America's coming civil war -- makers vs. takers Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/op

[Barb]

Asswipe poster !

You can, like I do, believe in America.....but not in the American government in it's current trajectory of large wealth distribution efforts.

isn't it funny how the exact same sentence can mean completely opposite things depending on the outlook?

It's the spending stupid Perhaps Steven King would like to personally reimburse the treasury a couple $BILL for the silly use of stimulus money that went to FOREIGN workers, Solyndra and costly shovel-ready jobs. That would show some TRUE concern for the financial situation..

"No more Taxes" isn't because we're selfish and greedy --- It's because YOU insist on ignoring the SOURCE of the problem...

Leftists are slowly starting to realize that waste and debt will PROCLUDE services and programs to the needy. When they realize how much govt incompetence and irresponsibility hurts their causes --- they will understand that their soaking the rich rhetoric isn't a wad of gum on a busted dam.

It's because YOU insist on ignoring the SOURCE of the problem...

and again

isn't it funny how the exact same sentence can mean completely opposite things depending on the outlook?

 

[Vast LWC]

It's the spending stupid Perhaps Steven King would like to personally reimburse the treasury a couple $BILL for the silly use of stimulus money that went to FOREIGN workers, Solyndra and costly shovel-ready jobs. That would show some TRUE concern for the financial situation..

"No more Taxes" isn't because we're selfish and greedy --- It's because YOU insist on ignoring the SOURCE of the problem...

Leftists are slowly starting to realize that waste and debt will PROCLUDE services and programs to the needy. When they realize how much govt incompetence and irresponsibility hurts their causes --- they will understand that their soaking the rich rhetoric isn't a wad of gum on a busted dam.

OK. Let's have targeted spending and targeted reward from spending.

For instance, you can pay the bill for the Iraq war, and reap all the benefits it has gotten us...

And I'll pay the bill for the health care bill, and reap the benefits from it.

I can play this game all day.

You know why? Because blue states, like the one I live in, have been paying more in taxes, per capita, than Red States, for decades.

And they have been getting less back from the Federal Government.

So, if we account for programs by what the voters actually want, broken down into regions, then I'll be much better off.

 

[Vast LWC]

And hey, maybe we can stop this program of Red State welfare once and for all.

 

[GuyPinestra]

And hey, maybe we can stop this program of Red State welfare once and for all.

Why don't we just stop ALL the welfare?

Put the Federal genie back in the bottle and run this country by the directions, for a change?

 

[flacaltenn]

Ridiculous...you're an idiot. You don't get it. Demand creates jobs. That's the point he's trying to make. Keep dropping wages and benefits on people. Keep shipping jobs out of the country. Keep fucking over the people who CREATE DEMAND and thereby create wealth...and let's just see how deep this crazy rabbit hole of worshiping billionaires takes us.

No...


Wealthy people create the jobs... The demand is what keeps the jobs in place.

who are these wealthy people that created the 100 plus million jobs in the USA? most people work for SMALL businesses in this country.....never knew small businesses were ''the wealthy''?

Labor is more important than capital....labor CREATES WEALTH. the chicken comes first, not the golden egg.

Wealth may come from labor, but we are concerned with JOBS and INNOVATION. Jobs and innovation don't get created by consumer consumption UNLESS it's an old established product (like milk or cereal) with a LOCAL manufacturing and distribution net. There are less and less of those commodities.

Mere increases in commodities will DO NOTHING to get us out of this economic contraction and job shrinkage.

Jobs are Innovation and growth in the economy come from NEW ventures either INVENTING market products or knocking off old arthritic Giant Companies.

You want to be hostage to General Mills or Kelloggs or do want some new choices and products that they don't control? You want NEW MODERN manufacturing brought to this country --- or try to wiggle on by servicing each other to death and not making ANY of the hard goods that we buy?

 

[flacaltenn]

isn't it funny how the exact same sentence can mean completely opposite things depending on the outlook?

It's the spending stupid Perhaps Steven King would like to personally reimburse the treasury a couple $BILL for the silly use of stimulus money that went to FOREIGN workers, Solyndra and costly shovel-ready jobs. That would show some TRUE concern for the financial situation..

"No more Taxes" isn't because we're selfish and greedy --- It's because YOU insist on ignoring the SOURCE of the problem...

Leftists are slowly starting to realize that waste and debt will PROCLUDE services and programs to the needy. When they realize how much govt incompetence and irresponsibility hurts their causes --- they will understand that their soaking the rich rhetoric isn't a wad of gum on a busted dam.

It's because YOU insist on ignoring the SOURCE of the problem...

and again

isn't it funny how the exact same sentence can mean completely opposite things depending on the outlook?

