Australian Shooting...wow....not covered in American media....

[westwall]

Australia has less murders than the US.

That's the issue you need to address.

New Zealand has more guns than Australia and the same murder rate....explain that....

Of course.

Firstly, NZ has a far higher number (per capita) of farmers, who always keep a gun for putting down a sick cow. Secondly NZ has a far stronger culture of duck and pig hunting than Australia does. This guns are rarely used in crime or violence. The same is true of US guns held on farms.

That is how statistics work - we can easily find a basic trend like less guns = less murders, and then when we look through any 'rogue' figures, there are often very clear, logical explanations.

Wrong. The most commonly used firearm to commit a crime with in New Zealand is a double barreled shotgun. And has been since I lived there in the 1970's.

 

[Saigon]

Rik -

Interesting...good results for the US and Finland. I'm quite happy with those...and a little surprised with the US one. Sometimes the standards of writing on this boards aren't always suggestive of such literacy!

 

[Saigon]

Wrong. The most commonly used firearm to commit a crime with in New Zealand is a double barreled shotgun. And has been since I lived there in the 1970's.

And what weapon do most farmers own?

So what kind of weapons are thus most commonplace in NZ?

When you "lived" there - how many handguns did you saee?

 

[Rikurzhen]

Rik -

Interesting...good results for the US and Finland. I'm quite happy with those...and a little surprised with the US one. Sometimes the standards of writing on this boards aren't always suggestive of such literacy!

Likely because this is what you usually see:

 

[westwall]

Wrong. The most commonly used firearm to commit a crime with in New Zealand is a double barreled shotgun. And has been since I lived there in the 1970's.

And what weapon do most farmers own?

So what kind of weapons are thus most commonplace in NZ?

When you "lived" there - how many handguns did you saee?

I saw lots of handguns, in fact the first CZ-75 I ever handled was on a range in Christchurch. I was a member of several shooting clubs. The shotguns are far more destructive than a handgun so I have no idea what you're trying to say, but it doesn't help your cause. Rifles were far more common than shotguns. I even had a friend who had a C license so he owned machineguns.

 

[Saigon]

Westwall -

You really aren't the sharpest kinfe in the drawer, are you?

There are very, very low levels of machine and handgun owenrship in NZ. You might see some in gun clubs, of course, but not in general. Rifles, sure, particularly amongst gangs like the Mongrel Mob or Black Power.

The point being that although NZ has a relatively high level of gun ownership, most of those weapons are:

a) held rurally by farmers, are safley stored and rarely used in crime (except of occasional domestic violence cases)

b) are not the weapons of choice of gangs and criminals, but are sometimes used because there are few other weapons avaialable in NZ.

This might explain why:

The 1983 Arms Act
The 1983 Arms Act abandoned registration for most long guns, as Parliament felt it was prohibitively expensive and not particularly useful. The philosophy of the new system was to control users, rather than firearms. Police were required to conduct a background check before a licence would be issued (though existing owners would be issued a licence automatically), but once a person had a licence there was no requirement to register long guns or obtain permits to procure when they were sold or lent.

Special restrictions applied to restricted weapons and pistols, which needed to be registered. Self-defence was no longer a valid reason to have a pistol (Although the Crimes Act 1961 states a person can use "reasonable force" to defend ones self and/or property and nowhere in this act states a person cannot use a firearm for such purposes while the arms act does not mention "directly in words" one cannot use a firearm for self-defence) but the new sport of target pistol shooting has become more popular and pistol club shooters can own pistols with a special "B" endorsement.

Gun politics in New Zealand - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

 

[I.P.Freely]

I have a licensed side by side shotgun here in the UK, its more destructive than a large caliber hand gun with hollow points?

 

[Politico]

Australia has less blacks than America.

Really?

Have you ever been to Sydney's Cabrmatta or Melbourne's Richmond?

What would you say the % of non-whites was?

Here, let me type more slowly so that you can comprehend what you read - AUSTRALIA has less blacks than AMERICA.

Of course they do. They have less people.

 

[westwall]

Westwall -

You really aren't the sharpest kinfe in the drawer, are you?

