Crimea votes to join Russia.

[Steinlight]

And yet it was rigged and illegal as well.

How is it illegal for an autonomous state to vote to secede from a government that overthrew a duly elected government?

It's not necessarily illegal, but can you take an election/vote seriously when armed thugs are around you?

Saddam Hussein won his elections with 99% of the vote, doesn't make it legitimate.

Fuck you and your neo-con zionist bs. You just can't stand the fact that people so roundly reject the EU, IMF, NATO, and thus by extension American Imperialism.

95% of the vote was in favor of joining Russia, and there was 85% voter turnout. Even a majority of Tatars participated, voting majority in favor of joining Russia.
http://rt.com/news/crimea-vote-join-russia-210/

International observers found not violations of voting laws or voter intimidation.
http://rt.com/news/crimea-vote-join-russia-210/

 

[O.R.I.O.N]

Depends on your point of view really. I say Churchill and Roosevelt provoked a war with Germany. Chamberlain knew better than to get involved in a war that had no affect on him or his country. Hitler wanted peace with England and said that many times.England may have won the war but it lost its entire empire.

Did Churchill and Roosevelt provoke Hitler into invading Poland? I don't think so!

Sent from my BNTV600 using Tapatalk

1. Part of "poland" was Germany's that was stolen from them during the first world war.
2. "poland" was committing mass murder against German civilians in parts of "poland"
He was justified.

 

[Bleipriester]

So if the west would have encouraged the Ukrainians to determine whether they want to "belong" to the west or the east instead of supporting a violent aggression against stability and order, things would have taken a different direction.
At first the west couldn´t wait for the next elections to achieve his goal, probably due his long odds, second he declared not to accept the democratic referendum in the Crimea.

Now we know their definition of democracy, it is not even a cheap phrase but a fraud per se.

 

[rightwinger]

http://rt.com/news/crimea-vote-join-russia-210/

Congratulations to Crimea. I am a fan of the Ukranian Nationalists but I am also a huge fan of secession and independence movements.

I don't understand these Communist and former Communist countries when it comes to fixing a vote. They seem to think that a unanamous vote gives them some credibility. 95.7% vote to join Russsia? How do you get 95.7% of the people to agree on anything? You have to figure 30% of the public has some financial ties to the Ukrainian government and would vote to save their jobs or fortune

Reminds me of the recent vote in N Korea where Kim got 99.9% of the vote with 100% turnout

 

[Bleipriester]

http://rt.com/news/crimea-vote-join-russia-210/

Congratulations to Crimea. I am a fan of the Ukranian Nationalists but I am also a huge fan of secession and independence movements.

I don't understand these Communist and former Communist countries when it comes to fixing a vote. They seem to think that a unanamous vote gives them some credibility. 95.7% vote to join Russsia? How do you get 95.7% of the people to agree on anything? You have to figure 30% of the public has some financial ties to the Ukrainian government and would vote to save their jobs or fortune

Reminds me of the recent vote in N Korea where Kim got 99.9% of the vote with 100% turnout

Given that the Crimea people still feel Russian I don´t wonder. And the need for officials doesn´t decrease.

 

[rightwinger]

http://rt.com/news/crimea-vote-join-russia-210/

Congratulations to Crimea. I am a fan of the Ukranian Nationalists but I am also a huge fan of secession and independence movements.

I don't understand these Communist and former Communist countries when it comes to fixing a vote. They seem to think that a unanamous vote gives them some credibility. 95.7% vote to join Russsia? How do you get 95.7% of the people to agree on anything? You have to figure 30% of the public has some financial ties to the Ukrainian government and would vote to save their jobs or fortune

Reminds me of the recent vote in N Korea where Kim got 99.9% of the vote with 100% turnout

Given that the Crimea people still feel Russian I don´t wonder. And the need for officials doesn´t decrease.

I call bullshit

No way 95.7% of voters would agree. Someone has to have a legitimate interest in maintaining the status quo

Even the American Revolution would have a hard time getting 60% of the people to vote for it

 

[paulitician]

It was rigged because the Russian military was standing around the election booths with guns. If you think it is ok for a foreign military show up in your country and call for an election.....then you are fucking insane.

