Why teachers need more pay

[anotherlife]

There are Teachers.....

and teachers...

the crazy ones.....the progressive teachers ,those against family and Christianity ...those teachers against decency and tradition...

I say ....let them starve or find another job,

the country doesn't need you.

If schools and teaching was not a public sector institution, then none of these problems would exist.

 

[anotherlife]

Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

All garbage.

First off, my parents are millionaires. And they were both public school teachers. Not only did both of them earn six-figure incomes by the end of their careers, but both of them went back to work after retiring, earning a full salary, plus their retirement.

"I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons"

No, 'teachers' do not deserve high pay. Good teachers, excellent teachers, award winning teachers, deserve high pay.

The vast majority of teachers are marginal, and many are just flat out crap. I had a teacher that would monotone a lecture for 30 minutes, and teach almost nothing.

Had another teacher that would push a VHS tape in (remember those?), hit play, and give a 'pop' quiz at the end of every single class.

That was his idea of "teaching".

So no, I reject this 'teachers deserve more' craziness. We have the most expensive, and least productive government funded school systems in the world. Most teachers should be paid less. A few should earn what they are getting, and a very tiny group should be paid a ton more because they are amazingly good at what they do and should be compensated.

None of that bullshit you described happens today.

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

Most would prefer the pension. Girl teaches for 30 years she’s 61 years old. She gets a pension the rest of her life.

We should not offer pensions to new teachers. Just pay them what teaching is worth. I did the math. Teachers make more per day than the rest of us. Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. I get 4 days off.

Add up all their days off they make A LOT per day. Teaching is worth $50k a year 60 if you’re good.

Having Christmas holidays is certainly a positive aspect of teaching as is having 8 weeks off in the summer but there are offsetting negative aspects of the job:

• Many people think teaching is just showing up for class 7 hours a day. What they don’t know is how many hours they actually spend prepping for the week. Teachers are up late at night grading papers scouring the Internet for ideas for class, answering emails from students and parents, grading papers and they spend their weekends doing the same. You also have to attend school dances, parent-teacher conferences, and extracurricular activities. Then there's surveys, attendance records, grade reporting, plus decorating the classroom, and purchasing supplies. When you add up these little jobs they are usually a lot more than 40 hours a week.
• Everyone knows that teachers are required to have a college education in most all districts. However, what a lot of people don't know is that in a number of states new teachers are required to obtain a Masters with in 3 to 5 years of employment.
• Teachers must also accumulate a certain number hours of continuing education which are additional classes they have to complete each year.
• Depending on the community, many parents have no regard for their child’s education which makes the teachers job very difficult. It's also extremely frustrating since school districts are increasing holding the teacher responsible for the progress of the student regardless of the situation at home.
• Compared to other professions, there are limited opportunities for advancement. Half of our teachers will never advance out of the classroom. As one teacher said, it's like going to school all your life and never graduating.

this list is not all that much different from what other e ecutives or workers have. In most jobs, you do need to prepare for your presentations, do your customer support work outside meting hours, and do these with only 2 weeks of vacation per year. So teachers are still wise guys who pulled it over everyone else. Very clever though. Hehehe.

 

[Unkotare]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

He has a long record of lying.

 

[sealybobo]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

Ok it could have been from Dec 20th to Jan 7th. Still a lot more days than we get off you whiny teacher bitches.

That's 19 fucking days off in a row. I would kill for 19 fucking days off you fucking pussy cry baby teachers. Pathetic.

 

[sealybobo]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

He has a long record of lying.

No I don't.

 

[sealybobo]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

Still a lot of days off. I get 15 days a year vacation total. You teachers are going to get 17 days off in a row? Go fuck yourselves when you cry about how bad you got it. Ridiculous.

 

[sealybobo]

Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

All garbage.

First off, my parents are millionaires. And they were both public school teachers. Not only did both of them earn six-figure incomes by the end of their careers, but both of them went back to work after retiring, earning a full salary, plus their retirement.

"I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons"

No, 'teachers' do not deserve high pay. Good teachers, excellent teachers, award winning teachers, deserve high pay.

The vast majority of teachers are marginal, and many are just flat out crap. I had a teacher that would monotone a lecture for 30 minutes, and teach almost nothing.

