Arctic Ice

[IanC]

Old Rocks, crick and others here have a habit of cherrypicking their definition of cherrypicking.

Honest people know that the evidence for human caused climate change is equivocal, only fanatics are certain.

 

[Olde Europe]

Old Rocks, crick and others here have a habit of cherrypicking their definition of cherrypicking.

Honest people know that the evidence for human caused climate change is equivocal, only fanatics are certain.

There's high certainty among the world's climate scientists that global warming is happening, and human activity is its main driver. On the other side of that debate we have the Merchants of Doubt, the same odious figures deployed that sold doubt about the harmful effects of smoking. Towards which of the sides you lean defines you.

There's cherry-picking alright, such as letting the temperature record begin in 1998. And then, there's the data-driven record, and analyses based on that (h/t to RollingThunder):

And no, the picture doesn't change in any relevant way whether or not pre-satellite data is included: The Arctic sea ice is collapsing since the 1950s, and at an accelerating rate.

Is someone paying you to post half truths and outright lies here?

No matter how tempting, unless you can provide an actual invoice, I think you shouldn't do that.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Can any of the warmers show us a lab experiment that controls for all variables except for a change in CO2 from 280 to 400PPM? They seem sooooooooooo certain

 

[RollingThunder]

That`s right but the data these satellites collected did not fit the narrative.

Another denier cult lie. Why do you lie all the time, poopybrains?

The satellite data does, in fact, show a definite warming trend.

Latest Global Temps
Dr. Roy Spencer

Latest Global Average Tropospheric Temperatures

There are publications that state that there was no clear trend, but they are all behind a paywall.

Another bullshit denier cult myth. "Oh, they are there, but you can't see them" LOLOLOL.......you denier cult nutbaggers are SO gullible and SO hypocritical. You only trust the supposed 'science' that your cult tells is there but can't show you. LOLOLOL.

There was also a lot of data collected by submarines that mapped ice extent and thickness with upward looking sonar since 1958.

Data from submarines indicates that the Arctic sea ice was thicker and larger in extent in the '50s and '60s.

From: Modern Day Climate Change
Figure 7.9 (Rothrock, et al., 1999) shows sea ice thickness has substantially declined. Using data from submarine cruises, Rothrock and collaborators determined that the mean ice draft at the end of the melt season in the Arctic has decreased by about 1.3 meters between the 1950s and the 1990s.

Figure 7.9: Mean sea ice draft: Decrease in Arctic sea ice draft for 1958 to 1997.

And then before that time there are all these whaling records that can give you pretty accurate information where the edges of the sea ice were.

And those records also indicate a much larger Arctic ice extent in the past, no matter what lies your cult clings to.

From the experts at the National Snow and Ice Data Center....

Arctic sea ice before satellites
JANUARY 2011
What do we know about Arctic sea ice extent before the satellite records began in 1979? Those satellite records show that Arctic sea ice has been declining at an increasing pace since 1979 -- enough data to see a strong signal of climate change. But scientists also want to know what sea ice was like before satellites were there to observe it. What do we know about sea ice conditions before 1979, and how do we know that?


Sea ice charts of the Arctic Ocean show that ice extent has declined since at least the 1950s. Credit: NSIDC and the UK Hadley Center

Historical data on sea ice
To look back into the past, researchers combine data and records from indirect sources known as proxy records. Researchers delved into shipping charts going back to the 1950s, which noted sea ice conditions. The data gleaned from those records, called the Hadley data set, show that Arctic sea ice has declined since at least the mid-1950s. Shipping records exist back to the 1700s, but do not provide complete coverage of the Arctic Ocean. However, taken together these records indicate that the current decline is unprecedented in the last several hundred years.

So it`s not as if the Goracles had no data, the data contradicts the claim that there is a correlation between sea ice and CO2.

Another denier cult lie! In the real world, the data fully supports the scientifically confirmed connection between the dramatic loss of Arctic sea ice and the rapidly rising Arctic temperatures driven by the enormous 46% increase in CO2 levels.

When it comes to temperature, the absence of direct measurements never stopped these scoundrels from producing data pretending to be accurate to a fraction of a degree using proxies.

Another example of the really insane crackpot conspiracy theories the denier cultists are gullible enough to swallow about all of the world's scientists conspiring to fool them....that are really all these deranged denier cult wackos have left to support their denial of reality.

 

[xyz]

Huge benefits to Russia:
In Russian Arctic, a new major sea port

Russian Arctic city hopes to cash in as melting ice opens new sea route to China

This map shows the massive scale of Russia's planned fortification of the Arctic

(also note Exxon, in other words, Tillerson's role in this):
Russia Wants To Melt More Arctic Sea Ice

 

[CrusaderFrank]

^ No warming in 2 decades

 

[Old Rocks]

Polar, Westwall, flap yap, post links from a credible source that shows that the ice in the '70's was not in the general and accelerating decline that we have seen in the satellite data.

