Democrats Fast-Track Bill To Override Hobby Lobby Decision

[Quantum Windbag]

[

That's joe. He paid for a policy, he doesn't even need to read it. He has a policy, they pay for everything now, right?

I had a policy, and it was presented to me that it would cover most situations.

I paid more out of pocket to get the Point Of Service Plan because it covered more than the HMO plan they initially offered.

Here's the thing. WHen HMO's first came out, people thought they were horrible.

Then I had a Pre-ObamaCare situation where our cheif of Human Resources remarked that she was glad her husband had an HMO instead of the shitty plan we had.

Seriously, guy, the thing is, why should I vote to continue this shit? Take this shit and like it, when I can vote for what I wanted to start with?

It's kind of like you dumb fucking Southern Shits who vote against Unions and for More work for less pay.

Don't forget the part where you didn't actually read it.

 

[daveman]

Guy, I shouldn't have to read through a damned policy.

It's rare to see someone so proud of being stupid and lazy.

Dumbass, the policy is a contract. If the insurer fails to live up to the contract they signed, there is legal recourse.

But you have to not be stupid and lazy.

What happened to you is your own damn fault, because you let them get away with it.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

There is only one drug approved to induce abortion. It is called RU-486 (mifepristone) and is not on the FDA's list of approved contraception. It is available only by prescription and no employer is forced to pay for it as part of an employee health plan.

MUCH MORE: What an abortifacient is -- and what it isn't | National Catholic Reporter

Much very good information for those who care to know.

Not true.

List of drugs used for Abortion (Induced Abortion ) / Abortion (Induced Abortion ) Medicines | Medindia

Not true? Really? You actually take the word of a website launched from India in 1999 over the American Food and Drug Administration founded in 1906?

Are you denying that those other drugs can cause abortions? After all, you are the one that claimed that only one drug causes abortion. The difference is that all of these other drugs are used for other purposes, which is why the FDA labels them not to be used by women who are, or considering becoming, pregnant.

Keep trying to pretend you know what you are talking about though.

 

[daveman]

Cancer is what kills you when you manage to survive everything else.

Canada has a longer life expectency than we do, and a lower infant mortality rate. They spend half of what we do.

But, boo-hoo, a rich person has to share a hospital room with a poor person and that's just awful.

Yeah ... um ... no. We're not sharing a room, Joe. I'll pay for my own room.

As long as I'm getting the treatment I need, I don't care who I have to share a room with.

Maybe if the rich got the same care as the poor and working folks did in this country, they'd care more about the problems.

Did you notice that all the caring, compassionate Democrats in DC who wrote ACA exempted themselves from it?

Yet you excuse their elitism, as if it's the natural order of the universe.

We're citizens here in the US, Iosef. If you want to be a subject, I suggest you move. I'm not willing to give up my rights of citizenship because you're a stupid lazy bastard who needs a Nanny State to change his diaper.

 

[JoeB131]

JoeB: I shouldn't have to read contracts I sign.

Lawyer: It doesn't work that way, if you signed it you read it.

JoeB: I am going to complain to Obama.

Lawyer: Good luck.

I've read them. and frankly, nope, if we all need lawyers to get our insurance companies to do what they promised, that's a good excuse to get rid of insurance companies.

 

[JoeB131]

Guy, I shouldn't have to read through a damned policy.

It's rare to see someone so proud of being stupid and lazy.

Dumbass, the policy is a contract. If the insurer fails to live up to the contract they signed, there is legal recourse.

But you have to not be stupid and lazy.

What happened to you is your own damn fault, because you let them get away with it.

That's wonderful, guy. I didn't make that contract.

That's the whole point. The contract between insurers and employers, and the courts have ruled the patients have no standing. That was the whole point of why they let the Sarkisyan girl die. Her father didn't have standing.

