Colorado puts 25% tax on marijuana

[theDoctorisIn]

I guess we must be idiots.
What part of "if you add 25% to the price of something you make it radically more expensive than the untaxed item" do you not understand?

so what is the going price in Colorado for an Oz Rabbi?...

I have no idea. Maybe you know.

That you have no idea what you're talking about has been pretty clear this entire thread.

 

[TooTall]

Annual deficit? What annual deficit? Won't be long before the other states follow suit, like they did with casinos and the lottery. Fed is going to have to soon too, because the rich would rather have stoners pay off the national debt.

Colorado voters approve 25 percent taxes on recreational marijuana

wrong. marijuana will just go underground as it was before.
Overtaxing results in the same activity as ban does - the contraband will flourish.

Especially since they are trying to turn pot from an illegal product into a legal product. The distribution lines for illegal sales are already well entrenched and established. It is the legal outlet trying to make a dent in illegal sales.

What is the penalty for having illegal and untaxed marijuana? Will there be federal stickers on pot sales like there are in cigarette sales? It is idiocy to think that people will pay more, significantly more, for pot just to get it legal when they've been getting it illegally for years.

If the legalization of marijuana went nationwide, the feds could do to the underground marketeers what they did to the moonshiners during prohibition. I don't think the individual states have the funds to hunt them down. Of course, the term 'jack booted thugs' comes to mind.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Try $50, not $250 - at least that's what all the ads I see say.

My prescription is from my GP, though. It's pretty silly to act like you somehow speak for "legitimate doctors".

There are two "clinics" in the same block on Wilshire. They both have staff "doctors" who will, for $250.00 provide a patient with a letter of prescription so they can treat their shoe blisters with marijuana therapy.

I'm familiar with the "clinics" you're referring to. Around here they're $50.

most in OC are 40.00-50.00 dollars for a year...Katz is talking about the Drs fee to see him....then you get the card included in his fee....if your doc gets the perscription then you just have to pay the fee for the card.....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Disagree. I know the cannabis market first hand in California and can tell you that the legal market is priced HIGHER than the underground market. The reason people paid a bit more was due to the quality and selection of product that dispensaries offered. People also joined dispensaries in an effort to support legalization. However, many, many people that don't have the financial resources (or that don't want to end up on the Fed's radar) continue to buy in the black market.

A 25% tax will only ensure the underground market thrives. That's for sure.



Strongly disagree. I suspect they will collect less revenue than they would with a normal sales tax rate. And even if they do collect more in revenue, they'll also pay more in policing and incarceration because I guarantee you the underground market will increase with a onerous tax.



Because we don't need a national sales tax on cannabis or anything for that matter. We need to spend less money and live within our means.

I am a medical cannabis user living in San Francisco.

My very high-end legal weed is cheaper than any black market weed I've ever purchased in my life.

Where are you getting your information from?

Then you were getting ripped off. Sucks to be you I guess.

how is he getting ripped off if he is getting better stuff cheaper?...

 

[eflatminor]

It's easy to grow shitty weed. It's hard to grow good weed.



Wait.. I thought you just said you didn't need any "equipment" other than soil, water and sun.

Bullshit. The THC content is in the seeds, not in how you grow it. Using hydroponics can result in faster time to flowering and more flowers per plant, but NOT "good weed". That comes from the genetics of the seeds and how you cure it once harvested.

And you don't need equipment to grow it, as everyone knows. The equipment allows for more growing cycles in a given time period. With mother nature, you get one cycle per year.

What you don't know about this subject is a lot.

The THC content is not just dependent on the seeds, its also dependent on preventing your females from being pollenated.

Well duh! Every grower knows to remove the males before they flower. Inside or outside, makes no difference. This has nothing to do with the quality of the product, which comes form the genetics of the seed and the curing process. Hydroponics offers more efficiency in growing, not better quality.

Again, you appear quite ignorant about the subject, but please blather on...

