You want to "fix" healthcare?

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs. Emergencies excluded of course but it consumers had more control over how & where their healthcare dollars were spent, providers could be kept in check. Need an mri? Price shop it. Why should one procedure cost Sam 4k and Sally 3k just because they have different insurance? The costs to the provider are static yet the cost to consumers fluctuate based on coverage type.
Remove the collusion between providers & insurance companies & put the consumer in charge.
Every other insurance works with the consumer in charge. Need a new bumper because of a fender bender? The insurance company cuts you a check for 400.00 and YOU shop for the best deal. Might cost you extra or you might pocket 50 bucks. In the end it's your choice and your bumper is replaced.
No other industry hides their fees to the consumer until after services are rendered except the healthcare industry.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Just a little anecdote to offer.

The last time I went to the ER was about 8 or 9 years ago. I was moving some furniture I'm my house barefoot and in the process broke my toe. Literally snapped it in two and it was pointed towards my heel.
After getting it set in the ER and getting a referral to an orthopedic surgeon I offered to pay for the bill. I don't remember the exact conversation but was basically told that wasn't possible and they couldn't even give me the bill. I had to wait weeks for the bill to come in the mail. I went back and asked for a cash price as I only carried catastrophic and they told me that I could fill out financial assistance forms! I told them I wasn't looking for assistance and wouldn't qualify anyways and was just looking for a cash price that didn't include fees for dealing with insurance companies.
The bill was absurdly high and no discount was given.

 

[Eaglewings]

Just a little anecdote to offer.

The last time I went to the ER was about 8 or 9 years ago. I was moving some furniture I'm my house barefoot and in the process broke my toe. Literally snapped it in two and it was pointed towards my heel.
After getting it set in the ER and getting a referral to an orthopedic surgeon I offered to pay for the bill. I don't remember the exact conversation but was basically told that wasn't possible and they couldn't even give me the bill. I had to wait weeks for the bill to come in the mail. I went back and asked for a cash price as I only carried catastrophic and they told me that I could fill out financial assistance forms! I told them I wasn't looking for assistance and wouldn't qualify anyways and was just looking for a cash price that didn't include fees for dealing with insurance companies.
The bill was absurdly high and no discount was given.

Yep, one time I went in with horrible vertigo spinning and barfing...they gave me 1 IV and script for sea sick pills..Charged me $7.000 for that...never again...

 

[Care4all]

Ones health care is not a widget someone is buying.... if your kid breaks his arm and leg, or is hit by a car, you don't have time to shop around for the best price...

Even in an MRI situations, it's usually an important test that is needed right away.....

Health care will not ever be a free market widget, they usually have us by the balls on what we have to pay....

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Ones health care is not a widget someone is buying.... if your kid breaks his arm and leg, or is hit by a car, you don't have time to shop around for the best price...

Even in an MRI situations, it's usually an important test that is needed right away.....

Health care will not ever be a free market widget, they usually have us by the balls on what we have to pay....

I CLEARLY made an exception for emergencies. And contrary to your belief, mri's, are not usually emergency prescribed. I've had around 6 of them. None were emergency situations.

Also it's sad to see that you've given into the status quo.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Obamacare, Medicare, Medicade & the va can demand & or fix set pricing for the government but they can't give that same latitude to the consumer?

 

[AntonToo]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs.

Pricing is different for most, depending on complex negotiations with payers. Therefore showing it is also very complex. Single payer doesn't have such issues - the prices are transparent and set for one payer.

That doesn't mean it can't be done, but it is a lot more involved then you might imagine and none of this necessitates repeal of Obamacare, which has other cost reducing mechanisms already in place, already reducing costs.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs.

Pricing is different for most, depending on complex negotiations with payers. Therefore showing it is also very complex. Single payer doesn't have such issues - the prices are transparent and set for one payer.

That doesn't mean it can't be done, but it is a lot more involved then you might imagine and none of this necessitates repeal of Obamacare, which has other cost reducing mechanisms already in place, already reducing costs.

Putting a man on the moon was complex. Setting regulations that would actually benefit consumers, not so much.

