Are conservative values dying? If so, why?

[Nosmo King]

Well progressives consider taxing someone more because they are sucessful fair, libertarians do not.

progressives consider speech codes on campuses fair, libertarians do not.

progressives consider restrictive gun control laws both fair and a form of justice. libertarians do not.

Because taxing everyone at the same rate is unfair to those least able to afford it. And check your history, unless you think that students at UC Berkley were all reactionary Libertarians or McCarthyesque Conservatives, it's interesting to see who fought for free speech on campuses.

And gun laws is a tar baby not worth grabbing tonight, unless you think that there should be no gun laws at all, in which case you would be too dangerous to voice an opinion.

Property taxes and sales taxes are at the same rate.
A gallon of milk and a loaf of bread is at the same rate.
They already get free health care, free housing, free food and free everything else and now you want a lower tax rate?
No wonder this country is going down the tubes.

You expect everyone to take care of themselves, fine. You expect everyone to plan for retirement without the benefits of Social Security. You expect everyone to provide their own health care without the benefit of the government interfering. You expect everyone to provide college for their own children without government help.

And yet you would tax people at or below the poverty line at the same rate you would tax millionaires. With the absence of government help for retirement, health care and college, how can those poor plan for these inevitable things? Who benefits most from the protections of government without the help for retirement, health care and college? Why those millionaires, that's who!

Taxing someone making $35,000 at 10% means there's $3,500 less in their budget. That leaves $32,500 before state, local, sales and property tax bills come due. With that amount, how can a family plan for retirement, pay for health care and provide a college education for their children? The millionaire, taxed at the same rate, still has $900,000 to do these things.

Who has it easier and who benefited more?

 

[Gadawg73]

conservatives want less gov't in peoples lives yet
a) they believe they have the right to tell a homosexual they shouldnt marry each other
b) are incredibly interested in controlling what women do with their bodies
c) if you are getting some form of assistance you are a leech...what business is it of theirs?

Seem like a giant case of hypocrites who stand soley in the corner of the wealthy?. Why do conservatives take such an interest in those who are uber wealthy over those who simply work hard for a living? What do conservatives have against those hard working middle class people besides EVERYTHING? The party needs a overhaul. I understand the fiscal conservative mindset but all the other social stuff is so overblown by a bunch of hypocritical holier than are thou over the top prunes

Not this conservative but many.
Many liberals believe we should be a socialist country.
Can not lump everyone in the same basket. I am 100% pro gay rights and although I oppose abortion I oppose government control over who gets one and who doesn't even more.
When you have the 4th generation of folks on government assistance with 32 year old grandmothers and 18 year olds with 3 kids that would be the moocher and parasite class that should not be getting government assistance.

 

[Gadawg73]

Because taxing everyone at the same rate is unfair to those least able to afford it. And check your history, unless you think that students at UC Berkley were all reactionary Libertarians or McCarthyesque Conservatives, it's interesting to see who fought for free speech on campuses.

And gun laws is a tar baby not worth grabbing tonight, unless you think that there should be no gun laws at all, in which case you would be too dangerous to voice an opinion.

Property taxes and sales taxes are at the same rate.
A gallon of milk and a loaf of bread is at the same rate.
They already get free health care, free housing, free food and free everything else and now you want a lower tax rate?
No wonder this country is going down the tubes.

You expect everyone to take care of themselves, fine. You expect everyone to plan for retirement without the benefits of Social Security. You expect everyone to provide their own health care without the benefit of the government interfering. You expect everyone to provide college for their own children without government help.

And yet you would tax people at or below the poverty line at the same rate you would tax millionaires. With the absence of government help for retirement, health care and college, how can those poor plan for these inevitable things? Who benefits most from the protections of government without the help for retirement, health care and college? Why those millionaires, that's who!

