Why do the God-haters persist?

[Montrovant]

From now on if you aren't a christian, muslim, jew, mormom or jehova fuck off. I don't want to argue with people who believe even though they know all the organized religions are completely made up. First I want to talk to the people who take the bible/koran literally. Then I want to talk to the people who know the stories in the bible are just stories invented by men to teach write and wrong. I'll talk to jews and muslims but I won't discuss god with people who don't believe any of the organized religions but still believe in god(s) because they have absolutely zero proof god exists and yet still believe.

At least Christians believe the stories in the bible are true. If they really believe god sent his son jesus to be crucified, then I can understand why they believe. But if you realize that's just a made up story and you still believe in god then maybe you are even dumber than the person who believes the jesus stories. Or the muslim who believes the mohammad stories or the jews who believe the mosus stories. At least they have an excuse. They've either been brainwashed from when they were kids or they are just utterly gullible or they've been scared into believing.

If you believe in god but not any organized religion, I almost want to say you are dumber than them but I have to give you points for at least not falling for the impossible stories. And I should realize people like Boss are closer to the truth than a gismys is. Once you realize the lies aren't true then maybe one day it will dawn on you that without the organized religions you really have zero as far as proof a god exists.

If not, they would have never invented the lies in the first place. There would have been no reason to lie. They would have just used Boss' arguments. But Boss' arguments don't hold much water so they had to make up the stories.

Maybe you should go make your own thread. Boss made this one and has been pretty clear from the beginning that he doesn't follow any organized religion. It seems kind of strange to come into a thread started by someone who doesn't believe in a religion and say you don't want to talk to anyone who has spiritual but not religious beliefs.

Well good point. But you see, the theists are all over the place. Do you believe in god? Christianity? Muslim? Jewish? Mormon? Jehova? Born again? Do you take the bible literally or do you not? Do you believe in hell? Do you believe the stories in the bible actually happened? Do you believe miracles happen? Do you believe god is watching you and cares about you? Did he make us in his image? Do angels exist? Is Lucifer a real person? I could go on and on. Ask 100 different theists these questions and you'll get 100 different replies. No standard. This is one of the reasons you know its bullshit.

Do you think Boss has proven god exists? Explain his position back to me then.

And the thread is why do god haters persist. We persist because ignorance while maybe bliss is not good for society. PERIOD! And as Gismys would say, AND YOU? ONLY A FOOL!!!

Well of course there's no standard! People can hardly agree on things based on the physical, there's certainly no reason to expect agreement on something without objective evidence.

No, I don't think Boss has proven god exists. I never claimed he did. That's particularly clear since I've stated more than once that I don't believe in god; if he'd proved god exists, I would believe, wouldn't I?

There is no single reason why Boss's supposed 'god-haters' persist. Besides the fact the premise is extremely flawed, as with anything, you will rarely get consensus from any reasonably large group of people.

 

[Boss]

God is not one of the thoughts that human's have as a basic instinct. I think those are hunger, fear, happiness, etc. So unless you can show me that every baby born eventually at some age comes to start believing in god instinctively, then shut the fuck up with your lame ass theory that man has always believed.

Oh, it's not a lame ass theory, it's based on legitimate archeological findings. The lame ass theory without any presented evidence thus far, is that man invented spirituality. I never said everyone instinctively believes in God. However, everyone does have an instinctive awareness of something greater than self, you called it "karma" earlier.

I shouldn't have to show you that at some point in history someone came up with the concept of god. Someone or a group of people. But god isn't automatically implanted in all humans.

If you are going to make that argument you DO have to show evidence to support it, otherwise it's a faith-based belief and your opinion, not a fact. Sorry, but that's just how arguments and debates work. Again... never said God is automatically implanted.

Show me a group of 10 babies raised together by 10 atheist parents. No tv, no magazines, books or stories about god. Video tape those kids and see if/when any of them come up with god. They may never.

In other words, take humans out of a cultural civilization scenario entirely and see what happens? I would say, if they aren't taught how to speak or read, not taught to wear clothes, not taught various social values, they might behave like chimpanzees. I would further say that if all humans had evolved without civilization, they would have become extinct. Now since most humans are part of a cultural civilization, at some point, they are going to contemplate the existence of something greater than self. It's inevitable.

Millions of people/groups probably came and went back when we were hunters and gatherers and they didn't all automatically believe in gods. Some tribes might have and some not. Just because all the American Injuns were spiritual too means that EVENTUALLY every group came up with god(s) and spirits sure, but they were all different stories and they like you had zero proof/evidence of god, only theories and feelings.

