consistent, you believe we should shut our mouths all together. You're a dumbass.

 

[Redfish]

The government of the USA should only tell people in the USA how to live, not the rest of the world.

That doesn't make sense though. Why should it be able to tell me how to live but not some citizen in Russia? Because of where someone is randomly born?

At least we have shown that you actually have no problem with governments controlling people you just seem to have more respect for russian citizens than american.

Hello! Anyone in there?

It's a straw man argument in the first place. No one is forcing Russians to bend to our will regarding gay rights. There's nothing wrong with arguing the Russians should give up the homophobia. Unless you have a problem with freedom of speech too?

There is a difference between private citizens making such a plea than for our government to do it, or sanction it.

 

[Unkotare]

You rant and rave that the US should convince the rest of the world to treat gays the way we treat them, but you are just fine with muslims being silent on an attack that killed 3000 innocent people.

Another false premise. Does everything you claim rest on a false premise? That's what ignorance will do to ya.

 

[ClosedCaption]

“To the people who are upset about their hard-earned tax money going to things they don’t like: welcome to the f*cking club. Reimburse me for the Iraq war and oil subsidies, and diaphragms are on me!”

Jon Stewart

 

[LibertyLemming]

It's not one or the other dumb ass.

Sure it is, he made the assertion not me, but it is true. You either favor the government dictating how people should leave or you do not.

Wrong.

Liberty does not include the liberty to take someone's liberty away from them.

Simple concept, but so many get it so wrong all the time.

Thus we have laws, enforced by our government employees, to ensure people don't run around taking our liberty away from us. For example, stealing our stuff. As another example, killing us. Still another example, raping our women and beating our children.

Well, obviously it doesn't work. Secondly, our government is the biggest taker of liberty in the world.

Finally, I am still right. You favor the government telling people what to do. I do not. It is one or the other.

 

[Rocko]

OMG, the liberal mind is a very confusing and confused thing. You are incapable of staying on topic.

Yes, slavery is wrong
Yes, discrimination is wrong

No one is defending those things.

Yes, Russia is wrong for discriminating against gays. But that is something that is up to the Russian people to accept or change----------------NOT US.

and we have no right to tell them that they are wrong to believe differently from us.

You are insane if you don't think you have a right to speak out against immorality.

Of course we all have the right to speak out against what we consider immoral.

But we don't have the right to tell other countries what they should consider immoral.

I know its kind of a fine line, and that you libs have a hard time with it. But I am trying to get you to THINK

You just contradicted everything you've said in this thread. You are a moron.

 

[LibertyLemming]

That doesn't make sense though. Why should it be able to tell me how to live but not some citizen in Russia? Because of where someone is randomly born?

At least we have shown that you actually have no problem with governments controlling people you just seem to have more respect for russian citizens than american.

Hello! Anyone in there?

It's a straw man argument in the first place. No one is forcing Russians to bend to our will regarding gay rights. There's nothing wrong with arguing the Russians should give up the homophobia. Unless you have a problem with freedom of speech too?

There is a difference between private citizens making such a plea than for our government to do it, or sanction it.

How is there a difference? Government is an illusion buddy. It is just a buncha individualists like you and me

 

[LibertyLemming]

You are insane if you don't think you have a right to speak out against immorality.

Of course we all have the right to speak out against what we consider immoral.

But we don't have the right to tell other countries what they should consider immoral.

I know its kind of a fine line, and that you libs have a hard time with it. But I am trying to get you to THINK

You just contradicted everything you've said in this thread. You are a moron.

yeah I've been trying to illustrate that with little success

 

[NYcarbineer]

That doesn't make sense though. Why should it be able to tell me how to live but not some citizen in Russia? Because of where someone is randomly born?

At least we have shown that you actually have no problem with governments controlling people you just seem to have more respect for russian citizens than american.

Hello! Anyone in there?

