Are You Going to Hell?

[Meriweather]

well, yeah.... You see, I can rip on the Catholics because I was born, baptized and confirmed Catholic and went to Catholic Schools for 12 years.

A few bad nuns and priests is the excuse you offer for why you have turned yourself into a mean, clueless mirror image of those priests and nuns you despised?

As someone who attended both public and Catholic schools during my twelve years...they aren't that different. One taught religion and paused class whenever an ambulance happened by for a moment of prayer. The other didn't. Also, if there were any priests and nuns with homosexual leanings, they certainly were not as obvious as those few (and fine) teachers I came across in the public school system. I had a bad teacher in the Catholic school system--and I also had one in the public school system.

 

[BreezeWood]

well, yeah.... You see, I can rip on the Catholics because I was born, baptized and confirmed Catholic and went to Catholic Schools for 12 years.

A few bad nuns and priests is the excuse you offer for why you have turned yourself into a mean, clueless mirror image of those priests and nuns you despised?

As someone who attended both public and Catholic schools during my twelve years...they aren't that different. One taught religion and paused class whenever an ambulance happened by for a moment of prayer. The other didn't. Also, if there were any priests and nuns with homosexual leanings, they certainly were not as obvious as those few (and fine) teachers I came across in the public school system. I had a bad teacher in the Catholic school system--and I also had one in the public school system.

.

As someone who attended both public and Catholic schools during my twelve years...they aren't that different.

- they aren't that different ...

was someone mentioning being brainwashed - willingly ... religious school's and public education are as distinct as night and day.

tip of the iceberg -

Study Finds Church Schools Racially Segregated

Private religious schools, particularly Roman Catholic ones, are more racially segregated than public schools, according to the first analysis of federal data on private school enrollment, by the Civil Rights Project at Harvard University.

The heightened segregation was largely confined to private religious schools, which make up 80 percent of all private schools. The report found that secular private schools were less segregated than public ones.

maintaining their comfort zone by proxy through their phony religion.


The report found that secular private schools were less segregated than public ones.

secular, education without the phony ....

 

[Karl Rand]

Discussions of this kind carried out on this forum exhibit more ignorance of biblical history than you can poke a stick at. Take for instance the stupidity of posting a graphic of the Kings James version of the Bible. Where did this idea come from that it, or any of the many other mistranslations are the innerant Word of God ? If all you have to offer in defence of Christianity is a towering ignorance of your own theology in a pathetic attempt at evangelism you’d best book into a retreat and contemplate Thessalonians Ch 2. V 11 for several weeks. If that gives you the horrors maybe you’re reading the wrong version? Maybe if you were brave enough to venture into the last several centuries of biblical studies rather than swallow whole the King James Version or the nonsense fed to you by those you regard religous authorities you’d actually manage to come closer to an understanding who Jesus was?

Oh, and I do admire the authoritian manner in which you true believers ORDER others to think. "Stop violate the Law of God!” Again, whose version? Rome’s? Jehovah’s Witnesses? Plymouth Brethren? Gnostics? Salvation Army? John Shelby Spongs? (look that one up petal)

 

[Karl Rand]

well, yeah.... You see, I can rip on the Catholics because I was born, baptised and confirmed Catholic and went to Catholic Schools for 12 years.

A few bad nuns and priests is the excuse you offer for why you have turned yourself into a mean, clueless mirror image of those priests and nuns you despised?

As someone who attended both public and Catholic schools during my twelve years...they aren't that different. One taught religion and paused class whenever an ambulance happened by for a moment of prayer. The other didn't. Also, if there were any priests and nuns with homosexual leanings, they certainly were not as obvious as those few (and fine) teachers I came across in the public school system. I had a bad teacher in the Catholic school system--and I also had one in the public school system.

Sorry, the statistics from the Australian Inquiry into child sex abuse contradict your assertion.
Mind you, having spent 11 years of my childhood in the heart of the beast at a catholic cathedral as a pipe organ pupil my perspective may have been warped by reality.

 

[Meriweather]

Sorry, the statistics from the Australian Inquiry into child sex abuse contradict your assertion.
Mind you, having spent 11 years of my childhood in the heart of the beast at a catholic cathedral as a pipe organ pupil my perspective may have been warped by reality.

Possibly. It behooves us all to keep in mind our own reality is not the reality of all. It is certainly not the reality Jesus--or the Apostles--were teaching.

 

[Karl Rand]

Sorry, the statistics from the Australian Inquiry into child sex abuse contradict your assertion.
Mind you, having spent 11 years of my childhood in the heart of the beast at a catholic cathedral as a pipe organ pupil my perspective may have been warped by reality.

Possibly. It behooves us all to keep in mind our own reality is not the reality of all. It is certainly not the reality Jesus--or the Apostles--were teaching.