Can't you think or write without politcal posters? How does that twittered crap say anything about the "spending stupid"???

 

[flacaltenn]

It's the spending stupid Perhaps Steven King would like to personally reimburse the treasury a couple $BILL for the silly use of stimulus money that went to FOREIGN workers, Solyndra and costly shovel-ready jobs. That would show some TRUE concern for the financial situation..

"No more Taxes" isn't because we're selfish and greedy --- It's because YOU insist on ignoring the SOURCE of the problem...

Leftists are slowly starting to realize that waste and debt will PROCLUDE services and programs to the needy. When they realize how much govt incompetence and irresponsibility hurts their causes --- they will understand that their soaking the rich rhetoric isn't a wad of gum on a busted dam.

OK. Let's have targeted spending and targeted reward from spending.

For instance, you can pay the bill for the Iraq war, and reap all the benefits it has gotten us...

And I'll pay the bill for the health care bill, and reap the benefits from it.

I can play this game all day.

You know why? Because blue states, like the one I live in, have been paying more in taxes, per capita, than Red States, for decades.

And they have been getting less back from the Federal Government.

So, if we account for programs by what the voters actually want, broken down into regions, then I'll be much better off.

THis is NOT A GAME. And we don't get to pick what Congress pisses away. NO STATE gets anything back from a govt that has $1.5TRILL debt a year. THINK HARD about that.
Who owes the debt? THOSE Blue/Red state taxpayers. It's like getting $1.75 back on a credit card that you've maxxed out and doing an endzone celebration..

Only dumb party animals behave that irresponsibly.

Whatever is being spent is going on the Credit Card. The FEDS have NOTHING more to give. THERE'S the bigger problem than pushing socialist redistribution.

BTW: Clinton BOMB IRAQ DAILY, kept Bases in Saudi Arabia and 2 carriers in the Gulf for EIGHT YEARS -- to enforce a truce that wasn't working.
That cost a crapful of money too. And it was shitty policy to take the keys to the IRaqi economy away, let the UN rape them in "oil for food" and lock them in with a ruthless, psychotic dictator for 12 years wasn't it?

 

[Care4all]

It's the spending stupid Perhaps Steven King would like to personally reimburse the treasury a couple $BILL for the silly use of stimulus money that went to FOREIGN workers, Solyndra and costly shovel-ready jobs. That would show some TRUE concern for the financial situation..

"No more Taxes" isn't because we're selfish and greedy --- It's because YOU insist on ignoring the SOURCE of the problem...

Leftists are slowly starting to realize that waste and debt will PROCLUDE services and programs to the needy. When they realize how much govt incompetence and irresponsibility hurts their causes --- they will understand that their soaking the rich rhetoric isn't a wad of gum on a busted dam.

and again

isn't it funny how the exact same sentence can mean completely opposite things depending on the outlook?

Can't you think or write without politcal posters? How does that twittered crap say anything about the "spending stupid"???

Obama is not spending like a madman....

spending is part of the problem, but so are the lack of tax revenues that we once took in..... we are bringing in less taxes and this raises the deficit, big time.

It's the COMBINATION of the 2, that is the problem....

Most of the on going spending increases come from people not having jobs so more of our safety net has kicked in for millions of people that have never needed them...that costs money.

and from the boomers retiring...which is a 2 fold problem...the boomers retiring takes them out of the workforce, which means they go from being taxed to not being taxed and receiving benefits, so not only is our retirement payout larger, but our tax revenues are less because these people are no longer working and paying taxes....

Defense spending has been going up, so Obama can be blamed for that....but a deal of this increase is increased spending on veterans returning from War...which I personally can not knock....the vets deserve it.

may I suggest that you go and look at the budget and what we are actually spending money on....it'll give the bigger picture of what has happened and why....

 

[flacaltenn]

It's not just Obama -- it's the entire hijacking of the DEM party by the Class Warriors and Redistributionists. It's Pelosi and Reid and the radicals that embarrass even Moderate Dem leadership.
So when I say "HE" --- I mean "THEM".

He has WASTED a $TRILL dollars on poorly conceived bailouts and stimulus.
He has FOCUSED on the fantasy of GREEN JOBS, not restoring the economy.
His Healthcare fiasco is now costed at nearly 3 times what he promised it would cost and implementation hasn't even begun.
He WANTED to spend more, but America took his control of Congress away before he could.

Those are the facts. Now I HAVE STUDIED the increase in debt and what I've found is complete lying and ignoring of significant facts.

