2/3 of Americans-Afghanistan Not Worth Fighting

[kaz]

The majority of the women and children supported the Taliban.
The reason they were so strict was to stop the murders, kidnappings, rapes, etc., after 30 years without police or government.
The majority understood and approved.

You claim you know a lot of things you have no way of knowing

 

[kaz]

Wrong.
The CIA demanded that the Mujahedeen give al Qaeda a base of operations against the desired of the Taliban.
You are totally ignorant of the fact it was the CIA who created the Mujahedeen in order to attack the Soviets.
Pashtun dislike and distrust Arab.
The Taliban never wanted them there.
The presence of Saudis was a condition the CIA demanded for US aid and weapons.

That doesn't contradict what I said, so how am I 'ignoring' it? That doesn't make sense.

The Taliban clearly did participate in the attack by providing a base of operations for the attackers. Your implication they are innocent is pure bull shit.

I support leaving Afghanistan. Democrats are so weird. You believe that supporting a position gives you the right to rewrite history. It doesn't

 

[Rigby5]

You made that up since you don't know what they knew.

But providing a base of operations to prepare for the attack was participating in it, liar

Wrong.
It was the US who made allowing al Qaeda a base camp in Afghanistan as a condition for aid.
You need to read up on Charlie's War.

Operation Cyclone - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

{...
Operation Cyclone was the code name for the United States Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) program to arm and finance the Afghan mujahideen in Afghanistan from 1979 to 1989, prior to and during the military intervention by the USSR in support of the Democratic Republic of Afghanistan. The mujahideen were also supported by Britain's MI6, who conducted separate covert actions. The program leaned heavily towards supporting militant Islamic groups, including groups with jihadist ties, that were favored by the regime of Muhammad Zia-ul-Haq in neighboring Pakistan, rather than other, less ideological Afghan resistance groups that had also been fighting the Soviet-oriented Democratic Republic of Afghanistan regime since before the Soviet intervention.[1]

Operation Cyclone was one of the longest and most expensive covert CIA operations ever undertaken.[2] Funding officially began with $695,000 in 1979,[3][4] was increased dramatically to $20–$30 million per year in 1980, and rose to $630 million per year in 1987,[1][5][6] described as the "biggest bequest to any Third World insurgency".[7] Funding continued (albeit reduced) after the 1989 Soviet withdrawal as the mujahideen continued to battle the forces of President Mohammad Najibullah's army during the Afghan Civil War (1989–1992).[8]
...}

 

[kaz]

Wrong.
It was the US who made allowing al Qaeda a base camp in Afghanistan as a condition for aid.
You need to read up on Charlie's War.

Operation Cyclone - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

{...
Operation Cyclone was the code name for the United States Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) program to arm and finance the Afghan mujahideen in Afghanistan from 1979 to 1989, prior to and during the military intervention by the USSR in support of the Democratic Republic of Afghanistan. The mujahideen were also supported by Britain's MI6, who conducted separate covert actions. The program leaned heavily towards supporting militant Islamic groups, including groups with jihadist ties, that were favored by the regime of Muhammad Zia-ul-Haq in neighboring Pakistan, rather than other, less ideological Afghan resistance groups that had also been fighting the Soviet-oriented Democratic Republic of Afghanistan regime since before the Soviet intervention.[1]

Operation Cyclone was one of the longest and most expensive covert CIA operations ever undertaken.[2] Funding officially began with $695,000 in 1979,[3][4] was increased dramatically to $20–$30 million per year in 1980, and rose to $630 million per year in 1987,[1][5][6] described as the "biggest bequest to any Third World insurgency".[7] Funding continued (albeit reduced) after the 1989 Soviet withdrawal as the mujahideen continued to battle the forces of President Mohammad Najibullah's army during the Afghan Civil War (1989–1992).[8]
...}

The CIA has a base of operations under your bed at your mom's house, don't they? Is that why you left home?

