Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

[Cosmos]

A- Cost prohibitive
B- Won't work
C- It's racist
D- It would reduce those successfully crossing the border
E- None of the Above

The machine benefits by not having a wall. Business (Republicans) get their cheap labor and (Democrats) get the votes

You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

There is no excuse for the Republicans not funding the wall.

-Geaux

This is one of the dumbest things I've seen yet with regard to the border wall. When they begin attacking us with tanks, artillery, and aircraft you might have a point.

 

[dblack]

A better question would be, how is building a wall so wrong when it feels so right?

That's a great question actually. I think it's like a lot of things that feel 'so right', but really aren't - or at least have dangerous costs associated. Drug addiction is a good example. People know, rationally that what they're doing is bad, for them and for others, but it feels so right, and the allure is so strong that all reason and perspective is lost.

 

[sealybobo]

A- Cost prohibitive
B- Won't work
C- It's racist
D- It would reduce those successfully crossing the border
E- None of the Above

The machine benefits by not having a wall. Business (Republicans) get their cheap labor and (Democrats) get the votes

You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

There is no excuse for the Republicans not funding the wall.

-Geaux

This is one of the dumbest things I've seen yet with regard to the border wall. When they begin attacking us with tanks, artillery, and aircraft you might have a point.

Who’s attacking us? What?

 

[sealybobo]

A better question would be, how is building a wall so wrong when it feels so right?

That's a great question actually. I think it's like a lot of things that feel 'so right', but really aren't - or at least have dangerous costs associated. Drug addiction is a good example. People know, rationally that what they're doing is bad, for them and for others, but it feels so right, and the allure is so strong that all reason and perspective is lost.

How many Americans self medicate?

Remember when rush said drug addicts should be executed? Then it was found that he was hooked on oxy cotton. Fucking hypocrites.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

From your New York Times (what else) article:

Officials at Customs and Border Protection called the report inaccurate, saying it confused how agents’ feedback about security vulnerabilities is used to develop programs to counter threats.

This issue in March is in sharp contrast to this article in the Washington Times a month later

Border Patrol agents back Trump wall, survey finds

Notice the term strategic locations. Funny how a border wall changed to a 1000 mile wall, to a wall in strategic locations to a border barrier/border fence which is currently 212 miles long, 112 miles of it replaces a border barrier built in 2006. Unable to get a single dollar to build the great wall Trump promised on the campaign trail, he has now settled on a new strategy: repairing and upgrading the existing fence and calling that his “wall.” Is that what you guys voted for?

So your saying he shouldn't compromise he should build a 2,000 mile wall or he didn't deserve to be elected by we who elected him?

I'm saying he should have told the truth to his supporters, that what was needed was a border barrier in selected locations which is what he is trying to get congress to approve. He never should have accused Mexicans of being rapist and murders. He should never have said he will make Mexico pay for the wall. He just made it that much more difficult getting his border wall approved by congress. Any other republican candidate would have had the 5 billion dollars approved now. Instead we have a standoff between congress and the administration that could last for months hurting millions of Americans.

The only reason Trump is asking for a barrier in certain places is because he’s being forced to settle. If you brag to your family and friends that you’re going to buy a $35,000 car, but the bank only approved a loan for $20,000, you have to settle for what the bank approved. I’m sure if he could get it, we would have a 40 billion dollar wall.


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That really doesn't make much sense when we're talking about a barrier wall. Suppose the farmer needs to fence his property to keep critters away from his crop and the bank says we will give you enough to fence 10% of your property. So the farmer builds the fence and watches the critters go around the fence and enter fields in the 90% that is not fence.

The only thing that makes sense is to secure approval for the whole project before starting. If you can't do that, then don't start the project.

Suppose congress had offered the president only 10% of the money to build the Panama Canal with no guarantee that more would come and the opposition party promising to stop all funding.

An animal may get around a farmers fence if it's only 10% of his farm, but not when it's 100 miles long.

This "all or nothing" deal just doesn't fly. Every mile of wall is a help to our border agents be it ten miles or 1000 miles. You yourself made a claim they will just look for easier places to get in. Well............isn't that a help? If we have agents knowing where those places are, they can concentrate their efforts at those points.

If Trump gives up on the wall, we will have the same problems we have now, had last year, had ten years ago. It's time to work on bringing these problems to a halt.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

How about a highway, how about oil lines, how about a prison or government garage?

Imagine how this country would be if we allowed private property owners to stop national progress.

So, are you arguing for a kind of unlimited eminent domain?

No, just eminent domain to advance our national interests. Where would we be today without all our highways, major roadways and bridges, pipelines that transport oil, water and sewer treatment plants?

