Zone1 what happens after death?

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I think it has. You'd have to contrast that with the path not taken without philosophy. Your comments on this are pretty shocking.

Sure, it had its uses . Coming up with democracy, for example. But 5 year old can puzzle out democracy on the playground all by themselves, when deciding what game to play.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I'm going to go with George Wald's reasoning over you.

That doesn't matter, facts are facts. They will remain whether you go with him or Charlie Manson.

 

[ding]

Sure, it had its uses . Coming up with democracy, for example. But 5 year old can puzzle out democracy on the playground all by themselves, when deciding what game to play.

That's nice.

 

[ding]

That doesn't matter, facts are facts. They will remain whether you go with him or Charlie Manson.

Still picking George Wald's reasoning over you.

 

[Lastamender]

Once you are dead, your brain is as well - as such your "consciousness" doesn't exist anymore, therefore you won't find out anything.

life is full of surprises. Why should death be any different?

 

[BreezeWood]

the evidence requires perception -

"Wow, how complex and beautiful! It must be designed!"

well, that is the point - the transformation is designed by the physiology's own unique spiritual content and that of all cicadas the physical process they miraculously have perfected.

as is evolution its presence and alterable consequences will always be an anathema for the drop dead crowd - ff.

 

[Kruska]

Your failure to recognize functional advantage as the reason for why belief in a higher power (aka religion) has existed in overwhelming numbers over the entirety of mankind.

Simply because scientists and those that are knowledgeable in science - are naturally/logically far outnumbered by those that prefer an easy life and not switching on their brains, aka simply chose to rely onto religion, that told them that the Earth is flat, is the center of the universe and that the sun therefore revolves around planet earth. etc. etc. etc. !!!

That religions ALL refute/ignore their own previous teachings is known - after they killed and brought millions to the stake, and being confronted with irrefutable scientific FACTS.

Science is destined to continue it's path - thus religion and it's believers are inadvertently becoming more and more obsolete.

 

[Kruska]

life is full of surprises. Why should death be any different?

Obviously you still need to figure out the difference between "LIFE" and "DEATH".

 

[Lastamender]

Obviously you still need to figure out the difference between "LIFE" and "DEATH".

It is obvious to the living.

 

[Red Front]

Simply because scientists and those that are knowledgeable in science - are naturally/logically far outnumbered by those that prefer an easy life and not switching on their brains, aka simply chose to rely onto religion, that told them that the Earth is flat, is the center of the universe and that the sun therefore revolves around planet earth. etc. etc. etc. !!!

That religions ALL refute/ignore their own previous teachings is known - after they killed and brought millions to the stake, and being confronted with irrefutable scientific FACTS.

Science is destined to continue it's path - thus religion and it's believers are inadvertently becoming more and more obsolete.

Both the Bible thumpers and the atheist materialists, have turned off their brains. As an atheist-materialist, who rejects the reality of the paranormal, you're no more rational or applying critical thinking than a Christian fundamentalist, thumping his Bible.

 

[Blues Man]

We know exactly what happens after death

 

[ding]

Simply because scientists and those that are knowledgeable in science - are naturally/logically far outnumbered by those that prefer an easy life and not switching on their brains, aka simply chose to rely onto religion, that told them that the Earth is flat, is the center of the universe and that the sun therefore revolves around planet earth. etc. etc. etc. !!!

That religions ALL refute/ignore their own previous teachings is known - after they killed and brought millions to the stake, and being confronted with irrefutable scientific FACTS.

Science is destined to continue it's path - thus religion and it's believers are inadvertently becoming more and more obsolete.

Like I said before... Seems like you are selective in your application of science when the science doesn't suit your worldview.

There are two components to natural selection; functional advantage and transfer of functional advantage to the next generation. If belief in a higher power (aka religion) did not provide a functional advantage then according to the Darwinian principle of natural selection it would have died out long ago.

 

[ding]

Consciousness did indeed evolve unless of course you believe life went from non-self aware single cell organisms to highly complex, self aware beings magically. ding 231027 Saqfpc01020

Yes, consciousness did indeed evolve.