Again, we're not talking about "automatically believing in God" or any particular religious incarnation of God. No human civilization we've ever unearthed is devoid of spiritual belief. NONE! NADDA! It doesn't matter in which corner of the Earth you look, over the course of tens of thousands of years, every human civilization that has ever existed has practiced some form of spirituality. Different stories and different incarnations of spirituality only shows that humans have imaginations. They make a real spiritual connection then apply their interpretation to those experiences. This has happened all of human history, or as long as humans have been civilized creatures.

And it seems most uneducated humans tend to believe in god(s). All the people 1000 years plus ago were not educated in science. Actually, there were many atheist greek phylosophers. Probably more than you know because most of them shut their mouth in fear of their lives.

Sorry, but you've already refuted this argument. There are MENSA geniuses who believe devoutly in God. There are scientists and doctors who believe devoutly in God. Sir Isaac Newton, probably the greatest scientific mind in history and Father of the Enlightenment, believed devoutly in God. So it's not exclusive to uneducated people by any stretch. Now it does seem to be true that certain people have achieved a high status of intelligence through academic study and have become "too smart for God" but this is typical hubris and the arrogance and vanity of man.

If it weren't for modern science and the internet, I'd probably still believe like I did in the 1980's. I didn't wake up until 2013 or 14. I started waking up in the 90's when I thought just like you.

You can be stubborn if you like, you never thought like me. I make a very real connection with a spiritual energy that I know is real and never question. I've never felt more wide awake and alive than immediately after meditation. I have no problems with modern science, but as we've repeatedly seen in this thread, modern science simply doesn't refute God. As for the Internet, any idiot with $100 can make a website and post a blog, and they can say virtually anything there. Do you honestly believe everything you read on the Internet?

I rejected all the organized religions but still had a personal relationship with god. I would even go to church and talk to god about feeling guilty that I am not a christian and don't believe the christian story. I said "god please don't punish me for not believing these stupid people who are probably swallowing a lie that the church invented to control them" And I was confident he agreed. So in a way, I was and you are a lot like Joseph Smith of the Mormons. You should start your own cult only leave out the magic underwear and crazy stories. In fact Mormons are the perfect example of how stupid people are. Youtube the mormon story southpark dumb dumb dumb. That is the actual Mormon story. REALLY? And those people bought it? So you keep telling me how you believe in god because everyone else believes, you stupid bastard.

Okay... So you frequent moronic Atheist blog sites on the Internet and you watch Southpark, and this is your basis of understanding with regard to God and human spirituality. 'Nuff said!

 

[JimBowie1958]

I rented God is not dead and it was actually a really good movie and it reminded me quiet a bit about those in this thread. I recommend you all watch it. It is about a freshmen at college having to defend why he refuses to say God is Dead . It also has many side stories in it that lets you see how God works in mysterious ways. I guess it is based on lawsuits being filed against universities for discrimination and harassment of Christians...They listed them in the credits and there was a hell of a lot of them.

Yeah, great movie.

I had a professor who claimed that belief in God was obsolete for a modern educated person.

I challenged him to debate and he passed on it. I got a minister to volunteer, but the prof ducked that one too.

I haven't seen a good debate between a believer and an atheist since Warren debated Flew back in the 70s. Warren must have done pretty good because now Flew is no longer an atheist, lol.

 

[hobelim]

Yes, it does, idiot.

For millions of years people have believed that assertion A is true and all civilizations have ben built on the belief that A is true. All civilizations that decided that A was no longer true or ceased to be true vanished not long after that.

The odds are overwhelming that A is in fact true.

Duh, dumb shit.

So the civilizations that existed 'millions' of years ago that worshiped stone statues of beasts and birds as if they were gods collapsed when they stopped believing? Not because the foundational structure was false? Not because every time some trouble arose they turned to stone statues, made by human hands, that have no life and can neither see, hear, think, or talk, for guidance, protection and help?

This proves the existence of God?

That is the most absurd reasoning presented yet.

congratulations!

You fail to comprehend my post, then claim I am absurd? I guess that follows, but for starters, I said 'people', you fucking retard, not 'civilizations'.

Take a reading comprehension class sometime.

