Who are the Israelis?

[Toddsterpatriot]

And you!

Exactly.

Toddistan is not a country. Neither is Palestine.

 

[rylah]

SEA OF GALILEE, the Enchanting City of Tiberias, and the Breathtaking Galilee Region.​

 

[rylah]

Torah Reading at Bar Mitzvah

 

[rylah]

Is the Progressive Left Antisemitic?​

 

[rylah]

Israel is 29th in the world in the size of the economy with a GDP of 539 billion dollars

Visualizing The $105 Trillion World Economy In One Chart | ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

 

[rylah]

Temple Mount Update | A Routine Day At The Temple Mount
Every day Jews ascend to the Temple Mount who come to thank God, to pray, to console a grieving person, God forbid, to rejoice before Him or just to stand in His holy place and worship.



Last week one of the regular visitors came to thank for a higher than usual income flow.

Every day, brides and grooms go up to the Temple Mount to celebrate Jerusalem with joy, mitzvah children and other happy people.

Rachel Sel'a ascended to the Temple Mount yesterday with her daughter-in-law and two grandsons and met there the Bar Chai family from Avney Eitan in the Golan, who ascended to honor the placing of Tefillin of the eldest son. They came with their 8 children, grandparents from both sides, and some cousins.

Elish'a, one of the regular visitors ascended, to console himself on the Temple Mount for the death of his brother.

The ascent to the Temple Mount is becoming natural and self-evident to a growing public,
and this is even before we have begun the practical building of the Temple...

The regular pilgrims to the Temple Mount say that every day they are moved anew, not only by the holiness of the place, but also by the variety of pilgrims to the Temple Mount, who testify more than anything to the return of the people of Israel to the courts of God's house.

HarHabait - Temple Mount Updates

8-year-old Bo'az Yachin came from the north to ascend the Temple Mount,
and finish the Terumot tractate of the 'Daily Yerushalmi Page' study

 

[rosends]

Then why say she provoked him the moment he shows his yarmulke?
The plane is not the issue, even if it's a cheap provocation for a headline,
the question remains about what social rules govern public places in a Halachah state.

but the plane is not a halachic state. Even if it was El Al (though in this case it wasn't) my understanding of halacha would not forbid sitting next to a person of the other gender in a public space. I have never understood why anyone ever asks for someone to move on those grounds and I have seen plenty of frum looking guys sitting wherever they are and not moving to get away. In a fully halachic state, the various agencies of the state would have to have a mora d'asra who establishes the halachic norms and expectations and an airline would post them when selling tickets. At this point, some guy who buys a ticket should know what he is getting in to.

In this case, the reporter was the one who was complaining -- first about the guy and then about the flight attendant. According to the guy, the reporter attacked him and the attendant was responding to the claims of "discrimination" that the reporter made.

 

[Grau]

The subject isn't your opinion about Israel,
it's actually about the Israelis themselves.

You're right.
The topic, as I understand it, is to express one's opinion of the Israeli people.

Perhaps the first factor which makes it impossible to accurately characterize all the Israeli people is that they come from so many different countries.
An Israeli from Russia may not even be able to understand an Israeli from Ethiopia.

Overall, I feel that it's impossible to to accurately generalize about any national, ethnic or religious group and especially about the Israelis because I never made it there.

I tried but was unable to visit Israel when I hitch-hiked and walked around the Islamic Middle East long ago for 10 - 11 months by myself.
I was in Southern Lebanon and had planned to head South to Israel and Egypt when the '73 War broke out and things went sideways.

Since I was staying near a Palestinian Refugee camp I heard plenty of opinions about the Israelis from Palestinians who survived the Nakba and others who had unflattering assessments of the Israeli government that took their homes but there's more to the Israeli people than brutal occupiers.

Like the people of any country, Israel has people of both extremes who have made wonderful contributions to mankind.
Unfortunately, Israel is frequently defined by its illegal occupation in spite of the efforts of B'Tselem and similar committed humanitarian groups to soften its image.

I feel that it is a regrettable reality that Israel will remain unpopular around the world as long as the occupation remains in the news.

Thanks,

 

[rylah]

You're right.
The topic, as I understand it, is to express one's opinion of the Israeli people.

Perhaps the first factor which makes it impossible to accurately characterize all the Israeli people is that they come from so many different countries.
An Israeli from Russia may not even be able to understand an Israeli from Ethiopia.

