Enough of this transgender nonsense.

[ChrisL]

The exception that proves the rule.

Guess what, you're wrong. Now look up XY females.

Stop equating anomalies with perfectly healthy and normal bodies.

If you can't say how you figure out what gender someone is, you can't say transgender people are wrong.

This doesn't make sense. It is completely different to mutilate a perfectly normal body than to perform surgery on a person who has something WRONG with them.

That's fine ChrisL Transgender people and their advocates ARE arguing they are exceptions,
and not like other situations.

What I'd tell any LGBT friends is the same thing I tell my prolife Christian friends.
Regardless of their views and intent, these are faith based. And by Constitutional laws, no beliefs
can be imposed through govt unless people CONSENT to those policies, it can never be forced.

I would love for everyone to access spiritual healing that would save lives, and prevent half the tragedies I read in the news every day. But as long as it is faith based, and not YET proven by science,
it remains a free choice and is not a proven treatment that more people could access.

So even though people die everyday, of diseases, abuse, addiction, by criminal illness or sick behavior by others that could have been cured,
spiritual healing cannot be implemented by govt because it is faith based. There would have to be some medically proven process, as valid therapy, and maybe it could be offered as a choice on a more public level.

You still have to respect the beliefs and faith of other people. If you present solutions that are so effective, they choose to adopt them, that is respecting free choice and equal freedom; there is no need to abuse force of law and govt to impose and bully others to change their beliefs, much less punish anyone.

If you don't want someone else's beliefs pushed through govt on you,
it's only fair not to do the same to someone else but respect their free choice and diversity of beliefs

I don't know why you are talking about government. I'm talking about people who feed delusions, and that is especially wrong when it involves a child who may not realize the "permanency" of the situation. Children are still in the process of growing and learning about themselves and life. They are not yet fully matured and may be just going through a phase or may be victims of abuse. There could be many, many different reasons for them feeling confused about their sexuality/gender. It's not right to mess with their normal and healthy "bodies" because of a sense of confusion they might be going through, when no one can tell whether that might be temporary.

 

[Jack4jill]

I don't think screwing around with their hormones and macabre surgery is the answer. I think the answer is intensive psychiatric treatment. For these "doctors" to be recommending and giving out hormones to children who do not have a genetic disorder and who have healthy and normally functioning body parts . . . that is sooo unethical.

Therapy is normal for these kids, don't worry about it.

What you want is for someone to stand them naked before a mirror and say see, you're a boy. That's great unles their mind says that's not true.

The true sex organ, the true gender organ, is the brain. Over time that, not the body, tells you who you are.

you are a victim of psychobabble. Sex is determined by anatomy, not thoughts.

This whole thing is a pile of bullshit, created to take us off of the real failures of Obama and the corruption of the hildebeast. Those assholes would have us revise our entire culture so that a few hundred people with mental illness don't get their feelings hurt.

This is bullshit, total unadulterated bullshit.

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

"The Six Most Common Karyotypes
The six biological karyotype sexes that do not result in death to the fetus are:

• X – Roughly 1 in 2,000 to 1 in 5,000 people (Turner’s )
• XX – Most common form of female
• XXY – Roughly 1 in 500 to 1 in 1,000 people (Klinefelter)
• XY – Most common form of male
• XYY – Roughly 1 out of 1,000 people
• XXXY – Roughly 1 in 18,000 to 1 in 50,000 births

When you consider that there are 7,000,000,000 alive on the planet, there are almost assuredly tens of millions of people who are not male or female. Many times, these people are unaware of their true sex. It’s interesting to note that everyone assumes that they, personally, are XY or XX. One study in Great Britain showed that 97 out of 100 people who were XYY had no idea. They thought they were a traditional male and had few signs otherwise.

Even today, we irrationally, and rather stupidly, think of someone as a “man” if they look masculine and as a “woman” if the look feminine. It’s entirely arbitrary and can lead to some significant misunderstandings of how the world actually works."
The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

 

[ChrisL]

They are a genetic anomaly and not the same as operating on a person without such an abnormality. Apples and oranges.

Male or female, bitch?

A genetic anomaly. Sorry if you don't know what that means, bastard.

That is hilarious. Unfortunately, I have to get ready for work now, so I'll leave this moron for you to handle.

And she runs away, as usual. Stupid ****.

