Another Nativity Question

[Clyde 154]

Um, for the Jewish converts, as long as the temple was standing, the old law was still in effect. That wasn't the false message that Peter was spreading.

The OLD LAW ended when the Christ declared, "It is finished........." Again...........with the contortions? What does compel mean? Peter was compelling the Gentiles to live as do the JEWS (Gal. 2:14) You are interpretating things not recorded as if your opinion was book, chapter and verse.

You are suggesting that PETER was ignorant, when He was given the keys to the kingdom of God. You missed the first gospel sermon preached by Peter in Acts 2? Peter informed the JEWS exactly what was required of them to be included in the church that Christ built as the chief cornerstone......and there were no OLD TESTMENT laws to follow.

 

[Road Runner]

Acts 10, Peter's vision about clean and unclean animals, will tell you exactly why Christians do not need to worry about clean and unclean animals for eating.

Oh I'm not worried about what I eat when it comes to that, but some people are and they have a right to feel that way.

Well, even if a farm has pigs, they aren't kept in the stable.

They're kept in barns, isn't that pretty much the same thing?

 

[norwegen]

The OLD LAW ended when the Christ declared, "It is finished........."

"Not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished." (Mt 5:18) Did I not read somewhere that you think the final judgment is still in the future?

 

[Cecilie1200]

Oh I'm not worried about what I eat when it comes to that, but some people are and they have a right to feel that way.






They're kept in barns, isn't that pretty much the same thing?

They aren't kept in barns. They're kept in pigsties. Pigs tend to have to be kept separate from horses and cows and such, because the requirements of the two groups tend to be contradictory. For example, horses and cows require salt licks; pigs are very vulnerable to salt poisoning. Pigs have a natural inclination to root, which can destroy pasture vegetation; horses and cows are dependent on grazing that same pasture vegetation.

Also, pigs are very intelligent creatures, and need enclosures built a certain way to keep them from escaping. Pigsties are designed differently from enclosed pastures for horses, cows, goats, etc. for this reason.

 

[Clyde 154]

"Not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished." (Mt 5:18) Did I not read somewhere that you think the final judgment is still in the future?

And yes..........the final judgement comes in the future (like a thief in the night, there will be no warning signs) when the earth and all the elements shall be burned, then Hades shall give up its dead, those alive will be changed in the twinkling of an eye while the Christ meets His faithful, both dead and alive in the heavens (sky).......then the kingdom of God is transferred back to the Father. Its not rocket science......its all recorded in scripture. (Cor. 15)

The LAW (of Moses) would last until John the Baptist's life time (Luke 16:16), "THE LAW and THE PROPHETS were UNTIL JOHN THE BAPTIST; SINCE THAT TIME THE KINGDOM OF GOD IS PREACHED (the church Jesus was building)..........

Under the law if you must follow ALL THE LAW, all the oracles of God. You do not add or take away (Deut. 12:32). You are required to KEEP IT ALL.......every dot, every tittle. (Deut 13:18). If you fail to keep one part of the law you are guilty of breaking all the law (James 2:10-11)

I am sure that you have been circumcised within the defined number days after birth......that your doctrine is taken directly by command of a tribe of Lev. priests, you offer annual animal blood sacrifices, you live under authority of a King appointed by God. You KEEP ALL THE LAW. If not you are under a CURSE from God (Gal. 3:10)

I know of no one arguing that Animal sacrifices are to continue......yet they were part of the LAW. Even the animal sacrifices were to continue until ALL WAS FULFILLED. No part, regardless of how small was to be kept intact UNTIL ALL WAS FULFILLED (Lue 16:16-17)

Jesus fulfilled the LAW, "For He (Jesus) is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us (the wall of the LAW that did not allow gentiles). HAVING ABOLISHED IN HIS FLESH (Jesus') the enmity (enmity: hostile toward), EVEN THE LAW OF THE COMMANDMENTS CONTAINED IN ORDIANCES (the law of Moses, 10 commandments) to make of Himself (Jesus) of twain (2, gentile and Jew) one new man (see: Gal. 3:28 ) so making peace." -- Eph. 2:14-16


All the Law was accomplished when the Christ stated, "It is finished.....", nothing passed from the Law until Christ fulfilled the requirements of the OLD LAW with His "perfect" sin free life, the perfect sacrificial Lamb of God. The Old Law was nailed to the Cross of the Christ. (Col. 2:14)

Jesus stated that the LAW and THE PROPHETS would be fulfilled, not destroyed. Fulfilled, finshed, as in "It is finished...."