 

[Care4all]

Ones health care is not a widget someone is buying.... if your kid breaks his arm and leg, or is hit by a car, you don't have time to shop around for the best price...

Even in an MRI situations, it's usually an important test that is needed right away.....

Health care will not ever be a free market widget, they usually have us by the balls on what we have to pay....

I CLEARLY made an exception for emergencies. And contrary to your belief, mri's, are not usually emergency prescribed. I've had around 6 of them. None were emergency situations.

Also it's sad to see that you've given into the status quo.

look, it is a mess, and yes it would be nice to know what someone is going to charge before they service you....

but it simply does not and can not work that way with Insurance in the picture. Each insurance company negotiates on the price they will have to pay the Hospital for each procedure....they sign a contract for that price...your neighbor's insurance company may not have gotten as good a price as your insurance company, for varying reasons...they may have fewer customers in the plan with the hospitals, they may have a plan that is covering only old people who are going to use hospital services more, etc etc etc etc etc.....than the insurance plan you are on, or less....it is filled with variables.... I think I read once that Jjohn Hopkins had 125 different insurance plans with 125 different prices that they had to deal with in their billing office, costing the hospital a fortune in just clerical work keeping up with the different plans and different prices the plans would pay....

It's a royal mess, I agree, but mostly due to the free market with Insurance companies being the middle men collecting the dough for clerical processing........

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Ones health care is not a widget someone is buying.... if your kid breaks his arm and leg, or is hit by a car, you don't have time to shop around for the best price...

Even in an MRI situations, it's usually an important test that is needed right away.....

Health care will not ever be a free market widget, they usually have us by the balls on what we have to pay....

I CLEARLY made an exception for emergencies. And contrary to your belief, mri's, are not usually emergency prescribed. I've had around 6 of them. None were emergency situations.

Also it's sad to see that you've given into the status quo.

look, it is a mess, and yes it would be nice to know what someone is going to charge before they service you....

but it simply does not and can not work that way with Insurance in the picture. Each insurance company negotiates on the price they will have to pay the Hospital for each procedure....they sign a contract for that price...your neighbor's insurance company may not have gotten as good a price as your insurance company, for varying reasons...they may have fewer customers in the plan with the hospitals, they may have a plan that is covering only old people who are going to use hospital services more, etc etc etc etc etc.....than the insurance plan you are on, or less....it is filled with variables.... I think I read once that Jjohn Hopkins had 125 different insurance plans with 125 different prices that they had to deal with in their billing office, costing the hospital a fortune in just clerical work keeping up with the different plans and different prices the plans would pay....

It's a royal mess, I agree, but mostly due to the free market with Insurance companies being the middle men collecting the dough for clerical processing........

You are excusing the very problem I am talking about. Insurance pools would be unnecessary if everyone had the power to barter for the same price. You are allowing the medical industry to treat you as a probable car buyer with this logic.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs.

Pricing is different for most, depending on complex negotiations with payers. Therefore showing it is also very complex. Single payer doesn't have such issues - the prices are transparent and set for one payer.

That doesn't mean it can't be done, but it is a lot more involved then you might imagine and none of this necessitates repeal of Obamacare, which has other cost reducing mechanisms already in place, already reducing costs.

I just realized you made my point for me.

"Pricing is complex because of negotiations with payers" ie, insurance companies.

Give that power to the consumer. Treat medical insurance like every other kind of insurance. If my house burns down my insurer doesn't negotiate the cost of a replacement tv or refrigerator with best buy, I do. They cut a check and I get the best deal I can. I may have no out of pocket expenses or I may upgrade and add my own money to the pot.
Why allow a third party dictate what we can or can not have in regards to our very lives when we don't for the most unimportant things?

 

[AntonToo]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs.

Pricing is different for most, depending on complex negotiations with payers. Therefore showing it is also very complex. Single payer doesn't have such issues - the prices are transparent and set for one payer.

That doesn't mean it can't be done, but it is a lot more involved then you might imagine and none of this necessitates repeal of Obamacare, which has other cost reducing mechanisms already in place, already reducing costs.

Putting a man on the moon was complex. Setting regulations that would actually benefit consumers, not so much.