It's a straw man argument in the first place. No one is forcing Russians to bend to our will regarding gay rights. There's nothing wrong with arguing the Russians should give up the homophobia. Unless you have a problem with freedom of speech too?

There is a difference between private citizens making such a plea than for our government to do it, or sanction it.

Why? The government is of the People, remember?

btw, a very basic question:

How many gay athletes should the President have put in his delegation in order to be at or below the maximum that you would deem acceptable?

 

[Redfish]

Hello! Anyone in there?

It's a straw man argument in the first place. No one is forcing Russians to bend to our will regarding gay rights. There's nothing wrong with arguing the Russians should give up the homophobia. Unless you have a problem with freedom of speech too?

There is a difference between private citizens making such a plea than for our government to do it, or sanction it.

Why? The government is of the People, remember?

btw, a very basic question:

How many gay athletes should the President have put in his delegation in order to be at or below the maximum that you would deem acceptable?

We should send athletes, not gay-athletes, black-athletes, white-athletes, or any other kind of hyphenated athletes.

they should go and participate in their sport and try to win medals. Nothing more.

 

[Redfish]

You are insane if you don't think you have a right to speak out against immorality.

Of course we all have the right to speak out against what we consider immoral.

But we don't have the right to tell other countries what they should consider immoral.

I know its kind of a fine line, and that you libs have a hard time with it. But I am trying to get you to THINK

You just contradicted everything you've said in this thread. You are a moron.

only in your small mind. individuals speaking out in the USA under the first amendment is quite different from a country taking a stand against another country's morals and ethics.

Its none of our fricken business how Russia or saudi arabia treat gays in their countries. It is not our role to convert the world to our standards.

You display the arrogance that causes most of the world to hate us.

 

[Redfish]

You rant and rave that the US should convince the rest of the world to treat gays the way we treat them, but you are just fine with muslims being silent on an attack that killed 3000 innocent people.

Another false premise. Does everything you claim rest on a false premise? That's what ignorance will do to ya.

So are you angry at the muslim clerics and leaders of muslim countries for not condemning the 9/11 attacks?

 

[LibertyLemming]

Of course we all have the right to speak out against what we consider immoral.

But we don't have the right to tell other countries what they should consider immoral.

I know its kind of a fine line, and that you libs have a hard time with it. But I am trying to get you to THINK

You just contradicted everything you've said in this thread. You are a moron.

only in your small mind. individuals speaking out in the USA under the first amendment is quite different from a country taking a stand against another country's morals and ethics.

Its none of our fricken business how Russia or saudi arabia treat gays in their countries. It is not our role to convert the world to our standards.

You display the arrogance that causes most of the world to hate us.

You seem to not understand that the government is nothing more than individuals

 

[Unkotare]

You rant and rave that the US should convince the rest of the world to treat gays the way we treat them, but you are just fine with muslims being silent on an attack that killed 3000 innocent people.

Another false premise. Does everything you claim rest on a false premise? That's what ignorance will do to ya.

So are you angry at the muslim clerics and leaders of muslim countries for not condemning the 9/11 attacks?

Have you been so thoroughly beaten down in this thread that you've been reduced to outright lies now? It has been pointed out to you by more than one poster that Muslim leaders and clerics did condemn the attacks, even in countries often openly hostile to the US.

 

[Contumacious]

You rant and rave that the US should convince the rest of the world to treat gays the way we treat them, but you are just fine with muslims being silent on an attack that killed 3000 innocent people.

Another false premise. Does everything you claim rest on a false premise? That's what ignorance will do to ya.

So are you angry at the muslim clerics and leaders of muslim countries for not condemning the 9/11 attacks?

So are you angry at Truman for fucking the Palestinians out of their land?

So are you angry at the US administrations which have subsidized their genocide ? Over 100 BBBBBBBBBBBBBBillion dollars since 1949 !!!!!!!!!!!!

So are you angry that the US allows Israel to invade Lebanon, kill women and children whenever they are in the mood?