There are very, very low levels of machine and handgun owenrship in NZ. You might see some in gun clubs, of course, but not in general. Rifles, sure, particularly amongst gangs like the Mongrel Mob or Black Power.

The point being that although NZ has a relatively high level of gun ownership, most of those weapons are:

a) held rurally by farmers, are safley stored and rarely used in crime (except of occasional domestic violence cases)

b) are not the weapons of choice of gangs and criminals, but are sometimes used because there are few other weapons avaialable in NZ.

This might explain why:

The 1983 Arms Act
The 1983 Arms Act abandoned registration for most long guns, as Parliament felt it was prohibitively expensive and not particularly useful. The philosophy of the new system was to control users, rather than firearms. Police were required to conduct a background check before a licence would be issued (though existing owners would be issued a licence automatically), but once a person had a licence there was no requirement to register long guns or obtain permits to procure when they were sold or lent.

Special restrictions applied to restricted weapons and pistols, which needed to be registered. Self-defence was no longer a valid reason to have a pistol (Although the Crimes Act 1961 states a person can use "reasonable force" to defend ones self and/or property and nowhere in this act states a person cannot use a firearm for such purposes while the arms act does not mention "directly in words" one cannot use a firearm for self-defence) but the new sport of target pistol shooting has become more popular and pistol club shooters can own pistols with a special "B" endorsement.

Gun politics in New Zealand - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Oh goody the supposedly Finnish "journalist" resorts to wiki for his argument. Just for the record there sport, wiki is as reliable as your knowledge of Finnish geography. Now, to your argument, the population of New Zealand is 4.5 millionish, it is primarily Caucasian. Considering how many firearms are in New Zealand, and the very small number of actual farmers in New Zealand, your argument that all the guns are on farms in the country is simply not borne out by fact.

Eighty six percent of New Zealand's population is located in the main urban areas with Tauranga (Auckland area) representing almost half of the country's total population. Less than 10 percent of New Zealand's population is involved in agriculture.

And, once again....New Zealand has always enjoyed a low crime rate, but, as immigration has increased the violent crime rate has increase.

 

[westwall]

I have a licensed side by side shotgun here in the UK, its more destructive than a large caliber hand gun with hollow points?

Yes, it is. If you shoot someone in the arm with a .357 its wrecked, but there. If you shoot a person in the arm with one shot of high base 6's, the arm is removed. So, which is more powerful?

 

[Saigon]

Westwall -

Firstly, genius, Tauranga is not in the Auckland area. It's a three hour drive away. How could you not know that if you lived there?!

There are five main urban areas, in descending order, Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch, Dunedin and Hamilton.

it is primarily Caucasian

Right.

And yet when we look at the demographics of Auckland, we see 300,000 Asians, 142,000 Maori, 194,000 PIs, and 25,000 Middle Eastern, from a population of 1.4 million. There also large communities from South Africa and a smaller one from South America (primarily Argentina).

Honestly....you post about NZ all the time, but have you ever actually been there?

Because I don't think you have ever posted anything to suggest you have been.


btw. Yes, I am a journalist, and yes I am in Finland. I don't mind proving either.

 

[2aguy]

From what you post you must not be a very good journalist...

 

[westwall]

Westwall -

Firstly, genius, Tauranga is not in the Auckland area. It's a three hour drive away. How could you not know that if you lived there?!

There are five main urban areas, in descending order, Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch, Dunedin and Hamilton.

it is primarily Caucasian

Right.

And yet when we look at the demographics of Auckland, we see 300,000 Asians, 142,000 Maori, 194,000 PIs, and 25,000 Middle Eastern, from a population of 1.4 million. There also large communities from South Africa and a smaller one from South America (primarily Argentina).

Honestly....you post about NZ all the time, but have you ever actually been there?

Because I don't think you have ever posted anything to suggest you have been.


btw. Yes, I am a journalist, and yes I am in Finland. I don't mind proving either.

Tauranga is the largest town in the Bay of Plenty region and is growing at the highest rate in New Zealand and yes it is around two hours south of Auckland on the way to Rotorua.

Westwall -

Firstly, genius, Tauranga is not in the Auckland area. It's a three hour drive away. How could you not know that if you lived there?!