Have you ever been abducted by aliens? You have, haven't you? Be honest

 

[Rigby5]

You claim you know a lot of things you have no way of knowing

No, everyone knows all this stuff.
The US created the Mujahedeen and forceg the al Qaeda Arabs on the Pashtun Mujahedeen, and the Taliban came out as the winner of the Mujahedeen because they were no corrupt and the most popular.
This is all common knowledge.
You just have to be following this back to 1979, when it first started.

 

[Batcat]

Afghanistan War Unpopular Amid Chaotic Pullout: Poll

Roughly two-thirds said they did not think America’s longest war was worth fighting, the poll shows.

www.huffpost.com

Despite the Republican whining and piling on...America does not approve of the "forever war" in Afghanistan

There was and never is...a "good way" to disengage from something as fucked up as that

I am for leaving Afghanistan after 20 years.

I also believe the strongest nation in the world should be able to plan a much better withdrawal than the embarrassing fiasco we are witnessing.

I thought our Vietnam withdrawal was bad but at least people weren’t clinging to and falling from helicopters in that mess.

 

[Rigby5]

That doesn't contradict what I said, so how am I 'ignoring' it? That doesn't make sense.

The Taliban clearly did participate in the attack by providing a base of operations for the attackers. Your implication they are innocent is pure bull shit.

I support leaving Afghanistan. Democrats are so weird. You believe that supporting a position gives you the right to rewrite history. It doesn't

The Taliban were very open about not liking or trusting the Saudi Arabs, so then how can they be held responsible for what the CIA insisted on?

 

[kaz]

No, everyone knows all this stuff.
The US created the Mujahedeen and forceg the al Qaeda Arabs on the Pashtun Mujahedeen, and the Taliban came out as the winner of the Mujahedeen because they were no corrupt and the most popular.
This is all common knowledge.
You just have to be following this back to 1979, when it first started.

You're going way beyond what everyone knows and presenting things you don't know as fact

 

[Rigby5]

The CIA has a base of operations under your bed at your mom's house, don't they? Is that why you left home?

Have you ever been abducted by aliens? You have, haven't you? Be honest

Read the whole history.
Al Qaeda was funded by the CIA.

 

[kaz]

The Taliban were very open about not liking or trusting the Saudi Arabs, so then how can they be held responsible for what the CIA insisted on?

That doesn't in any way support that the Taliban didn't give Al Qaeda a base of operations or justify what they did.

Your brain says to you here are three facts, therefore everything you make up, I mean derive, from them is fact. Doesn't work that way.

Fox Mulder: I want to believe

That's your mantra

 

[Persuader]

Well, pulling US civilians and Afghanistan employees out of the region before
closing up the shop would have been a "good way" to disengage from something as fucked up as that.

Sheesh

Yes.....biden was so stupid he pulled out the military before the civilians and the afghan interpeters etc.

Biden owns this mess and even the lamestream media admits to it.

Joe gotta go.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

The Taliban never participated in, knew of, or allowed any attacks on the US, ever.

Jesus Cripes, Bin Laden was Taliban you fcking retard

 

[kaz]

Read the whole history.
Al Qaeda was funded by the CIA.

What a perfect example of what I said in the post immediately following this one.

1: I already know that and did before this discussion started

2: It doesn't prove any of your "therefore ..." shit you keep making up.

The Taliban did provide Al Qaeda a base of operations and this doesn't contradict that

 

[theHawk]

Afghanistan War Unpopular Amid Chaotic Pullout: Poll

Roughly two-thirds said they did not think America’s longest war was worth fighting, the poll shows.

www.huffpost.com

Despite the Republican whining and piling on...America does not approve of the "forever war" in Afghanistan

There was and never is...a "good way" to disengage from something as fucked up as that

LOL yea okay. Yes we support withdrawing. No we didn’t have to leave behind Americans in a total clusterfuck.

Keep spinning though.

 

[Rigby5]

That doesn't in any way support that the Taliban didn't give Al Qaeda a base of operations or justify what they did.

Your brain says to you here are three facts, therefore everything you make up, I mean derive, from them is fact. Doesn't work that way.