Overall, I feel that it's impossible to to accurately generalize about any national, ethnic or religious group and especially about the Israelis because I never made it there.

I tried but was unable to visit Israel when I hitch-hiked and walked around the Islamic Middle East long ago for 10 - 11 months by myself.
I was in Southern Lebanon and had planned to head South to Israel and Egypt when the '73 War broke out and things went sideways.

Since I was staying near a Palestinian Refugee camp I heard plenty of opinions about the Israelis from Palestinians who survived the Nakba and others who had unflattering assessments of the Israeli government that took their homes but there's more to the Israeli people than brutal occupiers.

Like the people of any country, Israel has people of both extremes who have made wonderful contributions to mankind.
Unfortunately, Israel is frequently defined by its illegal occupation in spite of the efforts of B'Tselem and similar committed humanitarian groups to soften its image.

I feel that it is a regrettable reality that Israel will remain unpopular around the world as long as the occupation remains in the news.

Thanks,

Nice anecdote, but your biases are showing.

Arab supremacists call any non-Arab rule an 'occupation',
your anti-Jewish propaganda didn't start with Israeli independence.

 

[Grau]

Nice anecdote, but your biases are showing.

Arab supremacists call any non-Arab rule an 'occupation',
your anti-Jewish propaganda didn't start with Israeli independence.

Don't you think that everyone holds at least a slight bias when it comes to Middle East conflicts?

I am, however, sympathetic toward anyone who has been ruthlessly persecuted, had their land stolen, seen family members massacred and their homes destroyed.

Do you really deny that the Nakba happened?

Since I've studied the region and its conflicts for over 50 years and heard both sides of the story from survivors and participants, this is not the first I've heard the Nakba dismissed as "anti-Jewish propaganda".

Thanks for responding,

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Don't you think that everyone holds at least a slight bias when it comes to Middle East conflicts?

I am, however, sympathetic toward anyone who has been ruthlessly persecuted, had their land stolen, seen family members massacred and their homes destroyed.

Do you really deny that the Nakba happened?

Since I've studied the region and its conflicts for over 50 years and heard both sides of the story from survivors and participants, this is not the first I've heard the Nakba dismissed as "anti-Jewish propaganda".

Thanks for responding,

Do you really deny that the Nakba happened?

Nakba? You mean Israel being created? Arabs invading and losing?

 

[Grau]

Do you really deny that the Nakba happened?

Nakba? You mean Israel being created? Arabs invading and losing?

You're welcome to your own opinions but not your own facts.

Only the earth was "created" and that was long ago; the current state of Israel was imposed on Palestine's native residents by Colonial Powers and Zionist terrorist gangs.

To be clear, I fully support an Israeli state within something close to the pre 1967 borders as per International Law: UN Resolutions # 242 and # 338.

The Right Wing Israeli government's criminal "Settlements" program is proof that the Right Wing Israeli government is more interested in ethnic cleansing than a durable and equitable peace.

The US Government's unconditional support of any and every Right Wing Israeli crime and atrocity is neither in America's or Israel's best interests because it perpetuates unsustainable criminality against a civilian population.

What ever happened to "Never again."?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You're welcome to your own opinions but not your own facts.

Only the earth was "created" and that was long ago; the current state of Israel was imposed on Palestine's native residents by Colonial Powers and Zionist terrorist gangs.

To be clear, I fully support an Israeli state within something close to the pre 1967 borders as per International Law: UN Resolutions # 242 and # 338.

The Right Wing Israeli government's criminal "Settlements" program is proof that the Right Wing Israeli government is more interested in ethnic cleansing than a durable and equitable peace.

The US Government's unconditional support of any and every Right Wing Israeli crime and atrocity is neither in America's or Israel's best interests because it perpetuates unsustainable criminality against a civilian population.

What ever happened to "Never again."?

Only the earth was "created" and that was long ago; the current state of Israel was imposed on Palestine's native residents by Colonial Powers and Zionist terrorist gangs.

It's true, losers lose.

To be clear, I fully support an Israeli state within something close to the pre 1967 borders

Was that your position pre-1967?

The Right Wing Israeli government's criminal "Settlements" program is proof that the Right Wing Israeli government is more interested in ethnic cleansing than a durable and equitable peace.

