Executive Action: In Obama's own words...

[Kondor3]

...Democrats lost in Maryland and Massachusetts, Dude...stop deluding yourself about what this last election meant.

The remaining (and quickly evaporating) pool of Orgasmic ObamaBots are in denial - in a very real and clinical sense.

 

[Oldstyle]

Just curious, did any of you republicans bitch when Bush or your hero Reagan created Executive orders? No?

With all due respect, JFK...show me an Executive Action by either Bush or Reagan that flaunted existing laws passed by Congress like the EA that Obama is proposing would do!

Nice deflection but the question still stands. And what EAs is Obama "flaunted" existing law? Executive orders are directives on how the law should be enforced. So yeah, he can change how the law was enforced.

Deflection? You just stated that Reagan and Bush used EA the same way that Obama is planning to do with immigration. I simply asked you to provide an example of where Reagan or Bush used an EA to totally change the laws that Congress had passed.

 

[Kondor3]

Executive Orders were put in place to enable the President to do the country's business when Congress was not in session.

Nope. Cool story, though!

They are designed to execute the laws.

When Congress passes legislation, those laws contain sections which direct the Executive branch to flesh out the law. The law is the framework, and the Executive fleshes it out with regulations. EO's direct which departments are to carry out those tasks.

Regardless...

----------
...They were not put in place for the President to side step the people's representatives and rule by "decree".
----------

That's the REAL meat in that para...

As I said in another topic today, if you are going to fabricate a yardstick by which to measure the current occupant of the White House, don't whine when that same yardstick is used to measure prior and future occupants.

But we aren't talking about prior or future occupants.

We're talking about the current occupant.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

He knows that what he's proposing to do is illegal and simply doesn't care. This is a political calculation by Barack Obama that he can make the GOP out as the "bad guys" by forcing them into either a governmental shutdown or an attempt to impeach him...both of which will completely derail any legislation to fix the economy this coming year. It's akin to someone throwing a "stink bomb" into the gymnasium at a high school dance because they couldn't talk any of the girls into dancing with them.

I think it is actually a little more than that.
Of all Presidents, I have said that the one Obama has the most in common with is not Jimmy Carter, they are actually nothing alike at all, but Richard Nixon.
I believe that Obama still believes he has a mandate. I do not believe that he sees he lost the American people. As noted by his statement that "2/3 of the people didn't vote, I still hear those people" - alluding to, if not clinging to, a fact that most people still want him to do what he believes is right. Like I say, Richard Nixon.

Nixon would never have done what Obama is about to do, Iam. If Obama honestly believes that all those Democratic voters staying home was a "mandate" for him to continue doing what he's been doing, then he's either an idiot or is wearing political blinders.

Quite frankly I don't buy your explanation at all. I think this is an ego thing with Barack Obama. The GOP won control of the Senate. He was being marginalized. His last two years he would have been relegated to signing legislation that the Republicans were responsible for coming up with. Instead of allowing that to happen, Barry decided to make it all about himself again. He declared war on the GOP with his declaration of an Executive Action that he KNOWS will infuriate the GOP and destroy any chance of bi-partisanship on any legislation for years to come. This is a conscious choice by Barack Obama to bring the US government to a grinding halt rather than let the Republicans do anything that will improve the economy and make him look worse than he already does.

Oh I would disagree there, Nixon would have done more.
Both Nixon and Obama are narcissist. I don't think that is even up to debate.
Both believe they are/were above the constraints of their office - at the same time vehemently believing everyone else is NOT following rules.
Nixon was a man who would strongly be in support of censoring someone for stepping outside of the law - but at the same time believe, with sincerity, that he is not held to the same law. He said so.
Obama is a person, like Nixon, who believes he is special. He is more important, his opinions are inherently above others. And is visibly upset when someone even questions his statements/actions. He honestly does not understand the principle that he can be wrong.

 

[Oldstyle]

The amusing thing about your contention is that Barack Obama himself argued back in 2008 that a President had no business using EA's in such a manner and that if he became President he would end the practice.

 

[g5000]

The Right wasn't whining when Bush was acting like a dictator and wiped his ass with the Constitution. Hell, they were cheering him on.

Too fucking late to be all self-righteous over Obama's behavior now, kids.

 

[g5000]

The amusing thing about your contention is that Barack Obama himself argued back in 2008 that a President had no business using EA's in such a manner and that if he became President he would end the practice.

Absolutely. He said he was going to make a harder measuring stick, but he didn't. He still uses Bush's "I'm the Decider" yardstick.

 

[Kondor3]

The Right wasn't whining when Bush was acting like a dictator and wiped his ass with the Constitution. Hell, they were cheering him on...