There have been 5 stages of evolution of space and time; cosmic evolution, stellar evolution, chemical evolution, biological evolution and evolution of consciousness.

In his book, "The Phenomenon of Man" Pierre Teilhard de Chardin describes evolution as a process that leads to increasing complexity, culminating in a Christ consciousness. He limited his observations to biological evolution but the same observation can be made about all stages of the evolution of space and time. The complexification of matter increased until it naturally and logically made the leap to the next stage. The last and final stage of evolution of space and time is consciousness. So it seems logical that consciousness would also increase in complexity until it to made the leap to the next stage which Chardin describes as Christ consciousness.

1. The universe began as a soup of subatomic particles and radiation and naturally and logically complexified into hydrogen and helium. This is what is called the cosmic stage of the evolution of space and time.
2. Hydrogen and helium then naturally and logically complexified into structures like stars and galaxies. This is what is called the stellar stage of the evolution of space and time.
3. From the life cycle of galaxies and stars all of the other elements and compounds were naturally and logically formed. This is what is called the chemical stage of the evolution of space and time.
4. As chemical evolution naturally and logically complexified the leap to biological life was made. This is what is called the biological stage of the evolution of space and time.
5. As life logically and naturally evolved and complexified the leap to consciousness was made. This is what is called the conscious stage of of the evolution of space and time.

So we can see that each successive stage of the evolution of space and time complexified until it made the leap to the next stage. And it did so naturally and logically. So Chardin's assumption that consciousness will make the leap to a Christ consciousness is logical because it presumes that consciousness will evolve and complexify and make the leap to the next level because every other stage of the evolution of space and time did so too before it.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

well, that is the point

And it's an error.

 

[Red Front]

We know exactly what happens after death

That's the biological body. We might have another body, comprised of thoughts, energy..etc. A body or bodies (plural), comprised of material/s not yet identified by our present science. If you object, fine, no problem. I also object, to a certain degree, with respect to the claims of survival of human consciousness after the death of the biological body. We as personalities, consciousness, mind, might just be an emergent phenomenon of the biological brain. Maybe you're correct, BUT, the paranormal is real, hence before we can completely dismiss the possibility of life after death, we have to establish what the heck are these beings who are identifying themselves as "spirits", even the "spirits of the dead". They call themselves ghosts, demons..etc. Maybe they're ETs?

Until you become a true, genuine truth seeker (real scientists go wherever the evidence leads them, they don't close their minds or take strong positions, on practically anything) and investigate the existence of the paranormal, and are able to answer the questions I just asked, you're just the atheist-materialist equivalent of a Christian Bible Thumper. You're just another dogmatic religionist. Atheist-Materialism is your religion. You're just as dogmatic and close minded as the Bible Thumpers. Just as bad as they are.

 

[Blues Man]

That's the biological body. We might have another body, comprised of thoughts, energy..etc. A body or bodies (plural), comprised of material/s not yet identified by our present science. If you object, fine, no problem. I also object, to a certain degree, with respect to the claims of survival of human consciousness after the death of the biological body. We as personalities, consciousness, mind, might just be an emergent phenomenon of the biological brain. Maybe you're correct, BUT, the paranormal is real, hence before we can completely dismiss the possibility of life after death, we have to establish what the heck are these beings who are identifying themselves as "spirits", even the "spirits of the dead". They call themselves ghosts, demons..etc. Maybe they're ETs?

Until you become a true, genuine truth seeker (real scientists go wherever the evidence leads them, they don't close their minds or take a strong positions, on practically anything) and investigate the existence of the paranormal, and are able to answer the questions I just asked, you're just the atheist-materialist equivalent of a Christian Bible Thumper. You're just another dogmatic religionist. Atheist-Materialism is your religion. You're just as dogmatic and close minded as the Bible Thumpers. Just as bad as they are.