Facts like the SOC SEC crisis has hit 10 years EARLY. The "fund" went negative in 2010 after Obama channeled Robin Hood in a fairness hissy fit and gave out $20/month refunds of FICA taxes. This refund ACCELERATES the demise of S.S. and Medicare. In fact -- Obama SHOULD BE ARGUING that he inherited a $150Bill change in the FICA income. Used to run $100Bill SURPLUSES just a few years ago, and now they are in $50Bill deficits. WHY isn't this mentioned? Because the DEMS don't want their phoney FICA stimulus tax cut to be exposed as a large part of the prob. That and NEITHER party wants attention directed to the fact that the vaunted S.S. Trust Fund is a myth and TODAY'S taxpayers are paying for the theft of the SURPLUS for all those years.

We're in DEBT because 40% of spending is JUST PAYING INTEREST!!!!!

Don't tell me I need a larger picture.

Fixing the employment problem is NOT compatible with beating on Venture Capital and "the rich". And making statements that "The private sector is doing fine" -- instills no confidence that a Class Warrior is at all qualified to understand the SPENDING mess and the UNCERTAINTY mess that our economic system is in..

 

[Bfgrn]

It's not just Obama -- it's the entire hijacking of the DEM party by the Class Warriors and Redistributionists. It's Pelosi and Reid and the radicals that embarrass even Moderate Dem leadership.
So when I say "HE" --- I mean "THEM".

He has WASTED a $TRILL dollars on poorly conceived bailouts and stimulus.
He has FOCUSED on the fantasy of GREEN JOBS, not restoring the economy.
His Healthcare fiasco is now costed at nearly 3 times what he promised it would cost and implementation hasn't even begun.
He WANTED to spend more, but America took his control of Congress away before he could.

Those are the facts. Now I HAVE STUDIED the increase in debt and what I've found is complete lying and ignoring of significant facts.

Facts like the SOC SEC crisis has hit 10 years EARLY. The "fund" went negative in 2010 after Obama channeled Robin Hood in a fairness hissy fit and gave out $20/month refunds of FICA taxes. This refund ACCELERATES the demise of S.S. and Medicare. In fact -- Obama SHOULD BE ARGUING that he inherited a $150Bill change in the FICA income. Used to run $100Bill SURPLUSES just a few years ago, and now they are in $50Bill deficits. WHY isn't this mentioned? Because the DEMS don't want their phoney FICA stimulus tax cut to be exposed as a large part of the prob. That and NEITHER party wants attention directed to the fact that the vaunted S.S. Trust Fund is a myth and TODAY'S taxpayers are paying for the theft of the SURPLUS for all those years.

We're in DEBT because 40% of spending is JUST PAYING INTEREST!!!!!

Don't tell me I need a larger picture.

Fixing the employment problem is NOT compatible with beating on Venture Capital and "the rich". And making statements that "The private sector is doing fine" -- instills no confidence that a Class Warrior is at all qualified to understand the SPENDING mess and the UNCERTAINTY mess that our economic system is in..

Emote all you want. But the FACTS don't support what you parrot.

The LARGER picture...

CBO’s Long-Term Budget Outlook

Here is the 'rub'...We are on The Extended-Baseline Scenario trajectory 'Obama, Pelosi and Reid and the radicals' put us on. If Congress does nothing the Extended-Baseline Scenario is already in place.

IF the Bush tax cuts don't expire and the AHA is not fully implemented or repealed the The Alternative Fiscal Scenario is the trajectory Teapublicans will take us if they gain enough power.

the CBO lays it out perfectly clear...CRYSTAL.

Federal Debt Held by the Public Under CBO’s Long-Term Budget Scenarios (Percentage of gross domestic product)

The chart shows 2 scenarios. For all practical purposes, you can call the Extended-Baseline Scenario the Democrat scenario and the Alternative Fiscal Scenario the Teapublican scenario.


The Extended-Baseline Scenario adheres closely to current law. Under this scenario, the expiration of the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and most recently extended in 2010, the growing reach of the alternative minimum tax, the tax provisions of the recent health care legislation, and the way in which the tax system interacts with economic growth would result in steadily higher revenues relative to GDP.

The Alternative Fiscal Scenario
The budget outlook is much bleaker under the alternative fiscal scenario, which incorporates several changes to current law that are widely expected to occur or that would modify some provisions of law that might be difficult to sustain for a long period. Most important are the assumptions about revenues: that the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and extended most recently in 2010 will be extended; that the reach of the alternative minimum tax will be restrained to stay close to its historical extent; and that over the longer run, tax law will evolve further so that revenues remain near their historical average of 18 percent of GDP. This scenario also incorporates assumptions that Medicare’s payment rates for physicians will remain at current levels (rather than declining by about a third, as under current law) and that some policies enacted in the March 2010 health care legislation to restrain growth in federal health care spending will not continue in effect after 2021.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Obama spending binge never happened

Government outlays rising at slowest pace since 1950s

Here are the facts, according to the official government statistics:

• In the 2009 fiscal year — the last of George W. Bush’s presidency — federal spending rose by 17.9% from $2.98 trillion to $3.52 trillion. Check the official numbers at the Office of Management and Budget.