Now, yeah, I guess i could have sued them, and eventually I got the treatment I needed anyway. (I finally did get the treatment after fighting with them for a year and a half), but frankly, what you guys don't get because you are kind of stupid is, why should the rest of us put up with sub-standard treatment after we've paid for it?

It's like you all don't even understand why ObamaCare got passed to start with. Amazing.

 

[JoeB131]

[
Did you notice that all the caring, compassionate Democrats in DC who wrote ACA exempted themselves from it?

Yet you excuse their elitism, as if it's the natural order of the universe.

We're citizens here in the US, Iosef. If you want to be a subject, I suggest you move. I'm not willing to give up my rights of citizenship because you're a stupid lazy bastard who needs a Nanny State to change his diaper.

Says the guy with the no-work government job who is collecting a government pension. But you're not a subject at all.

Guy, that's pretty fucking idiotic.

"Hey, How Dare Congress exempt itself from ObamaCare when their coverage more than met standards!"

Here's an idea. We just take the plan Congress has and give it to every American. That would work.

 

[JoeB131]

[
The government sure as hell wouldn't if we had single-payer.

I'd point you towards the VA, but you're willfully blind to the way they've been not treating veterans.

Actually, when I've dealt with the VA, it's been a wonderful experience.

Of course, I'm not grabbing government benefits with both hands and then bitching about the government like you do.

 

[daveman]

[
Did you notice that all the caring, compassionate Democrats in DC who wrote ACA exempted themselves from it?

Yet you excuse their elitism, as if it's the natural order of the universe.

We're citizens here in the US, Iosef. If you want to be a subject, I suggest you move. I'm not willing to give up my rights of citizenship because you're a stupid lazy bastard who needs a Nanny State to change his diaper.

Says the guy with the no-work government job who is collecting a government pension. But you're not a subject at all.

Guy, that's pretty fucking idiotic.

"Hey, How Dare Congress exempt itself from ObamaCare when their coverage more than met standards!"

Here's an idea. We just take the plan Congress has and give it to every American. That would work.

Oh, I work plenty hard. You simply can't recognize it because you're a stupid lazy bastard.

And there you go again, excusing your rulers. Typical.

You're nothing more than a serf.

 

[daveman]

[
The government sure as hell wouldn't if we had single-payer.

I'd point you towards the VA, but you're willfully blind to the way they've been not treating veterans.

Actually, when I've dealt with the VA, it's been a wonderful experience.

Of course, I'm not grabbing government benefits with both hands and then bitching about the government like you do.

Note for the progressivism impaired:

Your limited experience does not define reality. Veterans have died waiting for appointments.

But that embarrasses Big Nanny Government, so you pretend it doesn't happen.

Serf.

 

[JoeB131]

[
Did you notice that all the caring, compassionate Democrats in DC who wrote ACA exempted themselves from it?

Yet you excuse their elitism, as if it's the natural order of the universe.

We're citizens here in the US, Iosef. If you want to be a subject, I suggest you move. I'm not willing to give up my rights of citizenship because you're a stupid lazy bastard who needs a Nanny State to change his diaper.

Says the guy with the no-work government job who is collecting a government pension. But you're not a subject at all.

Guy, that's pretty fucking idiotic.

"Hey, How Dare Congress exempt itself from ObamaCare when their coverage more than met standards!"

Here's an idea. We just take the plan Congress has and give it to every American. That would work.

Oh, I work plenty hard. You simply can't recognize it because you're a stupid lazy bastard.

And there you go again, excusing your rulers. Typical.

You're nothing more than a serf.

Guy, if you work for the government and you think government is worthless, doesn't that make you worthless? I find it amusing the guys who bitch about the government the loudest are the ones grabbing that government money with both hands.

Incidentally, I think ObamaCare is a mess because instead of going to Single Payer, it built on top of the corrupt private insurance system that even the insurance industry admits can't go on as it is.

 

[JoeB131]

[
The government sure as hell wouldn't if we had single-payer.

I'd point you towards the VA, but you're willfully blind to the way they've been not treating veterans.