Personally I don't believe in the paranormal. IMO it's all a function of the quantum field.
I don't think the mind can be separated from the brain at all but the quantum field could possible preserve some of the traces of your mind via entangled particles.

Quantum mechanics is really weird and we are only just realizing how prevalent it is in nature. Photosynthesis is now believed to rely on the quantum realm where a photon takes every possible path simultaneously which is how a photosynthetic reaction can occur in less than a trillionth of a second

And you seem to want to try and distill far more about me from a single post that was half tongue in cheek than is possible. So maybe you better check your own close mindedness and your penchant for jumping to conclusions on such sparse evidence.

 

[Donald H]

- So Chardin's assumption that consciousness will make the leap to a Christ consciousness is logical because it presumes that consciousness will evolve and complexify and make the leap to the next level because every other stage of the evolution of space and time did so too before it.

No, it's not logical. The greatest amount of what might be called chrisst consciousness is now in the past and now it's rapidly on the decline.

Not only did the Catholics accept Darwinian evolution, the more relevant part of it is that they threw out creation at the same time.

And then told their mindless flock that they could believe whatever they like.

 

[Red Front]

Personally I don't believe in the paranormal. IMO it's all a function of the quantum field.
I don't think the mind can be separated from the brain at all but the quantum field could possible preserve some of the traces of your mind via entangled particles.

Quantum mechanics is really weird and we are only just realizing how prevalent it is in nature. Photosynthesis is now believed to rely on the quantum realm where a photon takes every possible path simultaneously which is how a photosynthetic reaction can occur in less than a trillionth of a second

And you seem to want to try and distill far more about me from a single post that was half tongue in cheek than is possible. So maybe you better check your own close mindedness and your penchant for jumping to conclusions on such sparse evidence.

Personally I don't believe in the paranormal.

You're running from it, because you've already come to terms with "the fact" that there's no life after death. You're in the exact same position I was in twelve years ago. I had completely freed myself from the need to live forever. I was comfortable knowing that this life has an end and I actually was able to concentrate on this life, making it better for myself and everyone I care about.

I had overcome, conquered the need to be immortal. I figured why even dwell on nothingness (bodily death)? I will just focus on the life I have now, which is the only life I'm ever going to have. There are no gods, demons, angels, all of that is a bunch of Bull Hockey. I'm a sexy realist, a rational atheist-materialist, I even threw in some Marxist-Leninism. I didn't want to investigate the paranormal. I was incredulous but after being challenged by someone, I took the offer in order to humiliate him. I ended up experiencing the paranormal and having to change my materialist paradigm of reality.

I still believe moral, virtuous atheist-materialists, are superior to "righteous theists". Goodness for goodness sake is morally superior to goodness to stay out of hell or inherit eternal life. Being virtuous despite recognizing the finality of life is superior to theistic morality. Acknowledging that one's existence has an end and yet still being a good person, that's more impressive than religious morality. Not becoming a destructive, angry, nihilistic, atheist SOB, but rather, being virtuous, you have empathy, you can be compassionate, you're a responsible, caring person. If there is a God in heaven, I see him honoring such atheists, even more so than those religious holly-rollers, who grovel at his feet.

I sympathize with you, but nonetheless, the paranormal is real. You're at a disadvantage in life, if you don't recognize the various sources that have an influence over your life (your health, psyche, finances, relationships..etc.).


IMO it's all a function of the quantum field.

The human mind, the paranormal, it might all be connected, heavily influenced and dependent upon the "quantum" world. I don't believe in the supernatural, I believe in the paranormal. Both of those criteria aren't the same. The paranormal is 100% natural. The natural vs supernatural dichotomy is BS. Everything that exists is natural, including spirits, ghosts, demons, angels, God, whatever we call it. It's all 100% part of reality or nature. There's no "supernatural" and the paranormal, is only something "abnormal" or "para" normal and rare, because in the modern, materialist, scientific age, we ignore or run away from it. We condition ourselves to reject it, hence we hardly ever experience or recognize it, if ever.


