Excellent Argument Against Gun Control

[The2ndAmendment]

2nd Amendment -

I have no idea why Cuba would be a good basis of comparison for the US. It's small, it's not developed and it is not a western economy. Try the UK, Germany, Canada or France.

So at what cost? Your freedom and your liberty?

Countries like the UK, Germany, France and Canada are at least as free as the US, if not freer.

When innocent people are killed, they are not living free, are they? THEIR freedom also needs to be taken into account.

What separates out the US from other countries here is this manic paranoia about your own government. Other countries don't have that fear, and don't need to. If you don't like the government - don't vote for them.

They are only free for as long that the ruling powers ALLOW them the privilege of being free. At this current moment in time, their military(s) would not comply in oppressing the people.

Read that Federalist 46 above.

Also, read my signature. When the people are disarmed, they only freedoms they get are the freedoms the people with guns (government) allows them to have.

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Also, are you claiming that tyranny is impossible in the United States because we have elections?

 

[Saigon]

2nd amendment -

There is no rational reason for any of us to fear our governments, because our governments do not constitute a threat to our freedoms. Not at all, not in any way.

When was the last time the UK suffered tyranny? Or France? Canada?

The fact is that most western countries have no history of tyranny, and never will do. It simply is not in the cultural DNA.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

2nd amendment -

There is no rational reason for any of us to fear our governments, because our governments do not constitute a threat to our freedoms. Not at all, not in any way.

When was the last time the UK suffered tyranny? Or France? Canada?

The fact is that most western countries have no history of tyranny, and never will do. It simply is not in the cultural DNA.

I can name quite a few destructive governments that were democratically elected, do you want to go down this path?

 

[Saigon]

2nd Amendment -

I can name quite a few destructive governments that were democratically elected, do you want to go down this path?

Very, very, very few democratically elected governments have ever constitued a thread to their own citizenry. In most cases where they have, they have done so within a context of a society with a strong history of despotism, such as in Putin's Russia.

The obvious example of Hitler aside....how many examples can you think of where a democrati system elected a leader who then oppressed his own people?

 

[The2ndAmendment]

2nd Amendment -

I can name quite a few destructive governments that were democratically elected, do you want to go down this path?

Very, very, very few democratically elected governments have ever constitued a thread to their own citizenry. In most cases where they have, they have done so within a context of a society with a strong history of despotism, such as in Putin's Russia.

The obvious example of Hitler aside....how many examples can you think of where a democrati system elected a leader who then oppressed his own people?

A government does not need to go down the Genocide route to be considered "destructive."

That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it.

England wasn't committing genocide in the Colonies, but I can guarantee you that is was destructive.

 

[Saigon]

2nd Amendment -

The point here is that people do not need to defend themselves against their OWN government - they may well need to be defended against other governments.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

2nd Amendment -

The point here is that people do not need to defend themselves against their OWN government - they may well need to be defended against other governments.

If that idea comforts you, then let it be so.

 

[Saigon]

2nd Amendment -

I don't need to be comforted, because I am not the one of us in fear.

By all means list democracies in which tyrannical leaders have been elected, but I think we both know that in the past two hundred years there are only one or two examples from close to a hundred countries.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

2nd Amendment -

I don't need to be comforted, because I am not the one of us in fear.

By all means list democracies in which tyrannical leaders have been elected, but I think we both know that in the past two hundred years there are only one or two examples from close to a hundred countries.

You can start with the United States.

Bush was elected and re-elected.

Obama was elected and re-elected.

If you dissented, you were Un-American and put on the FBI terrorist list - Goodbye First Amendment

Patriot Act - Goodbye Fourth Amendment

NDAA - Goodbye H Corp and Amendments Five through Eight.

The Ninth and Tenth Amendments have been long dead.

Drones being quartered over our skies, creating a police state - Goodbye Third Amendment

All you have left is the Second Amendment, the only Amendment that can protect and restore the other nine.

Do you want to keep going down this road? It's a 72 hour drive. I'll be back tomorrow, I need to finally go to sleep. Get some yourself, you're going to need it if you wish to continue this.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Facts are an excellent argument against gun control.