I did not fail to comprehend your post. "people' whether they were 'civilized' or knuckle dragging barbarians used to believe in gods that never existed in reality and 'civilizations' hierarchy, class, and social structure built on a belief that was false fell apart after they stopped being idiots and seeking advice from statues. What a surprise!

sorry, but that is not proof of God. And I did not say that you were absurd, however absurd you may be, I said your reasoning was absurd. It is.

reading comprehension? fucking retard?

 

[BreezeWood]

Yes, it does, idiot.

For millions of years people have believed that assertion A is true and all civilizations have ben built on the belief that A is true. All civilizations that decided that A was no longer true or ceased to be true vanished not long after that.

The odds are overwhelming that A is in fact true.

Duh, dumb shit.

All civilizations that decided that A was no longer true or ceased to be true vanished not long after that.

What Happened On Easter Island ? A New (Even Scarier) Scenario : Krulwich Wonders... : NPR

Easter Island is the "clearest example of a society that destroyed itself by overexploiting its own resources." Once tree clearing started, it didn't stop until the whole forest was gone.

And yet, puzzlingly, these same people had managed to carve enormous statues — almost a thousand of them, with giant, hollow-eyed, gaunt faces, some weighing 75 tons. The statues faced not outward, not to the sea, but inward, toward the now empty, denuded landscape.

in truth, no civilization today represents a religion existing prior to the advent of the desert religions in a representative manner on a global scale nor the three mentioned -

and moreso, those religions as exemplified by Easter Island mimic the concentric reality demonstrated by the parable of Noah that those (new) religions to this day continue to ignore.


and yet there is a person who claims to speak to God in this very thread, Bossy ... whose deliberation is not for the Garden of Creation but an egotism strictly embodied for the selectivity of humanity - sound familiar, need a baron island to live on ?


.

No, I am doing just fine being king of my own household, thank you.

so much for a ticket on the Ark ....

.

 

[JimBowie1958]

So the civilizations that existed 'millions' of years ago that worshiped stone statues of beasts and birds as if they were gods collapsed when they stopped believing? Not because the foundational structure was false? Not because every time some trouble arose they turned to stone statues, made by human hands, that have no life and can neither see, hear, think, or talk, for guidance, protection and help?

This proves the existence of God?

That is the most absurd reasoning presented yet.

congratulations!

You fail to comprehend my post, then claim I am absurd? I guess that follows, but for starters, I said 'people', you fucking retard, not 'civilizations'.

Take a reading comprehension class sometime.

I did not fail to comprehend your post. "people' whether they were 'civilized' or knuckle dragging barbarians ...

So now you see no distinction between 'people' on one hand and 'civilizations' on the other.

roflmao, I was going to apologize for calling you a retard but on reflection I think I nailed it.

used to believe in gods that never existed in reality and 'civilizations' hierarchy, class, and social structure built on a belief that was false fell apart after they stopped being idiots and seeking advice from statues.

Not all 'gods' are the same, moron.

What a surprise!

sorry, but that is not proof of God.

The disproof of polytheistic 'gods' is not a disproof of a Creator, dumbass.

fucking retard?

Well, I only assume that you fuck, while you prove yourself a retard.

Yeah, a fucking retard.

 

[JimBowie1958]

All civilizations that decided that A was no longer true or ceased to be true vanished not long after that.






in truth, no civilization today represents a religion existing prior to the advent of the desert religions in a representative manner on a global scale nor the three mentioned -

and moreso, those religions as exemplified by Easter Island mimic the concentric reality demonstrated by the parable of Noah that those (new) religions to this day continue to ignore.


and yet there is a person who claims to speak to God in this very thread, Bossy ... whose deliberation is not for the Garden of Creation but an egotism strictly embodied for the selectivity of humanity - sound familiar, need a baron island to live on ?


.

No, I am doing just fine being king of my own household, thank you.

so much for a ticket on the Ark ....

.

lol, why would a need a ticket on the Ark?

 

[hobelim]

You fail to comprehend my post, then claim I am absurd? I guess that follows, but for starters, I said 'people', you fucking retard, not 'civilizations'.

Take a reading comprehension class sometime.

I did not fail to comprehend your post. "people' whether they were 'civilized' or knuckle dragging barbarians ...

So now you see no distinction between 'people' on one hand and 'civilizations' on the other.

retard.... moron..... dumbass.....fuck...... retard.... fucking retard.

Thank you for that thoughtful and enlightening response.

It is truly inspiring to see the many wonderful ways that being a believer has fucked up your mind..

 

[JimBowie1958]

I did not fail to comprehend your post. "people' whether they were 'civilized' or knuckle dragging barbarians ...