Had another teacher that would push a VHS tape in (remember those?), hit play, and give a 'pop' quiz at the end of every single class.

That was his idea of "teaching".

So no, I reject this 'teachers deserve more' craziness. We have the most expensive, and least productive government funded school systems in the world. Most teachers should be paid less. A few should earn what they are getting, and a very tiny group should be paid a ton more because they are amazingly good at what they do and should be compensated.

I think you're missing the point. We should not pay teachers more because they deserve it. We should pay teachers more because our kids and our nation desire it.

Most people go into education bypassing more lucrative fields because getting a degree in education is easier, jobs are more plentiful, and typically the jobs are more secure. This is not an environment that attacks our best people. There has to be changes and it all begins with better salaries but that's just for starters.

Teaching should be among our most honored professions. Teacher's education should be improved. School Districts need to spend a lot more money on the classroom and reducing pupil teacher ratios. There needs to be more incentives for teachers. But it all begins with better staff and that begins with better salaries and better education for teachers.

Old saying "He who can, does. He who cannot, teaches".

Most people bypass lucrative fields? You assume. Most can't hardly teach in their field, let alone be successful in the private sector.

You want to make that argument with me, show me the number of people who were in fact making 6-figure incomes or were extremely high in their field, and ditched it all to become a teacher. The number of those people is exceptionally small.

The rest of that is false. You look at spending per pupil, verses the quality of educational outcomes, and there is in inverse relationship. Here in Columbus Ohio, I compared relative spending per pupil, verses the 2nd year, and 4th year students. There was a clear connection between lower spending, and higher scores.

Equally I see no evidence that reduced class room sizes equals better educational outcomes.

A Libertarian Builds Low-Cost Private Schools for the Masses

I'm not buying that "most bypass lucrative fields" line either. If someone went to school and was cut out for marketing, they went into marketing. If they were talented enough to become a doctor they did. Engineering. Etc. If they were attracted to the business world maybe they went into HR or IT or whatever it is they were good at.

People who go into teaching have all these other degrees as options. They chose to be teachers because they didn't know what else they wanted to do. THey took 2 years of community college classes and then just like us they had a choice to make.

No one passed on a lucrative field because they were noble or righteous. Please don't tell me all the average teachers I know passed on lucrative fields because they were noble or righteous. That's just bullshit.

Just like sales is all I was ever really cut out to do, that's the only degree that they felt comfortable doing.

And when you graduate with a Marketing or HR degree you also have to figure out who's going to hire you when you have no experience. Teachers don't have to worry about that. They all get hired. That must play a role in why they pick teaching not to mention the job security.

You think in small terms, in limited terms, and if people don't think just like you, you can't imagine HOW they think.

Frankly, you would be a horrid teacher. And since you would be a horrid teacher, you really hate teachers and can't imagine why anyone would be one, except that it's "easy".

Didn't I already explain to you that it's just my republican side of my brain that hates you government public union workers. OTher than that I love you all. Except Unkotare.

 

[sealybobo]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

He has a long record of lying.

You actually have a long record of lying. In fact your post is a lie. Show me where or when I have lied.

Admiral, what he is referring to is that I got a partial scholarship to wrestle in college and I quit my freshman year because it was too hard to get a business degree and wrestle at the same time. This tells me a teaching degree must be easy because dummy Unkotare was able to do both. Until he got hurt of course. Because he's a fish and that's what happens to fish. They get hurt.

Anyways, me saying "I wrestled in college" is not a lie the same as it's not a lie that you say you wrestled in college. Did you wrestle all 4 years? Then you didn't wrestle in college either. LOL.

 

[Unkotare]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

Ok it could have been from Dec 20th to Jan 7th. ....

GUESS again, dumbass.

 

[sealybobo]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

Ok it could have been from Dec 20th to Jan 7th. ....

GUESS again, dumbass.

Milford Public Schools / Calendar

Dec 21-and they go back the 8th. How many days is that off in a row? I haven't had that many days off since I was in HIGHSCHOOL!!!

You spoiled brats.

Did you see that most people said yes when asked if teachers should make more money but then changed their minds when they found out how much teachers make?