Actually, when I've dealt with the VA, it's been a wonderful experience.

Of course, I'm not grabbing government benefits with both hands and then bitching about the government like you do.

Note for the progressivism impaired:

Your limited experience does not define reality. Veterans have died waiting for appointments.

But that embarrasses Big Nanny Government, so you pretend it doesn't happen.

Serf.

People have died waiting for private insurance to approve treatments.

And frankly, nothing stopped those veterans from paying for those treatments out of pocket, right? Isn't that what you guys have spent the last six pages telling me I should have done for my knee surgery?

 

[Meister]

Guy, I shouldn't have to read through a damned policy.

It's rare to see someone so proud of being stupid and lazy.

Dumbass, the policy is a contract. If the insurer fails to live up to the contract they signed, there is legal recourse.

But you have to not be stupid and lazy.

What happened to you is your own damn fault, because you let them get away with it.

That's wonderful, guy. I didn't make that contract.

That's the whole point. The contract between insurers and employers, and the courts have ruled the patients have no standing. That was the whole point of why they let the Sarkisyan girl die. Her father didn't have standing.

Now, yeah, I guess i could have sued them, and eventually I got the treatment I needed anyway. (I finally did get the treatment after fighting with them for a year and a half), but frankly, what you guys don't get because you are kind of stupid is, why should the rest of us put up with sub-standard treatment after we've paid for it?

It's like you all don't even understand why ObamaCare got passed to start with. Amazing.

Maybe they aren't so stupid, maybe they shopped around for the best deal they could by reading what was and wasn't offered. Obummercare's one size fits all is just stupid....

 

[Andylusion]

Senate Democrats are expediting legislation that would override the Supreme Court's decision in the Hobby Lobby case and compel for-profit employers to cover the full range of contraception for their employees, as required by the Affordable Care Act.

The bill, which is co-authored by Sens. Patty Murray (D-Wash.) and Mark Udall (D-Colo.), would ban for-profit companies from refusing to cover any federally guaranteed health benefits for religious reasons, including all 20 forms of contraception detailed in the Affordable Care Act. It would preserve the contraception mandate's current exemption for churches and accommodation for non-profit religious organizations, such as certain hospitals and schools.

A Senate aide told HuffPost that the bill will be introduced as soon as Tuesday night and go directly to the Senate floor as early as next week, without being considered in committee.

"The U.S. Supreme Court's Hobby Lobby decision opened the door to unprecedented corporate intrusion into our private lives. Coloradans understand that women should never have to ask their bosses for a permission slip to access common forms of birth control or other critical health services," Udall said in a statement. "My common-sense proposal will keep women's private health decisions out of corporate board rooms, because your boss shouldn't be able to dictate what is best for you and your family."

MORE: Democrats Fast-Track Bill To Override Hobby Lobby Decision

Sounds good. Get it done.

If I were at Hobby Lobby corporate, I'd simply cancel health insurance outright. Thus the problem is solved permanently.

 

[Andylusion]

Actually, when I've dealt with the VA, it's been a wonderful experience.

Of course, I'm not grabbing government benefits with both hands and then bitching about the government like you do.

Note for the progressivism impaired:

Your limited experience does not define reality. Veterans have died waiting for appointments.

But that embarrasses Big Nanny Government, so you pretend it doesn't happen.

Serf.

People have died waiting for private insurance to approve treatments.

And frankly, nothing stopped those veterans from paying for those treatments out of pocket, right? Isn't that what you guys have spent the last six pages telling me I should have done for my knee surgery?

Really. Where are these people who have died waiting for insurance. I'd like to read those cases one by one.

 

[kaz]

I had a policy, and it was presented to me that it would cover most situations

So seriously, you bought the cheapest, crappiest plan they offered and couldn't be bothered to read what it covered and you went by the sales pitch that it covers "most situations." You want an MRI, and you don't know if it's covered by the plan or not because you still won't research it. You will get on message boards and whine that your insurance company says it's not covered, at least not without physical therapy first. You don't know if that's true or not because you still won't read what it covers. And you won't pay for it yourself because your health is not what you think you should spend your money on, you think you should be able to spend someone else's money on it.