It's all rigged. The U.S. and Great Britain should have dealt with the illegal coup honestly and fairly. But they didn't do that. They forced Russia's hand instead. They helped create this mess. They were not honest neutral brokers. They were only thinking about what was best for themselves. And now Russia is doing the same. It is what it is.

 

[paulitician]

The joke is I heard it will cost Russia $3B a year to support Crimea.....Putin might be regretting this move even if the US and EU don't hammer his ass with sanctions.

And how much Taxpayer Cash are we gonna give the new illegitimate Government in Kiev? Bet it's a whole bunch. What do you think?

 

[Camp]

It was rigged because the Russian military was standing around the election booths with guns. If you think it is ok for a foreign military show up in your country and call for an election.....then you are fucking insane.

It's all rigged. The U.S. and Great Britain should have dealt with the illegal coup honestly and fairly. But they didn't do that. They forced Russia's hand instead. They helped create this mess. They were not honest neutral brokers. They were only thinking about what was best for themselves. And now Russia is doing the same. It is what it is.

You continuously comment about the illegal government in Kiev and the illegal coup sounding like a good transmitter of Russian disinformation. Whats up with that? Do you not recognize the legally elected parliamentary government of Ukraine that impeached Yanukovich and called for a new election under the constitution of Ukraine? They were specifically enforcing Article 108 Part 3 and Aritcle 111 of their constitution which gave them the duty and responsibility to impeach and set a date for a new election. On what grounds do you claim the parliament acted illegally?

 

[paulitician]

It was rigged because the Russian military was standing around the election booths with guns. If you think it is ok for a foreign military show up in your country and call for an election.....then you are fucking insane.

It's all rigged. The U.S. and Great Britain should have dealt with the illegal coup honestly and fairly. But they didn't do that. They forced Russia's hand instead. They helped create this mess. They were not honest neutral brokers. They were only thinking about what was best for themselves. And now Russia is doing the same. It is what it is.

You continuously comment about the illegal government in Kiev and the illegal coup sounding like a good transmitter of Russian disinformation. Whats up with that? Do you not recognize the legally elected parliamentary government of Ukraine that impeached Yanukovich and called for a new election under the constitution of Ukraine? They were specifically enforcing Article 108 Part 3 and Aritcle 111 of their constitution which gave them the duty and responsibility to impeach and set a date for a new election. On what grounds do you claim the parliament acted illegally?

Doesn't justify our involvement. We have enough problems right here at home. I'm tired of my country and Great Britain meddling all over the World. How many $Billions in Tax Dollars are gonna get flushed on this one? And for what? Greed, and pissing off the Russians? Well, no thanks. Let's get our $Billion back and mind our own damn business.

 

[paulitician]

US to violate own laws by financially aiding Ukraine’s coup-installed Govt

Washington’s decision to provide financial aid to the coup-appointed government of Ukraine goes against the US laws, Russia’s Foreign Ministry said, urging American politicians to think about the consequences of supporting the radicals in Kiev.

Ukraine’s ousted president, Viktor Yanukovich, said on Tuesday that the US plans to loan $1 billion to the country’s new authorities are illegal.

“Indeed, in accordance with the amendments introduced to the 1961 law (Foreign Assistance Act) a few years ago the provision of foreign assistance is prohibited to ‘the government of any country whose duly elected head of government is deposed by military coup or decree.’ The relevant provision is contained in 22 US Code § 8422,” the Russian Foreign Ministry said in a statement.

“Thus, by all criteria the provision of funds to the illegitimate [Kiev] regime, which seized power by force, is unlawful and goes beyond the boundaries of the US legal system,” the statement added.

However, the ministry said it realizes that the American side “would hardly recognize this obvious fact” due to the stance it has already taken in the Ukrainian crisis.

“The US administration will most probably continue to close its eyes on the dominance of the ultranationalist forces in Kiev, which have launched a hunt for dissidents across the country, increasing pressure on the Russian-speaking population and our compatriots, threatening the people in the Crimea with punishment for their desire for self-determination,” the ministry stressed.

Moscow has also urged the decision makers in the US to think hard about the possible consequences of “reckless indulgence of radical Nazi-oriented elements in Ukraine.”

Prohibition of American financial support to governments, which came to power via a coup, “isn’t some esoteric issue” as it has been applied just recently, he stressed.

