Are atheists materialists?

[WinterBorn]

Then you are a materialist like WB.

No, In am an Existentialist.
How many times do you have to be told before it sinks into your thick head?

Don't you know? ding gets to decide who and what we are.

There you go again taking things personal.

Its called a joke, son. At your expense, but still a joke.

If it was at my expense I think that proved my point.

Because I make fun of you and your tactics does not mean I am taking any of this personally. Try again.

 

[WinterBorn]

Not at all. But that seems to be what matters to you. You have continually asked others whether I am an atheist. You have continually tried to call me a materialist or a naturalist, despite the fact that I fit the definition of an atheist quite well.

An atheist who believes in spirits.

An atheist who believes in incorporeal things. You defined them as spirits, not me.

You really are a dishonest sort of debater, aren't you?

What would you call incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things, WB?

How about "incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things"? Saves you trying to say I believe in a soul that is animated by a mover, or some such nonsense.

Can you give me an example of something that is incorporeal that did not originate from something that was corporeal?

Because that literally describes a spirit which is outside of the material world.

Calling it a spirit implies it is sentient. I never said that.

 

[ding]

How does this soul exist separate from matter? Where did it come from and where will it go?

I prefer to interpret your “soul” as sentient consciousness.
It eventually develops from DNA-instructed stem cells that reflect brain activity patterned from basic and complicated experiences. Much of one’s personality is stored in long-term memory, which may appear to be the “soul” among religious thinkers.

Which would be a materialistic world view.

I would label myself an “agnostic” with a “soft atheist” view.
I don’t pretend to know what I don’t know, but I like to rationalize theories based on experiences or other evidence.
I have a scientific perspective.

I understand. So do I. I’ve been a practing engineer for 34 years.

You don’t appear to be a scientist, although you use scientific information in your career to pay the bills?
Here is one explanation of the difference:
“Science is the study of the physical world, while Engineering applies scientific knowledge to design processes, structures or equipment.”

Science is the study of nature to discover the order within nature to make predictions about nature.

 

[ding]

An atheist who believes in spirits.

An atheist who believes in incorporeal things. You defined them as spirits, not me.

You really are a dishonest sort of debater, aren't you?

What would you call incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things, WB?

How about "incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things"? Saves you trying to say I believe in a soul that is animated by a mover, or some such nonsense.

Can you give me an example of something that is incorporeal that did not originate from something that was corporeal?

Because that literally describes a spirit which is outside of the material world.

Calling it a spirit implies it is sentient. I never said that.

Let me know when you can provide an example.

 

[WinterBorn]

I’m not. I am starting from the two positions. Matter was created by spirit. Or spirit was created by matter. There is no middle ground.

One can have lots of empathy, believe in the golden rule and “love”, AND not be a theist who believes there is a “soul” separate from matter.

How does this soul exist separate from matter? Where did it come from and where will it go?

I prefer to interpret your “soul” as sentient consciousness.
It eventually develops from DNA-instructed stem cells that reflect brain activity patterned from basic and complicated experiences. Much of one’s personality is stored in long-term memory, which may appear to be the “soul” among religious thinkers.

Which would be a materialistic world view.

I would label myself an “agnostic” with a “soft atheist” view.
I don’t pretend to know what I don’t know, but I like to rationalize theories based on experiences or other evidence.
I have a scientific perspective.

Do you believe in god, denmark? I apologize if you have stated this before.

 

[ding]

No, In am an Existentialist.
How many times do you have to be told before it sinks into your thick head?

Don't you know? ding gets to decide who and what we are.

There you go again taking things personal.

Its called a joke, son. At your expense, but still a joke.

If it was at my expense I think that proved my point.

Because I make fun of you and your tactics does not mean I am taking any of this personally. Try again.

I’ve been made of fun before it’s not so bad.

Yes, it absolutely is one sign that you have taken this discussion personally.

 

[denmark]

I prefer to interpret your “soul” as sentient consciousness.
It eventually develops from DNA-instructed stem cells that reflect brain activity patterned from basic and complicated experiences. Much of one’s personality is stored in long-term memory, which may appear to be the “soul” among religious thinkers.

Which would be a materialistic world view.

