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.. And Jephthah has been covered already.... I do have a question though, you said in two separate threads (on this board) that you had doubts when you were 11, and that the nuns would not let you read the bible until later on in your borrowed (stolen?) Past. Why didn't you just grab the family bible and read it your self ? .
Once again, you take out the personal insults and stupid accusations, it becomes a lot easier to address the substance of what you say.
When was Jephthah covered? Sorry, must have missed that.
What kind of bizarro world do you live in where a man butchers his young daughter because he makes a foolish oath and God is still loving and decent? yeah, they hid this story for a reason.
As for why I didn't read the bible when I was 11. I had better things to do when I was 11. Like play with my friends and watch cartoons, which is what 11 year olds do.
Today I enjoy reading the bible. It's freakin' hysterical. But frankly, I've read the verse, and the verse itself is every bit as retarded as what Sister Mary Butch (not trademarked) said. God drowns everyone because he didn't like what they were doing, but sin still existed even after he killed everyone.
Noah gets drunk, his son sees him naked, they curse his grandchildren through Ham to be slaves, and then we move on to the Tower of Babel.
Now, the interesting thing was that people took that verse to justify slavery. Black people descended from Ham, so it was okay to enslave them.
IOW you can only make an economic case against slavery, you cannot make a moral case against slavery.Slavery a bad thing, yes or no?
I'm await your reasoned argument as to why it is bad. Until then I reserve judgment.
Oh, so you're waiting for me to convince you? You haven't made up your mind yet? I can give you a very good argument based on American history why slavery stunts economic growth and social development.
But here's the thing. If you want to have even a shred of credibility when attempting to take the moral high ground over another poster, when someone asks you if slavery is a bad thing, the answer is always and every time an unequivocal "yes."
"Don't listen to him! He equates Stalinism with Christianity!"
"Is slavery bad?"
"I don't know."
It sort of undermines your position.
Which should be plainly obvious.
Can you make a rational argument against slavery, yes or no?
What I want to know is, where does he think he came by what he thinks of as the "universal, obvious truth" that "it's wrong to own another person", given that no other culture in the history of humanity ever believed that . . . until Christianity built Western civilization.
I guess the first 1700 years before the Enlightenment, when Western Civilization was plunged into darkness, ignorance and backwardness doesn't count, eh? Yes, let's go back to the 12th century as our benchmark for moral constructs, shall we?
I've said before, you are simply wrong. He does not offer a human sacrifice. There is no proof in the text, which you cannot read, that he does.Okay, what is your point?
Honestly, it's one of my favorite bible stories.
First, why doesn't God stop the sacrifice like he stopped the sacrifice of Isaac?
Keep in mind, other places in the bible, God says sacrificing Children is the worst of all crimes.
But Jephthah offers to sacrifice the first thing he meets when he comes home, and God is totally good when that turns out to be his daughter.
This guy show the absurdity of it all.
What I want to know is, where does he think he came by what he thinks of as the "universal, obvious truth" that "it's wrong to own another person", given that no other culture in the history of humanity ever believed that . . . until Christianity built Western civilization.
I guess the first 1700 years before the Enlightenment, when Western Civilization was plunged into darkness, ignorance and backwardness doesn't count, eh? Yes, let's go back to the 12th century as our benchmark for moral constructs, shall we?
That's not only not an argument, that isn't even coherent.
Okay, what is your point?
Honestly, it's one of my favorite bible stories.
First, why doesn't God stop the sacrifice like he stopped the sacrifice of Isaac?
Keep in mind, other places in the bible, God says sacrificing Children is the worst of all crimes.
But Jephthah offers to sacrifice the first thing he meets when he comes home, and God is totally good when that turns out to be his daughter.
This guy show the absurdity of it all.
Jephthah (Judges 11) - YouTube
I've said before, you are simply wrong. He does not offer a human sacrifice. There is no proof in the text, which you cannot read, that he does.Okay, what is your point?
But Jephthah offers to sacrifice the first thing he meets when he comes home, and God is totally good when that turns out to be his daughter.
