English Language Requirement for Store Front Signs in Predominately Asian Community

[Zoom-boing]

All signs should be in English. Those who don't know English should learn it and assimilate.

native Americans are scratching their heads on this one. They really are.

No, they're not.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Hypothetical.

If an inexpensive and 100% reliable and safe brain implant that allowed you to understand any language......and automatcally translated your spoke English into any other language became available......would you opt to have the implant?

No...but only because I absolutely do not want anyone futzing around with my brain!

 

[The Rabbi]

Signs set up by municipalities absolutely must be in English. All official work should be in English. This is America, dammit.

But the gov't has no business dictating what private companies put on their signs. If Asians want Asian-language only on their signs, that's their business. If responders can't find it then they might want to reconsider. But it's their business entirely.

 

[Missourian]

.

Since we no longer promote assimilation and are now promoting division, fuck it.

.

Irish, Italian, Polish etc...assimilation is pretty easy. (Lose the accent. Done)

Japanese, Indian, Chinese, hell blacks....not so much. (Lose the color? Cant.)

Its so easy sometimes not being a minority, isnt it @Mac1958

The guy in your avatar managed it pretty handily.

 

[Missourian]

I really don't care what language the sign is in.

It would be nice if there was an English translation.

But as long as the ADDRESS is highly visible and in English, I would leave it up to the proprietor.

 

[Vox]

B: Roman Alphabet can be seen from Greater Distances than Kanji.


What on earth gave you either of those ideas?

some graphical figures could be seen easier and from further distance than the others.
Latin letters have less elements than oriental ones( which are not single letters), so that could be the basis of the statement.

would be interesting to ask an oriental ophthalmologist

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Here's an interesting issue that should be bipartisan as well - fancy that.

Near to where I live is a small suburb of Los Angeles called Monterey Park. MP is 67% Asian, and growing all the time in Asian population.

Several years ago, MP passed a city ordinance requiring some words in the "English language" to appear on the front of every shop. The idea was - well, I'm not sure what the idea was. I think the hidden agenda idea was a reluctance to have MP taken over by the Asian population, but the expressed idea was public safety, i.e., if an emergency vehicle is directed to a location that happens to be a store or a business of some kind, they need to know how to find it and if they don't speak Chinese, they might have a problem.

This issue has come up once again when the MP City Council, afraid that their ordinance, as worded, might violate Constitutional provisions, is proposing to re-word the ordinance to require "modern Latin letters" on storefront signs, rather than actual words in English. Some council members are opposed to even this, and want to do away with the requirement of English-related words or letters entirely.

Monterey Park sign ordinance debate recalls '80s ethnic controversy - latimes.com

It's an interesting issue. What's your take on it?

Not sure if the ‘first responders’ concern constitutes a substantial governmental interest per Central Hudson, but the requirement seems narrowly tailored. Of course we’ll never know unless someone actually challenges the ordinance.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

All signs should be in English. Those who don't know English should learn it and assimilate.

Further confirmation of the authoritarian conservative:

Everyone must conform, disdain diversity and dissent.

 

[Unkotare]

B: Roman Alphabet can be seen from Greater Distances than Kanji.


What on earth gave you either of those ideas?

some graphical figures could be seen easier and from further distance than the others.
Latin letters have less elements than oriental ones( which are not single letters), so that could be the basis of the statement.

would be interesting to ask an oriental ophthalmologist

If that were the issue at hand, the signs would simply be written in Hiragana or (where appropriate) katagana, which are as 'simple' as romanji, so that reasoning doesn't pan out.

 

[Pogo]

Hypothetical.

If an inexpensive and 100% reliable and safe brain implant that allowed you to understand any language......and automatcally translated your spoke English into any other language became available......would you opt to have the implant?

No. Way too much would be lost. Such as the opportunity to think in another language.

 

[Pogo]

The same thing happened in an Asian enclave in New York. It isn't a service for non asians. Its so emergency workers, police, firefighters and ambulances can locate the emergency.

Since the change in signage is primarily for their benefit, why make them change ? If they don't want emergency workers to find them, so what. Screw 'em.