That's because they've been hearing the chorus from teachers all these years about how overnworked and underpaid you all are. Well once people find out teachers make $70K, they then realize you guys are actually very well compensated. ESPECIALLY if you are getting a pension when you retire like my sister in law is. And ESPECIALLY when I could never take 17 days off in a row.

So my sister in law goes to Greece every summer for 2 months and she right now is enjoying more days off in a row than I get all year and she makes $70K?

Does anyone here think she deserves more money? Oh and I know parents who's kids had her as a teacher. She's not even a good teacher.

 

[Unkotare]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

He has a long record of lying.

No I don't.

There’s another.

 

[sealybobo]

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

He has a long record of lying.

No I don't.

There’s another.

Examples? Otherwise quit wasting our time and derailing the conversation. Do you have something to add to the topic that I know a bad teacher who makes $70K and she goes to Greece every summer for 2 months. I can't take 2 months off.

And right now she's got 17 days off in a row, which is more vacation days than I get all year total.

So every fucking year you get 2 vacations that are BOTH longer than all the days I have off all year.

Cry me a river you work hard. You work hard because you don't know what hard work is. The truth is, if you had to do our jobs you would go crawling back to your school thanking them for such a cush job with such great benefits and job security.

Fish.

 

[Unkotare]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

He has a long record of lying.

You actually have a long record of lying. In fact your post is a lie. Show me where or when I have lied.

...Did you wrestle all 4 years? ...

More than 4 years. Then I wrestled in China, and after that in Japan. Now I coach.


Feel (more) stupid yet, liar?

 

[Unkotare]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

This years holiday period starts today, December 21st and runs through January 6th. That's a full week less than what you said. Unkotare is right. Someone is lying to you. Either that, or you are telling a bald face lie.

He has a long record of lying.

... Show me where or when I have lied

...it was too hard to get a business degree and wrestle at the same time. This tells me a teaching degree must be easy because dummy Unkotare was able to do both. ...

More lies.

I independently completed two bachelor degrees (neither one a teaching degree, dumbass) in four years while training longer and harder than Bobo idiot ever has at anything, and working the overnight shift in a part-time job, and chasing girls around campus. Oh, and years later completing a Masters degree with a family and two jobs at the same time. Some lazy pieces of shit Have just always been lazy pieces of shit and oh what a surprise that they quit and wash out of things when it gets hard. Pathetic.

 

[ding]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

Most would prefer the pension. Girl teaches for 30 years she’s 61 years old. She gets a pension the rest of her life.

We should not offer pensions to new teachers. Just pay them what teaching is worth. I did the math. Teachers make more per day than the rest of us. Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. I get 4 days off.

Add up all their days off they make A LOT per day. Teaching is worth $50k a year 60 if you’re good.

I have a pension and I’m not in a union.

 

[SweetSue92]

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

.....Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. ....

Like, whoever told you that was, like, lying to you.

Ok it could have been from Dec 20th to Jan 7th. Still a lot more days than we get off you whiny teacher bitches.

That's 19 fucking days off in a row. I would kill for 19 fucking days off you fucking pussy cry baby teachers. Pathetic.

Get a grip on yourself. There's always someone who has it better than you--always. In time off, in money, in intelligence, in beauty, in raw talent, in circumstances, in dumb luck. Coveting will eat you up from the inside out, always.

Seriously. It's poison.

 

[SweetSue92]

All garbage.

First off, my parents are millionaires. And they were both public school teachers. Not only did both of them earn six-figure incomes by the end of their careers, but both of them went back to work after retiring, earning a full salary, plus their retirement.

"I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons"

No, 'teachers' do not deserve high pay. Good teachers, excellent teachers, award winning teachers, deserve high pay.

The vast majority of teachers are marginal, and many are just flat out crap. I had a teacher that would monotone a lecture for 30 minutes, and teach almost nothing.

Had another teacher that would push a VHS tape in (remember those?), hit play, and give a 'pop' quiz at the end of every single class.

That was his idea of "teaching".

So no, I reject this 'teachers deserve more' craziness. We have the most expensive, and least productive government funded school systems in the world. Most teachers should be paid less. A few should earn what they are getting, and a very tiny group should be paid a ton more because they are amazingly good at what they do and should be compensated.