Taxing someone making $35,000 at 10% means there's $3,500 less in their budget. That leaves $32,500 before state, local, sales and property tax bills come due. With that amount, how can a family plan for retirement, pay for health care and provide a college education for their children? The millionaire, taxed at the same rate, still has $900,000 to do these things.

Who has it easier and who benefited more?

As usual you make shit up to fit your fantasy land.
I fully supported Bush eliminating millions of lower middle class folks from the Federal income tax roles with his tax cuts.
You have them back paying taxes now with King BoZo.
I support higher tax rates for millionaires than those in the middle class but they are high enough now and taxes never balance
budgets.
No one making 35K pays 10% in this country so your example is bogus.
Not my problem how you plan for your retirement.
I worry about mine and after 31 years in business for myself at age 58 and the massive government regulations you guys have put in place, high taxes and more coming I will not be able to retire any time soon.
You guys are putting everything on our backs. We are the self employed and we will be working past age 70 so the fat cat union folks and government employees get to retire after 30 years on the job.
End that shit and there you go. Get off of my back. Find your play $$$ somewhere else.

 

[Gadawg73]

Obama didnt cut the deficit in half, he only cut it by a third. If he had been allowed to raise taxes on the wealthy, he would have cut it in half

He did not cut it at all.
The deficit has grown faster under him that any time in history.
The government IS STILL GROWING at a clip of about 4-5% a year.
Cut that growth to between 1-2% government growth a year and then we have a chance in the future.
News flash: He DID raise the taxes on the wealthy. That bill passed.
And you did not know that and want more. Amazing.

Obama did cut the deficit every year

There is a difference between the national debt and the national deficit. Obama never said he would cut the debt in half. Our economy could not handle it. He did say he would cut the deficit which is the annual difference between what you take in and what you spend. Obama did that

The tax increase was not passed until second term

Debt and deficit is debt.
Both are debt.

 

[rightwinger]

He did not cut it at all.
The deficit has grown faster under him that any time in history.
The government IS STILL GROWING at a clip of about 4-5% a year.
Cut that growth to between 1-2% government growth a year and then we have a chance in the future.
News flash: He DID raise the taxes on the wealthy. That bill passed.
And you did not know that and want more. Amazing.

Obama did cut the deficit every year

There is a difference between the national debt and the national deficit. Obama never said he would cut the debt in half. Our economy could not handle it. He did say he would cut the deficit which is the annual difference between what you take in and what you spend. Obama did that

The tax increase was not passed until second term

Debt and deficit is debt.
Both are debt.

Deficit is the rate at which you are adding to the debt.

Obama promised to half the deficit not the debt

 

[nodoginnafight]

One thing I can't get over is how eager some people are to tell us all what other people "value."

They don't talk TO these people (maybe they talk AT them sometimes) and they certainly never listen. Yet they believe they are authorities on what other people's values are.

Amazing.

Some political hack feeds you a bunch of crap about the moral and ethical failures of the other side and the dim-witted fixate on it and recite it like it was scripture or something.

 

[AceRothstein]

Obama didnt cut the deficit in half, he only cut it by a third. If he had been allowed to raise taxes on the wealthy, he would have cut it in half

Two years ago I made $200,000 and spent $300,000.

Last year I made $225,000 and spent $550,000.

I cut the deficit by a third.

Leftist math is awesome.

Is this math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better?

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

One thing I can't get over is how eager some people are to tell us all what other people "value."

They don't talk TO these people (maybe they talk AT them sometimes) and they certainly never listen. Yet they believe they are authorities on what other people's values are.

Amazing.

Some political hack feeds you a bunch of crap about the moral and ethical failures of the other side and the dim-witted fixate on it and recite it like it was scripture or something.

Please explain....

 

[nodoginnafight]

One thing I can't get over is how eager some people are to tell us all what other people "value."

They don't talk TO these people (maybe they talk AT them sometimes) and they certainly never listen. Yet they believe they are authorities on what other people's values are.

Amazing.

Some political hack feeds you a bunch of crap about the moral and ethical failures of the other side and the dim-witted fixate on it and recite it like it was scripture or something.