Funny you should mention that. When I was walking through Little Chinatown there was this Ambulance loading up some old Asian woman who had taken a fall. They had no problem finding her BECAUSE PEOPLE WERE WAVING AND POINTING TO THE GROUP OF PEOPLE HELPING HER!

That's how it usually happens you know.

Yeah, because there's never a situation without a big crowd waving and pointing. Like maybe, it rains...

 

[Pogo]

All signs should be in English. Those who don't know English should learn it and assimilate.

native Americans are scratching their heads on this one. They really are.

and who would those be?

There are road signs around this area in Cherokee...

 

[Esmeralda]

Here's an interesting issue that should be bipartisan as well - fancy that.

Near to where I live is a small suburb of Los Angeles called Monterey Park. MP is 67% Asian, and growing all the time in Asian population.

Several years ago, MP passed a city ordinance requiring some words in the "English language" to appear on the front of every shop. The idea was - well, I'm not sure what the idea was. I think the hidden agenda idea was a reluctance to have MP taken over by the Asian population, but the expressed idea was public safety, i.e., if an emergency vehicle is directed to a location that happens to be a store or a business of some kind, they need to know how to find it and if they don't speak Chinese, they might have a problem.

This issue has come up once again when the MP City Council, afraid that their ordinance, as worded, might violate Constitutional provisions, is proposing to re-word the ordinance to require "modern Latin letters" on storefront signs, rather than actual words in English. Some council members are opposed to even this, and want to do away with the requirement of English-related words or letters entirely.

Monterey Park sign ordinance debate recalls '80s ethnic controversy - latimes.com

It's an interesting issue. What's your take on it?

I think it is a good idea to have the place of business labeled in English so emergency vehicles, police, etc. can locate it. I also think it is a good thing to do in order for the business and community to be welcoming to English speakers.

 

[The Rabbi]

Here's an interesting issue that should be bipartisan as well - fancy that.

Near to where I live is a small suburb of Los Angeles called Monterey Park. MP is 67% Asian, and growing all the time in Asian population.

Several years ago, MP passed a city ordinance requiring some words in the "English language" to appear on the front of every shop. The idea was - well, I'm not sure what the idea was. I think the hidden agenda idea was a reluctance to have MP taken over by the Asian population, but the expressed idea was public safety, i.e., if an emergency vehicle is directed to a location that happens to be a store or a business of some kind, they need to know how to find it and if they don't speak Chinese, they might have a problem.

This issue has come up once again when the MP City Council, afraid that their ordinance, as worded, might violate Constitutional provisions, is proposing to re-word the ordinance to require "modern Latin letters" on storefront signs, rather than actual words in English. Some council members are opposed to even this, and want to do away with the requirement of English-related words or letters entirely.

Monterey Park sign ordinance debate recalls '80s ethnic controversy - latimes.com

It's an interesting issue. What's your take on it?

I think it is a good idea to have the place of business labeled in English so emergency vehicles, police, etc. can locate it. I also think it is a good thing to do in order for the business and community to be welcoming to English speakers.

Speaking of authoritarians.
Ever occur to you these businesses don't care about people who can't read their language?

 

[Esmeralda]

Here's an interesting issue that should be bipartisan as well - fancy that.

Near to where I live is a small suburb of Los Angeles called Monterey Park. MP is 67% Asian, and growing all the time in Asian population.

Several years ago, MP passed a city ordinance requiring some words in the "English language" to appear on the front of every shop. The idea was - well, I'm not sure what the idea was. I think the hidden agenda idea was a reluctance to have MP taken over by the Asian population, but the expressed idea was public safety, i.e., if an emergency vehicle is directed to a location that happens to be a store or a business of some kind, they need to know how to find it and if they don't speak Chinese, they might have a problem.

This issue has come up once again when the MP City Council, afraid that their ordinance, as worded, might violate Constitutional provisions, is proposing to re-word the ordinance to require "modern Latin letters" on storefront signs, rather than actual words in English. Some council members are opposed to even this, and want to do away with the requirement of English-related words or letters entirely.

Monterey Park sign ordinance debate recalls '80s ethnic controversy - latimes.com

It's an interesting issue. What's your take on it?