Here's a hint to what you are. It starts with an "L." It ends with an "oser."

Seriously, guy, the thing is, why should I vote to continue this shit? Take this shit and like it, when I can vote for what I wanted to start with?

Your health care agreement with your employer is what you're "voting" for. You can't negotiate your own deal, you need government to mandate it. Then you whine when they fire you because you suck at your job and you're too expensive. Here's a hint, what you are starts with an "L"...

It's kind of like you dumb fucking Southern Shits who vote against Unions and for More work for less pay.

More work? True, we have more work in the south. Less pay? No. We have the jobs, you have unemployment...

 

[kaz]

No, you wanted your insurance company to be! Ding, ding, ding! Why do you suppose they wanted you to try physical therapy first???

LOL, the money insurance companies comes from the sky, right Joe? You paid for a policy, now they should throw money at you whenever you ask.

Yes, that is EXACTLY what it means. I paid for a policy through payroll deductions or labor.

That means I expect them to pay for whatever my doctor rules is expedient and the best course of treatment.

The government sure as hell wouldn't if we had single-payer.

I'd point you towards the VA, but you're willfully blind to the way they've been not treating veterans.

He won't admit that, he's got this lie that he's a veteran. He can't admit he doesn't know what he's talking about with the VA because he'd have to admit his lie.

 

[Andylusion]

Says the guy with the no-work government job who is collecting a government pension. But you're not a subject at all.

Guy, that's pretty fucking idiotic.

"Hey, How Dare Congress exempt itself from ObamaCare when their coverage more than met standards!"

Here's an idea. We just take the plan Congress has and give it to every American. That would work.

Oh, I work plenty hard. You simply can't recognize it because you're a stupid lazy bastard.

And there you go again, excusing your rulers. Typical.

You're nothing more than a serf.

Guy, if you work for the government and you think government is worthless, doesn't that make you worthless? I find it amusing the guys who bitch about the government the loudest are the ones grabbing that government money with both hands.

Incidentally, I think ObamaCare is a mess because instead of going to Single Payer, it built on top of the corrupt private insurance system that even the insurance industry admits can't go on as it is.

Um... I'd take government money right now, if you are stupid enough to let me. Absolutely!

If you told me today, that you are going to hand out your hard earned money to anyone who says they need it, I'll send you certified mail, with my "need it" note before the end of the day. I'll take your money, and think you are a moron, the entire time.

You morons on the left, don't seem to grasp this. You can take advantage of a system, that you don't agree with. The two are not mutually exclusive.

You drive up the cost of health insurance, and then are shocked people drop the health care coverage they did have, to get free insurance from the government. Many of those people might even oppose government run health insurance, but because you idiots made private insurance too expensive, we take what we have to. I, myself, am an example of this.

 

[Andylusion]

No, you wanted your insurance company to be! Ding, ding, ding! Why do you suppose they wanted you to try physical therapy first???

LOL, the money insurance companies comes from the sky, right Joe? You paid for a policy, now they should throw money at you whenever you ask.

Yes, that is EXACTLY what it means. I paid for a policy through payroll deductions or labor.

That means I expect them to pay for whatever my doctor rules is expedient and the best course of treatment.

Wouldn't it be nice if the world worked that way?

But it doesn't. Insurance companies don't have unlimited cash. Neither does the government.

If you want the absolute best possible care, the only way to get it, is to pay for it yourself.

You don't have the money? Then you are at the mercy of the insurance company, or the government.

So which one is worse? Depends on perspective, I suppose.

The insurance company, it depends on the quality of the plan. The problem with company insurance plans, is that you don't really know how good the plan really is. The company can negotiate cut rate deals, with inclusions you have no idea about.

