Communist California to require Solar Panels on all new homes

[Redfish]

As you know, many Progressives erroneously consider tax deductions, available to any business, a subsidy, which it is not

PSST, let me clue you in - your conservatives pals here have spent many many posts arguing that the tax deductions I got for my solar system were SUBSIDIES and THATS why they were not self-financing like other tax-cuts.

I hope someone else other than you does your taxes. Because you are clueless.

Non-response as expected.

You really don't get it now do you................I think you finally admitted it's Subsidy. aka it's TAX CREDIT on TAXES..............

Big difference than a deduction..............LOL

I've ALWAYS counted it as a subsidy, LIKE ANY OTHER TAX-CUTS that someone has to pay for at some point.

Conservatives are the ones that keep making arguments of convinience because of all the tax-cut bullshit you've gotten used to eating up. I'm simply pointing out the contraditions.

getting the rest of us to pay the major cost of your solar system is a subsidy, giving all of us a tax cut benefits all of us, not just you.

you are amazingly stupid.

and, no, someone does not have to pay for a tax cut, government spending must be cut at the same time. The government gets plenty of revenue, the problem is that it spends too much.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

All that "free" energy, Californians should be paying less than the national average, not 40% more.

We will.

When?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The cost of electricity in Germany has become so high that many people are forced to do without. Electricity has become a luxury to many.

The average cost of electricity in the US is half that of Germany. Germany is unable to sustain these costs and are returning more and more to the use of coal.

Germany Renewable Energy Program Drives Up Costs
Germany comes in as a close second, with electricity prices of $0.19 per kilowatt hour. Due to this, it has been reported that the country has developed a program for increasing the contribution of electricity sourced from renewable sources to upwards of 80% by the calendar year 2050. During the first quarter of 2014, the country produced a record-setting 27% of its electricity via renewable sources, a result of both favorable weather and an increased capacity to utilize renewable energy within the country.

There are ramifications involved in Germany’s contemporary renewable energy program, including an instable electric grid, the burden being placed upon German households by increased costs for electricity, and the need for secure back-up power that is affordable and reliable. Currently, utility companies within the country are receiving payments from the grid as a measure of stabilizing a network that has been disrupted due to surges and falls in contributions from solar and wind power sources. Coal is being utilized in a heftier manner in order to back-up the renewable technologies (and their intermittent nature) while delivering a reliable base load of power, although at the risk of increasing emissions of carbon dioxide. The result has been German residents having to pay feed-in-tariffs in addition to high utility costs as a measure of subsidizing the renewable energy technologies.

Cost Of Electricity By Country

Lol 19 cents is what electricity costs in NY, USA currently (with a nuclear plant shutting down due to age soon this price is should be going up up up.)

Do you know how much a KWh your solar panels output costs you? ZERO.

LOL

The grid or offgrid system don't cost anything..........Oh........I'm sorry you got tax payers to buy it for you.

Cost of system......power produced over lifespan.........determines the actual cost per kwh.........which is NOT FREE.

You didn't get the point - 19 kWh is maybe what it costs to buy off the grid but with those with solar production only a fraction of electricity comes form the grid.

I pay less than 12 cents.................And if other people weren't paying for your system..........the cost of over the lifetime of your grid would cost more than the 19 you posted.

You pay 12c...oook and? how does that help ares with more expesive electricity? Does it help people in NY that will pay 20 or Hawaii that pay 30?

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people" (since when is me paying less taxes equates to OTHER PEOPLE?) pay for all kinds of things starting with expenses of making the grid black-out proof that solar energy realy helps with.

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people"

You never did say how much your bill used to be, how much it is now.......

 

[martybegan]

No more free choice. They decide, you kneel.

Fortune: California to Require Solar Panels for All New Homes

What they forget to mention is that is also requires the switchgear and monitoring gear to make sure the power coming into your house and the power generated by the panels play nice with each other.

With housing prices as crazy as they already are in california, adding another 25-30k to the cost (and another maintenance item) seems like shooting yourself in the foot.

How many fly-by-night crooks will install solar for fat fees, sell worthless "warranties", and vanish in a few years?