I think it is a good idea to have the place of business labeled in English so emergency vehicles, police, etc. can locate it. I also think it is a good thing to do in order for the business and community to be welcoming to English speakers.

Speaking of authoritarians.
Ever occur to you these businesses don't care about people who can't read their language?

You see this as authoritarian? I've never heard of a good business person who didn't welcome anyone who wants to buy from them regardless of language, culture, ethnicity, etc. The authoritian would be the one who would not welcome business from someone because of his background.

Without meaning to stereotype, Asians are known world wide as being extremely successful shop keepers and merchants; I've never been to an Asian run shop that wasn't welcoming of my business.

 

[The Rabbi]

I think it is a good idea to have the place of business labeled in English so emergency vehicles, police, etc. can locate it. I also think it is a good thing to do in order for the business and community to be welcoming to English speakers.

Speaking of authoritarians.
Ever occur to you these businesses don't care about people who can't read their language?

You see this as authoritarian? I've never heard of a good business person who didn't welcome anyone who wants to buy from them regardless of language, culture, ethnicity, etc. The authoritian would be the one who would not welcome business from someone because of his background.

Without meaning to stereotype, Asians are known world wide as being extremely successful shop keepers and merchants; I've never been to an Asian run shop that wasn't welcoming of my business.

No, you dont get it. You dont get to decide how people run their own businesses. If you ever got off your ass and decided to open one, you could do it any way you wanted and I wouldn't say a word.

 

[tinydancer]

All signs should be in English. Those who don't know English should learn it and assimilate.

Further confirmation of the authoritarian conservative:

Everyone must conform, disdain diversity and dissent.

I speak in many languages. Can you?

Before you slag someone you better be good at other languages. I'm Canadian so right then and there my first language is Tim Hortons....

The language goes like this

It's a double double and jelly

Now can you speak any other languages before you lecture us?

Because I really can and do and will type en francais little sister. On the get go. Not a lie.

I am that fluent in french. Now german. I have to go back to my days learning latin oh and by the way you had to take a class back then but I truly am thrilled because now I have a love of words.

 

[tinydancer]

Speaking of authoritarians.
Ever occur to you these businesses don't care about people who can't read their language?

You see this as authoritarian? I've never heard of a good business person who didn't welcome anyone who wants to buy from them regardless of language, culture, ethnicity, etc. The authoritian would be the one who would not welcome business from someone because of his background.

Without meaning to stereotype, Asians are known world wide as being extremely successful shop keepers and merchants; I've never been to an Asian run shop that wasn't welcoming of my business.

No, you dont get it. You dont get to decide how people run their own businesses. If you ever got off your ass and decided to open one, you could do it any way you wanted and I wouldn't say a word.

Thank you so much. Thank you ever so much. I've been both sides of this aisle and it never ceases to amaze me that those I worked with didn't have a clue about our boss aka dude who signs the check aka the guy that everyone in the shop thinks he's a rich man but he's actually going home and scarfing down some KD

I love and adore straight on business people who make it on their own.

 

[Sallow]

1. i doubt it has anything to do with "damn asians taking over our town". a sign does not stop asians from settling in that part of town.

2. the requirement should be perfectly constitutional, if there is a rational basis for the government needing an english sign. if not, then the requirement should be tossed. perhaps the local government could enforce a english requirement, yet, still allow them to have their own language sign. that makes more sense than banning a foreign language from a sign.

There is no official language in the United States.

 

[Mac1958]

Irish, Italian, Polish etc...assimilation is pretty easy. (Lose the accent. Done)

Japanese, Indian, Chinese, hell blacks....not so much. (Lose the color? Cant.)

Its so easy sometimes not being a minority, isnt it [MENTION=34298]Mac1958[/MENTION]

Generations of immigrants assimilated and did wonderfully in America.

Now suddenly it's too hard.

I have far more faith in people than you do.

.

What EXACTLY do you mean by assimilate? I know what the dictionary says it means, but what does it mean to you here in this instance...?

It means precisely what what it meant for those generations, look it up. And even better for them, the hard work, standards, expecations and discipline it took to assimilate quickly prepared them beautifully to be successful and happy Americans and to contribute so well to a dynamic and growing economy.

So much for that idea.

.