Does GDP growth mean Federal Tax revenue growth?

[kaz]

Trump cut taxes. Are you following the conversation? Not really? I'll color it in to see if it helps

So did Oblama and???

Obama cut taxes? I hate to call bull shit on that.

Bull shit on that. When did he do that?

When the Bush tax cuts expired, he kept them going...

So not increasing taxes is a tax cut? What the fuck?

And actually that was a tax increase, he did not extend the cuts for upper income earners.

So you think an Obama tax increase is a tax cut. Oh, but you vote Republican ....

I said I voted for Trump because I hate Hillary....I am an independent and have been as such since I voted for Reagan...His little escapade of amnesty and a so called tax cut which increased my taxes made me realize that politicians are just another name for three card monty..

Reagan raised your taxes? You were obviously in a special tax situation then. What was it?

 

[Moonglow]

So did Oblama and???

Obama cut taxes? I hate to call bull shit on that.

Bull shit on that. When did he do that?

When the Bush tax cuts expired, he kept them going...

So not increasing taxes is a tax cut? What the fuck?

And actually that was a tax increase, he did not extend the cuts for upper income earners.

So you think an Obama tax increase is a tax cut. Oh, but you vote Republican ....

I said I voted for Trump because I hate Hillary....I am an independent and have been as such since I voted for Reagan...His little escapade of amnesty and a so called tax cut which increased my taxes made me realize that politicians are just another name for three card monty..

Reagan raised your taxes? You were obviously in a special tax situation then. What was it?

I was young and not wealthy...He also cut off our GI Bill and healthcare after service. I was discharged in 1988 and it wasn't until George Bush jr that we got our healthcare back.. But no GI Bill for education...

 

[The Derp]

And actually that was a tax increase, he did not extend the cuts for upper income earners.

And we were told by Conservatives that if he let those cuts for the rich expire, the economy would collapse, the market would collapse, jobs would be lost, and the sky would fall.

They were wrong then, so why the fuck would they be right about this shit today????

 

[kaz]

What you mean is that deficits and spending will still go up because Congress won't control spending. The worst you can do is increase spending without cutting taxes because then deficits soar and the economy doesn't grow.

You know, like we just experienced in eight years of Obama

Ever hear of sequestration, yeah the GOP forced it into the budget reconciliation in 2011.....The budget deficit was being reduced to GNP. But the GOP under Trump just said fuck it....

Trump cut taxes. Are you following the conversation? Not really? I'll color it in to see if it helps

So did Oblama and???

Obama cut taxes? I hate to call bull shit on that.

Bull shit on that. When did he do that?

Obama cut payroll taxes for two years.

I believe it was one year. OK, he cut payroll taxes 2% for one year (two if you can show that). He increased taxes by far more than that. Tax cuts aren't cuts unless they are net cuts

 

[The Derp]

Single cause fallacy

Deficit before the tax cut: $500B
Deficit after the tax cut: $1T

So the deficit grew to $1T only because of the tax cut.

So it's not a fallacy, it's your tax cut's fault that the deficit is back to $1T.

 

[The Derp]

It also increases debt and deficits because the people in Congress won't control spending..

What you mean is that deficits and spending will still go up because Congress won't control spending. The worst you can do is increase spending without cutting taxes because then deficits soar and the economy doesn't grow.

You know, like we just experienced in eight years of Obama

Ever hear of sequestration, yeah the GOP forced it into the budget reconciliation in 2011.....The budget deficit was being reduced to GNP. But the GOP under Trump just said fuck it....

Trump cut taxes. Are you following the conversation? Not really? I'll color it in to see if it helps

In cutting taxes, Trump caused the deficit to grow to over $1T.

So clearly deficits are caused by reductions in revenue, not spending.

That doesn't bother near as much as the fake outrage and lies from the GOP about the budget and debt .I hate liars.....

I know...I don't really give a shit about the deficit or debt. What I give a shit about are Conservatives deliberately manufacturing deficits and debt because wrecking the budget is the only way they can get the cuts to the social programs like Medicare and Medicaid to which they are ideologically opposed.

 

[kaz]

Obama cut taxes? I hate to call bull shit on that.

Bull shit on that. When did he do that?

When the Bush tax cuts expired, he kept them going...

So not increasing taxes is a tax cut? What the fuck?

And actually that was a tax increase, he did not extend the cuts for upper income earners.

So you think an Obama tax increase is a tax cut. Oh, but you vote Republican ....

I said I voted for Trump because I hate Hillary....I am an independent and have been as such since I voted for Reagan...His little escapade of amnesty and a so called tax cut which increased my taxes made me realize that politicians are just another name for three card monty..

Reagan raised your taxes? You were obviously in a special tax situation then. What was it?

I was young and not wealthy...He also cut off our GI Bill and healthcare after service. I was discharged in 1988 and it wasn't until George Bush jr that we got our healthcare back.. But no GI Bill for education...

If you earned too little taxes to pay taxes, that isn't a tax increase. Point to the specific provision that increased your taxes. The bottom tax rate dropped from 14% to 11%. No tax rate went up

 

[The Derp]

Trump cut taxes. Are you following the conversation? Not really? I'll color it in to see if it helps

So did Oblama and???