 

[Old Rocks]

^ No warming in 2 decades

Now we understand, you are blind. LOL

 

[Marion Morrison]

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/02/150210160103.htm

 

[Old Rocks]

Global sea ice diminishing, despite Antarctic gains
Date:
February 10, 2015
Source:
NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
Summary:
Sea ice increases in Antarctica do not make up for the accelerated Arctic sea ice loss of the last decades, a new study finds. As a whole, the planet has been shedding sea ice at an average annual rate of 13,500 square miles (35,000 square kilometers) since 1979, the equivalent of losing an area of sea ice larger than the state of Maryland every year.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/02/150210160103.htm

Image 2 of 4 (play slideshow) Download

Image 4 of 4 (play slideshow) Download

You posted an article from two years ago. Here is the present conditions both the Arctic and Antarctic. I will give you a little leeway this time, but post out of date data again, presenting it as current, and I will know that you are completely dishonest, stupid, or, more likely, both.

 

[polarbear]

Polar, Westwall, flap yap, post links from a credible source that shows that the ice in the '70's was not in the general and accelerating decline that we have seen in the satellite data.

Excuuuuuse me?
We have to show what? It's you (&the end is nigh squealers) who say that it has accelerated after the 70's.
We don't have to show anything ! Why should the burden of proof be different in this case?
When it comes to assertions like illegal immigration,drugs and crime you liberals not only demand we provide the proof but make it a racist issue to collect and present the data because you know full well what the results will show. This is no different, so go get the sonar data the US & British Navy has compiled and show us that arctic sea ice behaves any different after 1970...then we'll talk.

 

[Old Rocks]

http://psc.apl.uw.edu/wordpress/wp-...volume/BPIOMASIceVolumeAnomalyCurrentV2.1.png


Reconstructed changes in Arctic sea ice over the past 1,450 years

• Christophe Kinnard,
• Christian M. Zdanowicz,
• David A. Fisher,
• Elisabeth Isaksson,
• Anne de Vernal
• & Lonnie G. Thompson

• Affiliations
• Contributions
• Corresponding author

Nature

479,

509–512

(24 November 2011)

doi:10.1038/nature10581
Received

24 December 2010
Accepted

21 September 2011
Published online

23 November 2011

Arctic sea ice extent is now more than two million square kilometres less than it was in the late twentieth century, with important consequences for the climate, the ocean and traditional lifestyles in the Arctic1, 2. Although observations show a more or less continuous decline for the past four or five decades3, 4, there are few long-term records with which to assess natural sea ice variability. Until now, the question of whether or not current trends are potentially anomalous5 has therefore remained unanswerable. Here we use a network of high-resolution terrestrial proxies from the circum-Arctic region to reconstruct past extents of summer sea ice, and show that—although extensive uncertainties remain, especially before the sixteenth century—both the duration and magnitude of the current decline in sea ice seem to be unprecedented for the past 1,450 years. Enhanced advection of warm Atlantic water to the Arctic6 seems to be the main factor driving the decline of sea ice extent on multidecadal timescales, and may result from nonlinear feedbacks between sea ice and the Atlantic meridional overturning circulation. These results reinforce the assertion that sea ice is an active component of Arctic climate variability and that the recent decrease in summer Arctic sea ice is consistent with anthropogenically forced warming.

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v479/n7374/full/nature10581.html

Not even a need to talk. We know what we are seeing now has not happened in the past thousand years.

 

[Old Rocks]

Scientists have pieced together historical records to reconstruct Arctic sea ice extent over the past 125 years. The results are shown in the figure below. The red line, showing the extent at the end of the summer melt season, is the most critical:http://nsidc.org/research/bios/fetterer.html

Historical documents reveal Arctic sea ice is disappearing at record speed | Dana Nuccitelli

More information on the present anomolous Arctic Sea Ice melt.

 

[Old Rocks]

Arctic sea ice is approaching the limit of natural variability

Using a new chemical technique, scientists have managed to document the expansion and decline of Arctic sea ice over the past 125,000 years.

“This is the first time we’ve been able to reconstruct Arctic sea ice in the past from a Greenland ice core,” says co-author Paul Vallelonga, associate professor from the Niels Bohr Institute Centre for Ice and Climate, at the University of Copenhagen, Denmark.

While sea ice is currently declining rapidly and has reached record lows in the last decade, it still has some way to go before it exceeds the minima that was last seen 8,000 years ago. But according to the new study, we were already about 90 per cent of the way there, even before the record breaking lows of 2015 and 2016.

The results redefine the natural limit of sea ice decline in the Arctic over the last 10,000 years, says Vallelonga.

“It’s good news that we’re still within the Arctic’s “natural threshold” if you like. But over the last 40 years we’ve seen sea ice changing rapidly, and we’re fast approaching this minimum level,” he says.

Now I can continue to post links as to the fact that the present rapid decrease in Arctic Sea Ice is not normal or natural in cause.

 

[RollingThunder]

No warming in 2 decades

And there's is the stark insanity of these denier cult wackos.

Even when the evidence is staring them in the face, like that graph, they deny it.

Even when the facts are that the world just experienced three successive 'hottest year on record' in a row, with 16 of the 17 hottest years on record occurring in this century since 2000, Arctic sea ice is at its lowest extent and volume in at least 5000 years, and rising sea levels are already causing problems in many places around the world....the braindead deniers still chant their deranged denier cult dogmas that the Earth isn't rapidly warming, the Arctic ice isn't melting and the sea levels aren't rising.