 

[OKTexas]

Why are you only concerned about border properties? The government uses imminent domain to take properties all the time. Where's your concern for the folks that lose land for a Post Office or other government functions?

I don't support eminent domain at all. But apparently "libertarians" like bripat9643 do. Whodathunkit?

That could make our roads look awfully funny.

.

 

[Cosmos]

A- Cost prohibitive
B- Won't work
C- It's racist
D- It would reduce those successfully crossing the border
E- None of the Above

The machine benefits by not having a wall. Business (Republicans) get their cheap labor and (Democrats) get the votes

You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

There is no excuse for the Republicans not funding the wall.

-Geaux

This is one of the dumbest things I've seen yet with regard to the border wall. When they begin attacking us with tanks, artillery, and aircraft you might have a point.

Who’s attacking us? What?

Must be the spiders that live in your empty head. Hey stupid, it was your strawman, not mine.

 

[Geaux4it]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

 

[sealybobo]

A- Cost prohibitive
B- Won't work
C- It's racist
D- It would reduce those successfully crossing the border
E- None of the Above

The machine benefits by not having a wall. Business (Republicans) get their cheap labor and (Democrats) get the votes

You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

There is no excuse for the Republicans not funding the wall.

-Geaux

This is one of the dumbest things I've seen yet with regard to the border wall. When they begin attacking us with tanks, artillery, and aircraft you might have a point.

Who’s attacking us? What?

Must be the spiders that live in your empty head. Hey stupid, it was your strawman, not mine.

I am willing to eithe4 challenge or agree with your position on this subject but I don’t even know what it is.

 

[Markle]

Look to the facts from a study, on the cost burdens surrounding illegal immigrants.

“At the federal, state, and local levels, taxpayers shell out approximately $134.9 billion to cover the costs incurred by the presence of more than 12.5 million illegal aliens, and about 4.2 million citizen children of illegal aliens. That amounts to a tax burden of approximately $8,075 per illegal alien family member and a total of $115,894,597,664. The total cost of illegal immigration to U.S. taxpayers is both staggering and crippling. In 2013, FAIR estimated the total cost to be approximately $113 billion. So, in under four years, the cost has risen nearly $3 billion.”

So let's fix that. And let's do it without indulging the shackles of big government.

The problems we have are the welfare state and birth-right citizenship. Neither of those requires the Berlin wall.

China / Hong Kong (early 1960s) - 32 km
Botswana / Zimbabwe 2003 - 500 km
Bulgaria / Turkey 2014 - 30 km
Chinese / Korean border fence (under construction) - 1,416 km
Macedonia / Greece barrier 2015 - 30 km
India / Myanmar barrier (under construction) - 1,624 km

Just the facts, and this is to name but a few. However, we are called to follow after other nations on how government faces health care? Yet a wall is immoral and racist, despite other nations around the globe seeing fit to do so against illegal immigration.

Explain that one to me. Anyone?

Even Harry Reid saw the burden of illegals on our nation, and that was 1993. Look, liberals lost the cost argument on illegal immigration and now they are to lose on the nation’s border barrier argument.

The studies of immigration, legal or illegal seem to always focuses 1st generation immigrants since they differ the most from the general population. Second generation immigrants are much closer to the general population. For example, in 2008 2nd generation immigrants earned and average of $42,297, 32% higher than their parents. There educational level was higher than national average. Their use of social programs like their parents was less than than than the national average and their violent crime rate was well below the national average.

Third generation immigrants are statistically about the same as the general population since most American identify themselves as third generation immigrants. For Hispanic immigrants only 7% of third generation consider themselves Hispanic, Africans 13%, and Asians 15%.
Majority of Americans Identify Themselves as Third Generation Americans

All four of my grandparents were immigrants around the turn of the last century. All came from Norway or Denmark. One grandfather worked on then bought farm North of Chicago. The other, had a fourth-grade education, probably equal to a master's degree today. His first job was driving a horse-drawn milk wagon in Chicago. Over time, he acquired several apartment buildings in Chicago, his wife never worked outside the home.

Both grandfathers provided for their wives before they died. My mother's mother always thought the government was crazy when she started getting survivor benefits when my grandfather passed.

 

[sealybobo]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

Soon watch the corporatist side of your party will start asking for more legal immigrants to replace all the baby boomers who are retiring.

Well I agree with you. I’d like to see our economy and population shrink. Poor people who have 2 to 5 kids need to start having 1-2 kids. The planet can’t take their reproduction and consumption of natural resources.