There are five main urban areas, in descending order, Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch, Dunedin and Hamilton.

it is primarily Caucasian

Right.

And yet when we look at the demographics of Auckland, we see 300,000 Asians, 142,000 Maori, 194,000 PIs, and 25,000 Middle Eastern, from a population of 1.4 million. There also large communities from South Africa and a smaller one from South America (primarily Argentina).

Honestly....you post about NZ all the time, but have you ever actually been there?

Because I don't think you have ever posted anything to suggest you have been.


btw. Yes, I am a journalist, and yes I am in Finland. I don't mind proving either.

Tauranga is a 2 hour drive at most. It is the southern end of the urban area centered on Auckland and extending north up to Whangerei. Half of New Zealand's population is in that area. You still haven't addressed the fact that less than 10 percent of New Zealand's population is agricultural in nature. Where does that mean the MAJORITY of firearms are in New Zealand? Hmmm?

As far as your claim to be a journalist, yes, I can see that. Your posts are as factually lacking as most journalists these days. Long on opinion and emotion, but vanishingly short on fact as demonstrated by your complete lack of knowledge of the geography of a country you claim to live in.

And yes, I lived in New Zealand for two years. Mainly south island. You're a journalist. Look up "Half Foot Simpson". He was one of my friends.


And yes, 76% of the population is Caucasian...I would classify that as "mainly"....wouldn't you, genius?

 

[Saigon]

Westwall -

Tauranga is a 2 hour drive at most. It is the southern end of the urban area centered on Auckland and extending north up to Whangerei.

That is utter, utter nonsense.

There is miles of open countryside, forest and farming between Auckland and Tauranga, and yes it is a three hour drive. Check the Kaimai Ranges and the Hauraki Plains, for instance.

You just can't get this stuff off google, you know. You'd do much better being honest.

btw. I have never made a mistake about geography on this board, not about Finland's; not about any other country. You have just made 3 in 3 posts. In future I suggest you stay in topic, post honestly, and try to maintain a little dignity.

 

[Saigon]

This is, apprently, an urban centre:

 

[2aguy]

Actually Saigon....this is an urban center in New Zealand...

 

[Saigon]

Billc -

Yes, that is downtown Auckland, and the picture was taken from Devonport, I'd say, although possibly from the onramp to the harbour bridge closer to Takapuna. Would you like me to have a crack at naming the buildings?

btw, I'm a good journalist that I only post about places that I have been to and know at least something about. You and Westwall should try that sometime.

 

[2aguy]

Saigon, I apologize for attacking you personally, it was wrong and I am sorry, I deleted the last bit about you....in the last post. You are a good guy, we differ in opinions...and I allowed my bad side to get the better of me...I am sorry....

It is good to discuss these things with you and the others...it helps me find information so thank you for that....

 

[westwall]

Westwall -

Tauranga is a 2 hour drive at most. It is the southern end of the urban area centered on Auckland and extending north up to Whangerei.

That is utter, utter nonsense.

There is miles of open countryside, forest and farming between Auckland and Tauranga, and yes it is a three hour drive. Check the Kaimai Ranges and the Hauraki Plains, for instance.

You just can't get this stuff off google, you know. You'd do much better being honest.

btw. I have never made a mistake about geography on this board, not about Finland's; not about any other country. You have just made 3 in 3 posts. In future I suggest you stay in topic, post honestly, and try to maintain a little dignity.

Yes, you have. You didn't know that Norway directly abutted Russia. Something that ANY Finnish native would know, and something that I would have expected a "journalist" to likewise know.

The distance is around 120 miles from Auckland to Tauranga. And yes, there are small holdings around, but the greater area is THE population center of the country. There are empty spots in New York City as well. Who would of thunk it.

As far as honesty go's your posting history is replete with half truths and outright lies, and as far as dignity go's mr. arrogant twit, you have a whole lot to learn about that.

 

[westwall]

This is, apprently, an urban centre:

What's on the other side of that hill?

If you want to see a rural/urban area plug in
101 Cameron Town Rd

Pukekohe, Auckland

Into your google maps to see what the area looks like.

Then go to google maps and see how far Pukekohe is from Auckland.