Or you can have a really good company, with a really good deal.

But ultimately, whatever is in those negotiated exclusions, you have to pay with out of pocket, and whatever is covered is covered.

Government on the other hand will give you nearly unlimited coverage and no exclusions.

But it's a lie. There are two ways government prevents you from getting health care, but both are less visible to the public.

The first way, is simply by denying treatment exists. In France, for example, they found doctors were required by the government, to not tell patients about treatments, that the government deemed to expensive to offer.

So while some patients had treatable conditions, they were never even allowed to know they existed.

Now tell me, would you have been so angry with your insurance company, if they had forced the doctor to sign a non-disclosure agreement about treatments they didn't cover?

Of course not. You would never have known. But in a free-market Capitalist system, you are allowed to know about everything that exists, even if you can't afford it. I know about the Bentley Phantom, even though I'll never own so much as a lug nut from one.

Yet either way, the result is the same. Your insurance didn't cover treatment X, and the people of France didn't even know treatment X existed. Neither paid for X, and neither got X.

The other way in which government limited expenses, is by simply delaying care. The insurance company denies a claim. Government delays the claim. Yes, you can get that treatment, absolutely, no problem, you got it...... Your name has been added to the list, we'll give you a call..... someday..... maybe.

The short flick A Short Course in Brain Surgery, by Stuart Browning, was about a guy in Canada who started having headaches and seizures. He was having them every single day. His local hospital said... we'll get you looked at in... oh 4 months. Instead he came to the US, and got it done within ONE day. He had a tumor. His local hospital said... ok that's important, we'll get in you in.... oh 4 months.

Now, unlike the Insurance company, the government does not do this intentionally. It's not a planned out thing.

Insurance companies have to make payroll, have to make a profit, have to pay bills and taxes, and all the things that an insurance company must do. So when they write up an insurance contract, they design that insurance contract to make a profit.

The government does not. That's true. If that is all you care about, then the government is better than insurance. But if you care about the results, the government ends up harming far more people, even if unintentional.

Government has limited funds. If they simply paid doctors and hospitals to do as many treatments as they can, the hospitals would do treatments until there was no money left, and then there would be a crisis.

To prevent that, the government must put limits on what the hospital can do. Rick Baker, the doctor who is filmed in the video mentioned above, says the reason he opened his private hospital was directly because he was turning away patients for lack of hospital bed at the Canadian hospital, even though they had an entire floor of empty hospital rooms. The rooms were "unfunded", meaning the government was not going to pay for them to be used.

Instead, patients were placed on the waiting list. Sound familiar? The VA system has just been caught doing the same thing. All government funded health care system operate this way. I would suggest to you, that is a worse system.

 

[kaz]

You don't have the money?

Joe can't decide if he has the money or not. First he said his employer shit canned him because he filed too many medical claims. I pointed out that apparently he wasn't very good at his job since he wasn't worth the bills, then he changed his story that he made his employer money hand over fist, and he ended up fine and his employer didn't. Though apparently his employer also had no problem replacing him, even though he couldn't replace him.

Joe also used to be a Republican, until he became a Democrat and agreed with Democrats on every issue and every talking point and he doesn't even remember why he thought what he did or what he ever thought, so he can't explain to Republicans the source of his epiphany, he just realized the Democrats were right on every issue and for the reason they think it.

He also isn't anti-Semetic, but he wants every Jew in Israel to die. He admits he hates Mormons, apparently the guy who shit canned him in the beginning of the story was a Mormon who fired him for sucking even though he made him money hand over fist and Joe ended up fine and he didn't, even though he had no problem replacing Joe.

Joe also used to be in the military and he loves guns, he's shot every gun known to man. He also hates guns because no one ever shoots one except to kill a person or train to kill a person. There is no other reason he can think of to fire a projectile. He's not sick or anything though, he didn't pretend to be killing people when he shot guns. It's the rest of us. We scare him.

This is why Joe's a hoot. He's a terrible liar.