• In fiscal 2010 — the first budget under Obama — spending fell 1.8% to $3.46 trillion.

• In fiscal 2011, spending rose 4.3% to $3.60 trillion.

• In fiscal 2012, spending is set to rise 0.7% to $3.63 trillion, according to the Congressional Budget Office’s estimate of the budget that was agreed to last August.

• Finally in fiscal 2013 — the final budget of Obama’s term — spending is scheduled to fall 1.3% to $3.58 trillion. Read the CBO’s latest budget outlook.

Over Obama’s four budget years, federal spending is on track to rise from $3.52 trillion to $3.58 trillion, an annualized increase of just 0.4%.

There has been no huge increase in spending under the current president, despite what you hear.

Why do people think Obama has spent like a drunken sailor? It’s in part because of a fundamental misunderstanding of the federal budget.

What people forget (or never knew) is that the first year of every presidential term starts with a budget approved by the previous administration and Congress. The president only begins to shape the budget in his second year. It takes time to develop a budget and steer it through Congress — especially in these days of congressional gridlock.

The 2009 fiscal year, which Republicans count as part of Obama’s legacy, began four months before Obama moved into the White House. The major spending decisions in the 2009 fiscal year were made by George W. Bush and the previous Congress.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

America's coming civil war -- makers vs. takers | Fox News

Those were Abe Lincoln’s words in his first inaugural in 1861, as America was running headlong into civil war. Now we’re a house divided again and another civil war is coming, with the 2012 election as its Gettysburg.

Call it America’s coming civil war between the Makers and the Takers.

On one side are those who create wealth, America’s private sector–the very ones targeted by President Obama’s tax hikes announced Monday.

On the other are the public employee unions; left-leaning intelligentsia who see the growth of government as index of progress; and the millions of Americans now dependent on government through a growing network of government transfer payments, from Medicaid and Social Security to college loans and corporate bailouts and handouts (think GM and Solyndra).

Over the past century America’s private sector has been the source of productivity, innovation, creativity, and growth–and gave us the iPhone and iPad. The public sector has been the engine of entitlement, stagnation, and decline -- and gave us Detroit and the South Bronx.

Read more: America's coming civil war -- makers vs. takers | Fox News

******************

I somehow think that the left believes there is legitimacy to the growing number of people on government programs.

Just like the third and fourth generation welfare folks I knew in CA who got together right after the checks showed up and celebrated with a bag of weed.

obama has proven time and time after time he does not give a damn about this country.

 

[Care4all]

fyi-I saw a breakdown that showed Obama affected the bush 2009 fiscal budget by only $150 billion, with the measures he took to change things when he got in to office....that hit the 2009 fiscal budget before september 30, 2009....

 

[007]

Sorry guys.

Your Atlas Shrugged wet dream isn't going to happen, no matter how many hyperbolic op-eds you can find.

You can no more predict that than you can predict when time will end.

The country is a tinder box ready ready for some sort of ignition. Race relations haven't been this bad since the last civil war, the division between the makers and the takers hasn't been this bad since the last civil war, and our government is absolutely out of control dysfunctional. Another civil war is actually a very possible thing.

 

[007]

America's coming civil war -- makers vs. takers | Fox News

Those were Abe Lincoln’s words in his first inaugural in 1861, as America was running headlong into civil war. Now we’re a house divided again and another civil war is coming, with the 2012 election as its Gettysburg.

Call it America’s coming civil war between the Makers and the Takers.

On one side are those who create wealth, America’s private sector–the very ones targeted by President Obama’s tax hikes announced Monday.

On the other are the public employee unions; left-leaning intelligentsia who see the growth of government as index of progress; and the millions of Americans now dependent on government through a growing network of government transfer payments, from Medicaid and Social Security to college loans and corporate bailouts and handouts (think GM and Solyndra).

Over the past century America’s private sector has been the source of productivity, innovation, creativity, and growth–and gave us the iPhone and iPad. The public sector has been the engine of entitlement, stagnation, and decline -- and gave us Detroit and the South Bronx.

Read more: America's coming civil war -- makers vs. takers | Fox News

******************

I somehow think that the left believes there is legitimacy to the growing number of people on government programs.

Just like the third and fourth generation welfare folks I knew in CA who got together right after the checks showed up and celebrated with a bag of weed.

obama has proven time and time after time he does not give a damn about this country.