Obama cut taxes? I hate to call bull shit on that.

Bull shit on that. When did he do that?

When the Bush tax cuts expired, he kept them going...

So not increasing taxes is a tax cut? What the fuck?

And actually that was a tax increase, he did not extend the cuts for upper income earners.

So you think an Obama tax increase is a tax cut. Oh, but you vote Republican ....

I said I voted for Trump because I hate Hillary....I am an independent and have been as such since I voted for Reagan...His little escapade of amnesty and a so called tax cut which increased my taxes made me realize that politicians are just another name for three card monty..

You regretting that vote now? You can admit it. If you admit it, you'll be far more respected.

 

[kaz]

And actually that was a tax increase, he did not extend the cuts for upper income earners.

And we were told by Conservatives that if he let those cuts for the rich expire, the economy would collapse, the market would collapse, jobs would be lost, and the sky would fall.

They were wrong then, so why the fuck would they be right about this shit today????

Democrats said electing Trump would collapse the world markets

Issues where if we flip parties you switch sides are irrelevant since it's not even something you actually believe, it's just partisan

 

[The Derp]

That's insane. Explain how you can have deficit spending when you're taxing and not spending

Deficit before the tax cut: $500B
Deficit after the tax cut: $1T

So the tax cut reduced revenues by $500B.

Tax cuts don't pay for themselves, never trickle down, and are just a Trojan Horse to attack the social programs Conservatives hate but lack the courage, support, and will to repeal through legislation. So instead you practice fiscal terrorism; which is deliberately manufacturing deficits and debt by flying planes of tax cuts into the budget, then using the fallout as justification for cutting those programs to which you are ideologically oppose, for the purpose of inflicting harm on those you sanctimoniously judge. That's fuckin' terrorism.

 

[kaz]

Single cause fallacy

Deficit before the tax cut: $500B
Deficit after the tax cut: $1T

So the deficit grew to $1T only because of the tax cut.

So it's not a fallacy, it's your tax cut's fault that the deficit is back to $1T.

Why did you cut the conversation up to that point out of your quote? Am I supposed to go look for it?

 

[kaz]

So did Oblama and???

Obama cut taxes? I hate to call bull shit on that.

Bull shit on that. When did he do that?

When the Bush tax cuts expired, he kept them going...

So not increasing taxes is a tax cut? What the fuck?

And actually that was a tax increase, he did not extend the cuts for upper income earners.

So you think an Obama tax increase is a tax cut. Oh, but you vote Republican ....

I said I voted for Trump because I hate Hillary....I am an independent and have been as such since I voted for Reagan...His little escapade of amnesty and a so called tax cut which increased my taxes made me realize that politicians are just another name for three card monty..

You regretting that vote now? You can admit it. If you admit it, you'll be far more respected.

I don't regret my vote. I'd vote for Gary Johnson again

 

[kaz]

That's insane. Explain how you can have deficit spending when you're taxing and not spending

Deficit before the tax cut: $500B
Deficit after the tax cut: $1T

So the tax cut reduced revenues by $500B.

Tax cuts don't pay for themselves, never trickle down, and are just a Trojan Horse to attack the social programs Conservatives hate but lack the courage, support, and will to repeal through legislation. So instead you practice fiscal terrorism; which is deliberately manufacturing deficits and debt by flying planes of tax cuts into the budget, then using the fallout as justification for cutting those programs to which you are ideologically oppose, for the purpose of inflicting harm on those you sanctimoniously judge. That's fuckin' terrorism.

That's just leftist propaganda. "Fiscal terrorism," you're just losing it now, LOL

 

[healthmyths]

If these tax cuts result in GDP growth to the point they will pay for themselves

Why is the deficit drastically increasing?

OK let's talk fundamentals here.
A) Tax cuts go into affect 2018. Question... when do tax payers normally pay income taxes? The next year!
B) Now PAYROLL taxes go in quarterly. No question. So the more people working...yup, the more payroll taxes collected.
See I think people like you don't seem to understand that according to the below, 34% comes from payroll taxes meaning yes... more people working means more taxes!
So as far as deficit "drastically" increasing" where did you get that information?
Feds Collect Record Taxes in First Month Under Tax Cut; Run Surplus in January
The federal government this January ran a surplus while collecting record total tax revenues for that month of the year, according to the Monthly Treasury Statement released today.January was the first month under the new tax law that President Donald Trump signed in December.
During January, the Treasury collected approximately $361,038,000,000 in total tax revenues and spent a total of approximately $311,802,000,000 to run a surplus of approximately $49,236,000,000.
Feds Collect Record Taxes in First Month Under Tax Cut; Run Surplus in January
So immediately there is almost a $50 billion surplus. This means there was MORE money coming in than going out!

I know this is really simple but hey you asked for it!

 

[OKTexas]

Damn, all these assumptions

Do you even know what the word "assumption" means? I haven't made any assumptions.