You are a nasty turd face, that's for sure. Disgusting and nasty, like trash.

 

[ChrisL]

I don't think screwing around with their hormones and macabre surgery is the answer. I think the answer is intensive psychiatric treatment. For these "doctors" to be recommending and giving out hormones to children who do not have a genetic disorder and who have healthy and normally functioning body parts . . . that is sooo unethical.

Therapy is normal for these kids, don't worry about it.

What you want is for someone to stand them naked before a mirror and say see, you're a boy. That's great unles their mind says that's not true.

The true sex organ, the true gender organ, is the brain. Over time that, not the body, tells you who you are.

you are a victim of psychobabble. Sex is determined by anatomy, not thoughts.

This whole thing is a pile of bullshit, created to take us off of the real failures of Obama and the corruption of the hildebeast. Those assholes would have us revise our entire culture so that a few hundred people with mental illness don't get their feelings hurt.

This is bullshit, total unadulterated bullshit.

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

You don't know anything about science apparently . . . BIOLOGY, learn it.

 

[Silhouette]

Do a cheek swab on someone claiming they're a transgender. 99% of the time you're going to find plain old XX or Xy chromosomes. So, time to bury that strawman and discuss the real issue: people playing pretend don't have "rights" to force others to play along.

 

[ChrisL]

These transgender people are NOT victims of a genetic mutation. They are confused in their mind, and that is probably due to some kind of early childhood trauma.

 

[Little-Acorn]

There's no such thing as a "transgender" man or woman.

People like Bruce Jenner (or whatever name he goes by this week) are simply a man who has undergone voluntary genital mutilation, and acquired a drug habit (hormones).

He is no more a woman, than an apple tree is now an orange tree because you picked off some of the apples and tied a few oranges to the branches, and injected some orange juice under the bark.

If Jenner wants to do what he did, fine, I don't have a problem with it. But trying to make laws to force the rest of us to allow a man into a woman's bathroom, drug habit or not, is ludicrous.

 

[amrchaos]

Intrasex and transgender is not the same thing.

Intrasex are people born with some development of both sex organs. This is a physical condition.

Transgender people are people that have one set of sex organs but believe they are actually a member of the opposite sex. This a psychological condition and may be a mental illness in children.

The two are not the same thing. It is possible for the intersex not to which sex they are until puberty. A transgender person can know long before but rejects the identity associated with his/her physical sex.

Not the same thing, so drop the biology. We are talking psychology.

 

[ChrisL]

Intrasex and transgender is not the same thing.

Intrasex are people born with some development of both sex organs. This is a physical condition.

Transgender people are people that have one set of sex organs but believe they are actually a member of the opposite sex. This a psychological condition and may be a mental illness in children.

The two are not the same thing. It is possible for the intersex not to which sex they are until puberty. A transgender person can know long before but rejects the identity associated with his/her physical sex.

Not the same thing, so drop the biology. We are talking psychology.

Biology is included with that, as they are BIOLOGICALLY men or women, and the transgenderism is only a problem with their minds and not their bodies.

 

[Jack4jill]

Intrasex and transgender is not the same thing.

Intrasex are people born with some development of both sex organs. This is a physical condition.

Transgender people are people that have one set of sex organs but believe they are actually a member of the opposite sex. This a psychological condition and may be a mental illness in children.

The two are not the same thing. It is possible for the intersex not to which sex they are until puberty. A transgender person can know long before but rejects the identity associated with his/her physical sex.

Not the same thing, so drop the biology. We are talking psychology.

Biology says you can't define what is male and what is female.

 

[Jack4jill]

Therapy is normal for these kids, don't worry about it.

What you want is for someone to stand them naked before a mirror and say see, you're a boy. That's great unles their mind says that's not true.

The true sex organ, the true gender organ, is the brain. Over time that, not the body, tells you who you are.

you are a victim of psychobabble. Sex is determined by anatomy, not thoughts.

This whole thing is a pile of bullshit, created to take us off of the real failures of Obama and the corruption of the hildebeast. Those assholes would have us revise our entire culture so that a few hundred people with mental illness don't get their feelings hurt.

This is bullshit, total unadulterated bullshit.

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

You don't know anything about science apparently . . . BIOLOGY, learn it.

The biology has been posted, bitch.