Or naturalistic, based on what we perceive and measure with a good degree of accuracy.

Same difference.

Same coin, perhaps.
One side is a philosophical view, and the other side focuses on scientific methods based on natural data.

Not sure how either of those changes your belief that everything proceeds from the material world. That things like spiritualality are consequences of the material world. Right?

I don’t need to use the ambiguous term “spirituality”.
We understand that consciousness is related to brain activity. The scientific questions relate to HOW they are linked.
In philosophy, some refer to “emergent properties” to explain consciousness “arising” from brain activity linked to the hippocampus, thalamus, hypothalamus.

 

[WinterBorn]

An atheist who believes in incorporeal things. You defined them as spirits, not me.

You really are a dishonest sort of debater, aren't you?

What would you call incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things, WB?

How about "incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things"? Saves you trying to say I believe in a soul that is animated by a mover, or some such nonsense.

Can you give me an example of something that is incorporeal that did not originate from something that was corporeal?

Because that literally describes a spirit which is outside of the material world.

Calling it a spirit implies it is sentient. I never said that.

Let me know when you can provide an example.

Let me know when you will provide your definition of "atheist".

 

[ding]

Which would be a materialistic world view.

Or naturalistic, based on what we perceive and measure with a good degree of accuracy.

Same difference.

Same coin, perhaps.
One side is a philosophical view, and the other side focuses on scientific methods based on natural data.

Not sure how either of those changes your belief that everything proceeds from the material world. That things like spiritualality are consequences of the material world. Right?

I don’t need to use the ambiguous term “spirituality”.
We understand that consciousness is related to brain activity. The scientific questions relate to HOW they are linked.
In philosophy, some refer to “emergent properties” to explain consciousness “arising” from brain activity linked to the hypothalamus.

I’d love to have a discussion on consciousness later. Right now I am interested in understanding if I am understanding your position on the OP. Specifically, that if you believe everything proceeds from the material world.

 

[ding]

What would you call incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things, WB?

How about "incorporeal things which did not originate from corporeal things"? Saves you trying to say I believe in a soul that is animated by a mover, or some such nonsense.

Can you give me an example of something that is incorporeal that did not originate from something that was corporeal?

Because that literally describes a spirit which is outside of the material world.

Calling it a spirit implies it is sentient. I never said that.

Let me know when you can provide an example.

Let me know when you will provide your definition of "atheist".

I already did. Someone who believes everything proceeded from the material world. That no spirits exist that did not originate from the material world. Your turn.

 

[denmark]

I prefer to interpret your “soul” as sentient consciousness.
It eventually develops from DNA-instructed stem cells that reflect brain activity patterned from basic and complicated experiences. Much of one’s personality is stored in long-term memory, which may appear to be the “soul” among religious thinkers.

Which would be a materialistic world view.

I would label myself an “agnostic” with a “soft atheist” view.
I don’t pretend to know what I don’t know, but I like to rationalize theories based on experiences or other evidence.
I have a scientific perspective.

I understand. So do I. I’ve been a practing engineer for 34 years.

You don’t appear to be a scientist, although you use scientific information in your career to pay the bills?
Here is one explanation of the difference:
“Science is the study of the physical world, while Engineering applies scientific knowledge to design processes, structures or equipment.”

Engineering is the commercial application of science.

What is your background?

Academic psychology.

 

[ding]

Which would be a materialistic world view.

I would label myself an “agnostic” with a “soft atheist” view.
I don’t pretend to know what I don’t know, but I like to rationalize theories based on experiences or other evidence.
I have a scientific perspective.

I understand. So do I. I’ve been a practing engineer for 34 years.

You don’t appear to be a scientist, although you use scientific information in your career to pay the bills?
Here is one explanation of the difference:
“Science is the study of the physical world, while Engineering applies scientific knowledge to design processes, structures or equipment.”

Engineering is the commercial application of science.

What is your background?

Academic psychology.

Excellent. So you are versed in the study of the human mind. What training have you had in natural sciences?

 

[denmark]

One can have lots of empathy, believe in the golden rule and “love”, AND not be a theist who believes there is a “soul” separate from matter.

How does this soul exist separate from matter? Where did it come from and where will it go?

