What was the meaning of the word infringed in the 2nd Amendment?

[Koios]

So now dropping "weapons of war" on foreign soil is not violence?

Why don't you ask the innocent victims of US bombings that and see what their opinion is on that one?

And I have shown you that your war on drugs has done nothing to lower drug use even with the spraying of thousands of hectares of coca fields in the Andes at the cost of billions of dollars.

It's just like your gun control theory: useless in the real world.

Isn't Richard Nixon dead? Did he leave his war on drugs to me in his will?

Drugs like cocaine and opiates are too dangerous to legalize, fool! It isn't going to be pie in the sky if they are legalized, fool!

says you. Those drugs are only dangerous to those who choose to use them and if someone does want to use them then it's none of your fucking business.

They can go in there and cut the coca down by themselves. Maybe the nations will pay them to do it and convert those plantation to producing something useful. They have no right on Earth growing coca for export.

You mean something you think is useful.

5 Years After: Portugal's Drug Decriminalization Policy Shows Positive Results: Scientific American

Ridiculous. There's huge collateral damage, to families and communities, not to mention crime by those wanting to fund their habit.

For godsake, we're running a goddamn country and not a fucking free-for-all within certain borders, as the retarded fucking Libertarians would like to believe, because they fucking clueless about what makes a nation great.

 

[Dubya]

So now dropping "weapons of war" on foreign soil is not violence?

Why don't you ask the innocent victims of US bombings that and see what their opinion is on that one?

And I have shown you that your war on drugs has done nothing to lower drug use even with the spraying of thousands of hectares of coca fields in the Andes at the cost of billions of dollars.

It's just like your gun control theory: useless in the real world.

Isn't Richard Nixon dead? Did he leave his war on drugs to me in his will?

Drugs like cocaine and opiates are too dangerous to legalize, fool! It isn't going to be pie in the sky if they are legalized, fool!

says you. Those drugs are only dangerous to those who choose to use them and if someone does want to use them then it's none of your fucking business.

They can go in there and cut the coca down by themselves. Maybe the nations will pay them to do it and convert those plantation to producing something useful. They have no right on Earth growing coca for export.

You mean something you think is useful.

5 Years After: Portugal's Drug Decriminalization Policy Shows Positive Results: Scientific American

Tell all those people dead on our streets and Mexico! Cocaine in itself can kill a person. Legalizing drugs is not going to stop the black market in drugs like crack. There is only one way to stop it and that's to stop mass production. You can't grow coca in the United States.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Isn't Richard Nixon dead? Did he leave his war on drugs to me in his will?

Drugs like cocaine and opiates are too dangerous to legalize, fool! It isn't going to be pie in the sky if they are legalized, fool!

says you. Those drugs are only dangerous to those who choose to use them and if someone does want to use them then it's none of your fucking business.

They can go in there and cut the coca down by themselves. Maybe the nations will pay them to do it and convert those plantation to producing something useful. They have no right on Earth growing coca for export.

You mean something you think is useful.

5 Years After: Portugal's Drug Decriminalization Policy Shows Positive Results: Scientific American

Ridiculous. There's huge collateral damage, to families and communities, not to mention crime by those wanting to fund their habit.

the crime is nothing compared to the cost of the failed war on drugs.

And when it's legal there will be less crime not more.

Spending a fraction of what is currently wasted on drug law enforcement on rehab programs will be more beneficial that our current system.

How many years have we fought the so called war on drugs?

How much money have we spent?

How many people have been killed?

And it has not had one iota of an effect on drug use.

For godsake, we're running a goddamn country and not a fucking free-for-all within certain borders, as the retarded fucking Libertarians would like to believe, because they fucking clueless about what makes a nation great.

What makes a nation great is the protection of individual rights above all else.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Isn't Richard Nixon dead? Did he leave his war on drugs to me in his will?

Drugs like cocaine and opiates are too dangerous to legalize, fool! It isn't going to be pie in the sky if they are legalized, fool!

says you. Those drugs are only dangerous to those who choose to use them and if someone does want to use them then it's none of your fucking business.

They can go in there and cut the coca down by themselves. Maybe the nations will pay them to do it and convert those plantation to producing something useful. They have no right on Earth growing coca for export.

You mean something you think is useful.

5 Years After: Portugal's Drug Decriminalization Policy Shows Positive Results: Scientific American

Tell all those people dead on our streets and Mexico! Cocaine in itself can kill a person. Legalizing drugs is not going to stop the black market in drugs like crack. There is only one way to stop it and that's to stop mass production. You can't grow coca in the United States.

You can't grow coca in the US and yet the price of coke has gone down and availability has remained the same despite all the money wasted trying to eradicate it.