The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

 

[Boss]

I don't think screwing around with their hormones and macabre surgery is the answer. I think the answer is intensive psychiatric treatment. For these "doctors" to be recommending and giving out hormones to children who do not have a genetic disorder and who have healthy and normally functioning body parts . . . that is sooo unethical.

Therapy is normal for these kids, don't worry about it.

What you want is for someone to stand them naked before a mirror and say see, you're a boy. That's great unles their mind says that's not true.

The true sex organ, the true gender organ, is the brain. Over time that, not the body, tells you who you are.

you are a victim of psychobabble. Sex is determined by anatomy, not thoughts.

This whole thing is a pile of bullshit, created to take us off of the real failures of Obama and the corruption of the hildebeast. Those assholes would have us revise our entire culture so that a few hundred people with mental illness don't get their feelings hurt.

This is bullshit, total unadulterated bullshit.

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

"The Six Most Common Karyotypes
The six biological karyotype sexes that do not result in death to the fetus are:

• X – Roughly 1 in 2,000 to 1 in 5,000 people (Turner’s )
• XX – Most common form of female
• XXY – Roughly 1 in 500 to 1 in 1,000 people (Klinefelter)
• XY – Most common form of male
• XYY – Roughly 1 out of 1,000 people
• XXXY – Roughly 1 in 18,000 to 1 in 50,000 births

When you consider that there are 7,000,000,000 alive on the planet, there are almost assuredly tens of millions of people who are not male or female. Many times, these people are unaware of their true sex. It’s interesting to note that everyone assumes that they, personally, are XY or XX. One study in Great Britain showed that 97 out of 100 people who were XYY had no idea. They thought they were a traditional male and had few signs otherwise.

Even today, we irrationally, and rather stupidly, think of someone as a “man” if they look masculine and as a “woman” if the look feminine. It’s entirely arbitrary and can lead to some significant misunderstandings of how the world actually works."
The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

Here's the problem with your argument, it doesn't matter. We can't have 6 public restrooms. Even if we did, you said yourself that many people aren't aware of which chromosomes they have, and even if they were, how are we to ensure the proper chromosomes are going into the proper restrooms? Would we need a new agency like TSA to screen your chromosomes before entering a restroom in public? So we cannot accommodate everyone... it's not practical.

We also can't naively go by the "honor system" and assume that every male going into a female facility is legitimately a person who is transgendering. The reason here is simple, people will exploit that situation who are not transgender but want to gain access for other reasons. We can't post a security guard outside every public restroom to ensure weirdos and perverts don't exploit the situation and even if we could, how would the security guard know?

So we have to have some rule that management can understand, that law enforcement can understand and that the public at large can understand... and which protects the individual right to privacy.... which trumps a right to accommodation always. Fortunately, we've had that rule for hundreds or thousands of years... it's your genitalia. If you have a penis, you go in the men's room, if you have a vagina, you go in the women's room... and that's how we've been handling this for years without any problems. No one is being asked to hold their pee... everyone is accommodated.

Now there may be exceptions where a person with a penis goes into a women's restroom without any problems and no one is the wiser. For the most part, if a man is caught in a women's restroom he can be arrested and charged for public indecency. The fact that some people get away with public indecency is not a reason to make it normalized.

And there is another reason this is important. There is a legal aspect that isn't largely considered. Let's say a woman is sexually assaulted by a male predator in a restroom. No one else is present. Legally, it is her word against his... but the fact he is a male in female restroom is evidence which weighs in her favor. He has no justifiable reason to be there, it's illegal. When we remove that illegality, he suddenly has a justifiable reason to be there and it reverts back to his word against hers. So you are essentially removing a layer of legal protection for women against predators. Accommodation is not a good enough reason to do that.

Finally, I want to touch on one more thing... Contrary to what you may think, I do not hate transgender people. I actually have a couple of friends and an Uncle who are transgenders. Now the Uncle has always been creepy and weird... my sister claims he tried to molest her when she was 9 years old. But my friends who are transgender seem to be good people with big hearts. I don't believe they are perverts in any way. The problem with this movement is the danger it poses to the transgender. You've now emboldened them and signaled that it's okay for them to use the female restrooms.... and society will have none of that. The result is going to be a precipitous increase in violent acts against transgenders. Sure, you can throw people in jail and charge them with a hate crime or whatever... it's still going to happen because you've enabled the situation.