It's a fact that your tax cut will expire in 2025.
It's a fact that tax rates go up by 2027.
It's a fact that because the tax cut explodes the deficit to over $1T, that Medicare and Medicaid will be cut.
It's a fact that Conservatives chained the tax brackets to CPI, which will push 80-90 million people in a higher bracket just by virtue of the fact that wages rise faster than inflation.

None of those are assumptions, pal. They're facts that are a part of the law you support (but seem to know nothing about).

I don't get wages anymore and the tax cut only saves me a couple of hundred bucks.

So then you're retired? Which means you are on Medicare and/or Medicaid. Well, starting next year your out of pocket expenses for Medicare and Medicaid will increase because the programs will face automatic cuts. So whatever you're paying for Medicare now, expect to pay far, far more this time next year because you just had to cut taxes for Donald Trump's dumb kids.

Yeah they are assumptions, you're assuming congress will do nothing between now and then. You're not very smart, are ya? The middle class tax cuts in the Bush era were temporary until congress extended them a couple of times and then made them permanent. So run along and assume away.


.

 

[healthmyths]

BUT it was ALL paid off during Obama! almost $700 billion back into the US Treasury and Obama STILL ran up a $9 Trillion addition to the debt!

It doesn't matter that it was paid off or not, what matters is that they had to be bailed out IN THE FIRST PLACE, then got a sweetheart deal on interest on the loans they got. Who in the world can get a 2% interest rate on any loan? No one except bailed out banks. So the banks were rewarded with a low interest rate on the loans we gave them that bailed them out of the mess they created.

The fact that you don't see what's wrong with that just proves the kind of partisan hack you are.

HEY dummy what was the interest rate in 2008?
Here are the facts...
12/2008 cost of average loan..... 2.757% Prime interest rate 3.250%
First Republic: Historical Interest Rates

So dummy again... what is the problem with an interest rate of 2%???
Geez I know some one with a 500 credit rating would NEVER see that rate but what the hell!

 

[OKTexas]

And the cuts were made temporary because 9 commiecrats refused to vote for the middle class cuts.

Why didn't the Conservatives make the cuts for the middle class permanent, and the cuts for the rich and corporations temporary?

I already told you dip shit, the commiecrats refused to vote for middle class tax cuts. They'd rather screw the middle class than give Trump a victory. It's that resist thing.


.

 

[healthmyths]

Wow, takes a liberal to twist that shit. I am against a group/panel of politicians sitting in a room 2000 miles away making health decisions that affect my life or anyone else's....dumbass.

But you are ok with a group/panel of CEOs and actuaries sitting in a room making health decisions that affect my life or anyone else's? When the only thing the CEOs and actuaries care about is profit?

Why is one better than the other? Face it, our system is fucked up, even more so thanks to the ACA than it was before.

The main reason we are so fucked up is that we are trying to have a hybrid system where healthcare is both a commodity and a service at the same time. Such a system is bound to fail, we as a nation have to choose one or the other eventually.

I just wonder what YOU would do if you were on the "group/panel of CEOs and actuaries sitting in a room making health decisions that affect my life or anyone else's? When the only thing the CEOs and actuaries care about is profit?"
Are you aware that your state insurance regulations require what are called "reserves" i.e. set aside of profits to pay "future" claims?
So the idea of "profits" or reserves depend on charging premiums and determining what to pay so there is a "reserve" for future claims?
This is one of the reasons health payers got out of ACA, i.e. ACA required 85% of premiums go to pay claims above the historical 80% ... Medical Loss Ratio.
So what would you do???

I would not want such a job, I would suck at choosing dollars over people and then my company would go bankrupt!

As for the required reserves, that is what those CEOs and actuaries trying to balance.

If claim A is paid but not claim B then they meet the threshold, but if they pay claim A and B then they have spent more than our 80/85 required so then they have to cut somewhere else to make up for it. Does not sound like the kind of thing I want to spend my day doing.

I truly agree with you! I had a basketball buddy who was an actuarial fellow and while a typical nerdy type he also understood the implications of what an actuary does and the direct affect on people's lives when calculating premiums. A lot of factors go into being an actuary and it is truly an unheralded job that most people don't know anything about.

 

[The Derp]

I believe it was one year. OK, he cut payroll taxes 2% for one year (two if you can show that). He increased taxes by far more than that. Tax cuts aren't cuts unless they are net cuts

No, it was two years. It was only supposed to be one year (2011), but he extended it for two (through 2012)

And what taxes did he increase? Taxes on the rich. And who says tax cuts aren't cuts unless they're net cuts? Where is that rule written? Or is it something you just made up on the fly?

 

[The Derp]

Democrats said electing Trump would collapse the world markets

They did? When? Who said that? And have you paid attention to our own market? It dropped 10%+ in the last week. So have markets worldwide.

Issues where if we flip parties you switch sides are irrelevant since it's not even something you actually believe, it's just partisan

No, you're just making shit up to draw some kind of equivalence where none exists. Fact is, your poor instincts and intuition made you an easy mark for Trump, and now you have to diminish everyone else just so you don't have to admit you weren't as clever as you thought.

Barf.

Get over yourself.