Doesn't matter... we're not talking about Shrub now... we're talking about Obumble.

...Too fucking late to be all self-righteous over Obama's behavior now, kids.

Not at all... actually, right on time, by the look of it.

 

[g5000]

Executive Orders were put in place to enable the President to do the country's business when Congress was not in session.

Nope. Cool story, though!

They are designed to execute the laws.

When Congress passes legislation, those laws contain sections which direct the Executive branch to flesh out the law. The law is the framework, and the Executive fleshes it out with regulations. EO's direct which departments are to carry out those tasks.

Regardless...

----------
...They were not put in place for the President to side step the people's representatives and rule by "decree".
----------

That's the REAL meat in that para...

As I said in another topic today, if you are going to fabricate a yardstick by which to measure the current occupant of the White House, don't whine when that same yardstick is used to measure prior and future occupants.

But we aren't talking about prior or future occupants.

We're talking about the current occupant.

Yes, and hacks would love it if we make an exception for Obama in the way he is measured. They want to measure him in a partisan vacuum so their rabid hypocrisy can go unchallenged.

 

[Oldstyle]

He knows that what he's proposing to do is illegal and simply doesn't care. This is a political calculation by Barack Obama that he can make the GOP out as the "bad guys" by forcing them into either a governmental shutdown or an attempt to impeach him...both of which will completely derail any legislation to fix the economy this coming year. It's akin to someone throwing a "stink bomb" into the gymnasium at a high school dance because they couldn't talk any of the girls into dancing with them.

I think it is actually a little more than that.
Of all Presidents, I have said that the one Obama has the most in common with is not Jimmy Carter, they are actually nothing alike at all, but Richard Nixon.
I believe that Obama still believes he has a mandate. I do not believe that he sees he lost the American people. As noted by his statement that "2/3 of the people didn't vote, I still hear those people" - alluding to, if not clinging to, a fact that most people still want him to do what he believes is right. Like I say, Richard Nixon.

Nixon would never have done what Obama is about to do, Iam. If Obama honestly believes that all those Democratic voters staying home was a "mandate" for him to continue doing what he's been doing, then he's either an idiot or is wearing political blinders.

Quite frankly I don't buy your explanation at all. I think this is an ego thing with Barack Obama. The GOP won control of the Senate. He was being marginalized. His last two years he would have been relegated to signing legislation that the Republicans were responsible for coming up with. Instead of allowing that to happen, Barry decided to make it all about himself again. He declared war on the GOP with his declaration of an Executive Action that he KNOWS will infuriate the GOP and destroy any chance of bi-partisanship on any legislation for years to come. This is a conscious choice by Barack Obama to bring the US government to a grinding halt rather than let the Republicans do anything that will improve the economy and make him look worse than he already does.

Oh I would disagree there, Nixon would have done more.
Both Nixon and Obama are narcissist. I don't think that is even up to debate.
Both believe they are/were above the constraints of their office - at the same time vehemently believing everyone else is NOT following rules.
Nixon was a man who would strongly be in support of censoring someone for stepping outside of the law - but at the same time believe, with sincerity, that he is not held to the same law. He said so.
Obama is a person, like Nixon, who believes he is special. He is more important, his opinions are inherently above others. And is visibly upset when someone even questions his statements/actions. He honestly does not understand the principle that he can be wrong.

As a historian I would argue that Nixon was much more a paranoid than he was a narcissist. He spent much of his Presidency obsessed with the opposition's plots against him. The Watergate break-in was to see if the Democrats were plotting some type of dirty tricks against him in the upcoming election. You can probably trace Nixon's paranoia to the things that happened to him when he ran for President against John F. Kennedy. Narcissists don't compile "enemies lists"...paranoids do.

Now compare Nixon to Obama. Obama doesn't have paranoid tendencies because he's floated through life on a strong current of Affirmative Action bliss...where he's constantly been told that he's "exceptional" and "gifted" even when he hasn't accomplished anything. He's the guy who gets a Nobel Peace Prize simply for showing up the first day at the Oval Office. HE is the poster child for narcissism! You can't tell someone how wonderful they are for twenty plus years without them starting to believe it.

 

[g5000]

The Right wasn't whining when Bush was acting like a dictator and wiped his ass with the Constitution. Hell, they were cheering him on...

Doesn't matter... we're not talking about Shrub now... we're talking about Obumble.

...Too fucking late to be all self-righteous over Obama's behavior now, kids.

Not at all... actually, right on time, by the look of it.

Let this be a lesson to the hacks. When your guy is acting like a dipshit, it is just a matter of time before the dipshit torch gets passed to the other team. If you wait until then to whine, then you have zero integrity and zero weight in the subsequent debate.