Please explain....

I thought that was pretty straight-forward and self-explanatory ... but here goes.

Many liberals will tell you all about "conservative values" and what they mean.
Many conservatives will tell you all about "liberal values" and what They mean.

Neither spends any time really getting to know the other, they just rejurgitate what their favorite pundit (one of their own bias of course) tells them about the other folks. But man, they live and die by those slanders and slurs.

 

[rightwinger]

Obama didnt cut the deficit in half, he only cut it by a third. If he had been allowed to raise taxes on the wealthy, he would have cut it in half

Two years ago I made $200,000 and spent $300,000.

Last year I made $225,000 and spent $550,000.

I cut the deficit by a third.

Leftist math is awesome.

Is this math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better?

Is it any wonder that they crashed the economy?

 

[nodoginnafight]

One thing I can't get over is how eager some people are to tell us all what other people "value."

They don't talk TO these people (maybe they talk AT them sometimes) and they certainly never listen. Yet they believe they are authorities on what other people's values are.

Amazing.

Some political hack feeds you a bunch of crap about the moral and ethical failures of the other side and the dim-witted fixate on it and recite it like it was scripture or something.

Please explain....

I thought that was pretty straight-forward and self-explanatory ... but here goes.

Many liberals will tell you all about "conservative values" and what they mean.
Many conservatives will tell you all about "liberal values" and what They mean.

Neither spends any time really getting to know the other, they just rejurgitate what their favorite pundit (one of their own bias of course) tells them about the other folks. But man, they live and die by those slanders and slurs.

Just look at how many threads are started here with titles like "what liberals believe" or "what conservatives believe"

They are never started by a member of the group they seek to define.

If I want to know what a conservative believes, I'll ask a conservative, not a liberal.
And I'll always remember that no two people agree 100% even if they do belong to the same party, the same church, or even the same family for that matter.

 

[Staidhup]

The values of the nation have eroded to becoming one of extreme tolerance, we are now an atheistic nation of anything goes, do your own thing, its all about the "me". The "me" generation demands everything, provided someone else pays for it. They blame others and make excuses for their ignorance, deficiencies, and lot in life, expect to be taken care of because its the now that counts, and believe only a fool cares about the future. Our government has embraced the embodiment of the me generation and we as a nation will now pay the price, for the self determination spirit that once was this country has evolved into one of dependence upon the government for their manna.

 

[nodoginnafight]

The values of the nation have eroded to becoming one of extreme tolerance, we are now an atheistic nation of anything goes, do your own thing, its all about the "me". The "me" generation demands everything, provided someone else pays for it. They blame others and make excuses for their ignorance, deficiencies, and lot in life, expect to be taken care of because its the now that counts, and believe only a fool cares about the future. Our government has embraced the embodiment of the me generation and we as a nation will now pay the price, for the self determination spirit that once was this country has evolved into one of dependence upon the government for their manna.

MHO is that there are pros and cons to your observations. I agree about the "me" generation, the inability to appreciate deffered gratification, the sense of entitlement, etc... and the negative impacts of that.

But I believe that tolerance and the acceptance of all religions (or lack of religions) is much more in keeping with the sentiment "all men are created equal." And as long as no one is infringing upon the rights of others - I think the freedom to "do your own thing" is also in keeping with the highest ideals of our country.

 

[Staidhup]

Doing ones own thing is fine provided they accept the consequences for their actions and do not look to another (government) for support. Doing ones own thing can be defined as a luxury unless it provides subsistence. What built this country was a sense of self reliance and determination that one can achieve their greatest aspirations without being punished in the precess. Now those that prosper or have achieved a level of success have become their brothers keeper and viewed with disdain. There are those that claim others, referred to as right wing gun toting religious nut cases, are attempting to legislate morality when in fact, through the courts, and within the beltway of government, the accusers are attempting to do just that because they just want to do their own thing.