Can I suggest we do not have sufficient evidence to know with any certainty exactly what Jesus was teaching? As to the apostles, if you imagine anything like the King James Version gives an accurate picture of what the apostles taught, you're lost in the fog of centuries.
To start with we need to ask ourselves what does the term ‘apostle’ actually mean.

 

[Meriweather]

Can I suggest we do not have sufficient evidence to know with any certainty exactly what Jesus was teaching?

I think we have more than sufficient evidence. His teachings weren't exactly novel or unusual. He taught basics, based on God's love and mercy. Most can be found in the Old Testament, or were based on Old Testament teachings.

 

[Meriweather]

As to the apostles, if you imagine anything like the King James Version gives an accurate picture of what the apostles taught, you're lost in the fog of centuries.

Don't be silly. The majority of Christians are not attached to the King James Version. Never read it myself, although I can usually identify when it is being quoted.

 

[Meriweather]

To start with we need to ask ourselves what does the term ‘apostle’ actually mean.

Catholic childhood education taught that Apostle means one who is sent forth with a mission in mind. For Christ's apostles, it meant spreading the Good News of Repentance for the forgiveness of sins. In other words, turning towards God/obedience to God and away from sin results in forgiveness.

 

[JoeB131]

Joe, how many years have you been out of the Catholic schools? I figure it must be around FORTY YEARS now. Forty years. How many years has it been since your mother has died? For real, this is a long time to be carrying around so much bitterness and anger. This is not any kind of rational problem you have with Christianity. It's personal animus--as you have said, HATRED. You know that does no damage to Christianity, or very little. It eats up at you, though.

Like I said, the same people are still engaged in the same asshattery. They deserve all the score I'll inflict on them. I know that I won't see the happy day when kids point at empty churches and ask what that building was for... but some day humanity will reach that happy place.

Were you brainwashed? Tell us how the people you still know personally and have a close relationship portray this brainwashing.

Actually, what I've found is that people who grew up Catholic generally take it with a grain of salt. The real nutters are the people who coverted to Catholicism from something else if you want to see the real High Octane Crazy...

I generally try to keep religious nuts out of my life, and most people know better than to try to discuss religion with me.

The first five books of the Bible (known as the Torah) were written by Moses - an adopted son of the king of Egypt - in approximately 1400 B.C.. These five books focus on the beginning of the nation of Israel; b

Guy, Moses did not write the Torah. They were written much later than that, with the last book, Leviticus, probably being added later, around the time of the Babylonian Captivity. This is why they contain so many contradictions on issues like divorce and whether you can marry your dead brother's widow. (Henry VIII had a lot of fun with that one.).

 

[Meriweather]

Actually, what I've found is that people who grew up Catholic generally take it with a grain of salt. The real nutters are the people who coverted to Catholicism

Wrong again. My dad was a convert to the Catholic faith, and less like a nut than anyone else on the planet. Joe, most practicing Catholics are simply people of simple faith who value the grace of God. In some way, God has touched their life, and it is something they hold onto and treasure.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Actually, what I've found is that people who grew up Catholic generally take it with a grain of salt. The real nutters are the people who coverted to Catholicism

Wrong again. My dad was a convert to the Catholic faith, and less like a nut than anyone else on the planet. Joe, most practicing Catholics are simply people of simple faith who value the grace of God. In some way, God has touched their life, and it is something they hold onto and treasure.

Great. They should just keep it to themselves.

 

[JoeB131]

A few bad nuns and priests is the excuse you offer for why you have turned yourself into a mean, clueless mirror image of those priests and nuns you despised?

Not at all. I've never molested an altar boy... slaughtered a heretic, collaborated with a Nazi, burned a witch ( I did fuck one for about a month), or started a crusade.

And they were all bad. This is what happens when you make your clergy a dumping ground for your sexual deviants.

As someone who attended both public and Catholic schools during my twelve years...they aren't that different. One taught religion and paused class whenever an ambulance happened by for a moment of prayer.

Wow... That was a useless activity.

Also, if there were any priests and nuns with homosexual leanings, they certainly were not as obvious as those few (and fine) teachers I came across in the public school system. I had a bad teacher in the Catholic school system--and I also had one in the public school system.

Well, no, all the Catholic Clergy were queer. The minute Little Timmy started singing show tunes, they carted his ass off to the seminary. This is why they are paying off so much money now, because when Little Timmy grew up to be Father Timothy, he was still the same 14 year old confused gay kid who didn't know nothing.

 

[ding]

Joe, how many years have you been out of the Catholic schools? I figure it must be around FORTY YEARS now. Forty years. How many years has it been since your mother has died? For real, this is a long time to be carrying around so much bitterness and anger. This is not any kind of rational problem you have with Christianity. It's personal animus--as you have said, HATRED. You know that does no damage to Christianity, or very little. It eats up at you, though.

Like I said, the same people are still engaged in the same asshattery. They deserve all the score I'll inflict on them. I know that I won't see the happy day when kids point at empty churches and ask what that building was for... but some day humanity will reach that happy place.