 

[Kondor3]

...Yes, and hacks would love it if we make an exception for Obama in the way he is measured. They want to measure him in a partisan vacuum so their rabid hypocrisy can go unchallenged.

By Jove, I think you've got it.

Fun, ain't it?

Oh, and, this time around, they may just get away with it, for all intents and purposes.

Things have gotten that bad, I'm afraid, where any old excuse will do nicely, and to the Devil with the hypocrisy.

 

[Jarhead]

Just curious, did any of you republicans bitch when Bush or your hero Reagan created Executive orders? No?

Executive action to "rename a street to honor a fallen hero" is not the same as executive action as it pertains to a topic where the electorate is very equally divided.

How would anyone feel if a republican issues an executive order to prevent all abortions?

Sorry pal......it is not the executive action....it is the topic of what he is acting on.

Wake up and smell the coffee bro.

 

[JFK_USA]

The Right wasn't whining when Bush was acting like a dictator and wiped his ass with the Constitution. Hell, they were cheering him on.

Too fucking late to be all self-righteous over Obama's behavior now, kids.

The Bush Doctrine was given straight from Jesus according to the Far Right. He could do no wrong!

 

[Silhouette]

He knows that what he's proposing to do is illegal and simply doesn't care. This is a political calculation by Barack Obama that he can make the GOP out as the "bad guys" by forcing them into either a governmental shutdown or an attempt to impeach him...both of which will completely derail any legislation to fix the economy this coming year. It's akin to someone throwing a "stink bomb" into the gymnasium at a high school dance because they couldn't talk any of the girls into dancing with them.

Well the GOP could do wonders for the hispanic situation by acting and acting early so that any outfall will be forgotten in 2 years.

Here are some pragmatic solutions for the cheapest and most effective solution to the immigration problem.. Compromise on Illegal Aliens Win-Win US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

And being a dem who voted a protest-dem reluctant GOP vote this Midterm last week, let me just say to the democratic party who think they are working some cute angle that will get them votes...

1. No, it won't. Hispanics will bite the hand that feeds them if the dem platform is repugnant to their catholic roots The Democrat Dilemma A Palpable Party Rift US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

and

2. tens of millions of middle bloc dem voters just perceived the democratic party's leader as having just sucker punched their chances of finding work right in the gut. What was just done was the legitimization of millions of competition for good paying jobs, by those who will still be happy to take lower wages even though they are now "legal".

Thanks for creating a Banana Republic Odummy/dems!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Remember.....

He's a pathological liar

So what if he lied, that's what Marxists do!

 

[HenryBHough]

Based on America's Great Obamanation Experiment it's only logical that the next Republican president issue an Executive Order that all male Democrat Party adherents be castrated despite their pleas that they are already impotent.

 

[blackhawk]

Just curious was Obama lying then when he said he didn't have the authority to do this or is he lying now when he says he does?

 

[Roadrunner]

Executive Orders were put in place to enable the President to do the country's business when Congress was not in session.

Nope. Cool story, though!

They are designed to execute the laws.

When Congress passes legislation, those laws contain sections which direct the Executive branch to flesh out the law. The law is the framework, and the Executive fleshes it out with regulations. EO's direct which departments are to carry out those tasks.

Regardless...

----------
...They were not put in place for the President to side step the people's representatives and rule by "decree".
----------

That's the REAL meat in that para...

As I said in another topic today, if you are going to fabricate a yardstick by which to measure the current occupant of the White House, don't whine when that same yardstick is used to measure prior and future occupants.

Don't get me wrong, though. Obama made a promise that he was going to fashion a new, more difficult yardstick for himself. He broke that promise. He kept Bush's yardstick around.

Power usurped from the people rarely goes back to the people without a fight.

Republicans will use Obama's precedents to take this country so far to the right the dependent class will think, and maybe wish, they had died and gone to Hell.

 

[Roadrunner]

Executive Orders were put in place to enable the President to do the country's business when Congress was not in session.

Nope. Cool story, though!

They are designed to execute the laws.

When Congress passes legislation, those laws contain sections which direct the Executive branch to flesh out the law. The law is the framework, and the Executive fleshes it out with regulations. EO's direct which departments are to carry out those tasks.

Regardless...

----------
...They were not put in place for the President to side step the people's representatives and rule by "decree".
----------

That's the REAL meat in that para...

As I said in another topic today, if you are going to fabricate a yardstick by which to measure the current occupant of the White House, don't whine when that same yardstick is used to measure prior and future occupants.

But we aren't talking about prior or future occupants.

We're talking about the current occupant.

Yes, and hacks would love it if we make an exception for Obama in the way he is measured. They want to measure him in a partisan vacuum so their rabid hypocrisy can go unchallenged.

Saul would be proud.