As long as the federal and State $$ flow, there will be people taking advantage of it.

 

[Billo_Really]

No, but we'll make a hell of a lot of money for the city.

Goddammit! In the words of Johnny Carson, may solar panels be installed on your entire block, except for your house.

 

[Billo_Really]

Yeah, we can all see how well that plan is working for Germany and the rest of Europe.

We have a better economy than Germany and the rest of Europe.

An Obama economy!

 

[eagle1462010]

The cost of electricity in Germany has become so high that many people are forced to do without. Electricity has become a luxury to many.

The average cost of electricity in the US is half that of Germany. Germany is unable to sustain these costs and are returning more and more to the use of coal.

Germany Renewable Energy Program Drives Up Costs
Germany comes in as a close second, with electricity prices of $0.19 per kilowatt hour. Due to this, it has been reported that the country has developed a program for increasing the contribution of electricity sourced from renewable sources to upwards of 80% by the calendar year 2050. During the first quarter of 2014, the country produced a record-setting 27% of its electricity via renewable sources, a result of both favorable weather and an increased capacity to utilize renewable energy within the country.

There are ramifications involved in Germany’s contemporary renewable energy program, including an instable electric grid, the burden being placed upon German households by increased costs for electricity, and the need for secure back-up power that is affordable and reliable. Currently, utility companies within the country are receiving payments from the grid as a measure of stabilizing a network that has been disrupted due to surges and falls in contributions from solar and wind power sources. Coal is being utilized in a heftier manner in order to back-up the renewable technologies (and their intermittent nature) while delivering a reliable base load of power, although at the risk of increasing emissions of carbon dioxide. The result has been German residents having to pay feed-in-tariffs in addition to high utility costs as a measure of subsidizing the renewable energy technologies.

Cost Of Electricity By Country

Lol 19 cents is what electricity costs in NY, USA currently (with a nuclear plant shutting down due to age soon this price is should be going up up up.)

Do you know how much a KWh your solar panels output costs you? ZERO.

LOL

The grid or offgrid system don't cost anything..........Oh........I'm sorry you got tax payers to buy it for you.

Cost of system......power produced over lifespan.........determines the actual cost per kwh.........which is NOT FREE.

You didn't get the point - 19 kWh is maybe what it costs to buy off the grid but with those with solar production only a fraction of electricity comes form the grid.

I pay less than 12 cents.................And if other people weren't paying for your system..........the cost of over the lifetime of your grid would cost more than the 19 you posted.

You pay 12c...oook and? how does that help ares with more expesive electricity? Does it help people in NY that will pay 20 or Hawaii that pay 30?

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people" (since when is me paying less taxes equates to OTHER PEOPLE?) pay for all kinds of things starting with expenses of making the grid black-out proof that solar energy realy helps with.

We are not California..............who drive up costs due to their own stupidity........You want some help for areas paying more for electricity........Stop listening to people like Al Gore and believing it's your duty to safe the planet. Use fossil fuels and stop being anti business. There you go.

 

[Billo_Really]

cutting taxes is greed? are you insane?

Cutting taxes on the rich, because you were paid to cut taxes on the rich, is most definitely greedy.

 

[Dschrute3]

Always by way of Government force. It's what Communists are about. I just don't get why so many continue to vote Democrat. Is it mostly just about the promised Government Freebies? I mean, the Democratic Party threw American Citizens overboard years ago. The Party's only about placating foreign interests now.

 

[Billo_Really]

When?

Soon.

 

[Flopper]

It's done because the Solar industry can't stand on it's own because of the prices. While prices are coming down they are still not cost effective. In California the rates are much higher than my State........because we use EVIL FOSSIL FUELS.

Fossil fuels are subsidized as well, I guess that means that industry can't stand on it's own. :rolleys:

You show me any energy source and I'll show you a history of subsidies.

Big money is spent on preventing blackouts and solar power production is IDEALY suited to help the system in that aspect because the power production shoots up with AC energy demand.

Fossil fuels are subsidized as well

Liar.

A new report shows that the US government provided about $6 billion annually in financial support to the oil, gas, and coal industries between 2013 and 2015. That's over four times the amount that went to clean energy, which received $1.3 billion.