This guy show the absurdity of it all.
Okay, what is your point?
Honestly, it's one of my favorite bible stories.
First, why doesn't God stop the sacrifice like he stopped the sacrifice of Isaac?
Keep in mind, other places in the bible, God says sacrificing Children is the worst of all crimes.
But Jephthah offers to sacrifice the first thing he meets when he comes home, and God is totally good when that turns out to be his daughter.
This guy show the absurdity of it all.
Jephthah (Judges 11) - YouTube
.....
I've said before, you are simply wrong. He does not offer a human sacrifice. There is no proof in the text, which you cannot read, that he does.Okay, what is your point?
But Jephthah offers to sacrifice the first thing he meets when he comes home, and God is totally good when that turns out to be his daughter.
This guy show the absurdity of it all.
Really?
SAB, Judges 11
11:30 And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands,
11:31 Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering.
11:34 And Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only child; beside her he had neither son nor daughter.
11:35 And it came to pass, when he saw her, that he rent his clothes, and said, Alas, my daughter! thou hast brought me very low, and thou art one of them that trouble me: for I have opened my mouth unto the LORD, and I cannot go back.
11:39 And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had vowed: and she knew no man. And it was a custom in Israel,
11:40 That the daughters of Israel went yearly to lament the daughter of Jephthah the Gileadite four days in a year.
Sounds pretty clear to me... The girl got butchered.
was that she lived out her life as a virgin or some nonsense. But there's really nothing in the bible to indicate that. She was slaughtered.
Samson is like a little kid waiving his arms up and down hoping someone pays attention to him...
I've said before, you are simply wrong. He does not offer a human sacrifice. There is no proof in the text, which you cannot read, that he does.
Really?
SAB, Judges 11
11:30 And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands,
11:31 Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering.
11:34 And Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only child; beside her he had neither son nor daughter.
11:35 And it came to pass, when he saw her, that he rent his clothes, and said, Alas, my daughter! thou hast brought me very low, and thou art one of them that trouble me: for I have opened my mouth unto the LORD, and I cannot go back.
11:39 And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had vowed: and she knew no man. And it was a custom in Israel,
11:40 That the daughters of Israel went yearly to lament the daughter of Jephthah the Gileadite four days in a year.
Sounds pretty clear to me... The girl got butchered.
was that she lived out her life as a virgin or some nonsense. But there's really nothing in the bible to indicate that. She was slaughtered.
You implied she was cut up like animal sacrifices were. Ware does it say that ?
" that she lived out her life as a virgin or some nonsense"
Never heard that one. Due to the fact that the story mentions Jephthah crying after he made the promise says that he killed her, and fully intended to do so. You are weak. Opinion, and not even an educated one at that.
IOW you can only make an economic case against slavery, you cannot make a moral case against slavery.I'm await your reasoned argument as to why it is bad. Until then I reserve judgment.
Oh, so you're waiting for me to convince you? You haven't made up your mind yet? I can give you a very good argument based on American history why slavery stunts economic growth and social development.
But here's the thing. If you want to have even a shred of credibility when attempting to take the moral high ground over another poster, when someone asks you if slavery is a bad thing, the answer is always and every time an unequivocal "yes."
"Don't listen to him! He equates Stalinism with Christianity!"
"Is slavery bad?"
"I don't know."
It sort of undermines your position.
Which should be plainly obvious.
Thanks for playing. Come back when you have something intelligent to say.
Really?
SAB, Judges 11
11:30 And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands,
11:31 Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering.
11:34 And Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only child; beside her he had neither son nor daughter.
11:35 And it came to pass, when he saw her, that he rent his clothes, and said, Alas, my daughter! thou hast brought me very low, and thou art one of them that trouble me: for I have opened my mouth unto the LORD, and I cannot go back.
11:39 And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had vowed: and she knew no man. And it was a custom in Israel,
11:40 That the daughters of Israel went yearly to lament the daughter of Jephthah the Gileadite four days in a year.
Sounds pretty clear to me... The girl got butchered.
was that she lived out her life as a virgin or some nonsense. But there's really nothing in the bible to indicate that. She was slaughtered.