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Bullshit. The THC content is in the seeds, not in how you grow it. Using hydroponics can result in faster time to flowering and more flowers per plant, but NOT "good weed". That comes from the genetics of the seeds and how you cure it once harvested.

And you don't need equipment to grow it, as everyone knows. The equipment allows for more growing cycles in a given time period. With mother nature, you get one cycle per year.

What you don't know about this subject is a lot.

The THC content is not just dependent on the seeds, its also dependent on preventing your females from being pollenated.

Well duh! Every grower knows to remove the males before they flower. Inside or outside, makes no difference. This has nothing to do with the quality of the product, which comes form the genetics of the seed and the curing process. Hydroponics offers more efficiency in growing, not better quality.

Again, you appear quite ignorant about the subject, but please blather on...

It has a lot to do with the quality of the product - pollinated weed, full of seeds, is much "lower quality" than sinsemilla.

Now, I realize that you're getting some sort of ego boost from pretending that you're an "expert" and claiming that I don't know what I'm talking about, but you've completely moved the goalposts from the topic of the thread.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

There are two "clinics" in the same block on Wilshire. They both have staff "doctors" who will, for $250.00 provide a patient with a letter of prescription so they can treat their shoe blisters with marijuana therapy.

I'm familiar with the "clinics" you're referring to. Around here they're $50.

most in OC are 40.00-50.00 dollars for a year...Katz is talking about the Drs fee to see him....then you get the card included in his fee....if your doc gets the perscription then you just have to pay the fee for the card.....

You don't even need the card - I don't have one.

I just showed my "prescription" to the clubs when I joined.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Wait and see how it actually turns out. If such a tax turns people from the legal outlets to the old reliable street corner dealer, it won't be such a good idea.

Why would they go back and pay more. It is cheaper and more accessible the legal way.

it'll be cheaper on the "street corner" too. Perhaps even cheaper than at a retail outlet. In fact, I'm going to put my money on it. People will grow and distribute the same as they did when it was illegal but with the added bonus of not having to contend with the criminal charges.

The tax is excessive and will keep the black market aspect firmly intact.

is it still illegal to buy it outside of a sanctioned store?....it is here in Cal....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Before the right wingers started the war on drugs...

Number of cannabis dispensary raids under Bush: 0
Under Obama, hundreds.

From the oh-so-right-wing Huffington Post:

Obama Explains Increasing Medical Marijuana Crackdowns, Raids In 'Rolling Stone' Interview

1. Further, the first law to restricted the distribution and use drugs was the Harrison Narcotics Tax Act of 1914, passed under Woodrow Wilson, a Democrat. That law was put on his desk with both houses of Congress being controlled by fellow Democrats.
   
   
2. Later, in 1935, that "right winger" FDR publicly supported the adoption of the Uniform State Narcotic Drug Act. The New York Times used the headline "ROOSEVELT ASKS NARCOTIC WAR AID."
   
   
3. Then, in 1937, the Marijuana Transfer Tax Act was passed, further escalating the war on drugs. Guess who was President then? Guess which party had a SUPERMAJORITY in both houses???
   
   
4. On October 27, 1970, Congress passes the 'Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act of 1970', a major expansion on the war on drugs. Guess which party had the majority in BOTH houses in 1970?
   
   
5. In 1973, the DEA was established, this time under a different Congress but once again, both houses had a Democrat majority.
   
   
6. Lastly, the 'Anti-Drug Abuse Act of 1988', which established the ONDCP (our first Drug Czar), was passed by Congress who had...wait for it...a Democrat majority in both houses.

Once again, your overwhelming bias, hypocrisy, and propensity to lie has been exposed. But you go with what fits your little agenda...

bullshit.....during Bushs reign there were quit a few out here....

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Before the right wingers started the war on drugs...

Number of cannabis dispensary raids under Bush: 0
Under Obama, hundreds.

From the oh-so-right-wing Huffington Post:

Obama Explains Increasing Medical Marijuana Crackdowns, Raids In 'Rolling Stone' Interview

1. Further, the first law to restricted the distribution and use drugs was the Harrison Narcotics Tax Act of 1914, passed under Woodrow Wilson, a Democrat. That law was put on his desk with both houses of Congress being controlled by fellow Democrats.
   