So now you see no distinction between 'people' on one hand and 'civilizations' on the other.

retard.... moron..... dumbass.....fuck...... retard.... fucking retard.

Thank you for that thoughtful and enlightening response.

It is truly inspiring to see the many wonderful ways that being a believer has fucked up your mind..

Lol, you cant think straight, but that is my fault for telling you?

roflmao

whatever helps you sleep at night, shit-for-brains

 

[BillyP]

Knowing God is essentially to seeing God.

That rational part of your mind is what has preserved your sanity and saved you from becoming a mindless believer in things that never happened and praying for guidance to a god that does not exist.

And that same rational part of your mind is what will assist you in knowing my God by using that intelligence to perceive the deeper implications of the divine commands which reveal a profound wisdom of a God that does not give a crap about what you eat or what you wear, a God that you may have never been looking for but once seen you will know and also see that he has always been there and intimately involved with you for your entire life.

But don't take my word for it. The more you purify your mind the more accurately you will perceive things the more you will be capable of comprehending and the sooner you will see God with your own eyes.

I hear what you're saying, but here "it is about cause and effect, action and consequence." you seem to be still talking about a god that's needy and wants to be obeyed.

It may seem that way to you but, if you had a child and you said "do not touch the stove or you will burn your finger" would you say it because you were needy and wanted to be obeyed?

If the child did not listen and touched the stove and burned his finger would it be a punishment from you?

Ok, let's see if I can squeeze any sense out of this.

So you're saying that god himself tells you what not to do? And if you disobey he'll make sure you get burned?
Because if it were my kid, I'd stop him from getting burned, whether he understood or not.

 

[BreezeWood]

No, I am doing just fine being king of my own household, thank you.

so much for a ticket on the Ark ....

.

lol, why would a need a ticket on the Ark?

suit yourself would be the obvious answer, and actually I am not sure what your response was in reference to.

the unobvious answer unfortunately is we are all in this together - sink or swim as a group and being the salvation from royalty has best been paraphrased by the guillotine one sees little hope of a cumbya for such differing opinions ...

.

 

[Slyhunter]

Knowing God is essentially to seeing God.

That rational part of your mind is what has preserved your sanity and saved you from becoming a mindless believer in things that never happened and praying for guidance to a god that does not exist.

And that same rational part of your mind is what will assist you in knowing my God by using that intelligence to perceive the deeper implications of the divine commands which reveal a profound wisdom of a God that does not give a crap about what you eat or what you wear, a God that you may have never been looking for but once seen you will know and also see that he has always been there and intimately involved with you for your entire life.

But don't take my word for it. The more you purify your mind the more accurately you will perceive things the more you will be capable of comprehending and the sooner you will see God with your own eyes.

I hear what you're saying, but here "it is about cause and effect, action and consequence." you seem to be still talking about a god that's needy and wants to be obeyed.

It may seem that way to you but, if you had a child and you said "do not touch the stove or you will burn your finger" would you say it because you were needy and wanted to be obeyed?

If the child did not listen and touched the stove and burned his finger would it be a punishment from you?

Not the same thing is "be perfect or go to Hell."

 

[Slyhunter]

All civilizations that decided that A was no longer true or ceased to be true vanished not long after that.






in truth, no civilization today represents a religion existing prior to the advent of the desert religions in a representative manner on a global scale nor the three mentioned -

and moreso, those religions as exemplified by Easter Island mimic the concentric reality demonstrated by the parable of Noah that those (new) religions to this day continue to ignore.


and yet there is a person who claims to speak to God in this very thread, Bossy ... whose deliberation is not for the Garden of Creation but an egotism strictly embodied for the selectivity of humanity - sound familiar, need a baron island to live on ?


.

No, I am doing just fine being king of my own household, thank you.

so much for a ticket on the Ark ....

.

How did Kangaroo's get their ticket?
And how did they make it back to Australia after the flood?

 

[Boss]

the unobvious answer unfortunately is we are all in this together - sink or swim as a group and being the salvation from royalty has best been paraphrased by the guillotine one sees little hope of a cumbya for such differing opinions

Alas, the pontificate of the many is in conflict with the turmoils of the few, and assimilation unto the higher realm is without consideration of the lesser of evils, therefore it is impervious to stride toward objectivism in the path of knowledge without the wisdom heretofore assigned by the abundance of enlightenment. Clarity and understanding are of far less importance to discourse whenever language can be a useful tool for the purpose of examination in the realm of fecal material from bulls or horses. Disbursement of such matter is paramount to harmonic communication with other carbonic forms, not withstanding the flora and fauna.

