911 facts no theories

[SFC Ollie]

Oh yes there are so many out there who want to believe this is an inside job. You know if you guys could produce some physical evidence instead of "Because I said so" BS, then maybe some of the rest of us could look at it without laughing. And if you could argue a point without calling people liars that might help too.

I don't mind admitting that I could be wrong, but I never lie. So show us some real physical evidence instead of BS made up stuff., because we will first debunk anything you present, with real facts.

There are polls suggesting that the official version of 9-11 is not as accurate. 54% in this one. Some opinions in this poll are divided as to who, and many aren't sure, but it shows they aren't convinced that the govs. story is true.

"Theorizing about what happened on 9/11, when you're not being given answers to your questions about that day by the people who SHOULD be able to do so, is PERFECTLY normal. As is suspecting that the reason these answers aren't being given is "sinister" in nature. After 9 plus years of obfuscation, spin, lies, and cover-ups regarding the 9/11 attacks, it is unavoidable to think that criminal complicity is the reason why. we have not proven it beyond the shadow of doubt. We do not have documentation that shows they planned it. We do not have a signed confession from someone. We have pieces of the puzzle, and to most of us that have been doing this a long time, those pieces point to more than just Osama Bin Laden, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, and 19 hijackers.
I would like to say that I am convinced some elements within our Government, and others were complicit in the attacks of 9/11. The information that exists today clearly points in that direction. We have pieces to the puzzle, and we KNOW who refuses to give up the other pieces."
Here's a link to 50 facts that all concerned might find interesting about 9-11. Yeah it's what you all call a truther site. I hope your anger and disdain for the people you argue with on here can be put aside for a while and you take the time to read it with an open mind, the page has links to the information sources. This shouldn't be a war between us citizens, it should be us against those that want to keep the truth covered up. The more this issue divides us the less chance we will have of getting answers and finding out what really happened.

The Facts Speak For Themselves - 911truth.org

I read the first 15 or so of your facts. They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained. There is no prove there of any Government involvement. Oh and I am not angry with anyone on here. I simply will not be called a liar by anyone. I think that is rather reasonable.

 

[Mr. Jones]

The responses in this thread by people that refuse to even think the official 9-11 conspiracy is bullshit clearly illustrates just how irrational some peoples' defenses can be. It's like they are faced with the possibility that their beloved old uncle Sam, is the prime suspect of decades long serial murders. It's fear, and cowardice and lack of objectivity. Some people will never accept the possibility that they have been duped all their lives, and they are hopeless and are a waste of time. Polls are showing more and more people are questioning the official account of 9-11 so, you shouldn't spend a lot of time and effort on those who strongly resist change. You only have to help and protect those who want to change.
"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists." ~ J. Edgar Hoover, Director of the FBI
"Such reactions are emotionally based. 9/11 is a very emotionally charged issue. The source of the denial and resistance is FEAR. The implications of 9/11 Truth are very scary for most people to take in. Given that a part of our government's job description is keeping its citizens safe, it's terrifying to consider that a secret rogue part of our government will do just the opposite -- mass murder those very citizens, in order to advance dark agendas -- like wars for corporate empire. To further consider that associated 'secret teams' would then put out corporate media cover-up stories, in the form of an elaborate fantasy story backed up with planted evidence, and to think that story was nearly universally accepted without question -- this is the stuff of nightmares."
The intensity of fear brought up by these vast implications causes defense mechanisms to take over our rational thought processes. Such denial most often overrides rationality.
Questioning the official story of 9/11 threatens the foundations of our society, or at least seems to. It challenges our fellow citizens' belief systems regarding the nature of our government, and even the very nature of our nation. Such questioning is far more profound than, say, questioning a war. Accepting the truth of 9/11 is, for many, a major paradigm shift, an inverting of their worldview. Such shifts risk a period of chaos and uncertainty, which many find scary.

In his book As If We Were Grownups, author Jeff Golden's thoughtful assertion is that, "We consistently elect [political] candidates who tell us what children would want to hear. Children want to hear that everything is okay, that little is required of them, that they can go out and play or watch TV, and that they'll be taken care of and protected. In exchange, they are expected to be seen and not heard, to pay their taxes, to take their flu shots, and to not question the authorities."