What's the definition of insanity again?

Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

The war on drugs is a textbook example of insanity.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Ridiculous. There's huge collateral damage, to families and communities, not to mention crime by those wanting to fund their habit.

Really? Your evidence is where? Your colon wall? (Which is all you can ever see.)

Skull offered you evidence from a highly respected journal, but we should ignore that and accept your bullshit, cuz you said so..

For godsake, we're running a goddamn country and not a fucking free-for-all within certain borders, as the retarded fucking Libertarians would like to believe, because they fucking clueless about what makes a nation great.

You're an authoritarian thug, seeking to reduce civil liberty to zip - any proposal which actually increases individual freedom is bound to offend you.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Ridiculous. There's huge collateral damage, to families and communities, not to mention crime by those wanting to fund their habit.

Really? Your evidence is where? Your colon wall? (Which is all you can ever see.)

Skull offered you evidence from a highly respected journal, but we should ignore that and accept your bullshit, cuz you said so..

For godsake, we're running a goddamn country and not a fucking free-for-all within certain borders, as the retarded fucking Libertarians would like to believe, because they fucking clueless about what makes a nation great.

You're an authoritarian thug, seeking to reduce civil liberty to zip - any proposal which actually increases individual freedom is bound to offend you.

There's a word for these particular types of control freaks

sadomoralist

An official with power who derives pleasure from inflicting personal moral judgments on others. A sadomoralist obsessively promotes punishment, often through the criminalization of personal behavior, and will not even consider alternative approaches, or evidence of the ineffectiveness or harm of punishment.

 

[Dubya]

Ridiculous. There's huge collateral damage, to families and communities, not to mention crime by those wanting to fund their habit.

Really? Your evidence is where? Your colon wall? (Which is all you can ever see.)

Skull offered you evidence from a highly respected journal, but we should ignore that and accept your bullshit, cuz you said so..

For godsake, we're running a goddamn country and not a fucking free-for-all within certain borders, as the retarded fucking Libertarians would like to believe, because they fucking clueless about what makes a nation great.

You're an authoritarian thug, seeking to reduce civil liberty to zip - any proposal which actually increases individual freedom is bound to offend you.

There's a word for these particular types of control freaks

sadomoralist

An official with power who derives pleasure from inflicting personal moral judgments on others. A sadomoralist obsessively promotes punishment, often through the criminalization of personal behavior, and will not even consider alternative approaches, or evidence of the ineffectiveness or harm of punishment.

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

 

[Skull Pilot]

Really? Your evidence is where? Your colon wall? (Which is all you can ever see.)

Skull offered you evidence from a highly respected journal, but we should ignore that and accept your bullshit, cuz you said so..



You're an authoritarian thug, seeking to reduce civil liberty to zip - any proposal which actually increases individual freedom is bound to offend you.

There's a word for these particular types of control freaks

sadomoralist

An official with power who derives pleasure from inflicting personal moral judgments on others. A sadomoralist obsessively promotes punishment, often through the criminalization of personal behavior, and will not even consider alternative approaches, or evidence of the ineffectiveness or harm of punishment.

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

I never said it would.

I said it would help stem the violence caused by the war on drugs and save countless lives and billions of dollars

And you're all about saving lives aren't you? How do you feel about wasting billions of dollars every year on a program that doesn't work?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

Are you seriously this stupid?

Okay, black markets exist because goods or services that people want are outlawed by the state. Criminal elements dominate black markets because they are already engaged in illegal acts, and because neither customers or distributors will go to the authorities if criminal or violent acts occur.

Legal products are subject to societal protections. Which is why Miller Beer and Cheetos are not controlled by a cartel.

 

[Dubya]

There's a word for these particular types of control freaks

sadomoralist

An official with power who derives pleasure from inflicting personal moral judgments on others. A sadomoralist obsessively promotes punishment, often through the criminalization of personal behavior, and will not even consider alternative approaches, or evidence of the ineffectiveness or harm of punishment.

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

I never said it would.

I said it would help stem the violence caused by the war on drugs and save countless lives and billions of dollars

And you're all about saving lives aren't you? How do you feel about wasting billions of dollars every year on a program that doesn't work?

It isn't going to stop the violence in our streets or Mexico. Only getting rid of those plantations growing coca for the world market can do that. Koios and I both said don't jail users of drugs.

Think about it, no drugs, but they have plenty of cheap pot. The supply of guns gets cut off. They can't market drugs and fight over turf like they used to. They get high, just chill out and the homicide rates decline.

 

[Koios]

Ridiculous. There's huge collateral damage, to families and communities, not to mention crime by those wanting to fund their habit.