 

[BreezeWood]

the unobvious answer unfortunately is we are all in this together - sink or swim as a group and being the salvation from royalty has best been paraphrased by the guillotine one sees little hope of a cumbya for such differing opinions

Alas, the pontificate of the many is in conflict with the turmoils of the few, and assimilation unto the higher realm is without consideration of the lesser of evils, therefore it is impervious to stride toward objectivism in the path of knowledge without the wisdom heretofore assigned by the abundance of enlightenment. Clarity and understanding are of far less importance to discourse whenever language can be a useful tool for the purpose of examination in the realm of fecal material from bulls or horses. Disbursement of such matter is paramount to harmonic communication with other carbonic forms, not withstanding the flora and fauna.

- was that your response to Easter Island, just another deflection from reality ?

.

 

[Boss]

the unobvious answer unfortunately is we are all in this together - sink or swim as a group and being the salvation from royalty has best been paraphrased by the guillotine one sees little hope of a cumbya for such differing opinions

Alas, the pontificate of the many is in conflict with the turmoils of the few, and assimilation unto the higher realm is without consideration of the lesser of evils, therefore it is impervious to stride toward objectivism in the path of knowledge without the wisdom heretofore assigned by the abundance of enlightenment. Clarity and understanding are of far less importance to discourse whenever language can be a useful tool for the purpose of examination in the realm of fecal material from bulls or horses. Disbursement of such matter is paramount to harmonic communication with other carbonic forms, not withstanding the flora and fauna.

- was that your response to Easter Island, just another deflection from reality ?

.

Nope. It was my response to your posts that no one can decipher.

 

[JimBowie1958]

No, I am doing just fine being king of my own household, thank you.

so much for a ticket on the Ark ....

.

How did Kangaroo's get their ticket?
And how did they make it back to Australia after the flood?

The core truth to the Noah story is that, IMO, he had some kind of forewarning of the collapse of the Bosporus Straights glacier that then flooded the Black Sea area that he lived in. If Noah had been a subsistence farmer and herder, then he would have essentially saved the animals that he depended on for his livelihood and not literally every freaking animal on the planet.

I don't know anyone but the most extreme Biblical literalists who think Noah literally took in every animal species; the majority of Christ's church does not.

 

[hobelim]

I hear what you're saying, but here "it is about cause and effect, action and consequence." you seem to be still talking about a god that's needy and wants to be obeyed.

It may seem that way to you but, if you had a child and you said "do not touch the stove or you will burn your finger" would you say it because you were needy and wanted to be obeyed?

If the child did not listen and touched the stove and burned his finger would it be a punishment from you?

Not the same thing is "be perfect or go to Hell."

I think you are confusing church dogma with what I said.

If a person fills their own mind with irrational garbage they will become confused and say and do stupid things that injure themselves and the people they love.

Its not rocket science.

May people here prove this true every single day.

 

[BreezeWood]

so much for a ticket on the Ark ....

.

How did Kangaroo's get their ticket?
And how did they make it back to Australia after the flood?

The core truth to the Noah story is that, IMO, he had some kind of forewarning of the collapse of the Bosporus Straights glacier that then flooded the Black Sea area that he lived in. If Noah had been a subsistence farmer and herder, then he would have essentially saved the animals that he depended on for his livelihood and not literally every freaking animal on the planet.

I don't know anyone but the most extreme Biblical literalists who think Noah literally took in every animal species; the majority of Christ's church does not.

that he depended on for his livelihood and not literally every freaking animal on the planet.


the parable in fact does purposefully keep alive "every freaking animal (and plant) on the planet" including the liberal Noah with the exclusion of "Conservatards" sic (special evil humans) who were the sole targets for the condemnation against humanity ...

.

 

[Slyhunter]

so much for a ticket on the Ark ....

.

How did Kangaroo's get their ticket?
And how did they make it back to Australia after the flood?

The core truth to the Noah story is that, IMO, he had some kind of forewarning of the collapse of the Bosporus Straights glacier that then flooded the Black Sea area that he lived in. If Noah had been a subsistence farmer and herder, then he would have essentially saved the animals that he depended on for his livelihood and not literally every freaking animal on the planet.

I don't know anyone but the most extreme Biblical literalists who think Noah literally took in every animal species; the majority of Christ's church does not.

The bible says God flooded the world and killed everyone. If that's not true that makes it a work of fiction.