Peace with pally terrorists?

 

[Billo_Really]

Fair by what standard?
Give an example.

Equal rights. Why can't Palestinians commemorate Nakba Day?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Equal rights. Why can't Palestinians commemorate Nakba Day?

If they call it Loser Day, they can celebrate all they want.

 

[rylah]

You're welcome to your own opinions but not your own facts.

Only the earth was "created" and that was long ago; the current state of Israel was imposed on Palestine's native residents by Colonial Powers and Zionist terrorist gangs.

To be clear, I fully support an Israeli state within something close to the pre 1967 borders as per International Law: UN Resolutions # 242 and # 338.

The Right Wing Israeli government's criminal "Settlements" program is proof that the Right Wing Israeli government is more interested in ethnic cleansing than a durable and equitable peace.

The US Government's unconditional support of any and every Right Wing Israeli crime and atrocity is neither in America's or Israel's best interests because it perpetuates unsustainable criminality against a civilian population.

What ever happened to "Never again."?

Every sentence a fallacy.

Why the need to pile grandiose assumptions,
instead of rationally arguing your anti-Israel position?

 

[rylah]

Don't you think that everyone holds at least a slight bias when it comes to Middle East conflicts?

I am, however, sympathetic toward anyone who has been ruthlessly persecuted, had their land stolen, seen family members massacred and their homes destroyed.

Do you really deny that the Nakba happened?

Since I've studied the region and its conflicts for over 50 years and heard both sides of the story from survivors and participants, this is not the first I've heard the Nakba dismissed as "anti-Jewish propaganda".

Thanks for responding,

Assuming Arabs deserve exclusive domination over the entire Middle East and Africa,
and placing all responsibility for the conflict on Jews, is not "slight bias" - but blatant racism.

On the other hand, virtue signaling "sympathy" to disguise racial hostility towards a minority,
i.e singling out Israel, means your disregard for the other 99.9% of casualties, as result
of the constant wars among Arab-Muslim states in the region.

And yes, of course "Nakba" is anti-Jewish propaganda,
after all, it's the narrative of the shameful defeat and loss
of Arab hegemony to no other minority, but - the Jewish state.

What if other MENA nations fight for independence from the yoke of Arab imperialism?

 

[rylah]

Equal rights. Why can't Palestinians commemorate Nakba Day?

For the same reason you can't commemorate the victory of any country as defeat.
They can commemorate that in the East Bank for now, and if so pleased,
will add reasons to make the celebration more memorable.

Arabs think they know revenge,
but they fear a Jewish king,
that was a preview.

 

[Grau]

Every sentence a fallacy.

Why the need to pile grandiose assumptions,
instead of rationally arguing your anti-Israel position?

First, I am no more anti Israel than I am anti American.

I made it clear that I opposed Israel's Right Wing, criminal expansionism as does Israel's courageous peace seeking element.

Next, recorded history is not an "assumption".

It is an irrefutable fact that murderous, Zionist terrorist gangs drove almost one million native Palestinians from their homes and slaughtered countless innocent men, women and children.

I met innumerable Nakba survivors, heard about their former homes and looked at their worn, old photos .

Why are their accounts any less valid than those of other survivors?

Where are their reparations for loosing everything?

Israel and its people are better than the "Settlers" and militant Right Wingers that perpetuate it's American funded infamy.

 

[rylah]

but the plane is not a halachic state. Even if it was El Al (though in this case it wasn't) my understanding of halacha would not forbid sitting next to a person of the other gender in a public space. I have never understood why anyone ever asks for someone to move on those grounds and I have seen plenty of frum looking guys sitting wherever they are and not moving to get away. In a fully halachic state, the various agencies of the state would have to have a mora d'asra who establishes the halachic norms and expectations and an airline would post them when selling tickets. At this point, some guy who buys a ticket should know what he is getting in to.

In this case, the reporter was the one who was complaining -- first about the guy and then about the flight attendant. According to the guy, the reporter attacked him and the attendant was responding to the claims of "discrimination" that the reporter made.

Agree, yet the plane was a Halachah state for that matter, even if for half an hour,
at least as the reporter wanted to challenge the situation.

But the question of public decency is less interesting,
than the challenge to see the Temple service as reality
including Animal Rights and LGBTQ+-% demonstrations.

Because the demonstrations are here, but who joins the tango?