 

[flacaltenn]

It's not just Obama -- it's the entire hijacking of the DEM party by the Class Warriors and Redistributionists. It's Pelosi and Reid and the radicals that embarrass even Moderate Dem leadership.
So when I say "HE" --- I mean "THEM".

He has WASTED a $TRILL dollars on poorly conceived bailouts and stimulus.
He has FOCUSED on the fantasy of GREEN JOBS, not restoring the economy.
His Healthcare fiasco is now costed at nearly 3 times what he promised it would cost and implementation hasn't even begun.
He WANTED to spend more, but America took his control of Congress away before he could.

Those are the facts. Now I HAVE STUDIED the increase in debt and what I've found is complete lying and ignoring of significant facts.

Facts like the SOC SEC crisis has hit 10 years EARLY. The "fund" went negative in 2010 after Obama channeled Robin Hood in a fairness hissy fit and gave out $20/month refunds of FICA taxes. This refund ACCELERATES the demise of S.S. and Medicare. In fact -- Obama SHOULD BE ARGUING that he inherited a $150Bill change in the FICA income. Used to run $100Bill SURPLUSES just a few years ago, and now they are in $50Bill deficits. WHY isn't this mentioned? Because the DEMS don't want their phoney FICA stimulus tax cut to be exposed as a large part of the prob. That and NEITHER party wants attention directed to the fact that the vaunted S.S. Trust Fund is a myth and TODAY'S taxpayers are paying for the theft of the SURPLUS for all those years.

We're in DEBT because 40% of spending is JUST PAYING INTEREST!!!!!

Don't tell me I need a larger picture.

Fixing the employment problem is NOT compatible with beating on Venture Capital and "the rich". And making statements that "The private sector is doing fine" -- instills no confidence that a Class Warrior is at all qualified to understand the SPENDING mess and the UNCERTAINTY mess that our economic system is in..

Emote all you want. But the FACTS don't support what you parrot.

The LARGER picture...

CBO’s Long-Term Budget Outlook

Here is the 'rub'...We are on The Extended-Baseline Scenario trajectory 'Obama, Pelosi and Reid and the radicals' put us on. If Congress does nothing the Extended-Baseline Scenario is already in place.

IF the Bush tax cuts don't expire and the AHA is not fully implemented or repealed the The Alternative Fiscal Scenario is the trajectory Teapublicans will take us if they gain enough power.

the CBO lays it out perfectly clear...CRYSTAL.

Federal Debt Held by the Public Under CBO’s Long-Term Budget Scenarios (Percentage of gross domestic product)

The chart shows 2 scenarios. For all practical purposes, you can call the Extended-Baseline Scenario the Democrat scenario and the Alternative Fiscal Scenario the Teapublican scenario.


The Extended-Baseline Scenario adheres closely to current law. Under this scenario, the expiration of the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and most recently extended in 2010, the growing reach of the alternative minimum tax, the tax provisions of the recent health care legislation, and the way in which the tax system interacts with economic growth would result in steadily higher revenues relative to GDP.

The Alternative Fiscal Scenario
The budget outlook is much bleaker under the alternative fiscal scenario, which incorporates several changes to current law that are widely expected to occur or that would modify some provisions of law that might be difficult to sustain for a long period. Most important are the assumptions about revenues: that the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and extended most recently in 2010 will be extended; that the reach of the alternative minimum tax will be restrained to stay close to its historical extent; and that over the longer run, tax law will evolve further so that revenues remain near their historical average of 18 percent of GDP. This scenario also incorporates assumptions that Medicare’s payment rates for physicians will remain at current levels (rather than declining by about a third, as under current law) and that some policies enacted in the March 2010 health care legislation to restrain growth in federal health care spending will not continue in effect after 2021.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Obama spending binge never happened

Government outlays rising at slowest pace since 1950s

Here are the facts, according to the official government statistics:

• In the 2009 fiscal year — the last of George W. Bush’s presidency — federal spending rose by 17.9% from $2.98 trillion to $3.52 trillion. Check the official numbers at the Office of Management and Budget.

• In fiscal 2010 — the first budget under Obama — spending fell 1.8% to $3.46 trillion.

• In fiscal 2011, spending rose 4.3% to $3.60 trillion.

• In fiscal 2012, spending is set to rise 0.7% to $3.63 trillion, according to the Congressional Budget Office’s estimate of the budget that was agreed to last August.

• Finally in fiscal 2013 — the final budget of Obama’s term — spending is scheduled to fall 1.3% to $3.58 trillion. Read the CBO’s latest budget outlook.