I prefer to interpret your “soul” as sentient consciousness.
It eventually develops from DNA-instructed stem cells that reflect brain activity patterned from basic and complicated experiences. Much of one’s personality is stored in long-term memory, which may appear to be the “soul” among religious thinkers.

Which would be a materialistic world view.

I would label myself an “agnostic” with a “soft atheist” view.
I don’t pretend to know what I don’t know, but I like to rationalize theories based on experiences or other evidence.
I have a scientific perspective.

Do you believe in god, denmark? I apologize if you have stated this before.

Whose concept of “god” or “God”?
I am agnostic in my beliefs.

 

[ding]

How does this soul exist separate from matter? Where did it come from and where will it go?

I prefer to interpret your “soul” as sentient consciousness.
It eventually develops from DNA-instructed stem cells that reflect brain activity patterned from basic and complicated experiences. Much of one’s personality is stored in long-term memory, which may appear to be the “soul” among religious thinkers.

Which would be a materialistic world view.

I would label myself an “agnostic” with a “soft atheist” view.
I don’t pretend to know what I don’t know, but I like to rationalize theories based on experiences or other evidence.
I have a scientific perspective.

Do you believe in god, denmark? I apologize if you have stated this before.

Whose concept of “god” or “God”?
I am agnostic in my beliefs.

Do you believe that everything proceeded from the material world? It’s kind of the topic of the OP.

 

[denmark]

Right now I am interested in understanding if I am understanding your position on the OP. Specifically, that if you believe everything proceeds from the material world.

I don’t know.

 

[denmark]

I would label myself an “agnostic” with a “soft atheist” view.
I don’t pretend to know what I don’t know, but I like to rationalize theories based on experiences or other evidence.
I have a scientific perspective.

I understand. So do I. I’ve been a practing engineer for 34 years.

You don’t appear to be a scientist, although you use scientific information in your career to pay the bills?
Here is one explanation of the difference:
“Science is the study of the physical world, while Engineering applies scientific knowledge to design processes, structures or equipment.”

Engineering is the commercial application of science.

What is your background?

Academic psychology.

Excellent. So you are versed in the study of the human mind. What training have you had in natural sciences?

I will not expand on my specific credentials, but my breath includes some physical & biological sciences, and mostly behavioral sciences & supporting fields of study/research.

 

[ding]

Right now I am interested in understanding if I am understanding your position on the OP. Specifically, that if you believe everything proceeds from the material world.

I don’t know.

Thanks for clarifying. I couldn’t tell that from your prior post. Which is why I asked. Better to ask them assume, wouldn’t you agree.

 

[denmark]

Right now I am interested in understanding if I am understanding your position on the OP. Specifically, that if you believe everything proceeds from the material world.

I don’t know.

Thanks for clarifying. I couldn’t tell that from your prior post. Which is why I asked. Better to ask them assume, wouldn’t you agree.

Agree. I need to move on at this time. Will check up later. Thank you.

 

[denmark]

You don’t appear to be a scientist, although you use scientific information in your career to pay the bills?
Here is one explanation of the difference:
“Science is the study of the physical world, while Engineering applies scientific knowledge to design processes, structures or equipment.”

Engineering is the commercial application of science.

What is your background?

Academic psychology.

Excellent. So you are versed in the study of the human mind. What training have you had in natural sciences?

I will not expand on my specific credentials, but my breath includes some physical & biological sciences, but mostly behavioral sciences.

Basic undergraduate classes. Probably more on biology and chemistry than physics.

Did you disagree with my definitions on engineering and science?

“Engineering is the commercial application of science.”
That sounds accurate.

 

[ding]

Right now I am interested in understanding if I am understanding your position on the OP. Specifically, that if you believe everything proceeds from the material world.

I don’t know.

Thanks for clarifying. I couldn’t tell that from your prior post. Which is why I asked. Better to ask them assume, wouldn’t you agree.

Agree. I need to move on at this time. Will check up later. Thank you.

When you get back I’d like to explore something that is relevant to this thread and in your area of expertise.

I learned a long time ago that the human mind cannot live in conflict. That when presented with a conflict in belief, it will rationalize that there is no conflict. I’d love to get your professional opinion on this.