When addressing the THE LAW the scriptures define the LAW, all the law (Gal. 5:14). And when speaking of the law before the Law of Moses the scriptures define such Law as THE PROPHETS....all the prophets of God before Moses in deliving the oracles of God to Israel. Example (Acts 28:23), reading from Moses and the Prophets.

Used as both, its simply the Law and the Prophets (Romans 3:21)

Why did Jesus come to fulfill the law? The LAW was unable to impart life (Gal. 3:21). The Law made nothing perfect (Heb. 7:18-19). The Law had fault (Heb. 8:7). The Law could not cleanse sin (Heb. 10:1-4, 8-10, 14). Without Jesus the Law would remain in effect (Hebrews 9:15)

Jesus did not state, Until Heaven and Earth shall end by itself. This was but 1 of 2 conditions stated that would fulfill the requirement of the Law. The other condition was met. OR ALL WAS ACCOMPLISHED.....i.e, done, finished.

 

[JohnDB]

Now I'm talking about Nativity scenes here not what actually happened or didn't happen in the Bible. Why is it you see cows, horses, and sheep in Nativity scenes but not pigs, chickens, roosters, or goats? I'm guessing pigs because over where Jesus was born they don't eat them, but what about the other animals?

Goats, where common, aren't usually used because the shepherds were watching sheep. The same sheep used for temple sacrifice.

The other animals are there because it was a type of barn for both people and animals...in most nice barns there usually is a room for ranch hands...aka bunkhouse. In the ANE these things weren't all that uncommon either.

 

[healthmyths]

Now I'm talking about Nativity scenes here not what actually happened or didn't happen in the Bible. Why is it you see cows, horses, and sheep in Nativity scenes but not pigs, chickens, roosters, or goats? I'm guessing pigs because over where Jesus was born they don't eat them, but what about the other animals?

Because Jesus was born in a stable where "free" ranging animals aren't kept. Pigs,chickens,etc., are free ranging mean they don't have to be kept in a stable like cows, horses, sheep, etc.
Mangers are animal feeding troughs, and barns are where one would expect to find them...

Was Jesus born in a stable? - ChristianAnswers.Net

Discussion on the type of dwelling Jesus was born in

christiananswers.net

Little Internet research ok?

 

[JohnDB]

Because Jesus was born in a stable where "free" ranging animals aren't kept. Pigs,chickens,etc., are free ranging mean they don't have to be kept in a stable like cows, horses, sheep, etc.
Mangers are animal feeding troughs, and barns are where one would expect to find them...

Was Jesus born in a stable? - ChristianAnswers.Net

Discussion on the type of dwelling Jesus was born in

christiananswers.net

Little Internet research ok?

Pigs are an unclean animal used for ritual sacrifice of a different god worship. (Usually in the Baal class)

But they are a herded animal just like anything else...but you can't herd chickens or ducks.

 

[Leviticus]

I dont mind public displays, but it shouldnt use public money. I dont see public money being used for non-christian religious displays, and many christians would complain if it were. If you want to put up a nativity scene on public land, get a permit, pay for it with private money, and dont complain when non-christians are allowed to do the same thing.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Goats, where common, aren't usually used because the shepherds were watching sheep. The same sheep used for temple sacrifice.

The other animals are there because it was a type of barn for both people and animals...in most nice barns there usually is a room for ranch hands...aka bunkhouse. In the ANE these things weren't all that uncommon either.

My son brought up a good point when I was discussing this with him. He pointed out that the stable Joseph and Mary were staying in wasn't on a working farm; it was at an inn. They wouldn't have had the same animals present at an inn that would be found on a farm.

I suspect a lot of the answer simply continues to be that nativity scenes include animals common to the societies that first popularized them.