You implied she was cut up like animal sacrifices were. Ware does it say that ?
" that she lived out her life as a virgin or some nonsense"
Never heard that one. Due to the fact that the story mentions Jephthah crying after he made the promise says that he killed her, and fully intended to do so. You are weak. Opinion, and not even an educated one at that.
Like I said, guy, there are FUndies who try to claim that was the "Sacrifice". I think Rabbid was trying to imply that, right when he tried to imply Hitler was an atheist or slavery was cool or referred to people as "yard apes." It's kind of hard to keep track of Rabbid's rantings.
He said that he sacrificed her as a burnt offering. Burnt offerings were butchered before they were burned. (Which is probably a good thing, it would make the story even more horrifying if he burned the girl alive.)
Of course, the rest of the book of Judges really do paint Jephthah as a stone cold psychopath. From slaughtering the Ammonites to his fellow Israelites for not being able to pronoun "Shibboleth" right.
IOW you can only make an economic case against slavery, you cannot make a moral case against slavery.Oh, so you're waiting for me to convince you? You haven't made up your mind yet? I can give you a very good argument based on American history why slavery stunts economic growth and social development.
But here's the thing. If you want to have even a shred of credibility when attempting to take the moral high ground over another poster, when someone asks you if slavery is a bad thing, the answer is always and every time an unequivocal "yes."
"Don't listen to him! He equates Stalinism with Christianity!"
"Is slavery bad?"
"I don't know."
It sort of undermines your position.
Which should be plainly obvious.
Thanks for playing. Come back when you have something intelligent to say.
Lol
Being chastised on morals by a racist who can't say whether or not slavery is bad. Outstanding!
Make the moral case against "Why Jews are subhuman" and you've made the moral case against slavery.
FFS
Not the ones who read there Bibles. Jephthah is covered in Sunday school classes geared towards second graders.
Hitler on religion. Its Wikipedia, but looks legit.
Adolf Hitler's religious views - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Adolf Hitler's religious views are a matter of some dispute. While raised by a skeptic father and a Catholic mother, after childhood, he ceased to participate in the Sacraments completely. He sometimes made public statements which seemed to affirm religion (which suited his political purposes) and prior to 1940 had promoted a "positive Christianity", purged of Judaism and instilled with Nazi philosophy, but in private was hostile to Christianity and had a plan to destroy it after the war. The degree to which he imbibed in and was influenced by the racist occultism, paganism and eroticism which was popular in late 19th, early 20th century Germany is also a matter of dispute.
Not the ones who read there Bibles. Jephthah is covered in Sunday school classes geared towards second graders.
Hitler on religion. Its Wikipedia, but looks legit.
Adolf Hitler's religious views - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Adolf Hitler's religious views are a matter of some dispute. While raised by a skeptic father and a Catholic mother, after childhood, he ceased to participate in the Sacraments completely. He sometimes made public statements which seemed to affirm religion (which suited his political purposes) and prior to 1940 had promoted a "positive Christianity", purged of Judaism and instilled with Nazi philosophy, but in private was hostile to Christianity and had a plan to destroy it after the war. The degree to which he imbibed in and was influenced by the racist occultism, paganism and eroticism which was popular in late 19th, early 20th century Germany is also a matter of dispute.
Now, you see, this is what an argument looks like.
Okay, let's tackle Jephthah first. Do you have a link to the second graders version of Judges. the only story they talked about from the Book of Judges was Samson, and in that case, they just talked about how he lost his strength when they cut his hair. (They passed over his numerous slaughters of Philistines when he wasn't trying to have sex with them.)
Your point on Hitler is "Well, maybe". Maybe he believed in Paganism or Occultism, but what he didn't believe in was atheism. He didn't reject sky pixies, he just believed in slightly different ones.
But the people who carried out his orders without question, no doubt, the vast majority of them were Christians. While a few churchmen had the courage to speak out most went along.
Like the Pastor who admitted that he said nothing when the Nazis came for everyone else, until they came for him.