US Code § 8422 saw the US Congress freezing financial aid to Egypt, following the 2013 military coup, which resulted in the ousting of president, Mohamed Morsi...

Read More:
US to violate own laws by financially aiding Ukraine?s coup-installed govt ? Moscow ? RT News

 

[tinydancer]

For crying out loud Crimea was Russian till Nikita gave the country as a present to the Ukraine in the mid 50's. Demographically it is still a majority of ethnic Russians.

Considering the whack jobs in Kiev who overthrew the duly elected pro Russian President absolutely HATE ethnic Russians and as part of their party platform state plain out that they were going to take away Crimea's autonomy and ban the Russian language and strip certain ethnic Russians of citizenship it is a freaking no brainer how the vote went.

 

[tinydancer]

It was rigged because the Russian military was standing around the election booths with guns. If you think it is ok for a foreign military show up in your country and call for an election.....then you are fucking insane.

It's all rigged. The U.S. and Great Britain should have dealt with the illegal coup honestly and fairly. But they didn't do that. They forced Russia's hand instead. They helped create this mess. They were not honest neutral brokers. They were only thinking about what was best for themselves. And now Russia is doing the same. It is what it is.

You continuously comment about the illegal government in Kiev and the illegal coup sounding like a good transmitter of Russian disinformation. Whats up with that? Do you not recognize the legally elected parliamentary government of Ukraine that impeached Yanukovich and called for a new election under the constitution of Ukraine? They were specifically enforcing Article 108 Part 3 and Aritcle 111 of their constitution which gave them the duty and responsibility to impeach and set a date for a new election. On what grounds do you claim the parliament acted illegally?

Svoboda and Right Sector were the muscle. This was a coup. Members of the duly elected government left for their own safety and others quite simply voted to save their ass.

You obviously don't really understand who these goons are that took over. And it's not Russian propaganda to state that Svoboda and the Right Sector are "uber Ukrainians" and are anti Jew and anti Russian.

When one's party platform includes "making Ukrainaphobia a crime" aka you shoot your mouth off about the new government and you go to jail sure you can't be construed as a democracy loving party.

 

[paulitician]

For crying out loud Crimea was Russian till Nikita gave the country as a present to the Ukraine in the mid 50's. Demographically it is still a majority of ethnic Russians.

Considering the whack jobs in Kiev who overthrew the duly elected pro Russian President absolutely HATE ethnic Russians and as part of their party platform state plain out that they were going to take away Crimea's autonomy and ban the Russian language and strip certain ethnic Russians of citizenship it is a freaking no brainer how the vote went.

It's already a done-deal. They'll end up agreeing to split the country in half. America, Great Britain, and some allies will own one half, and Russia will own the other half. There won't be War over this one. However, there could be quite a bit of bloodshed in the divvying up process. Possibly like what happened in India when Pakistan was created. There could be some ethnic cleansing. It might get pretty ugly.

But personally, i don't want to own any part of Ukraine. It'll likely end up costing American Taxpayers far more than it's worth. We should have just stayed out of it. But greed is a powerful thing. We couldn't help ourselves. It's pretty sad.

 

[tinydancer]

For crying out loud Crimea was Russian till Nikita gave the country as a present to the Ukraine in the mid 50's. Demographically it is still a majority of ethnic Russians.

Considering the whack jobs in Kiev who overthrew the duly elected pro Russian President absolutely HATE ethnic Russians and as part of their party platform state plain out that they were going to take away Crimea's autonomy and ban the Russian language and strip certain ethnic Russians of citizenship it is a freaking no brainer how the vote went.

It's already a done-deal. They'll end up agreeing to split the country in half. America, Great Britain, and some allies will own one half, and Russia will own the other half. There won't be War over this one. However, there could be quite a bit of bloodshed in the divvying up process. Possibly like what happened in India when Pakistan was created.

But personally, i don't want to own any part of Ukraine. It'll likely end up costing American Taxpayers far more than it's worth. We should have just stayed out of it. But greed is a powerful thing. We couldn't help ourselves. It's pretty sad.

This whole thing is just insane to me. I get that the EU wanted and pushed for the new government and I know about Nuland and the monies already spent.

Okey dokey. What was done was done and water under the bridge. But to now financially back the new government is crazy. The EU wanted them the EU can pay for them.