To believe 9/11 Truth, one also has to believe many other difficult truths, such as:

* Parts of our corporate media must be incredibly corrupt to be complicit in such a massive cover-up;
* There must be a powerful, secret, hidden government that is capable of planning and executing such a horrible and unthinkable act;
* Some of our leaders are more corrupt and malicious than most of us would want to believe.
""Most people prefer to believe their leaders are just and fair even in the face of evidence to the contrary, because once a citizen acknowledges that the government under which they live is lying and corrupt, the citizen has to choose what he or she will do about it. To take action in the face of a corrupt government entails risks of harm to life and loved ones. To choose to do nothing is to surrender one's self-image of standing for principles. Most people do not have the courage to face that choice. Hence, most propaganda is not designed to fool the critical thinker but only to give moral cowards an excuse not to think at all."

The Truth is Not Enough: How to Overcome Emotional Barriers to 9/11 Truth
The Truth is Not Enough: How to Overcome Emotional Barriers to 9/11 Truth - 911truth.org

Creating the bullshit universe then buying into it is very funny.

For example, if the government is corrupt, why did it not plant WMDs in Iraq or Afghanistan? It would have done the following:

Secured more funding for the DOD and through it, more money for Defense Contractors; a heavy GOP contributor.

Likely would have meant more Republican seats that were held on to in 2004, 2006 and 2008 since the votes to go to war would have been justified.

Likely a stronger showing than the GOP made in 2008 given that Obama's mantra of his not voting to use force in the Middle East would have been seen as foolish in the face of what was found.

A validification of the Bush doctrine.

A legitimate reason to re-vamp America's defenses and an entree into further acts of first-move aggression where WMDs are suspected.

And so much more. Yet we're supposed to believe that the government is so corrupt as to willingly murder 3,000 citizens but so mysteriously stupid as to not plant a single WMD to justify the actions and make the supposed endgame of "keeping us safe" a more realistic necessity.

Its truly hilarious to hear a truther talk about reality and rational thought; none of you exhibit anything close to it.

They didn't need to plant anything, anywhere in Afghanistan or Iraq, the war was on and there was no turning back, and nothing could be done about it, nor was when they didn't find any.
"The media have raised the possibility that the US might "plant" weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, and that this may be another reason to keep UN inspectors out. This is a charge of such seriousness that we Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity have been conducting an informal colloquium on the issue. As one might expect, there is no unanimity among us on the likelihood of such planting, but most believe that Washington would consider it far too risky. Those holding this view add that recent polls suggest most Americans will not be very critical of the Bush administration even if no weapons of mass destruction are found."

David MacMichael and Ray McGovern: Weapons of Mass Destruction: Where? Find? Plant?
You believe what he hell you want, I'm not making this stuff up and pleading with you to believe it.

 

[Mr. Jones]

I read the first 15 or so of your facts. They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained. There is no prove there of any Government involvement. Oh and I am not angry with anyone on here. I simply will not be called a liar by anyone. I think that is rather reasonable.

Well go ahead and dismiss them then. After all you are asking for people to "prove" and show you evidence, then when people oblige, you give it a cursory once over and say"They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained."
The facts aren't mine, they are main stream media sourced. Go ahead and try to tell us how theses facts don't make for objective questioning of the official version of 9-11 and how they shouldn't steer 54% of people polled world wide to question that 9-11official story. I've linked you to my sources of information that gave me reason to doubt the govs. story, now you link me to your sources that say they are baseless, and can "be explained". I think that is rather reasonable.

 

[Mr. Jones]