I think you're missing the point. We should not pay teachers more because they deserve it. We should pay teachers more because our kids and our nation desire it.

Most people go into education bypassing more lucrative fields because getting a degree in education is easier, jobs are more plentiful, and typically the jobs are more secure. This is not an environment that attacks our best people. There has to be changes and it all begins with better salaries but that's just for starters.

Teaching should be among our most honored professions. Teacher's education should be improved. School Districts need to spend a lot more money on the classroom and reducing pupil teacher ratios. There needs to be more incentives for teachers. But it all begins with better staff and that begins with better salaries and better education for teachers.

Old saying "He who can, does. He who cannot, teaches".

Most people bypass lucrative fields? You assume. Most can't hardly teach in their field, let alone be successful in the private sector.

You want to make that argument with me, show me the number of people who were in fact making 6-figure incomes or were extremely high in their field, and ditched it all to become a teacher. The number of those people is exceptionally small.

The rest of that is false. You look at spending per pupil, verses the quality of educational outcomes, and there is in inverse relationship. Here in Columbus Ohio, I compared relative spending per pupil, verses the 2nd year, and 4th year students. There was a clear connection between lower spending, and higher scores.

Equally I see no evidence that reduced class room sizes equals better educational outcomes.

A Libertarian Builds Low-Cost Private Schools for the Masses

I'm not buying that "most bypass lucrative fields" line either. If someone went to school and was cut out for marketing, they went into marketing. If they were talented enough to become a doctor they did. Engineering. Etc. If they were attracted to the business world maybe they went into HR or IT or whatever it is they were good at.

People who go into teaching have all these other degrees as options. They chose to be teachers because they didn't know what else they wanted to do. THey took 2 years of community college classes and then just like us they had a choice to make.

No one passed on a lucrative field because they were noble or righteous. Please don't tell me all the average teachers I know passed on lucrative fields because they were noble or righteous. That's just bullshit.

Just like sales is all I was ever really cut out to do, that's the only degree that they felt comfortable doing.

And when you graduate with a Marketing or HR degree you also have to figure out who's going to hire you when you have no experience. Teachers don't have to worry about that. They all get hired. That must play a role in why they pick teaching not to mention the job security.

You think in small terms, in limited terms, and if people don't think just like you, you can't imagine HOW they think.

Frankly, you would be a horrid teacher. And since you would be a horrid teacher, you really hate teachers and can't imagine why anyone would be one, except that it's "easy".

Didn't I already explain to you that it's just my republican side of my brain that hates you government public union workers. OTher than that I love you all. Except Unkotare.

Oh just spare me. You spew nothing but horrid vitriol here. So really, spare me. No you don't.

 

[Flopper]

Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

All garbage.

First off, my parents are millionaires. And they were both public school teachers. Not only did both of them earn six-figure incomes by the end of their careers, but both of them went back to work after retiring, earning a full salary, plus their retirement.

"I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons"

No, 'teachers' do not deserve high pay. Good teachers, excellent teachers, award winning teachers, deserve high pay.

The vast majority of teachers are marginal, and many are just flat out crap. I had a teacher that would monotone a lecture for 30 minutes, and teach almost nothing.

Had another teacher that would push a VHS tape in (remember those?), hit play, and give a 'pop' quiz at the end of every single class.

That was his idea of "teaching".

So no, I reject this 'teachers deserve more' craziness. We have the most expensive, and least productive government funded school systems in the world. Most teachers should be paid less. A few should earn what they are getting, and a very tiny group should be paid a ton more because they are amazingly good at what they do and should be compensated.

None of that bullshit you described happens today.

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

Most would prefer the pension. Girl teaches for 30 years she’s 61 years old. She gets a pension the rest of her life.

We should not offer pensions to new teachers. Just pay them what teaching is worth. I did the math. Teachers make more per day than the rest of us. Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. I get 4 days off.

Add up all their days off they make A LOT per day. Teaching is worth $50k a year 60 if you’re good.