I don't think the mind can be separated from the brain at all but the quantum field could possible preserve some of the traces of your mind via entangled particles.

Maybe, it's all just quantum physics. I agree. Maybe we have a "quantum body", a body made of some other material or energy than the biological. Maybe thoughts, the mind, has a body. I don't know, maybe I'm talking crap, but I do know what I experienced, and it's "paranormal". Those intelligent entities that were communicating with me through those radio-sweepers really do exist.

Quantum mechanics is really weird and we are only just realizing how prevalent it is in nature. Photosynthesis is now believed to rely on the quantum realm where a photon takes every possible path simultaneously which is how a photosynthetic reaction can occur in less than a trillionth of a second And you seem to want to try and distill far more about me from a single post that was half tongue in cheek than is possible. So maybe you better check your own close mindedness and your penchant for jumping to conclusions on such sparse evidence.

I already experienced and witnessed the evidence for the paranormal, and so did my wife and children, so we know it's true. There are beings, who are generally invisible to our five senses, yet are just as real as you and me. They identify themselves as spirits, sometimes "the dead", "ghosts", the mischievous ones will identify themselves as "demons", "devils"..etc. Poltergeists are also real, because I had one, for the duration of my research with the radio-sweepers. Objects moving around by themselves in front of my family and I. It wasn't nearly as dramatic as the movie "Poltergeist", it was just simple stuff. Cabinet doors opening and closing by themselves, a spatula flying off the kitchen counter, headphones sliding across the desk.

I'm surprised, being that you're a genuine seeker of truth, that you haven't asked me how to conduct your own study. Why haven't you inquired on how to organize your own research into this phenomena? I already imbedded some videos showing what's involved. It's easy to set-up your own lab or workshop at home. Just let me know, if you're interested, and I will assist you in your effort to establish contact, with the spirits. It will transform your life, and view of reality. Maybe you just don't want that, I know I didn't.

I repeat, you're at a disadvantage though, if you're a strict materialist, who rejects the paranormal, for the reason I mentioned earlier. You can be manipulated, even "cursed" by someone and you won't have a clue (the knowledge or awareness), to recognize it for what it is (recognizing it will often neutralize it). Maybe all of this paranormal stuff, is just generated by the biological brain. Human consciousness can generate all of this phenomena. Maybe it's true that when we die there's nothing, because the biological "hardware" (i.e. the brain) that generates consciousness is gone. But again, the paranormal is real. Investigate, research it and you'll see for yourself.

 

[BreezeWood]

well, that is the point - the transformation is designed by the physiology's own unique spiritual content and that of all cicadas the physical process they miraculously have perfected.

And it's an error.

no, what's more is only the cicada's unique spiritual content is able to make their own physiological transformation from one being to another - a land creature to an avian.

the ability surly is relayed by means of the heavens, metaphysically from one generation to the next - a connection even the drop dead crowd can not deny - ff.

 

[Blues Man]

Personally I don't believe in the paranormal.

You're running from it, because you've already come to terms with "the fact" that there's no life after death. You're in the exact same position I was in twelve years ago. I had completely freed myself from the need to live forever. I was comfortable knowing that this life has an end and I actually was able to concentrate on this life, making it better for myself and everyone I care about.

I had overcome, conquered the need to be immortal. I figured why even dwell on nothingness (bodily death)? I will just focus on the life I have now, which is the only life I'm ever going to have. There are no gods, demons, angels, all of that is a bunch of Bull Hockey. I'm a sexy realist, a rational atheist-materialist, I even threw in some Marxist-Leninism. I didn't want to investigate the paranormal. I was incredulous but after being challenged by someone, I took the offer in order to humiliate him. I ended up experiencing the paranormal and having to change my materialist paradigm of reality.