Were you brainwashed? Tell us how the people you still know personally and have a close relationship portray this brainwashing.

Actually, what I've found is that people who grew up Catholic generally take it with a grain of salt. The real nutters are the people who coverted to Catholicism from something else if you want to see the real High Octane Crazy...

I generally try to keep religious nuts out of my life, and most people know better than to try to discuss religion with me.

The first five books of the Bible (known as the Torah) were written by Moses - an adopted son of the king of Egypt - in approximately 1400 B.C.. These five books focus on the beginning of the nation of Israel; b

Guy, Moses did not write the Torah. They were written much later than that, with the last book, Leviticus, probably being added later, around the time of the Babylonian Captivity. This is why they contain so many contradictions on issues like divorce and whether you can marry your dead brother's widow. (Henry VIII had a lot of fun with that one.).

Moses did not write the first 11 chapters of Genesis. He recorded the first 11 chapters of Genesis.

 

[Meriweather]

Great. They should just keep it to themselves.

Have you considered that by coming into a religion forum you are not exactly giving us the opportunity to keep it to ourselves? We are not coming to you--you are coming here to us.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Have you considered that by coming into a religion forum you are not exactly giving us the opportunity to keep it to ourselves?

I'm not really referring to discussing it in discussion forums. Just to clarify.

 

[JoeB131]

Moses did not write the first 11 chapters of Genesis. He recorded the first 11 chapters of Genesis.

Moses didn't write anything, he never existed.

 

[Meriweather]

And they were all bad.

I am sorry you had such a horrible life, peopled with such horrors. My experience was much different.

 

[ding]

Moses did not write the first 11 chapters of Genesis. He recorded the first 11 chapters of Genesis.

Moses didn't write anything, he never existed.

The first five books of the Bible (known as the Torah) were written by Moses - an adopted son of the king of Egypt - in approximately 1400 B.C.. These five books focus on the beginning of the nation of Israel; but the first 11 chapters of the Torah records the history that all nations have in common. These allegorical accounts of the history of the world had been passed down from generation to generation orally for thousands of years. Moses did not write the first 11 chapters of the Bible. Moses was the first Hebrew to record them.


Approximately 1500 years before Moses recorded the allegorical accounts of the history of the world. The Chinese recorded this history as symbols in the Chinese language. They drew pictures to express words or ideas. Simple pictures were combined to make more complex thoughts. They used well known history and common everyday things to make a word so people could easily remember it. The account of Genesis found it's way into the Chinese written language because the Chinese had migrated from the cradle of civilization. Prior to this migration they all shared a common history and religion.


The Bible even explains how it was possible for the Chinese to record the account of Genesis 1500 years before Moses recorded it. The account of the Tower of Babel was the allegorical account of the great migration from Mesopotamia. This also explains why all ancient cultures have an account of a great flood. Because they all shared a common history and religion before the great migration from the cradle of civilization.


So if we start from the belief that the first eleven chapters of the Torah are an allegorical account of world history before the great migration from Mesopotamia - which was an actual historical event - then the first eleven chapters of the Torah takes on new meaning. Seen in this light these accounts should be viewed less like fairy tales and more like how important information was passed down in ancient times. Just as the Chinese used well known history and everyday things as symbols in their written language to make words easier to remember, ancient man used stories to pass down historical events and important knowledge to future generations. Interspersed in these allegorical accounts of history are wisdoms that they deemed important enough to pass down and remember. Such as man knows right from wrong and when he violates it, rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong he rationalizes he didn't do wrong. Most people don't even realize this wisdom is in the Torah because they read it critically instead of searching for the wisdom that ancient man knew and found important enough to include in his account of world history.


We have to keep in mind that these accounts are 6,000 years old and were passed down orally from one generation to the next for thousands of years. Surely ancient man believed these accounts were of the utmost importance otherwise they would not have been passed down for thousands of years before they were recorded in writing. We shouldn't view these accounts using the context of the modern world. Unfortunately, we are so far removed from these events that we have lost all original meaning. If you were to ask almost any Jew what the Tower of Babel was about he would have no clue that it was the allegorical account of the great migration from the cradle of civilization. That is not intended to be a criticism. It is intended to be an illustration of just how difficult a task it is to discover the original meaning from ancient accounts from 6,000 years ago. We read these texts like they were written yesterday looking for ways to discredit them and make ourselves feel superior rather than seeking the original meaning and wisdom. Shame on you, Joey.

 

[JoeB131]

Wrong again. My dad was a convert to the Catholic faith, and less like a nut than anyone else on the planet. Joe, most practicing Catholics are simply people of simple faith who value the grace of God. In some way, God has touched their life, and it is something they hold onto and treasure.

Reading your posts, I don't think I'll take your word on what constitutes nutty.

Still waiting to hear why God could still be considered good after doing the Jephthah's Daughter Barbecue