 

[westwall]

No warming in 2 decades

And there's is the stark insanity of these denier cult wackos.

Even when the evidence is staring them in the face, like that graph, they deny it.

Even when the facts are that the world just experienced three successive 'hottest year on record' in a row, with 16 of the 17 hottest years on record occurring in this century since 2000, Arctic sea ice is at its lowest extent and volume in at least 5000 years, and rising sea levels are already causing problems in many places around the world....the braindead deniers still chant their deranged denier cult dogmas that the Earth isn't rapidly warming, the Arctic ice isn't melting and the sea levels aren't rising.

What was that little hater dupe?

Here's one graph that shows that the year 1971 was much lower than the present day. It wasn't till 1975 that the Polar ice began to recover, and then it bloomed thanks to the record cold that we suffered through. That is why you cherry picking silly people choose 1979 as your start point. To go earlier exposes your lies.

 

[Muhammed]

It looks like we are headed for another very low ice cover in the Arctic this summer.

Arctic Sea Ice News & Analysis
Conditions in context

Although the 2009 melt season started slowly, the pace of ice loss quickened through May. During May, the Arctic Ocean lost 1.67 million square kilometers (645,000 square miles) of ice, an average decline of 54,000 square kilometers (21,000 square miles) per day. This is similar to the rate of decline observed last year. For comparison, the long-term average (1979-2000) rate of decline for May is 47,000 kilometers per day (18,000 square miles per day). By the end of May 2009, ice extent was 84,000 square kilometers (32,000 square miles) higher than extent at the end of May 2007.

Do you live on arctic ice?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

^ No warming in 2 decades

Now we understand, you are blind. LOL

No, but you must be a moron.

See the red line that peaks in 98 and 99?

 

[Old Rocks]

No warming in 2 decades

And there's is the stark insanity of these denier cult wackos.

Even when the evidence is staring them in the face, like that graph, they deny it.

Even when the facts are that the world just experienced three successive 'hottest year on record' in a row, with 16 of the 17 hottest years on record occurring in this century since 2000, Arctic sea ice is at its lowest extent and volume in at least 5000 years, and rising sea levels are already causing problems in many places around the world....the braindead deniers still chant their deranged denier cult dogmas that the Earth isn't rapidly warming, the Arctic ice isn't melting and the sea levels aren't rising.

What was that little hater dupe?

Here's one graph that shows that the year 1971 was much lower than the present day. It wasn't till 1975 that the Polar ice began to recover, and then it bloomed thanks to the record cold that we suffered through. That is why you cherry picking silly people choose 1979 as your start point. To go earlier exposes your lies.

LOL Little box in the upper left corner shows the extent of the ice that is being measured. It is not at all the whole arctic. In fact, it is not even a major fraction of it. Once again you are busted in a purposeful lie, Mr. Westwall. A really stupid and self evident one at that. LOL

 

[RollingThunder]

No warming in 2 decades

And there's is the stark insanity of these denier cult wackos.

Even when the evidence is staring them in the face, like that graph, they deny it.

Even when the facts are that the world just experienced three successive 'hottest year on record' in a row, with 16 of the 17 hottest years on record occurring in this century since 2000, Arctic sea ice is at its lowest extent and volume in at least 5000 years, and rising sea levels are already causing problems in many places around the world....the braindead deniers still chant their deranged denier cult dogmas that the Earth isn't rapidly warming, the Arctic ice isn't melting and the sea levels aren't rising.

Here's one graph that shows that the year 1971 was much lower than the present day. It wasn't till 1975 that the Polar ice began to recover, and then it bloomed thanks to the record cold that we suffered through. That is why you cherry picking silly people choose 1979 as your start point. To go earlier exposes your lies.

The denier cult troll, the walleyedretard, always tries to pass off bogus pseudo-science from denier cult blogs as if it was actual science, but it is always just bullshit propaganda. His source this time is a nutjob blog called 'https://polarbearscience.files.wordpress.'.

In the real world....from the experts at the National Snow and Ice Data Center....

Arctic sea ice before satellites
JANUARY 2011
What do we know about Arctic sea ice extent before the satellite records began in 1979? Those satellite records show that Arctic sea ice has been declining at an increasing pace since 1979 -- enough data to see a strong signal of climate change. But scientists also want to know what sea ice was like before satellites were there to observe it. What do we know about sea ice conditions before 1979, and how do we know that?


Sea ice charts of the Arctic Ocean show that ice extent has declined since at least the 1950s. Credit: NSIDC and the UK Hadley Center

Historical data on sea ice
To look back into the past, researchers combine data and records from indirect sources known as proxy records. Researchers delved into shipping charts going back to the 1950s, which noted sea ice conditions. The data gleaned from those records, called the Hadley data set, show that Arctic sea ice has declined since at least the mid-1950s. Shipping records exist back to the 1700s, but do not provide complete coverage of the Arctic Ocean. However, taken together these records indicate that the current decline is unprecedented in the last several hundred years.