 

[amrchaos]

Intrasex and transgender is not the same thing.

Intrasex are people born with some development of both sex organs. This is a physical condition.

Transgender people are people that have one set of sex organs but believe they are actually a member of the opposite sex. This a psychological condition and may be a mental illness in children.

The two are not the same thing. It is possible for the intersex not to which sex they are until puberty. A transgender person can know long before but rejects the identity associated with his/her physical sex.

Not the same thing, so drop the biology. We are talking psychology.

Biology says you can't define what is male and what is female.

We are talking psychologicalcategory against discernible physical sex. We are talking about gender dysophia, not the many varied forms of intersex and the genetic mutation s that classify it.

You are way off base here.

 

[ChrisL]

you are a victim of psychobabble. Sex is determined by anatomy, not thoughts.

This whole thing is a pile of bullshit, created to take us off of the real failures of Obama and the corruption of the hildebeast. Those assholes would have us revise our entire culture so that a few hundred people with mental illness don't get their feelings hurt.

This is bullshit, total unadulterated bullshit.

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

You don't know anything about science apparently . . . BIOLOGY, learn it.

The biology has been posted, bitch.

The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

Genetic mutations don't count. Are you really that stupid?

 

[ChrisL]

you are a victim of psychobabble. Sex is determined by anatomy, not thoughts.

This whole thing is a pile of bullshit, created to take us off of the real failures of Obama and the corruption of the hildebeast. Those assholes would have us revise our entire culture so that a few hundred people with mental illness don't get their feelings hurt.

This is bullshit, total unadulterated bullshit.

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

You don't know anything about science apparently . . . BIOLOGY, learn it.

The biology has been posted, bitch.

The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

Transgenders do NOT have a genetic mutation. They have a mental illness.

 

[Jack4jill]

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

You don't know anything about science apparently . . . BIOLOGY, learn it.

The biology has been posted, bitch.

The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

Transgenders do NOT have a genetic mutation. They have a mental illness.

How do you know?

Right, you don't. You don't even know what is or isn't male.

 

[Jack4jill]

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

You don't know anything about science apparently . . . BIOLOGY, learn it.

The biology has been posted, bitch.

The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

Transgenders do NOT have a genetic mutation. They have a mental illness.

Those aren't mutations, those are variations you stupid bitch. And they walk the earth just like you do, some of them male and female at very same time.

 

[Jack4jill]

Intrasex and transgender is not the same thing.

Intrasex are people born with some development of both sex organs. This is a physical condition.

Transgender people are people that have one set of sex organs but believe they are actually a member of the opposite sex. This a psychological condition and may be a mental illness in children.

The two are not the same thing. It is possible for the intersex not to which sex they are until puberty. A transgender person can know long before but rejects the identity associated with his/her physical sex.

Not the same thing, so drop the biology. We are talking psychology.

Biology says you can't define what is male and what is female.

We are talking psychologicalcategory against discernible physical sex. We are talking about gender dysophia, not the many varied forms of intersex and the genetic mutation s that classify it.

You are way off base here.

Physical sex? What sex is an XY female, male or female?

 

[emilynghiem]

I don't think screwing around with their hormones and macabre surgery is the answer. I think the answer is intensive psychiatric treatment. For these "doctors" to be recommending and giving out hormones to children who do not have a genetic disorder and who have healthy and normally functioning body parts . . . that is sooo unethical.

Therapy is normal for these kids, don't worry about it.

What you want is for someone to stand them naked before a mirror and say see, you're a boy. That's great unles their mind says that's not true.

The true sex organ, the true gender organ, is the brain. Over time that, not the body, tells you who you are.

you are a victim of psychobabble. Sex is determined by anatomy, not thoughts.

This whole thing is a pile of bullshit, created to take us off of the real failures of Obama and the corruption of the hildebeast. Those assholes would have us revise our entire culture so that a few hundred people with mental illness don't get their feelings hurt.

This is bullshit, total unadulterated bullshit.

If sex is determined by anatomy, how come we have babies we have to pick a sex for?

And how come we have toddlers who are transsexual? What's in the underpants doesn't always match a simple A or B choice.

Vanilla, chocolate, and what do you know, strawberry.