Well, here are some facts:

The US has four times as many homicides as any other developed country.

The US has been ten and twenty times as many gun-related homicides as any other developed country.

Some 50,000 Americans were deliberately shot last year.

The UK now has its lowest homicide rate for 30 years. Australia's rate of suicide plumetted since instituting gun control.

In the US, 14,748 people were killed by guns last year. In France the number was 682. In Germany it was 690. In Spain it was 390.

Facts? Well here are some facts you hate too hear.
The U.S. has the most guns per person than any other country, yet the U.S. doesn't lead in gun deaths, nor do they lead in violent crimes nor does the U.S. lead in being a victim.
deaths by rifles were less than death by bats or blunt objects.

Some 50,000 Americans were deliberately shot last year.

Care to explain the reason why they were shot? And who shot them?

 

[Saigon]

2nd Amendment -

You seem to be proving my point here - no President in US history has ever attempted to serve a third term in office, proving that the checks and balances within your system work.

Any American can say what they like, where they like it - as they do on this board every day. How many of our posters appear on any FBI list?

 

[Saigon]

The U.S. has the most guns per person than any other country, yet the U.S. doesn't lead in gun deaths,

In the developed world, yes it does "lead" the world - and by some distance.

Congratulations again on having less murders than Zimbabwe.

 

[Saigon]

Big Reb -

Care to explain the reason why they were shot? And who shot them?

Please try and post honestly and with a little maturity and common sense.

 

[TemplarKormac]

2nd Amendment -

You seem to be proving my point here - no President in US history has ever attempted to serve a third term in office, proving that the checks and balances within your system work.

Any American can say what they like, where they like it - as they do on this board every day. How many of our posters appear on any FBI list?

Franklin Delano Roosevelt served three terms was elected for a fourth in 1945 and died in April that year, Saigon. The checks and balances system had not yet been fully established until the 22nd Amendment was passed limiting a C-in-C to two terms in office in any given 10 year period. Stop spinning history Saigon.

Caught red handed.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Big Reb -

Care to explain the reason why they were shot? And who shot them?

Please try and post honestly and with a little maturity and common sense.

I can't blame him for losing patience with you. You are too damned thick headed to reason with. You fudge the facts and consistently participate in brown nosing with your liberal buddies on these boards.

Pathetic man.

 

[Saigon]

Franklin Delano Roosevelt served three terms was elected for a fourth in 1945 and died in April that year, Saigon. The checks and balances system had not yet been fully established until the 22nd Amendment was passed limiting a C-in-C to two terms in office in any given 10 year period. Stop spinning history Saigon.

Caught red handed.

Yes, that's a very fair point - my apology. I had completely forgotten that.

 

[Saigon]

I can't blame him for losing patience with you. You are too damned thick headed to reason with. You fudge the facts and consistently participate in brown nosing with your liberal buddies on these boards.

Pathetic man.

He isn't losing patience - he is presenting a point which has absolutely no factual or logical basis whatsoever. Nice brown-nosing effort from you, though!

By all means go through the numbers I presented earlier on gun violence an address them if you can.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Big Reb -

Care to explain the reason why they were shot? And who shot them?

Please try and post honestly and with a little maturity and common sense.

Bitch do you think I will allow you the chance to disregard what I said?

Facts? Well here are some facts you hate too hear.
The U.S. has the most guns per person than any other country, yet the U.S. doesn't lead in gun deaths, nor do they lead in violent crimes nor does the U.S. lead in being a victim.
deaths by rifles were less than death by bats or blunt objects.

Some 50,000 Americans were deliberately shot last year.

Care to explain the reason why they were shot? And who shot them?

Address it or shut the fuck up

 

[Old Rocks]

One of the best 7 minute speeches on gun control ever. - YouTube

Best arguements for gun control, the posts of SJ and Big Rabble

 

[TemplarKormac]

The U.S. has the most guns per person than any other country, yet the U.S. doesn't lead in gun deaths,

In the developed world, yes it does "lead" the world - and by some distance.

Congratulations again on having less murders than Zimbabwe.

Convenient enough for you to put that little "in the developed world" line in there to make the US automatically the worst at something.