Ok who is going to do it? Republicans? Don't make me laugh, they are too busy salivating over how to wreck what they couldn't build.

 

[Flopper]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs. Emergencies excluded of course but it consumers had more control over how & where their healthcare dollars were spent, providers could be kept in check. Need an mri? Price shop it. Why should one procedure cost Sam 4k and Sally 3k just because they have different insurance? The costs to the provider are static yet the cost to consumers fluctuate based on coverage type.
Remove the collusion between providers & insurance companies & put the consumer in charge.
Every other insurance works with the consumer in charge. Need a new bumper because of a fender bender? The insurance company cuts you a check for 400.00 and YOU shop for the best deal. Might cost you extra or you might pocket 50 bucks. In the end it's your choice and your bumper is replaced.
No other industry hides their fees to the consumer until after services are rendered except the healthcare industry.

Do you realize that most of the healthcare cost is not going to the emergency rooms every 7 or 8 years, seeing a doctor a couple times a year or a 3 day stay in the hospital every 10 or 20 years. The fact is 5% of the patients account for more than 50% of the medical cost in the US. 15% of the healthcare is end of life care. The vast majority of these people are really sick, with multiple doctors, many trips to the hospital, a dozen or more medications daily. These people do not and often can not shop for healthcare. I had a family member who became very ill and was rushed to the hospital. After 16 days in intensive care dozens of procedures, and 2 amputations he died. The bill was $438,000 and it was over 200 pages long. Thinking people with serious acute medical conditions are going to go shopping for medical care is absurd.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Ones health care is not a widget someone is buying.... if your kid breaks his arm and leg, or is hit by a car, you don't have time to shop around for the best price...

Even in an MRI situations, it's usually an important test that is needed right away.....

Health care will not ever be a free market widget, they usually have us by the balls on what we have to pay....

I CLEARLY made an exception for emergencies. And contrary to your belief, mri's, are not usually emergency prescribed. I've had around 6 of them. None were emergency situations.

Also it's sad to see that you've given into the status quo.

look, it is a mess, and yes it would be nice to know what someone is going to charge before they service you....

but it simply does not and can not work that way with Insurance in the picture. Each insurance company negotiates on the price they will have to pay the Hospital for each procedure....they sign a contract for that price...your neighbor's insurance company may not have gotten as good a price as your insurance company, for varying reasons...they may have fewer customers in the plan with the hospitals, they may have a plan that is covering only old people who are going to use hospital services more, etc etc etc etc etc.....than the insurance plan you are on, or less....it is filled with variables.... I think I read once that Jjohn Hopkins had 125 different insurance plans with 125 different prices that they had to deal with in their billing office, costing the hospital a fortune in just clerical work keeping up with the different plans and different prices the plans would pay....

It's a royal mess, I agree, but mostly due to the free market with Insurance companies being the middle men collecting the dough for clerical processing........

Obamacare was never about health care but had everything to do with health insurance. Get the insurance companies out of the equation, don't let them write the next rendition of health coverage and focus on actual care
and we might see some improvements. And let's not wait to see what's in a new plan until after it's voted upon.

 

[AntonToo]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs.

Pricing is different for most, depending on complex negotiations with payers. Therefore showing it is also very complex. Single payer doesn't have such issues - the prices are transparent and set for one payer.

That doesn't mean it can't be done, but it is a lot more involved then you might imagine and none of this necessitates repeal of Obamacare, which has other cost reducing mechanisms already in place, already reducing costs.

I just realized you made my point for me.

"Pricing is complex because of negotiations with payers" ie, insurance companies.

Give that power to the consumer. Treat medical insurance like every other kind of insurance. If my house burns down my insurer doesn't negotiate the cost of a replacement tv or refrigerator with best buy, I do. They cut a check and I get the best deal I can. I may have no out of pocket expenses or I may upgrade and add my own money to the pot.
Why allow a third party dictate what we can or can not have in regards to our very lives when we don't for the most unimportant things?

...you negotiated TV price because you paid for it out of pocket well before emergency hit. That's not how healthcare works, the analogy is false.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs.

Pricing is different for most, depending on complex negotiations with payers. Therefore showing it is also very complex. Single payer doesn't have such issues - the prices are transparent and set for one payer.