   
2. Later, in 1935, that "right winger" FDR publicly supported the adoption of the Uniform State Narcotic Drug Act. The New York Times used the headline "ROOSEVELT ASKS NARCOTIC WAR AID."
   
   
3. Then, in 1937, the Marijuana Transfer Tax Act was passed, further escalating the war on drugs. Guess who was President then? Guess which party had a SUPERMAJORITY in both houses???
   
   
4. On October 27, 1970, Congress passes the 'Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act of 1970', a major expansion on the war on drugs. Guess which party had the majority in BOTH houses in 1970?
   
   
5. In 1973, the DEA was established, this time under a different Congress but once again, both houses had a Democrat majority.
   
   
6. Lastly, the 'Anti-Drug Abuse Act of 1988', which established the ONDCP (our first Drug Czar), was passed by Congress who had...wait for it...a Democrat majority in both houses.

Once again, your overwhelming bias, hypocrisy, and propensity to lie has been exposed. But you go with what fits your little agenda...

bullshit.....during Bushs reign there were quit a few out here....

He's actually mostly correct about this.

Obama has been really shitty about cracking down on medical weed, significantly worse than Bush was.

 

[Harry Dresden]

I guess we must be idiots.
What part of "if you add 25% to the price of something you make it radically more expensive than the untaxed item" do you not understand?

so what is the going price in Colorado for an Oz Rabbi?...

I have no idea. Maybe you know.

so then you dont know if that 25% tax will make the illegal stuff seem a better bargain?....

 

[Harry Dresden]

I'm familiar with the "clinics" you're referring to. Around here they're $50.

most in OC are 40.00-50.00 dollars for a year...Katz is talking about the Drs fee to see him....then you get the card included in his fee....if your doc gets the perscription then you just have to pay the fee for the card.....

You don't even need the card - I don't have one.

I just showed my "prescription" to the clubs when I joined.

cards down here.....at least the ones i have talked to told me.....yearly fee....

 

[Trajan]

This is actually a win for everybody.

The smokers still pay far less than when it was illegal, even with the new tax. Their state's budget is strengthened. It's all good news and I don't get why the Feds wouldn't follow suit.

whats the present alcohol tax in Colorado?

and lets face it, like off track betting and other forms of gambling, when the state can't or won't enforce something, if they can find a way to make money, all of sudden its not such a morally corrupting or risky behavior anymore

 

[Uncensored2008]

The reason people paid a bit more was due to the quality and selection of product that dispensaries offered.

so whats a "bit" more?....if i knew i could by some good quality pot for 20-30 dollars more an Oz...i would do it....

There has never been a legal market in California. The dispensaries are at best grey market. Pot is illegal - period. That a loophole allows a fraud to be perpetrated doesn't alter the fact that pot is contraband. It is priced like contraband.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Number of cannabis dispensary raids under Bush: 0
Under Obama, hundreds.

From the oh-so-right-wing Huffington Post:

Obama Explains Increasing Medical Marijuana Crackdowns, Raids In 'Rolling Stone' Interview

1. Further, the first law to restricted the distribution and use drugs was the Harrison Narcotics Tax Act of 1914, passed under Woodrow Wilson, a Democrat. That law was put on his desk with both houses of Congress being controlled by fellow Democrats.
   
   
2. Later, in 1935, that "right winger" FDR publicly supported the adoption of the Uniform State Narcotic Drug Act. The New York Times used the headline "ROOSEVELT ASKS NARCOTIC WAR AID."
   
   
3. Then, in 1937, the Marijuana Transfer Tax Act was passed, further escalating the war on drugs. Guess who was President then? Guess which party had a SUPERMAJORITY in both houses???
   
   
4. On October 27, 1970, Congress passes the 'Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act of 1970', a major expansion on the war on drugs. Guess which party had the majority in BOTH houses in 1970?
   