Over Obama’s four budget years, federal spending is on track to rise from $3.52 trillion to $3.58 trillion, an annualized increase of just 0.4%.

There has been no huge increase in spending under the current president, despite what you hear.

Why do people think Obama has spent like a drunken sailor? It’s in part because of a fundamental misunderstanding of the federal budget.

What people forget (or never knew) is that the first year of every presidential term starts with a budget approved by the previous administration and Congress. The president only begins to shape the budget in his second year. It takes time to develop a budget and steer it through Congress — especially in these days of congressional gridlock.

The 2009 fiscal year, which Republicans count as part of Obama’s legacy, began four months before Obama moved into the White House. The major spending decisions in the 2009 fiscal year were made by George W. Bush and the previous Congress.

All of that is as phoney as a 2nd rate circus sideshow..

There HASN'T been an approved Congressional Budget in over 2 years. Spending is on autopilot. And the CBO makes LUDICROUS assumptions because they HAVE to.

Like the fact that ALL (everyone) of the BUsh Tax Cuts will expire. That GM will repay every penny of their "loans". That Congress will TRUELY CUT $500Bill from Medicare like the Dems promised in the ACA costing.

The baseline doesn't show DRASTICALLY increasing Medicare and Soc Sec payouts. In fact, looking at that flatline -- there's no inkling of the impending CRISIS that everyone knows is coming.

It's crap.. based on BUDGETS that don't exist. And everytime Congress spends extraordinary amounts of money (like the phoney stimulus) the argument is "how ya gonna pay for that?". Never an answer.. OUTSIDE the budget -- not shown in the baseline.

It's exactly like the MASSIVE LIE that the S.S. has OODLES of cash in it --- just waiting to repay the folks who got the Surplus stolen from under them all those years. A fabrication to cause you and me to quarrel, while Congress escapes responsibility for mismanaging the massive taxes that they already recieve.

In fact --- everything I told you is in the quote for the "alternative scenario" which turns out to be the REAL SCENARIO. To wit..

The Alternative Fiscal Scenario
The budget outlook is much bleaker under the alternative fiscal scenario, which incorporates several changes to current law that are widely expected to occur or that would modify some provisions of law that might be difficult to sustain for a long period. Most important are the assumptions about revenues: that the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and extended most recently in 2010 will be extended (they will); that the reach of the alternative minimum tax will be restrained to stay close to its historical extent (it will, in fact the Stimulus addressed that); and that over the longer run, tax law will evolve further so that revenues remain near their historical average of 18 percent of GDP. This scenario also incorporates assumptions that Medicare’s payment rates for physicians will remain at current levels (rather than declining by about a third, as under current law) (see -- i told you) and that some policies enacted in the March 2010 health care legislation to restrain growth in federal health care spending will not continue in effect after 2021.

THAT's actually the much more likely scenario.. Given that Dems have been giving Seniors a wink and saying that the Medicare cuts are just rhetoric. Because if they DIDN'T do that -- they'd have to put wheelchair spike strips into the Capitol ramps..

 

[Bfgrn]

It's not just Obama -- it's the entire hijacking of the DEM party by the Class Warriors and Redistributionists. It's Pelosi and Reid and the radicals that embarrass even Moderate Dem leadership.
So when I say "HE" --- I mean "THEM".

He has WASTED a $TRILL dollars on poorly conceived bailouts and stimulus.
He has FOCUSED on the fantasy of GREEN JOBS, not restoring the economy.
His Healthcare fiasco is now costed at nearly 3 times what he promised it would cost and implementation hasn't even begun.
He WANTED to spend more, but America took his control of Congress away before he could.

Those are the facts. Now I HAVE STUDIED the increase in debt and what I've found is complete lying and ignoring of significant facts.

Facts like the SOC SEC crisis has hit 10 years EARLY. The "fund" went negative in 2010 after Obama channeled Robin Hood in a fairness hissy fit and gave out $20/month refunds of FICA taxes. This refund ACCELERATES the demise of S.S. and Medicare. In fact -- Obama SHOULD BE ARGUING that he inherited a $150Bill change in the FICA income. Used to run $100Bill SURPLUSES just a few years ago, and now they are in $50Bill deficits. WHY isn't this mentioned? Because the DEMS don't want their phoney FICA stimulus tax cut to be exposed as a large part of the prob. That and NEITHER party wants attention directed to the fact that the vaunted S.S. Trust Fund is a myth and TODAY'S taxpayers are paying for the theft of the SURPLUS for all those years.

We're in DEBT because 40% of spending is JUST PAYING INTEREST!!!!!

Don't tell me I need a larger picture.