That doesn't mean it can't be done, but it is a lot more involved then you might imagine and none of this necessitates repeal of Obamacare, which has other cost reducing mechanisms already in place, already reducing costs.

Putting a man on the moon was complex. Setting regulations that would actually benefit consumers, not so much.

Ok who is going to do it? Republicans? Don't make me laugh, they are too busy salivating over how to wreck what they couldn't build.

And the dems were so much better? Pahlezzz. My medical premiums went through the roof thanks to their help.

Rather than playing the blame game why not pool our thoughts and inform our representatives what we think & want regardless of party.

The election of Trump proves that Americans have power if they choose to exercise it.

 

[AntonToo]

Obamacare was never about health care but had everything to do with health insurance. Get the insurance companies out of the equation.

ummm HOW?

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs. Emergencies excluded of course but it consumers had more control over how & where their healthcare dollars were spent, providers could be kept in check. Need an mri? Price shop it. Why should one procedure cost Sam 4k and Sally 3k just because they have different insurance? The costs to the provider are static yet the cost to consumers fluctuate based on coverage type.
Remove the collusion between providers & insurance companies & put the consumer in charge.
Every other insurance works with the consumer in charge. Need a new bumper because of a fender bender? The insurance company cuts you a check for 400.00 and YOU shop for the best deal. Might cost you extra or you might pocket 50 bucks. In the end it's your choice and your bumper is replaced.
No other industry hides their fees to the consumer until after services are rendered except the healthcare industry.

Do you realize that most of the healthcare cost is not going to the emergency rooms every 7 or 8 years, seeing a doctor a couple times a year or a 3 day stay in the hospital every 10 or 20 years. The fact is 5% of the patients account for more than 50% of the medical cost in the US. 15% of the healthcare is end of life care. The vast majority of these people are really sick, with multiple doctors, many trips to the hospital, a dozen or more medications daily. These people do not and often can not shop for healthcare. I had a family member who became very ill and was rushed to the hospital. After 16 days in intensive care dozens of procedures, and 2 amputations he died. The bill was $438,000 and it was over 200 pages long. Thinking people with serious acute medical conditions are going to go shopping for medical care is absurd.

Yes, I realize that. We took care of my grandmother in home until the last 6 months of her life. I get that, VERY MUCH, but you have to start somewhere.

 

[AntonToo]

And the dems were so much better? Pahlezzz. My medical premiums went through the roof thanks to their help.

Rather than playing the blame game why not pool our thoughts and inform our representatives what we think & want regardless of party.

The election of Trump proves that Americans have power if they choose to exercise it.

World doesn't revolve around YOU and statistics show otherwise. Premiums and general healthcare spending growth has not gone through the roof compared to what was going on in 2000s, it was slower.

Election proves that Americans are more ignorant and desperate for that new car smell than some anticipated.

Trump has been everywhere from Single Payer to Universal Care to No Care, he is an orange buffoon without any real understanding of any issues, healthcare least of all.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Start with pricing. Open & public pricing would create competition among healthcare providers for your dollar and your healthcare needs.

Pricing is different for most, depending on complex negotiations with payers. Therefore showing it is also very complex. Single payer doesn't have such issues - the prices are transparent and set for one payer.

That doesn't mean it can't be done, but it is a lot more involved then you might imagine and none of this necessitates repeal of Obamacare, which has other cost reducing mechanisms already in place, already reducing costs.

I just realized you made my point for me.

"Pricing is complex because of negotiations with payers" ie, insurance companies.

Give that power to the consumer. Treat medical insurance like every other kind of insurance. If my house burns down my insurer doesn't negotiate the cost of a replacement tv or refrigerator with best buy, I do. They cut a check and I get the best deal I can. I may have no out of pocket expenses or I may upgrade and add my own money to the pot.
Why allow a third party dictate what we can or can not have in regards to our very lives when we don't for the most unimportant things?

...you negotiated TV price because you paid for it out of pocket well before emergency hit. That's not how healthcare works, the analogy is false.

There is SOME truth to your post but not every healthcare need is an emergency. I think in those cases the general idea is very much valid