Oil, gas, and coal industries get a shocking amount of funding from the US government, a new report shows

Thanks for the link.
Shockingly, they didn't give any specifics.
Try again?

Yes they did in supporting links.

Here is a tiny exmaple:

In Ohio, Marathon Petroleum is benefitting from a 15-year tax credit for retaining 1,650 jobs and a 10-year tax credit for creating 100 new jobs. The subsidy is worth $78.5m, according to the Good Jobs First database. “I think Marathon always wanted to be here,” Republican governor John Kasich said in 2011. “All we’re doing is helping them.” In 2011, Kasich was named as the top recipient of oil and gas donations in Ohio, having received $213, 519. The same year Kasich appointed Marathon Petroleum’s CEO to the board of Jobs Ohio, a semi-private group “in charge of the economic growth in the state of Ohio”.

Government paying employers to hire people through tax incentives is becoming a means for keeping people employed. In 25 years, 47% of the jobs in America will be gone, blue and white collar jobs, high skilled and low skilled. The primary reason is AI, robotics and other technologies. Both government and the public need to be prepared.

 

[AntonToo]

Lol 19 cents is what electricity costs in NY, USA currently (with a nuclear plant shutting down due to age soon this price is should be going up up up.)

Do you know how much a KWh your solar panels output costs you? ZERO.

LOL

The grid or offgrid system don't cost anything..........Oh........I'm sorry you got tax payers to buy it for you.

Cost of system......power produced over lifespan.........determines the actual cost per kwh.........which is NOT FREE.

You didn't get the point - 19 kWh is maybe what it costs to buy off the grid but with those with solar production only a fraction of electricity comes form the grid.

I pay less than 12 cents.................And if other people weren't paying for your system..........the cost of over the lifetime of your grid would cost more than the 19 you posted.

You pay 12c...oook and? how does that help ares with more expesive electricity? Does it help people in NY that will pay 20 or Hawaii that pay 30?

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people" (since when is me paying less taxes equates to OTHER PEOPLE?) pay for all kinds of things starting with expenses of making the grid black-out proof that solar energy realy helps with.

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people"

You never did say how much your bill used to be, how much it is now.......

Yes I did. Unit is expected to produce 10500 kWh a year, which is a bit over 100% of my expected energy consumption.

Other than energy you also pay for base grid charge.

My last bill was $15.

 

[AntonToo]

PSST, let me clue you in - your conservatives pals here have spent many many posts arguing that the tax deductions I got for my solar system were SUBSIDIES and THATS why they were not self-financing like other tax-cuts.

I hope someone else other than you does your taxes. Because you are clueless.

Non-response as expected.

You really don't get it now do you................I think you finally admitted it's Subsidy. aka it's TAX CREDIT on TAXES..............

Big difference than a deduction..............LOL

I've ALWAYS counted it as a subsidy, LIKE ANY OTHER TAX-CUTS that someone has to pay for at some point.

Conservatives are the ones that keep making arguments of convinience because of all the tax-cut bullshit you've gotten used to eating up. I'm simply pointing out the contraditions.

getting the rest of us to pay the major cost of your solar system is a subsidy, giving all of us a tax cut benefits all of us, not just you.

you are amazingly stupid.

and, no, someone does not have to pay for a tax cut, government spending must be cut at the same time. The government gets plenty of revenue, the problem is that it spends too much.

Did you get Trump tax-cut? I didn’t - broke about even....so I guess I’m subsidizing your Trump tax-cut - right?

 

[AntonToo]

Lol 19 cents is what electricity costs in NY, USA currently (with a nuclear plant shutting down due to age soon this price is should be going up up up.)

Do you know how much a KWh your solar panels output costs you? ZERO.

LOL

The grid or offgrid system don't cost anything..........Oh........I'm sorry you got tax payers to buy it for you.

Cost of system......power produced over lifespan.........determines the actual cost per kwh.........which is NOT FREE.

You didn't get the point - 19 kWh is maybe what it costs to buy off the grid but with those with solar production only a fraction of electricity comes form the grid.