Fixing the employment problem is NOT compatible with beating on Venture Capital and "the rich". And making statements that "The private sector is doing fine" -- instills no confidence that a Class Warrior is at all qualified to understand the SPENDING mess and the UNCERTAINTY mess that our economic system is in..

Emote all you want. But the FACTS don't support what you parrot.

The LARGER picture...

CBO’s Long-Term Budget Outlook

Here is the 'rub'...We are on The Extended-Baseline Scenario trajectory 'Obama, Pelosi and Reid and the radicals' put us on. If Congress does nothing the Extended-Baseline Scenario is already in place.

IF the Bush tax cuts don't expire and the AHA is not fully implemented or repealed the The Alternative Fiscal Scenario is the trajectory Teapublicans will take us if they gain enough power.

the CBO lays it out perfectly clear...CRYSTAL.

Federal Debt Held by the Public Under CBO’s Long-Term Budget Scenarios (Percentage of gross domestic product)

The chart shows 2 scenarios. For all practical purposes, you can call the Extended-Baseline Scenario the Democrat scenario and the Alternative Fiscal Scenario the Teapublican scenario.


The Extended-Baseline Scenario adheres closely to current law. Under this scenario, the expiration of the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and most recently extended in 2010, the growing reach of the alternative minimum tax, the tax provisions of the recent health care legislation, and the way in which the tax system interacts with economic growth would result in steadily higher revenues relative to GDP.

The Alternative Fiscal Scenario
The budget outlook is much bleaker under the alternative fiscal scenario, which incorporates several changes to current law that are widely expected to occur or that would modify some provisions of law that might be difficult to sustain for a long period. Most important are the assumptions about revenues: that the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and extended most recently in 2010 will be extended; that the reach of the alternative minimum tax will be restrained to stay close to its historical extent; and that over the longer run, tax law will evolve further so that revenues remain near their historical average of 18 percent of GDP. This scenario also incorporates assumptions that Medicare’s payment rates for physicians will remain at current levels (rather than declining by about a third, as under current law) and that some policies enacted in the March 2010 health care legislation to restrain growth in federal health care spending will not continue in effect after 2021.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Obama spending binge never happened

Government outlays rising at slowest pace since 1950s

Here are the facts, according to the official government statistics:

• In the 2009 fiscal year — the last of George W. Bush’s presidency — federal spending rose by 17.9% from $2.98 trillion to $3.52 trillion. Check the official numbers at the Office of Management and Budget.

• In fiscal 2010 — the first budget under Obama — spending fell 1.8% to $3.46 trillion.

• In fiscal 2011, spending rose 4.3% to $3.60 trillion.

• In fiscal 2012, spending is set to rise 0.7% to $3.63 trillion, according to the Congressional Budget Office’s estimate of the budget that was agreed to last August.

• Finally in fiscal 2013 — the final budget of Obama’s term — spending is scheduled to fall 1.3% to $3.58 trillion. Read the CBO’s latest budget outlook.

Over Obama’s four budget years, federal spending is on track to rise from $3.52 trillion to $3.58 trillion, an annualized increase of just 0.4%.

There has been no huge increase in spending under the current president, despite what you hear.

Why do people think Obama has spent like a drunken sailor? It’s in part because of a fundamental misunderstanding of the federal budget.

What people forget (or never knew) is that the first year of every presidential term starts with a budget approved by the previous administration and Congress. The president only begins to shape the budget in his second year. It takes time to develop a budget and steer it through Congress — especially in these days of congressional gridlock.

The 2009 fiscal year, which Republicans count as part of Obama’s legacy, began four months before Obama moved into the White House. The major spending decisions in the 2009 fiscal year were made by George W. Bush and the previous Congress.

All of that is as phoney as a 2nd rate circus sideshow..

There HASN'T been an approved Congressional Budget in over 2 years. Spending is on autopilot. And the CBO makes LUDICROUS assumptions because they HAVE to.

Like the fact that ALL (everyone) of the BUsh Tax Cuts will expire. That GM will repay every penny of their "loans". That Congress will TRUELY CUT $500Bill from Medicare like the Dems promised in the ACA costing.

The baseline doesn't show DRASTICALLY increasing Medicare and Soc Sec payouts. In fact, looking at that flatline -- there's no inkling of the impending CRISIS that everyone knows is coming.

It's crap.. based on BUDGETS that don't exist. And everytime Congress spends extraordinary amounts of money (like the phoney stimulus) the argument is "how ya gonna pay for that?". Never an answer.. OUTSIDE the budget -- not shown in the baseline.

It's exactly like the MASSIVE LIE that the S.S. has OODLES of cash in it --- just waiting to repay the folks who got the Surplus stolen from under them all those years. A fabrication to cause you and me to quarrel, while Congress escapes responsibility for mismanaging the massive taxes that they already recieve.