Really? Your evidence is where? Your colon wall? (Which is all you can ever see.)

Skull offered you evidence from a highly respected journal, but we should ignore that and accept your bullshit, cuz you said so..

For godsake, we're running a goddamn country and not a fucking free-for-all within certain borders, as the retarded fucking Libertarians would like to believe, because they fucking clueless about what makes a nation great.

You're an authoritarian thug, seeking to reduce civil liberty to zip - any proposal which actually increases individual freedom is bound to offend you.

Hahahahaha. Ahhh, U'08. If only your head was not up your ass so far you're looking at tonsils and not your fucking colon, I might be offended. But coming from you, pal, has me laughing even as I type this. No shit.

Meanwhile, crack cocaine was a goddamn virus in the black community. Meth, a goddamn epidemic that began in Portland OR, is yet to reach the East Coast, and they have no fucking idea what they're in for. It makes crack fucking poptarts in comparison.

And crime rates increase in meth-affected in precise parallel to the number of meth addicts, which itself rises and fall with the street purity of meth. And that was a goddamn clusterfuck when the Ochoa Brothers created a dummy medical entity in South America, which bought pure epinephrine from India after the US slowed the sale of epinephrine-containing over the counter products, such a Sudafed. It took us and producers in India a couple years to figure out what was going on and stop it. Make that shit legal, and OM fucking G. The addiction rates would go off the fucking charts, and plunge the country into chaos.

 

[Dubya]

Ridiculous. There's huge collateral damage, to families and communities, not to mention crime by those wanting to fund their habit.

Really? Your evidence is where? Your colon wall? (Which is all you can ever see.)

Skull offered you evidence from a highly respected journal, but we should ignore that and accept your bullshit, cuz you said so..

For godsake, we're running a goddamn country and not a fucking free-for-all within certain borders, as the retarded fucking Libertarians would like to believe, because they fucking clueless about what makes a nation great.

You're an authoritarian thug, seeking to reduce civil liberty to zip - any proposal which actually increases individual freedom is bound to offend you.

Hahahahaha. Ahhh, U'08. If only your head was not up your ass so far you're looking at tonsils and not your fucking colon, I might be offended. But coming from you, pal, has me laughing even as I type this. No shit.

Meanwhile, crack cocaine was a goddamn virus in the black community. Meth, a goddamn epidemic that began in Portland OR, is yet to reach the East Coast, and they have no fucking idea what they're in for. It makes crack fucking poptarts in comparison.

And crime rates increase in meth-affected in precise parallel to the number of meth addicts, which itself rises and fall with the street purity of meth. And that was a goddamn clusterfuck when the Ochoa Brothers created a dummy medical entity in South America, which bought pure epinephrine from India after the US slowed the sale of epinephrine-containing over the counter products, such a Sudafed. It took us and producers in India a couple years to figure out what was going on and stop it. Make that shit legal, and OM fucking G. The addiction rates would go off the fucking charts, and plunge the country into chaos.

Meth has made it's rounds before in America and it turns people into animals.

 

[Koios]

Really? Your evidence is where? Your colon wall? (Which is all you can ever see.)

Skull offered you evidence from a highly respected journal, but we should ignore that and accept your bullshit, cuz you said so..



You're an authoritarian thug, seeking to reduce civil liberty to zip - any proposal which actually increases individual freedom is bound to offend you.

Hahahahaha. Ahhh, U'08. If only your head was not up your ass so far you're looking at tonsils and not your fucking colon, I might be offended. But coming from you, pal, has me laughing even as I type this. No shit.

Meanwhile, crack cocaine was a goddamn virus in the black community. Meth, a goddamn epidemic that began in Portland OR, is yet to reach the East Coast, and they have no fucking idea what they're in for. It makes crack fucking poptarts in comparison.

And crime rates increase in meth-affected in precise parallel to the number of meth addicts, which itself rises and fall with the street purity of meth. And that was a goddamn clusterfuck when the Ochoa Brothers created a dummy medical entity in South America, which bought pure epinephrine from India after the US slowed the sale of epinephrine-containing over the counter products, such a Sudafed. It took us and producers in India a couple years to figure out what was going on and stop it. Make that shit legal, and OM fucking G. The addiction rates would go off the fucking charts, and plunge the country into chaos.

Meth has made it's rounds before in America and it turns people into animals.

In truth, it's still moving from West to East. The East Coast is yet to see the worst of it. Hawai'i too is in the shit, and having a hell of a proplem.

And the rise and fall in addiction rates, in effected areas, has to do with the purity of the meth on the streets, which police track along with addiction rates, and the parallel was first identified by a journalist in Portland, doing amazing research.