   
5. In 1973, the DEA was established, this time under a different Congress but once again, both houses had a Democrat majority.
   
   
6. Lastly, the 'Anti-Drug Abuse Act of 1988', which established the ONDCP (our first Drug Czar), was passed by Congress who had...wait for it...a Democrat majority in both houses.

Once again, your overwhelming bias, hypocrisy, and propensity to lie has been exposed. But you go with what fits your little agenda...

bullshit.....during Bushs reign there were quit a few out here....

He's actually mostly correct about this.

Obama has been really shitty about cracking down on medical weed, significantly worse than Bush was.

maybe....but Bush still fucked with them....Santa Ana had a few raided during his time....Obama is showing what a hypocrite he is by fucking with these things....even Pelosi thinks so....

Pelosi criticizes federal medical pot crackdown - AP News 5/4/2012 8:15 AM

 

[manifold]

I have no idea.

The only honest thing you've ever posted.

 

[Harry Dresden]

The reason people paid a bit more was due to the quality and selection of product that dispensaries offered.

so whats a "bit" more?....if i knew i could by some good quality pot for 20-30 dollars more an Oz...i would do it....

There has never been a legal market in California. The dispensaries are at best grey market. Pot is illegal - period. That a loophole allows a fraud to be perpetrated doesn't alter the fact that pot is contraband. It is priced like contraband.

it might as well be legal here....i can have up to an once and if i caught get my wrist slapped....and a friend of mine has a card and was coming home from buying it.....was pulled over by the CHP for no brake lights and the Cop saw his bag on the floor....was asked about it....the guy showed him his card and the cop made sure he had what he said he had and that was that.....fix it ticket....and he was on his way....and if you think its priced like Contraband then its pretty reasonable contraband....the prices and quality are sure as hell better than when i was actively buying back in the 70's....

 

[TakeAStepBack]

I honestly lol'd at a some of the truly ignorant comments posted in this thread.

Apparently some retards believe that the cost structure and required returns of black market distribution channels are exactly the same as legal channels and that the only difference in cost is the 25% tax rate.

just. fucking. wow!

Fuckin' wow is right.

Who thinks that? The point is that in order to compete, black markets will have to lower their prices. Which isn't going to be that difficult considering it's now legal to have it and to grow it. There is going to be so much effort put into the regulation of the state over the counter version that enforcement of the dude ove rthe hill with a few pound harvest isn't going to need to look over his shoulder.

The cost structure will be affected by the legal market. And also the fact people can now grow their own.

Why would the "dude on the hill" sell his crop on the "black market" if the prices are lower than what he'd get for selling it to a legal dispensary?

Because it will in the end be more than paying the set up and tax fees. Not only that. Oh, nevermind. I;ve said enough already.

Good talk, folks.



We'll certainly revisit in a year and see where we are with it.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Fuckin' wow is right.

Who thinks that? The point is that in order to compete, black markets will have to lower their prices. Which isn't going to be that difficult considering it's now legal to have it and to grow it. There is going to be so much effort put into the regulation of the state over the counter version that enforcement of the dude ove rthe hill with a few pound harvest isn't going to need to look over his shoulder.

The cost structure will be affected by the legal market. And also the fact people can now grow their own.

Why would the "dude on the hill" sell his crop on the "black market" if the prices are lower than what he'd get for selling it to a legal dispensary?

Because it will in the end be more than paying the set up and tax fees. Not only that. Oh, nevermind. I;ve said enough already.

Good talk, folks.



We'll certainly revisit in a year and see where we are with it.

Sounds good. I'm interested in how it'll all turn out.

 

[alan1]

It is "idiocy" to think that taxed, legal weed will be more expensive than illegal, black market weed.

of course it will be more expensive.
otherwise black market does not have any reason to exist - what is it going to propose to the consumer which he already does not have?

Is taxed, legal alcohol more expensive than black market alcohol (which is untaxed?).

Do we see any bootleggers these days?

Yes.