In fact --- everything I told you is in the quote for the "alternative scenario" which turns out to be the REAL SCENARIO. To wit..

The Alternative Fiscal Scenario
The budget outlook is much bleaker under the alternative fiscal scenario, which incorporates several changes to current law that are widely expected to occur or that would modify some provisions of law that might be difficult to sustain for a long period. Most important are the assumptions about revenues: that the tax cuts enacted since 2001 and extended most recently in 2010 will be extended (they will); that the reach of the alternative minimum tax will be restrained to stay close to its historical extent (it will, in fact the Stimulus addressed that); and that over the longer run, tax law will evolve further so that revenues remain near their historical average of 18 percent of GDP. This scenario also incorporates assumptions that Medicare’s payment rates for physicians will remain at current levels (rather than declining by about a third, as under current law) (see -- i told you) and that some policies enacted in the March 2010 health care legislation to restrain growth in federal health care spending will not continue in effect after 2021.

THAT's actually the much more likely scenario.. Given that Dems have been giving Seniors a wink and saying that the Medicare cuts are just rhetoric. Because if they DIDN'T do that -- they'd have to put wheelchair spike strips into the Capitol ramps..

Yes, unfortunately it is the most likely scenario, because our government has been hijacked by the opulent who have no need for programs that save millions of middle class jobs, which the stimulus did. And we no longer have a free press, we have corporate puppets who repeat everything they are told by 5 huge corporations who OWN the press.

We are headed for a civil war, when the truly dependent (children and the elderly) are harmed or extinguished.

Medicare is by far the greatest accomplishment in our nation's history. It took the elderly from being the most likely to live in poverty, and living under the specter of losing everything they worked their entire lifetime for with one illness, to the least likely to face poverty.

IT is too valuable, and MUST be funded.

We have all made mistakes. But Dante tells us that divine justice weighs the sins of the cold-blooded and the sins of the warm-hearted on different scales. Better the occasional faults of a party living in the spirit of charity than the consistent omissions of a party frozen in the ice of its own indifference.
President John F. Kennedy

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

On one side are those who create wealth, America’s private sector–the very ones targeted by President Obama’s tax hikes announced Monday.

On the other are the public employee unions; left-leaning intelligentsia who see the growth of government as index of progress; and the millions of Americans now dependent on government through a growing network of government transfer payments, from Medicaid and Social Security to college loans and corporate bailouts and handouts (think GM and Solyndra).

Ignorant rightist idiocy.

Over the past century America’s private sector has been the source of productivity, innovation, creativity, and growth–and gave us the iPhone and iPad. The public sector has been the engine of entitlement, stagnation, and decline -- and gave us Detroit and the South Bronx.

Nonsense.

America’s growth and prosperity during the 20th Century was the consequence of public and private sectors working together.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

On one side are those who create wealth, America’s private sector–the very ones targeted by President Obama’s tax hikes announced Monday.

On the other are the public employee unions; left-leaning intelligentsia who see the growth of government as index of progress; and the millions of Americans now dependent on government through a growing network of government transfer payments, from Medicaid and Social Security to college loans and corporate bailouts and handouts (think GM and Solyndra).

Ignorant rightist idiocy.

Over the past century America’s private sector has been the source of productivity, innovation, creativity, and growth–and gave us the iPhone and iPad. The public sector has been the engine of entitlement, stagnation, and decline -- and gave us Detroit and the South Bronx.

Nonsense.

America’s growth and prosperity during the 20th Century was the consequence of public and private sectors working together.

Total fucking horse shit, you're an idiot.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Says the wannabee totalitarian and fascist, bigrebnc, working with the fascist Big Lie technique. You are among those on this Board that hate traditional American values. He so wants to be a Leader.

On one side are those who create wealth, America’s private sector–the very ones targeted by President Obama’s tax hikes announced Monday.

On the other are the public employee unions; left-leaning intelligentsia who see the growth of government as index of progress; and the millions of Americans now dependent on government through a growing network of government transfer payments, from Medicaid and Social Security to college loans and corporate bailouts and handouts (think GM and Solyndra).

Ignorant rightist idiocy.

Over the past century America’s private sector has been the source of productivity, innovation, creativity, and growth–and gave us the iPhone and iPad. The public sector has been the engine of entitlement, stagnation, and decline -- and gave us Detroit and the South Bronx.

Nonsense.

America’s growth and prosperity during the 20th Century was the consequence of public and private sectors working together.

Total fucking horse shit, you're an idiot.

 

[Zoom]

So that damn race war is finally going to happen? I have been hearing it was coming my entire life.