Having Christmas holidays is certainly a positive aspect of teaching as is having 8 weeks off in the summer but there are offsetting negative aspects of the job:

• Many people think teaching is just showing up for class 7 hours a day. What they don’t know is how many hours they actually spend prepping for the week. Teachers are up late at night grading papers scouring the Internet for ideas for class, answering emails from students and parents, grading papers and they spend their weekends doing the same. You also have to attend school dances, parent-teacher conferences, and extracurricular activities. Then there's surveys, attendance records, grade reporting, plus decorating the classroom, and purchasing supplies. When you add up these little jobs they are usually a lot more than 40 hours a week.
• Everyone knows that teachers are required to have a college education in most all districts. However, what a lot of people don't know is that in a number of states new teachers are required to obtain a Masters with in 3 to 5 years of employment.
• Teachers must also accumulate a certain number hours of continuing education which are additional classes they have to complete each year.
• Depending on the community, many parents have no regard for their child’s education which makes the teachers job very difficult. It's also extremely frustrating since school districts are increasing holding the teacher responsible for the progress of the student regardless of the situation at home.
• Compared to other professions, there are limited opportunities for advancement. Half of our teachers will never advance out of the classroom. As one teacher said, it's like going to school all your life and never graduating.

this list is not all that much different from what other e ecutives or workers have. In most jobs, you do need to prepare for your presentations, do your customer support work outside meting hours, and do these with only 2 weeks of vacation per year. So teachers are still wise guys who pulled it over everyone else. Very clever though. Hehehe.

I think the major difference between professional people in business and teachers is the opportunity of advancement. Most people that go into teaching give up the idea that they will every advance past the classroom. If you are lucky, you might become a department head with a small increase in pay and a lot of additional work plus teaching. Over half the teachers that remain in education retire as teachers. The opportunity for advance is slim at best. You don't get to be a principle without at least a Masters degree and if you hope to move up further you better plan on more education. Even with more education advancement is not likely. Unlike the business world, success does not equate to more money. Growth rates in education is relatively low compared to most businesses so you can't look forward to any end of year bonuses or major expansions. What you get in teaching as compensation is job security, a good retiremen. Without that it's just the satisfaction of teaching kids which grows pretty old after 20 years.

A friend of mine is retiring from teaching after 30 years. She has been an elementary teacher at the same school for 26 years in the same classroom. She loves teaching and loves kids. I have no doubt that she would continue teaching till the day she died but her health prevents it. The pay is immaterial. However, most teachers are not like this. They teach because they need a paycheck. If you want better education for your kids, you need to pay a salary that will attract better people. It's that simple.

 

[fncceo]

If you want to make the argument that teachers deserve more pay because of their value to society. Well, that is at least a basis for an argument. Although the market seems to state pretty categorically that they don't.

But, to say that teachers need to make more money because the need it. That is no argument at all. Every worker in America can make the same exact claim. I need more money too. If I was making a million dollars a month, I'd still need another $50 a month to pay the ISP bill.

 

[anotherlife]

Okay, so I hope everyone can follow me here. I am going to write about how much teachers should be paid, but not from my own perspective. I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons, I just want to clarify that. But let's, for a second, assume I am the kind of person who says "Teachers jobs are easy, they get summers off, they're just glorified babysitters" and the work we all know teachers need to take home doesn't count.

Let's assume we pay teachers less than what I was paid to babysit in high school. So give them...$4/hour. Let's only pay them for the hours they are in school - let's say 6.5 hours a day. That brings their daily pay to $26.

But teachers don't only teach one student. Let's say the teacher teaches 30 students. Every parent should pay $26 a day for their child to be "babysat" and at thirty students that comes out to $780/day.

Now, 5 day school week brings that to $3,900 a week.
Or, if you want to figure in days, let's say they work 180 days a year (meaning no paid vacations) $780/day for 180 days = $140,000.

The average teacher salary tends to hover between $50,000 - $60,000. So, on the high end of that spectrum, let's figure out how much teachers make per hour per child:
$60,000/180 days = $333.33/day. $333.33 per day/30 students = $11.11 per student per day. Figure in the 6.5 hours and that's $1.71 per hour per student.



So teachers get paid more than they do on average, even in my fictional scenario, where we pay teachers less per hour per child than the average babysitter, and don't pay them for any of the additional work they need to do outside of school hours, and give them no vacation pay.

All garbage.