Fox Mulder: I want to believe

That's your mantra

Wrong.
Go look it up.
The Taliban were constantly complaining about bin Laden, and they arrested him several times.
They suspected he was involved in embassy bombings in Africa, and some bombing in Indonesia I don't really remember.
Look it up.
They wanted him out of the country, and the CIA constantly demanded he stay, if the Taliban wanted any US money.

 

[Rigby5]

Jesus Cripes, Bin Laden was Taliban you fcking retard

That is ridiculously ignorant.
Bin Laden did not even speak Peshto, so could not even talk to Afghans without a translator.
The Taliban were a coalition of radical students and conservative rural Aghan clerics, and there was not a single Arab in the Taliban.

 

[BS Filter]

These ignorant pawns will defend Biden, regardless. If Trump was President and this happened we would be inundated with posts screaming "incompetent". I hope you dumb ass lemmings learn a very big lesson here.

 

[kaz]

Wrong.
Go look it up.
The Taliban were constantly complaining about bin Laden, and they arrested him several times.
They suspected he was involved in embassy bombings in Africa, and some bombing in Indonesia I don't really remember.
Look it up.
They wanted him out of the country, and the CIA constantly demanded he stay, if the Taliban wanted any US money.

Again, what you said doesn't support the conclusions you draw.

Al Qaeda WAS in Afghanistan where they prepared to attack the US. What difference does it make if what you said is true and they harassed him a bit since they still allowed him to do that?

You continue to draw wild and unsupported conclusions from little information

 

[kaz]

That is ridiculously ignorant.
Bin Laden did not even speak Peshto, so could not even talk to Afghans without a translator.
The Taliban were a coalition of radical students and conservative rural Aghan clerics, and there was not a single Arab in the Taliban.

The Taliban and Al Qaeda are both advocates of Sharia law. That is their primary objective. So really you are the one who is splitting hairs. They are allies and support the same objective

 

[Rigby5]

What a perfect example of what I said in the post immediately following this one.

1: I already know that and did before this discussion started

2: It doesn't prove any of your "therefore ..." shit you keep making up.

The Taliban did provide Al Qaeda a base of operations and this doesn't contradict that

There is no doubt Osama bin Laden was an agent for the CIA during the war against the Soviets.
So there is no way the Taliban can be blamed for what the CIA did before the Taliban even existed.

It is also illegal for the US to demand extradition to the US without evidence, and in violation of Afghan law, just as it is illegal for the US to demand extradition for any charge with possible execution from any country that makes execution illegal.

Read up.
The Taliban were honest and legal, while the US was neither.

{...
Bin Laden became the 456th person listed on the FBI Ten Most Wanted Fugitives list, when he was added on June 7, 1999, following his indictment along with others for capital crimes in the 1998 embassy attacks. Attempts at assassination and requests for the extradition of bin Laden from the Taliban of Afghanistan were met with failure before the bombing of Afghanistan in October 2001.[201] In 1999, US President Bill Clinton convinced the United Nations to impose sanctions against Afghanistan in an attempt to force the Taliban to extradite him.[202]

On October 10, 2001, bin Laden appeared as well on the initial list of the top 22 FBI Most Wanted Terrorists, which was released to the public by the President of the United States George W. Bush, in direct response to the September 11 attacks, but which was again based on the indictment for the 1998 embassy attack. Bin Laden was among a group of thirteen fugitive terrorists wanted on that latter list for questioning about the 1998 embassy bombings. Bin Laden remains the only fugitive ever to be listed on both FBI fugitive lists.

Despite the multiple indictments listed above and multiple requests, the Taliban refused to extradite Osama bin Laden. However, they did offer to try him before an Islamic court if evidence of Osama bin Laden's involvement in the September 11 attacks was provided. It was not until eight days after the bombing of Afghanistan began in October 2001 that the Taliban finally did offer to turn over Osama bin Laden to a third-party country for trial in return for the United States ending the bombing. This offer was rejected by President Bush stating that this was no longer negotiable, with Bush responding "there's no need to discuss innocence or guilt. We know he's guilty."[203]

On June 15, 2011, federal prosecutors of the United States of America officially dropped all criminal charges against Osama bin Laden following his death in May.[204]
...}

Osama bin Laden - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org