The responses in this thread by people that refuse to even think the official 9-11 conspiracy is bullshit clearly illustrates just how irrational some peoples' defenses can be. It's like they are faced with the possibility that their beloved old uncle Sam, is the prime suspect of decades long serial murders. It's fear, and cowardice and lack of objectivity. Some people will never accept the possibility that they have been duped all their lives, and they are hopeless and are a waste of time. Polls are showing more and more people are questioning the official account of 9-11 so, you shouldn't spend a lot of time and effort on those who strongly resist change. You only have to help and protect those who want to change.
"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists." ~ J. Edgar Hoover, Director of the FBI
"Such reactions are emotionally based. 9/11 is a very emotionally charged issue. The source of the denial and resistance is FEAR. The implications of 9/11 Truth are very scary for most people to take in. Given that a part of our government's job description is keeping its citizens safe, it's terrifying to consider that a secret rogue part of our government will do just the opposite -- mass murder those very citizens, in order to advance dark agendas -- like wars for corporate empire. To further consider that associated 'secret teams' would then put out corporate media cover-up stories, in the form of an elaborate fantasy story backed up with planted evidence, and to think that story was nearly universally accepted without question -- this is the stuff of nightmares."
The intensity of fear brought up by these vast implications causes defense mechanisms to take over our rational thought processes. Such denial most often overrides rationality.
Questioning the official story of 9/11 threatens the foundations of our society, or at least seems to. It challenges our fellow citizens' belief systems regarding the nature of our government, and even the very nature of our nation. Such questioning is far more profound than, say, questioning a war. Accepting the truth of 9/11 is, for many, a major paradigm shift, an inverting of their worldview. Such shifts risk a period of chaos and uncertainty, which many find scary.

In his book As If We Were Grownups, author Jeff Golden's thoughtful assertion is that, "We consistently elect [political] candidates who tell us what children would want to hear. Children want to hear that everything is okay, that little is required of them, that they can go out and play or watch TV, and that they'll be taken care of and protected. In exchange, they are expected to be seen and not heard, to pay their taxes, to take their flu shots, and to not question the authorities."

To believe 9/11 Truth, one also has to believe many other difficult truths, such as:

* Parts of our corporate media must be incredibly corrupt to be complicit in such a massive cover-up;
* There must be a powerful, secret, hidden government that is capable of planning and executing such a horrible and unthinkable act;
* Some of our leaders are more corrupt and malicious than most of us would want to believe.
""Most people prefer to believe their leaders are just and fair even in the face of evidence to the contrary, because once a citizen acknowledges that the government under which they live is lying and corrupt, the citizen has to choose what he or she will do about it. To take action in the face of a corrupt government entails risks of harm to life and loved ones. To choose to do nothing is to surrender one's self-image of standing for principles. Most people do not have the courage to face that choice. Hence, most propaganda is not designed to fool the critical thinker but only to give moral cowards an excuse not to think at all."

The Truth is Not Enough: How to Overcome Emotional Barriers to 9/11 Truth
The Truth is Not Enough: How to Overcome Emotional Barriers to 9/11 Truth - 911truth.org

i DO believe 9/11 truth
the troofer are the ones that deny it

And what 9-11 "truth" do you believe. What do you really know for sure and what is your take on it? I can't debate you if I don't know.

 

[DiveCon]

The responses in this thread by people that refuse to even think the official 9-11 conspiracy is bullshit clearly illustrates just how irrational some peoples' defenses can be. It's like they are faced with the possibility that their beloved old uncle Sam, is the prime suspect of decades long serial murders. It's fear, and cowardice and lack of objectivity. Some people will never accept the possibility that they have been duped all their lives, and they are hopeless and are a waste of time. Polls are showing more and more people are questioning the official account of 9-11 so, you shouldn't spend a lot of time and effort on those who strongly resist change. You only have to help and protect those who want to change.
"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists." ~ J. Edgar Hoover, Director of the FBI
"Such reactions are emotionally based. 9/11 is a very emotionally charged issue. The source of the denial and resistance is FEAR. The implications of 9/11 Truth are very scary for most people to take in. Given that a part of our government's job description is keeping its citizens safe, it's terrifying to consider that a secret rogue part of our government will do just the opposite -- mass murder those very citizens, in order to advance dark agendas -- like wars for corporate empire. To further consider that associated 'secret teams' would then put out corporate media cover-up stories, in the form of an elaborate fantasy story backed up with planted evidence, and to think that story was nearly universally accepted without question -- this is the stuff of nightmares."
The intensity of fear brought up by these vast implications causes defense mechanisms to take over our rational thought processes. Such denial most often overrides rationality.
Questioning the official story of 9/11 threatens the foundations of our society, or at least seems to. It challenges our fellow citizens' belief systems regarding the nature of our government, and even the very nature of our nation. Such questioning is far more profound than, say, questioning a war. Accepting the truth of 9/11 is, for many, a major paradigm shift, an inverting of their worldview. Such shifts risk a period of chaos and uncertainty, which many find scary.