First off, my parents are millionaires. And they were both public school teachers. Not only did both of them earn six-figure incomes by the end of their careers, but both of them went back to work after retiring, earning a full salary, plus their retirement.

"I believe teachers deserve high pay for a multitude of reasons"

No, 'teachers' do not deserve high pay. Good teachers, excellent teachers, award winning teachers, deserve high pay.

The vast majority of teachers are marginal, and many are just flat out crap. I had a teacher that would monotone a lecture for 30 minutes, and teach almost nothing.

Had another teacher that would push a VHS tape in (remember those?), hit play, and give a 'pop' quiz at the end of every single class.

That was his idea of "teaching".

So no, I reject this 'teachers deserve more' craziness. We have the most expensive, and least productive government funded school systems in the world. Most teachers should be paid less. A few should earn what they are getting, and a very tiny group should be paid a ton more because they are amazingly good at what they do and should be compensated.

None of that bullshit you described happens today.

Teachers would get more pay if 99 % of their tax budget was not all about paying pensions.

Most would prefer the pension. Girl teaches for 30 years she’s 61 years old. She gets a pension the rest of her life.

We should not offer pensions to new teachers. Just pay them what teaching is worth. I did the math. Teachers make more per day than the rest of us. Like teachers are off from December 15 to Jan 7. I get 4 days off.

Add up all their days off they make A LOT per day. Teaching is worth $50k a year 60 if you’re good.

Having Christmas holidays is certainly a positive aspect of teaching as is having 8 weeks off in the summer but there are offsetting negative aspects of the job:

• Many people think teaching is just showing up for class 7 hours a day. What they don’t know is how many hours they actually spend prepping for the week. Teachers are up late at night grading papers scouring the Internet for ideas for class, answering emails from students and parents, grading papers and they spend their weekends doing the same. You also have to attend school dances, parent-teacher conferences, and extracurricular activities. Then there's surveys, attendance records, grade reporting, plus decorating the classroom, and purchasing supplies. When you add up these little jobs they are usually a lot more than 40 hours a week.
• Everyone knows that teachers are required to have a college education in most all districts. However, what a lot of people don't know is that in a number of states new teachers are required to obtain a Masters with in 3 to 5 years of employment.
• Teachers must also accumulate a certain number hours of continuing education which are additional classes they have to complete each year.
• Depending on the community, many parents have no regard for their child’s education which makes the teachers job very difficult. It's also extremely frustrating since school districts are increasing holding the teacher responsible for the progress of the student regardless of the situation at home.
• Compared to other professions, there are limited opportunities for advancement. Half of our teachers will never advance out of the classroom. As one teacher said, it's like going to school all your life and never graduating.

this list is not all that much different from what other e ecutives or workers have. In most jobs, you do need to prepare for your presentations, do your customer support work outside meting hours, and do these with only 2 weeks of vacation per year. So teachers are still wise guys who pulled it over everyone else. Very clever though. Hehehe.

I think the major difference between professional people in business and teachers is the opportunity of advancement. Most people that go into teaching give up the idea that they will every advance past the classroom. If you are lucky, you might become a department head with a small increase in pay and a lot of additional work plus teaching. Over half the teachers that remain in education retire as teachers. The opportunity for advance is slim at best. You don't get to be a principle without at least a Masters degree and if you hope to move up further you better plan on more education. Even with more education advancement is not likely. Unlike the business world, success does not equate to more money. Growth rates in education is relatively low compared to most businesses so you can't look forward to any end of year bonuses or major expansions. What you get in teaching as compensation is job security, a good retiremen. Without that it's just the satisfaction of teaching kids which grows pretty old after 20 years.

A friend of mine is retiring from teaching after 30 years. She has been an elementary teacher at the same school for 26 years in the same classroom. She loves teaching and loves kids. I have no doubt that she would continue teaching till the day she died but her health prevents it. The pay is immaterial. However, most teachers are not like this. They teach because they need a paycheck. If you want better education for your kids, you need to pay a salary that will attract better people. It's that simple.

No, because the business world is volatile. You only write about success, but no, in business for every success there is at least two failures. And I met teachers who successfully transitioned into banking and various public relations offices. Teachers skills are transferable too.