So are you angry that the US for arbitrarily invading Iraq?

No? So Shut the fuck up.

.

 

[Redfish]

Another false premise. Does everything you claim rest on a false premise? That's what ignorance will do to ya.

So are you angry at the muslim clerics and leaders of muslim countries for not condemning the 9/11 attacks?

So are you angry at Truman for fucking the Palestinians out of their land?

So are you angry at the US administrations which have subsidized their genocide ? Over 100 BBBBBBBBBBBBBBillion dollars since 1949 !!!!!!!!!!!!

So are you angry that the US allows Israel to invade Lebanon, kill women and children whenever they are in the mood?

So are you angry that the US for arbitrarily invading Iraq?

No? So Shut the fuck up.

.

Yes, I am angry about all of those things, and they prove my point. The USA should not be sticking its nose in the affairs, morals, governments, or laws of any other country.

You libs bitch about Iraq and other stupid wars like viet nam, but you are fine with us trying to tell the rest of the world how they should live and what they should believe.

YOU are the hypocrites.

 

[LibertyLemming]

So are you angry at the muslim clerics and leaders of muslim countries for not condemning the 9/11 attacks?

So are you angry at Truman for fucking the Palestinians out of their land?

So are you angry at the US administrations which have subsidized their genocide ? Over 100 BBBBBBBBBBBBBBillion dollars since 1949 !!!!!!!!!!!!

So are you angry that the US allows Israel to invade Lebanon, kill women and children whenever they are in the mood?

So are you angry that the US for arbitrarily invading Iraq?

No? So Shut the fuck up.

.

Yes, I am angry about all of those things, and they prove my point. The USA should not be sticking its nose in the affairs, morals, governments, or laws of any other country.

You libs bitch about Iraq and other stupid wars like viet nam, but you are fine with us trying to tell the rest of the world how they should live and what they should believe.

YOU are the hypocrites.

You realize you are affording foreigners more respect from our government than you would afford your fellow citizens? You don't want the USA government dictating to foreigners how to live but you are completely fine with it dictating to everyone in the USA.

 

[Redfish]

Another false premise. Does everything you claim rest on a false premise? That's what ignorance will do to ya.

So are you angry at the muslim clerics and leaders of muslim countries for not condemning the 9/11 attacks?

Have you been so thoroughly beaten down in this thread that you've been reduced to outright lies now? It has been pointed out to you by more than one poster that Muslim leaders and clerics did condemn the attacks, even in countries often openly hostile to the US.

Is that so? then give me a quote by Ahmadinijad, King Abdullah, any Iranian ayatollah, or Assad condemning the 9/11 attacks.

Beaten down? I think not. I have destroyed every argument and deflection put forth by you or any other liberal. Your left wing hypocrisy makes you look like fools on every topic.

 

[Redfish]

So are you angry at Truman for fucking the Palestinians out of their land?

So are you angry at the US administrations which have subsidized their genocide ? Over 100 BBBBBBBBBBBBBBillion dollars since 1949 !!!!!!!!!!!!

So are you angry that the US allows Israel to invade Lebanon, kill women and children whenever they are in the mood?

So are you angry that the US for arbitrarily invading Iraq?

No? So Shut the fuck up.

.

Yes, I am angry about all of those things, and they prove my point. The USA should not be sticking its nose in the affairs, morals, governments, or laws of any other country.

You libs bitch about Iraq and other stupid wars like viet nam, but you are fine with us trying to tell the rest of the world how they should live and what they should believe.

YOU are the hypocrites.

You realize you are affording foreigners more respect from our government than you would afford your fellow citizens? You don't want the USA government dictating to foreigners how to live but you are completely fine with it dictating to everyone in the USA.

American citizens are subject to the laws of the USA, those laws dictate how we live. Those laws do not apply outside the USA. The laws that other countries choose to follow are none of our fuckin business.