I am so angry.

I elected my freaking government to govern my country. Not try to govern the world.
Fix my economy and fix my pot holes.

Sorries. I'm spitting bullets as you can tell.

 

[tinydancer]

Now for those that think that Putin is just laying "propaganda" out there by calling these goons for what they are check this out.

This is from BBC 2012. Long before the coup.

First the "thuggery". You bet they intimidated whoever was left in the government to impeach the President.


Meeting for its first two sessions in mid-December, the Rada - as it has a number of times in the past - degenerated into scenes that resembled not so much a legislative process as an ice hockey brawl, involving dozens of shoving, punching and kicking parliamentarians.

Svoboda's newly installed deputies, clad in traditional Ukrainian embroidered shirts, were in the thick of the melee, when not actually leading the charge.

They helped attack and drive from the opposition's ranks two deputies - a father and son - who were accused of preparing to defect to the ruling party.

Then they joined a massive free-for-all around the speaker's rostrum, in protest at alleged illegal absentee-voting by deputies from the governing party.

BBC News - Svoboda: The rise of Ukraine's ultra-nationalists

 

[tinydancer]

And here is a great representation of the anti jew sentiment of Svoboda (you have to remember they were rewarded with plum positions for being the muscle)

This is who we are freaking backing?

The open letter (2005)

Title - Stop the Criminal Activities of Organised Jewry

Signed by Tyahnybok and 17 others

Lists Jewish businessmen, who got rich in the 1990s, and claims they control Ukrainian media

Describes Zionism as "Jewish Nazism" and warns of "genocide" through the impoverishment of Ukrainians

Demands investigation into the activities of Jewish organisations headed by people "suspected of serious crimes"


http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-20824693

 

[paulitician]

Now for those that think that Putin is just laying "propaganda" out there by calling these goons for what they are check this out.

This is from BBC 2012. Long before the coup.

First the "thuggery". You bet they intimidated whoever was left in the government to impeach the President.


Meeting for its first two sessions in mid-December, the Rada - as it has a number of times in the past - degenerated into scenes that resembled not so much a legislative process as an ice hockey brawl, involving dozens of shoving, punching and kicking parliamentarians.

Svoboda's newly installed deputies, clad in traditional Ukrainian embroidered shirts, were in the thick of the melee, when not actually leading the charge.

They helped attack and drive from the opposition's ranks two deputies - a father and son - who were accused of preparing to defect to the ruling party.

Then they joined a massive free-for-all around the speaker's rostrum, in protest at alleged illegal absentee-voting by deputies from the governing party.

BBC News - Svoboda: The rise of Ukraine's ultra-nationalists

We are all Ukrainians now. Oh goody. Happy days are here again.

 

[tinydancer]

Oh and it gets better. I don't have a warm and fuzzy about this new government.

Other Svoboda members have also courted controversy.

Yuriy Mykhalchyshyn, a parliamentary deputy considered one of the party's ideologues, liberally quotes from former Nazi propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels, along with other National-Socialist leaders.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-20824693

 

[tinydancer]

Now for those that think that Putin is just laying "propaganda" out there by calling these goons for what they are check this out.

This is from BBC 2012. Long before the coup.

First the "thuggery". You bet they intimidated whoever was left in the government to impeach the President.


Meeting for its first two sessions in mid-December, the Rada - as it has a number of times in the past - degenerated into scenes that resembled not so much a legislative process as an ice hockey brawl, involving dozens of shoving, punching and kicking parliamentarians.

Svoboda's newly installed deputies, clad in traditional Ukrainian embroidered shirts, were in the thick of the melee, when not actually leading the charge.

They helped attack and drive from the opposition's ranks two deputies - a father and son - who were accused of preparing to defect to the ruling party.

Then they joined a massive free-for-all around the speaker's rostrum, in protest at alleged illegal absentee-voting by deputies from the governing party.

BBC News - Svoboda: The rise of Ukraine's ultra-nationalists

We're all Ukrainians now. Oh goody.

You would think that any party that believes in an "ethnically pure Ukraine" and was part of the take over would set off some alarms.

I know when I first started checking into Svoboda and Right Sector I was thunderstruck by how history was repeating itself in western Ukraine.