Look population 1900 America and see how many more there are today

Corporations will hate this. They will lose money but ultimately we can’t keep doubling the population

 

[Geaux4it]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

Soon watch the corporatist side of your party will start asking for more legal immigrants to replace all the baby boomers who are retiring.

Well I agree with you. I’d like to see our economy and population shrink. Poor people who have 2 to 5 kids need to start having 1-2 kids. The planet can’t take their reproduction and consumption of natural resources.

Look population 1900 America and see how many more there are today

Corporations will hate this. They will lose money but ultimately we can’t keep doubling the population

What is my party exactlly?

-Geaux

 

[sealybobo]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

Soon watch the corporatist side of your party will start asking for more legal immigrants to replace all the baby boomers who are retiring.

Well I agree with you. I’d like to see our economy and population shrink. Poor people who have 2 to 5 kids need to start having 1-2 kids. The planet can’t take their reproduction and consumption of natural resources.

Look population 1900 America and see how many more there are today

Corporations will hate this. They will lose money but ultimately we can’t keep doubling the population

What is my party exactlly?

-Geaux

Trump republican?

 

[Geaux4it]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

Soon watch the corporatist side of your party will start asking for more legal immigrants to replace all the baby boomers who are retiring.

Well I agree with you. I’d like to see our economy and population shrink. Poor people who have 2 to 5 kids need to start having 1-2 kids. The planet can’t take their reproduction and consumption of natural resources.

Look population 1900 America and see how many more there are today

Corporations will hate this. They will lose money but ultimately we can’t keep doubling the population

What is my party exactlly?

-Geaux

Trump republican?

In name only. Neither POTUS nor I are Republican

-Geaux

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

Soon watch the corporatist side of your party will start asking for more legal immigrants to replace all the baby boomers who are retiring.

Well I agree with you. I’d like to see our economy and population shrink. Poor people who have 2 to 5 kids need to start having 1-2 kids. The planet can’t take their reproduction and consumption of natural resources.

Look population 1900 America and see how many more there are today

Corporations will hate this. They will lose money but ultimately we can’t keep doubling the population

Not to worry. Automation is taking American jobs away by the millions. We lost way more jobs due to automation than outsourcing. Pretty soon it will be to the point of very few blue collar jobs left.

 

[sealybobo]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

Soon watch the corporatist side of your party will start asking for more legal immigrants to replace all the baby boomers who are retiring.

Well I agree with you. I’d like to see our economy and population shrink. Poor people who have 2 to 5 kids need to start having 1-2 kids. The planet can’t take their reproduction and consumption of natural resources.

Look population 1900 America and see how many more there are today

Corporations will hate this. They will lose money but ultimately we can’t keep doubling the population

Not to worry. Automation is taking American jobs away by the millions. We lost way more jobs due to automation than outsourcing. Pretty soon it will be to the point of very few blue collar jobs left.

So don’t you think the people who live in poverty right now should cut down on the number of kids they are having?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I have a message for all these illegal invaders

-Geaux

Soon watch the corporatist side of your party will start asking for more legal immigrants to replace all the baby boomers who are retiring.

Well I agree with you. I’d like to see our economy and population shrink. Poor people who have 2 to 5 kids need to start having 1-2 kids. The planet can’t take their reproduction and consumption of natural resources.

Look population 1900 America and see how many more there are today

Corporations will hate this. They will lose money but ultimately we can’t keep doubling the population

Not to worry. Automation is taking American jobs away by the millions. We lost way more jobs due to automation than outsourcing. Pretty soon it will be to the point of very few blue collar jobs left.

So don’t you think the people who live in poverty right now should cut down on the number of kids they are having?

Of course I agree with that. In fact in the past, I have suggested that women get fixed first before they get one dime on any social program. After all, the apple usually doesn't fall far from the tree. How can we ever solve poverty if we encourage people to make more children that are likely to be poor?

 

[dblack]

Why are you only concerned about border properties? The government uses imminent domain to take properties all the time. Where's your concern for the folks that lose land for a Post Office or other government functions?

I don't support eminent domain at all. But apparently "libertarians" like bripat9643 do. Whodathunkit?

That could make our roads look awfully funny.

.

Not necessarily. Believe it or not, problems like that can be resolved without resorting to violence.

 

[OKTexas]

Why are you only concerned about border properties? The government uses imminent domain to take properties all the time. Where's your concern for the folks that lose land for a Post Office or other government functions?

I don't support eminent domain at all. But apparently "libertarians" like bripat9643 do. Whodathunkit?

That could make our roads look awfully funny.

.

Not necessarily. Believe it or not, problems like that can be resolved without resorting to violence.

Care to elaborate?

.