I still believe moral, virtuous atheist-materialists, are superior to "righteous theists". Goodness for goodness sake is morally superior to goodness to stay out of hell or inherit eternal life. Being virtuous despite recognizing the finality of life is superior to theistic morality. Acknowledging that one's existence has an end and yet still being a good person, that's more impressive than religious morality. Not becoming a destructive, angry, nihilistic, atheist SOB, but rather, being virtuous, you have empathy, you can be compassionate, you're a responsible, caring person. If there is a God in heaven, I see him honoring such atheists, even more so than those religious holly-rollers, who grovel at his feet.

I sympathize with you, but nonetheless, the paranormal is real. You're at a disadvantage in life, if you don't recognize the various sources that have an influence over your life (your health, psyche, finances, relationships..etc.).


IMO it's all a function of the quantum field.

The human mind, the paranormal, it might all be connected, heavily influenced and dependent upon the "quantum" world. I don't believe in the supernatural, I believe in the paranormal. Both of those criteria aren't the same. The paranormal is 100% natural. The natural vs supernatural dichotomy is BS. Everything that exists is natural, including spirits, ghosts, demons, angels, God, whatever we call it. It's all 100% part of reality or nature. There's no "supernatural" and the paranormal, is only something "abnormal" or "para" normal and rare, because in the modern, materialist, scientific age, we ignore or run away from it. We condition ourselves to reject it, hence we hardly ever experience or recognize it, if ever.


I don't think the mind can be separated from the brain at all but the quantum field could possible preserve some of the traces of your mind via entangled particles.

Maybe, it's all just quantum physics. I agree. Maybe we have a "quantum body", a body made of some other material or energy than the biological. Maybe thoughts, the mind, has a body. I don't know, maybe I'm talking crap, but I do know what I experienced, and it's "paranormal". Those intelligent entities that were communicating with me through those radio-sweepers really do exist.

Quantum mechanics is really weird and we are only just realizing how prevalent it is in nature. Photosynthesis is now believed to rely on the quantum realm where a photon takes every possible path simultaneously which is how a photosynthetic reaction can occur in less than a trillionth of a second And you seem to want to try and distill far more about me from a single post that was half tongue in cheek than is possible. So maybe you better check your own close mindedness and your penchant for jumping to conclusions on such sparse evidence.

I already experienced and witnessed the evidence for the paranormal, and so did my wife and children, so we know it's true. There are beings, who are generally invisible to our five senses, yet are just as real as you and me. They identify themselves as spirits, sometimes "the dead", "ghosts", the mischievous ones will identify themselves as "demons", "devils"..etc. Poltergeists are also real, because I had one, for the duration of my research with the radio-sweepers. Objects moving around by themselves in front of my family and I. It wasn't nearly as dramatic as the movie "Poltergeist", it was just simple stuff. Cabinet doors opening and closing by themselves, a spatula flying off the kitchen counter, headphones sliding across the desk.

I'm surprised, being that you're a genuine seeker of truth, that you haven't asked me how to conduct your own study. Why haven't you inquired on how to organize your own research into this phenomena? I already imbedded some videos showing what's involved. It's easy to set-up your own lab or workshop at home. Just let me know, if you're interested, and I will assist you in your effort to establish contact, with the spirits. It will transform your life, and view of reality. Maybe you just don't want that, I know I didn't.

I repeat, you're at a disadvantage though, if you're a strict materialist, who rejects the paranormal, for the reason I mentioned earlier. You can be manipulated, even "cursed" by someone and you won't have a clue (the knowledge or awareness), to recognize it for what it is (recognizing it will often neutralize it). Maybe all of this paranormal stuff, is just generated by the biological brain. Human consciousness can generate all of this phenomena. Maybe it's true that when we die there's nothing, because the biological "hardware" (i.e. the brain) that generates consciousness is gone. But again, the paranormal is real. Investigate, research it and you'll see for yourself.

The term paranormal does not specifically refer to life after death. And I'm not running from anything I told you my thoughts on the matter.

And I don't believe that you saw a ghost. Just like I don't believe Elvis is still alive even though people still say they see him. There would be far more evidence that ghosts exist if they really did.

And I never said I was a "strict" materialist. I can't help it if my discussion of the quantum field was beyond your understanding.