And the parallel is stark, overlaying crime rates, addiction rates, and street quality. The curves align almost exactly.

 

[Inthemiddle]

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

Well, first of all, the Cartels have little to nothing to do with cocaine. But to address how legalization can reduce crime.....Coca is produced legally in Peru and Bolivia. Direct importation for domestic commercial processing into recreational cocaine would completely remove organized crime from the picture, as far as cocaine goes. It's pretty simple.

 

[Koios]

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

Are you seriously this stupid?

Okay, black markets exist because goods or services that people want are outlawed by the state. Criminal elements dominate black markets because they are already engaged in illegal acts, and because neither customers or distributors will go to the authorities if criminal or violent acts occur.

Legal products are subject to societal protections. Which is why Miller Beer and Cheetos are not controlled by a cartel.

Of course, you abject moron. Just as bootleg liquor stopped being produced a nanosecond after the Volstead Act was repealed.

Good thinking, dipshit.

 

[Koios]

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

Well, first of all, the Cartels have little to nothing to do with cocaine. But to address how legalization can reduce crime.....Coca is produced legally in Peru and Bolivia. Direct importation for domestic commercial processing into recreational cocaine would completely remove organized crime from the picture, as far as cocaine goes. It's pretty simple.

WTF???

Here's a list of cocaine cartels in Mexico, even: Mexican Drug War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

To think cartels no longer operate in Columbia is abject stupidity.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Hahahahaha. Ahhh, U'08. If only your head was not up your ass so far you're looking at tonsils and not your fucking colon, I might be offended. But coming from you, pal, has me laughing even as I type this. No shit.

Meanwhile, crack cocaine was a goddamn virus in the black community. Meth, a goddamn epidemic that began in Portland OR, is yet to reach the East Coast, and they have no fucking idea what they're in for. It makes crack fucking poptarts in comparison.

So, you agree with your fellow retard that the government should bomb cocoa plants in other nations? And of course, bomb all those "meth plants" too...

ROFL

You really are dumb little shit.

And crime rates increase in meth-affected in precise parallel to the number of meth addicts, which itself rises and fall with the street purity of meth.

And that couldn't have ANYTHING to do with the fact that meth is artificially expensive due to it being an illegal substance and thus in the hands of criminal gangs, could it?

Meth is bad shit, could be what ate away any brains you might have once had - dunno, could be the oven cleaner you huffed as well.

However, as bad as meth is, the residual crime from black market activities are far worse. Meth heads like you only damage themselves. But the criminals running it aren't real careful about shooting bystanders.

Oh, and we can't even buy cold medicine because the dickwad prohibitionists are worried that the ephedrine in cold pills can be used to make meth.

And that was a goddamn clusterfuck when the Ochoa Brothers created a dummy medical entity in South America, which bought pure epinephrine from India after the US slowed the sale of epinephrine-containing over the counter products, such a Sudafed. It took us and producers in India a couple years to figure out what was going on and stop it. Make that shit legal, and OM fucking G. The addiction rates would go off the fucking charts, and plunge the country into chaos.

When you say "epinephrine," I assume you actually mean "ephedrine."

Sudafed used a synthetic ephedrine called Pseudoephedrine. While virtually the most effective decongestant known to man, it can be liberated using stong solvents such as acetone or ether to create a meth like stimulant. Real methamphetamine does not use any form of ephedrine.

 

[Koios]

Hahahahaha. Ahhh, U'08. If only your head was not up your ass so far you're looking at tonsils and not your fucking colon, I might be offended. But coming from you, pal, has me laughing even as I type this. No shit.

Meanwhile, crack cocaine was a goddamn virus in the black community. Meth, a goddamn epidemic that began in Portland OR, is yet to reach the East Coast, and they have no fucking idea what they're in for. It makes crack fucking poptarts in comparison.

So, you agree with your fellow retard that the government should bomb cocoa plants in other nations? And of course, bomb all those "meth plants" too...

ROFL

You really are dumb little shit.

And crime rates increase in meth-affected in precise parallel to the number of meth addicts, which itself rises and fall with the street purity of meth.

1. And that couldn't have ANYTHING to do with the fact that meth is artificially expensive due to it being an illegal substance and thus in the hands of criminal gangs, could it?

Meth is bad shit, could be what ate away any brains you might have once had - dunno, could be the oven cleaner you huffed as well.

However, as bad as meth is, the residual crime from black market activities are far worse. Meth heads like you only damage themselves. But the criminals running it aren't real careful about shooting bystanders.