In his book As If We Were Grownups, author Jeff Golden's thoughtful assertion is that, "We consistently elect [political] candidates who tell us what children would want to hear. Children want to hear that everything is okay, that little is required of them, that they can go out and play or watch TV, and that they'll be taken care of and protected. In exchange, they are expected to be seen and not heard, to pay their taxes, to take their flu shots, and to not question the authorities."

To believe 9/11 Truth, one also has to believe many other difficult truths, such as:

* Parts of our corporate media must be incredibly corrupt to be complicit in such a massive cover-up;
* There must be a powerful, secret, hidden government that is capable of planning and executing such a horrible and unthinkable act;
* Some of our leaders are more corrupt and malicious than most of us would want to believe.
""Most people prefer to believe their leaders are just and fair even in the face of evidence to the contrary, because once a citizen acknowledges that the government under which they live is lying and corrupt, the citizen has to choose what he or she will do about it. To take action in the face of a corrupt government entails risks of harm to life and loved ones. To choose to do nothing is to surrender one's self-image of standing for principles. Most people do not have the courage to face that choice. Hence, most propaganda is not designed to fool the critical thinker but only to give moral cowards an excuse not to think at all."

The Truth is Not Enough: How to Overcome Emotional Barriers to 9/11 Truth
The Truth is Not Enough: How to Overcome Emotional Barriers to 9/11 Truth - 911truth.org

i DO believe 9/11 truth
the troofer are the ones that deny it

And what 9-11 "truth" do you believe. What do you really know for sure and what is your take on it? I can't debate you if I don't know.

that 19 al qaeda terrorists highjacked 4 planes and crashed them
that IS the truth

 

[Mr. Jones]

i DO believe 9/11 truth
the troofer are the ones that deny it

And what 9-11 "truth" do you believe. What do you really know for sure and what is your take on it? I can't debate you if I don't know.

that 19 al qaeda terrorists highjacked 4 planes and crashed them
that IS the truth

Ok, then can I ask, have you sifted through any of the websites, and videos and listened to educated people who have formed organizations to bring awareness that what you were told to believe might not be true, or that there are things that the gov. story says that doesn't jive with them?

 

[DiveCon]

And what 9-11 "truth" do you believe. What do you really know for sure and what is your take on it? I can't debate you if I don't know.

that 19 al qaeda terrorists highjacked 4 planes and crashed them
that IS the truth

Ok, then can I ask, have you sifted through any of the websites, and videos and listened to educated people who have formed organizations to bring awareness that what you were told to believe might not be true, or that there are things that the gov. story says that doesn't jive with them?

yes, and i find them less than educated
most of them are fucking NUTZ
like YOU

 

[Mr. Jones]

that 19 al qaeda terrorists highjacked 4 planes and crashed them
that IS the truth

Ok, then can I ask, have you sifted through any of the websites, and videos and listened to educated people who have formed organizations to bring awareness that what you were told to believe might not be true, or that there are things that the gov. story says that doesn't jive with them?

yes, and i find them less than educated
most of them are fucking NUTZ
like YOU

Enough said, your a waste of time. You had a chance at contributing something useful in this thread, but it appears you are only here to argue and resort to name calling. Looks like what the others think of you is spot on. Move out of the way please, don't you have home work or chores to do?

 

[SFC Ollie]

I read the first 15 or so of your facts. They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained. There is no prove there of any Government involvement. Oh and I am not angry with anyone on here. I simply will not be called a liar by anyone. I think that is rather reasonable.

Well go ahead and dismiss them then. After all you are asking for people to "prove" and show you evidence, then when people oblige, you give it a cursory once over and say"They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained."
The facts aren't mine, they are main stream media sourced. Go ahead and try to tell us how theses facts don't make for objective questioning of the official version of 9-11 and how they shouldn't steer 54% of people polled world wide to question that 9-11official story. I've linked you to my sources of information that gave me reason to doubt the govs. story, now you link me to your sources that say they are baseless, and can "be explained". I think that is rather reasonable.