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

"The Six Most Common Karyotypes
The six biological karyotype sexes that do not result in death to the fetus are:

• X – Roughly 1 in 2,000 to 1 in 5,000 people (Turner’s )
• XX – Most common form of female
• XXY – Roughly 1 in 500 to 1 in 1,000 people (Klinefelter)
• XY – Most common form of male
• XYY – Roughly 1 out of 1,000 people
• XXXY – Roughly 1 in 18,000 to 1 in 50,000 births

When you consider that there are 7,000,000,000 alive on the planet, there are almost assuredly tens of millions of people who are not male or female. Many times, these people are unaware of their true sex. It’s interesting to note that everyone assumes that they, personally, are XY or XX. One study in Great Britain showed that 97 out of 100 people who were XYY had no idea. They thought they were a traditional male and had few signs otherwise.

Even today, we irrationally, and rather stupidly, think of someone as a “man” if they look masculine and as a “woman” if the look feminine. It’s entirely arbitrary and can lead to some significant misunderstandings of how the world actually works."
The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

Hi Jack4jill now THIS is very interesting, thank you for posting.

There are also different ranges of voices in music, and people can be
soprano, alto-soprano, alto, tenor, tenor-bass, bass
or have an 8 octave range like Cyndi Lauper. I think Freddie Mercury's range
made him a legendary phenomenon in both opera and rock like no other.

Just because people can find their voices all over the scale
does not mean we can't label treble and bass parts.
It depends on the context. If Freddie Mercury is singing in falsetto,
then in that context it's a high soprano. If he's singing a lower part
in another piece or part of the same song, then that's tenor or bass.

I notice this in relationships, with what I call spiritual gender.
If people are playing the female/nurturing role that assists as a helper to the other,
or the male/authority role that leads as the one in charge; if someone is playing
the student or intern role, while the other person is playing the teacher or mentor role.

People can switch depending on context. In one case, someone who is a
fledging piano student, just learning the keys, may be a master in teaching electronics.

Does this mean this has to cause confusion over who is a teacher
and who is a student? People can change according to context.

So this is NOT about physical gender and trying to pin it down to one label for all situations.
When you are talking about what role people are acting internally, of course, that can change.
And it's THAT level of "gender identity" that people are trying to express; it is not unchanging
like physical gender is. What LGBT advocates are saying is that the "gender identity" level
is what they have the right to express as part of their personalities.

See more below on how this is NOT an issue of genes,
but how people identify and relate Spiritually or by Personality
that goes beyond genes:

===========================================
Here's some more research for you, Jack4jill
from "Can Homosexuality be Healed?" by Francis MacNutt

"The simplest indication that there is no gay gene comes from the studies of identical twins, in whom all the genes are identical. If there were a gay gene, both twins would necessarily be either heterosexual or homosexual. Most of the researchers who have studied identical twins in relation to homosexuality have hoped to prove that sexual orientation is genetic. But the studies show a 50 percent concordance rate, at best, when both twins were raised at home. And with twins raised separately by different families, studies demonstrate a concordance rate of zero. *[footnote] This research indicates, then, that there is no gay gene, although there may be a partial genetic influence. Even so, gay activies have largely convinced church leaders and the public that homosexuals have been created with a same-sex orientation."

NOTE: if you do believe people were born to be gay or live as and experience gay relationships, that is where I argue it can still be spiritually caused or predetermined independent of genetics. What we are spiritually, such as identifying Buddhist, or Muslim, or Christian is part of our spiritual path and personality and how we express our beliefs, but not necessarily in our genetics either. Yet people have their right to their religious expression without discrimination. So that is why I find a BETTER approach is to treat gender identity/orientation at the same level as people's religious beliefs, so these can be accommodated equally with no need to prove genetics. If you believe something, you automatically have the right to your own beliefs; but at the same time you cannot abuse govt to impose your beliefs on others, or punish them for not going along and following them.

 

[ChrisL]

total BS

It's S C I E N C E. Learn it.

You don't know anything about science apparently . . . BIOLOGY, learn it.

The biology has been posted, bitch.

The 6 Most Common Biological Sexes in Humans

Transgenders do NOT have a genetic mutation. They have a mental illness.

Those aren't mutations, those are variations you stupid bitch. And they walk the earth just like you do, some of them male and female at very same time.

They are genetic mutations of XX and XY genotypes. This isn't about birth defects. It's about transgenderism.