Oh, and we can't even buy cold medicine because the dickwad prohibitionists are worried that the ephedrine in cold pills can be used to make meth.

And that was a goddamn clusterfuck when the Ochoa Brothers created a dummy medical entity in South America, which bought pure epinephrine from India after the US slowed the sale of epinephrine-containing over the counter products, such a Sudafed. It took us and producers in India a couple years to figure out what was going on and stop it. Make that shit legal, and OM fucking G. The addiction rates would go off the fucking charts, and plunge the country into chaos.

2. When you say "epinephrine," I assume you actually mean "ephedrine."

Sudafed used a synthetic ephedrine called Pseudoephedrine. While virtually the most effective decongestant known to man, it can be liberated using stong solvents such as acetone or ether to create a meth like stimulant. Real methamphetamine does not use any form of ephedrine.

1. No, dipshit. The thing crackheads moving to meth will tell ya, the shit last for days. Way cheaper than crack to stay fucked up and awake for a week or more at a time.

2. My mistake, indeed. Sorry. Working from memory, and not googling as I go.

 

[Dubya]

Hahahahaha. Ahhh, U'08. If only your head was not up your ass so far you're looking at tonsils and not your fucking colon, I might be offended. But coming from you, pal, has me laughing even as I type this. No shit.

Meanwhile, crack cocaine was a goddamn virus in the black community. Meth, a goddamn epidemic that began in Portland OR, is yet to reach the East Coast, and they have no fucking idea what they're in for. It makes crack fucking poptarts in comparison.

So, you agree with your fellow retard that the government should bomb cocoa plants in other nations? And of course, bomb all those "meth plants" too...

ROFL

You really are dumb little shit.

And crime rates increase in meth-affected in precise parallel to the number of meth addicts, which itself rises and fall with the street purity of meth.

And that couldn't have ANYTHING to do with the fact that meth is artificially expensive due to it being an illegal substance and thus in the hands of criminal gangs, could it?

Meth is bad shit, could be what ate away any brains you might have once had - dunno, could be the oven cleaner you huffed as well.

However, as bad as meth is, the residual crime from black market activities are far worse. Meth heads like you only damage themselves. But the criminals running it aren't real careful about shooting bystanders.

Oh, and we can't even buy cold medicine because the dickwad prohibitionists are worried that the ephedrine in cold pills can be used to make meth.

And that was a goddamn clusterfuck when the Ochoa Brothers created a dummy medical entity in South America, which bought pure epinephrine from India after the US slowed the sale of epinephrine-containing over the counter products, such a Sudafed. It took us and producers in India a couple years to figure out what was going on and stop it. Make that shit legal, and OM fucking G. The addiction rates would go off the fucking charts, and plunge the country into chaos.

When you say "epinephrine," I assume you actually mean "ephedrine."

Sudafed used a synthetic ephedrine called Pseudoephedrine. While virtually the most effective decongestant known to man, it can be liberated using stong solvents such as acetone or ether to create a meth like stimulant. Real methamphetamine does not use any form of ephedrine.

My backgroud is chemistry and they use to make meth from ephedrine, before the over the counter market switched to pseudoephedrine.

You people may not be old enough to remember it, but we have been through this meth thing before. It isn't the kind of drug you want on the streets and evenually people start injecting it. It's very addicting like heroin, because both mimic biochemical processes that everybody has. The chemicals are necessary for proper body function and the drug addicts are telling their bodies they are making too much of the chemical and to shut down the body's production. Meth in itself will turn people violent. It isn't going to follow your libertarian philosophy, even if it's free.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Explain how legalizing crack is going to stop the control of Drug Cartels over the drug!

I never said it would.

I said it would help stem the violence caused by the war on drugs and save countless lives and billions of dollars

And you're all about saving lives aren't you? How do you feel about wasting billions of dollars every year on a program that doesn't work?

It isn't going to stop the violence in our streets or Mexico. Only getting rid of those plantations growing coca for the world market can do that. Koios and I both said don't jail users of drugs.

Think about it, no drugs, but they have plenty of cheap pot. The supply of guns gets cut off. They can't market drugs and fight over turf like they used to. They get high, just chill out and the homicide rates decline.

So now you want to magically end all the violence in Mexico too?

Portugal is a great example of what happens when all drugs are decriminalized.

Drug use actually declines, deaths from overdose decline, crime declines and the streets are safer. The money saved by not pursuing and incarcerating users more than funds drug treatment programs and actually helps people get a handle on their addictions.

Tell me what particular brand of hubris is it that makes you think it's possible to change human nature?

people have been using mood altering substances since the dawn of man and you think you can just make it stop or just allow people to use the drugs you approve of?