Take your facts into a court of law and most of them will be automatically dismissed as circumstantial or hearsay. Most of us have said that the 911CR is correct on all the major points, there are some unanswered questions. Much of what happened that day, during the investigation, and even some things from prior to the attacks are classified. And they are not classified to hide a conspiracy, but to protect the people of the USA.

When you have physical evidence that the 911 CR is wrong, let us know.

 

[DiveCon]

Ok, then can I ask, have you sifted through any of the websites, and videos and listened to educated people who have formed organizations to bring awareness that what you were told to believe might not be true, or that there are things that the gov. story says that doesn't jive with them?

yes, and i find them less than educated
most of them are fucking NUTZ
like YOU

Enough said, your a waste of time. You had a chance at contributing something useful in this thread, but it appears you are only here to argue and resort to name calling. Looks like what the others think of you is spot on. Move out of the way please, don't you have home work or chores to do?

because thats all you fucking morons deserve
grow a functioning brain and stop trusting asswipes like alex jones and that griffin idiot

 

[miller]

WE HAVE SFC OLLIE HERE TO PROTECT US.

OH GOODY and that's on top of this -- SFC WROTE, "And they are not classified to hide a conspiracy, but to protect the people of the USA."

We're being protected from the terrorists now we can all go back to sleep. What a deal.

 

[miller]

THAT WAS THE POINT OF THE THREAD 911 FACTS NO THEORIES.

Here's the SFC OLLIE QUOTE, "I read the first 15 or so of your facts. They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained."

Let's see you refute any fact listed with credible proof. NO THEORIES, NO BULLSHIT.

 

[DiveCon]

THAT WAS THE POINT OF THE THREAD 911 FACTS NO THEORIES.

Here's the SFC OLLIE QUOTE, "I read the first 15 or so of your facts. They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained."

Let's see you refute any fact listed with credible proof. NO THEORIES, NO BULLSHIT.

but all you have posted is theories and bullshit

 

[SFC Ollie]

THAT WAS THE POINT OF THE THREAD 911 FACTS NO THEORIES.

Here's the SFC OLLIE QUOTE, "I read the first 15 or so of your facts. They can mostly either be dismissed as having little or nothing to do with the attacks or they can be explained."

Let's see you refute any fact listed with credible proof. NO THEORIES, NO BULLSHIT.

but all you have posted is theories and bullshit

Is this jackoff addressing me? After calling me a liar? Does he think I was kidding when I said that is an automatic ignore? LOL that's funny. Ask Manifold how long I've been ignoring his ass for calling me a liar.... Anyway, one of you guys can answer this dumb ass. He's not worth my time.

 

[miller]

1,682 VIEWS SO FAR.

There hasn't been 1 of the 15 facts sited that has ever been mentioned let alone proved false.

All they have are baseless name calling -- idiot, moron -- and outright lies.

BRAINWASHED LOSERS. They won't consider they are brainwashed and manipulated by the media which hid more than 40 warnings to Bush. Massoui was arrested before 911, tried and convicted in a court of law as one of the terrorists. The entire crime was filmed. 118 fire fighters witnessed explosions. Steel beams landed on roofs 200 yards from the WTC. See the explosion of the south tower while the north tower is burning. All 3 towers dropped at free fall speed. None toppled. All 3 dropped straight into their basements.

 

[elvis]

I said magenta, you dipshit. MAGENTA! Get with the fucking program.

 

[miller]

sfc ollie is a liar

screw shit you draw flies.

 

[Obamerican]

1) Dozens of media reporters arrived at the WTC minutes after the 1st plane hit the north tower.True
2) The entire crime was photographed.You don't come across as unbiased when you use the word "crime". Learn how to fix that, little boy. It was photographed.
3) Private photographers filmed the entire crime."Crime" again? Idiot. But true on private.
4) Before any spin developed directly reported at the WTC there were numerous witnesses who mentioned hearing explosions.WOW!! How old were they, 10? Anyone can say that. Most are NOT experts.
5) All 3 towers collapsed at free fall speed.NOT true. It was NOT free fall speed.
6) Philip Shenon the NYT's reporter assigned to cover the entire 911 Commission in 2004 also published his story titled THE COMMISSION published in 2008. On page 151 he wrote,"The warnings were going straight to President Bush each mornings in his briefings by Tenet and in the PDBs. It would later be revealed by the 911 Commission that more than forty PDBs presented to Bush from January 2001 through September 10, 2001 included references to bin Laden. Here are a few of the headlines:

a) "Bin Laden attacks may be imminent" (June 23)
b) "Bin Laden Planning High-Profile Attacks" June 30)
c) "Bin Laden threats are real" (June 30)
d) "Planning for Bin Laden attacks continues, despite delays" (July 2)I worked for the NSA from 1971-1974. The President gets HUNDREDS of messages like the ones you are quoting. NOT ONE said that UBL was going to attack the WTC. How do you prepare for that when you DON'T know the target?

7) Philip Shenon and the NYT failed to publish this spectacular set of facts they had learned in 2004. They purposely mislead their audience by concealing this story.And you can PROVE they purposely didn't reveal these facts? I didn't think so.
8) Shenon's conclusion was that Bushed failed to react. That contradicts the pictures taken that clearly show the explosions of both the north and south towers, and the implosion of Building 7.WTC7 is still out. WTC 1 and 2 are the victims of an unreliable design and gravity.
9) The 911 Commisssion omitted any mention that Building 7 also collapsed.True
10) The pictures reveal thousands of steel beams blasting in all directions. That defies the law of gravity. The beams weigh tons. There are more pictures that show thousands of steel beams (cut not bent) lying all around the WTC complex as far away as the roofs of other buildings across the street from the WTC complex.
10) Some person had to have detonated the explosives. That person had to know there were thousands of people including the first responders in the north and south towers. No people were killed in Building 7.
11) Rigging thousands of explosives would require a team of experts who were maneuvered around the security (The Port Authority Police). It would take a considerable time to rig thousands of explosives.
12) Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neil claimed in his book THE PRICE OF LOYALTY that during the first two NSC meetings Bush told the NSC members he wanted to attack Iraq to remove Saddam. Both meeting were immediately after the inauguration in January and February 2001, well before 911.
13) Bush dwelled on 911 and used 911 as his reason to attack Afghanistan and Iraq in addition to many other policies of his.
14) What reason could any American citizen have to not want to know who perpetrated the mass murders filmed at the WTC on 911? This especially includes the fire fighters and their union bosses. I have confronted UFA local 94 President Steve Cassidy in addition to more than a dozen others who refuse to discuss the pictures I emailed them.
15) Why would the government destroy evidence and why would the media prevent the reporting of more than 40 warnings to Bush if they had nothing to hide?

This is a COMPLETE waste of time with you idiots but, hey, it's my day off.

More later. NONE OF THIS IS NEW!!!!! Miller is a sock, nothing else.

 

[Obamerican]

AND YOU'RE AN IDIOT!!! LOOK MA, BIG FONTS AND BRIGHT COLORS!!!

sfc ollie is a liar

screw shit you draw flies.

 

[candycorn]

They didn't need to plant anything, anywhere in Afghanistan or Iraq, the war was on and there was no turning back, and nothing could be done about it, nor was when they didn't find any.

I detailed why they would have done it if they were corrupt as you fantasize them being.

"The media have raised the possibility that the US might "plant" weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, and that this may be another reason to keep UN inspectors out. This is a charge of such seriousness that we Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity have been conducting an informal colloquium on the issue. As one might expect, there is no unanimity among us on the likelihood of such planting, but most believe that Washington would consider it far too risky.

Silliest statement ever. Not sure what your authors were smoking at the time but it's probably illegal everywhere except Cali.

There would be no risk to planting WMDs in either place. Even moreso there would be no risk compared to the risk of planting anything in the towers, in Virginia, or Pennsylvania where there would be multiple jurisdictions and multiple investigators. That wouldn't be the case in the Middle East. Whoeve said it would be "far too risky" is either an idiot or simply ignorant of reality.

You believe what he hell you want, I'm not making this stuff up and pleading with you to believe it.

I believe the 9/11 Commission Report. Feel free to regale us with your version of events. We both know you won't because if you take a stand, you will have to defend it. So we all know you won't because you have to be able to change your story.