I pay less than 12 cents.................And if other people weren't paying for your system..........the cost of over the lifetime of your grid would cost more than the 19 you posted.

You pay 12c...oook and? how does that help ares with more expesive electricity? Does it help people in NY that will pay 20 or Hawaii that pay 30?

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people" (since when is me paying less taxes equates to OTHER PEOPLE?) pay for all kinds of things starting with expenses of making the grid black-out proof that solar energy realy helps with.

We are not California..............who drive up costs due to their own stupidity........You want some help for areas paying more for electricity........Stop listening to people like Al Gore and believing it's your duty to safe the planet. Use fossil fuels and stop being anti business. There you go.

I listened to no one but my bottom line - it was an offer too good to refuse.

 

[Flopper]

A new report shows that the US government provided about $6 billion annually in financial support to the oil, gas, and coal industries between 2013 and 2015. That's over four times the amount that went to clean energy, which received $1.3 billion.

Oil, gas, and coal industries get a shocking amount of funding from the US government, a new report shows

Please share with us the percentage of energy produced by oil, gas and coal during those years and the percentage of "clean" energy. What were the gross sales for both?

Thank you!

Thats a fair point - 6 billion is a smaller % of fossil industry volume than 1.3 billion for clean energy. However clean energy industry young and developing and at this stage the other industries have recieved more subsidies.

Within 50 years, the demand for clean energy will eclipse anything we have ever seen with fossil fuels. Nations that have developed the technologies and skills needed to fight global warming will be the economic leaders of future.

 

[xyz]

If it was communist, you wouldn't have to pay for it.

 

[Flopper]

If the state of California starts losing tax revenue they will find a way to tax it and the cost won’t change. They are going to charge electric cars more for car tags in 2020 because of lost revenue at the gas pump. The greedy government will make sure your cost won’t go down.

I don't see us losing tax revenue.

And you're not likely to. California's growth rate certainly doesn't lead the nation but it's higher than in most states. In fact, it stands at 6.13%, #17 in the nation. With the exception of Texas and Florida, states that have higher growth rates than California have much smaller populations. States with smaller populations, traditional grow at faster rates than larger states.

In job growth rate, California was #6 in the nation with a 295,000 new jobs on top of an increase of 421,000 jobs in 2015.

So no, California is far from losing tax revenue.
The States That Added the Most Jobs Last Year
List of U.S. states and territories by population growth rate - Wikipedia

 

[Norman]

I think their plan is now to actively try drive Californians out of the state so that they will repeat the mistake of voting democrat on some other state.

 

[Flopper]

Sure they will. In that sense, government is like private business. They're just going to find another way to get their money from ya.

Are you guys going to beat Boston? Yes or no?

No, but we'll make a hell of a lot of money for the city.

Looking at the tax burden in Ohio, you don't have much to brag about with Ohio, number 11 in taxes and California number 10.
The 15 US states where taxes take the most out of your paycheck

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

LOL

The grid or offgrid system don't cost anything..........Oh........I'm sorry you got tax payers to buy it for you.

Cost of system......power produced over lifespan.........determines the actual cost per kwh.........which is NOT FREE.

You didn't get the point - 19 kWh is maybe what it costs to buy off the grid but with those with solar production only a fraction of electricity comes form the grid.

I pay less than 12 cents.................And if other people weren't paying for your system..........the cost of over the lifetime of your grid would cost more than the 19 you posted.

You pay 12c...oook and? how does that help ares with more expesive electricity? Does it help people in NY that will pay 20 or Hawaii that pay 30?

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people" (since when is me paying less taxes equates to OTHER PEOPLE?) pay for all kinds of things starting with expenses of making the grid black-out proof that solar energy realy helps with.

I still pay monthly fee for the grid and "other people"

You never did say how much your bill used to be, how much it is now.......

Yes I did. Unit is expected to produce 10500 kWh a year, which is a bit over 100% of my expected energy consumption.

Other than energy you also pay for base grid charge.

My last bill was $15.

Yes I did. Unit is expected to produce 10500 kWh a year, which is a bit over 100% of my expected energy consumption.

No you didn't. You said how much less power you bought.

My last bill was $15.

Thanks. How much were they before you installed solar?