Franklin Roosevelt: A God To The Uninformed

[Camp]

PoliticalChic has been on her anti FDR Crusade here at USMB for years. Same old nonsense year after year. She is losing her Crusade. FDR's popularity has actually improved to the point where he has been rated #1 Greatest President a couple of times. Imagine, rated Greater than Washington or Lincoln.

And yet YOU cannot defend him.

I defend him just fine, as do others. You are one of the last hold outs from the time when many posters would chime in to support PC and her nonsense and dopey rants about FDR. They have all mostly vanished. Tired of being bitch slapped into reality and of less status than amateurs on the topics of history in regards to FDR and WWII.

 

[Camp]

Many Allied leaders agreed with General Wedemeyer, that Roosevelt's 'unconditional surrender' announcement unified and stiffened Germany's resolve not to surrender, ....they knew that it would prolong the war. Included with Wedermeyer were Winston Churchill, Brit foreign minister Anthony Eden, Secretary of State Cordell Hull, Ambassador to Moscow Averell Harriman, and others.
" The Memoirs of Cordell Hull in two volumes," 1570, 1575

Those were of course, not the military tacticians, Generals and Admirals and experts FDR listened to for forming his own doctrines and strategies which won the war quickly and with minimal casualties to US forces. Remember, Churchill's campaigns had been dismal failures until British forces combined with American forces under the leadership of Marshall and Eisenhower. The rest of the names on that list are diplomats. FDR didn't win the war by listening to diplomats.

 

[PoliticalChic]

PoliticalChic has been on her anti FDR Crusade here at USMB for years. Same old nonsense year after year. She is losing her Crusade. FDR's popularity has actually improved to the point where he has been rated #1 Greatest President a couple of times. Imagine, rated Greater than Washington or Lincoln.

"PoliticalChic has been on her anti FDR Crusade..."


You've mischaracterized the crusade: it is to provide the truth about Roosevelt.


And, of course, you've been more than helpful by not being able to deny anything I've posted.

I have proved your wacky thesis's to be false many times. I have event debunked this one in this very thread. You are just hooked on the belief that if you repeat your nonsense enough times people will believe it and hence, it becomes true.

It comes down to a very basic principal. You can not declare subjective opinions and allegations to be fact. Facts are facts. Opinions are opinions. Despite what you have been told, there is no reality in "alternate facts". Alternate facts are what you call lies when you are caught lying.

Everything I've posted is documented.

Sooo.....nothing that you can dispute beyond your hot air???


Excellent.....I win again.

 

[Camp]

PoliticalChic has been on her anti FDR Crusade here at USMB for years. Same old nonsense year after year. She is losing her Crusade. FDR's popularity has actually improved to the point where he has been rated #1 Greatest President a couple of times. Imagine, rated Greater than Washington or Lincoln.

"PoliticalChic has been on her anti FDR Crusade..."


You've mischaracterized the crusade: it is to provide the truth about Roosevelt.


And, of course, you've been more than helpful by not being able to deny anything I've posted.

I have proved your wacky thesis's to be false many times. I have event debunked this one in this very thread. You are just hooked on the belief that if you repeat your nonsense enough times people will believe it and hence, it becomes true.

It comes down to a very basic principal. You can not declare subjective opinions and allegations to be fact. Facts are facts. Opinions are opinions. Despite what you have been told, there is no reality in "alternate facts". Alternate facts are what you call lies when you are caught lying.

Everything I've posted is documented.

Sooo.....nothing that you can dispute beyond your hot air???


Excellent.....I win again.

OK, now that that is settled you can go feed and groom your Unicorn.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Many Allied leaders agreed with General Wedemeyer, that Roosevelt's 'unconditional surrender' announcement unified and stiffened Germany's resolve not to surrender, ....they knew that it would prolong the war. Included with Wedermeyer were Winston Churchill, Brit foreign minister Anthony Eden, Secretary of State Cordell Hull, Ambassador to Moscow Averell Harriman, and others.
" The Memoirs of Cordell Hull in two volumes," 1570, 1575

Those were of course, not the military tacticians, Generals and Admirals and experts FDR listened to for forming his own doctrines and strategies which won the war quickly and with minimal casualties to US forces. Remember, Churchill's campaigns had been dismal failures until British forces combined with American forces under the leadership of Marshall and Eisenhower. The rest of the names on that list are diplomats. FDR didn't win the war by listening to diplomats.

'FDR didn't win the war by listening to diplomats.'

Watch me eviscerate you again.
1. FDR listened to his lord and master, Joseph Stalin

2. Stalin demanded 'a second front' be opened in Europe, to hinder Hitler's attacks on Russia....and a major question was whether it would be via Italy, or from northern France, i.e., Normandy.

Since Stalin's agenda had always been to occupy Eastern Europe, he ordered that it be via France, leaving the middle of Europe to the occupation by the Red Army.

3. How about Eisenhower's assessment at the time?

"Italy was the correct place in which to deploy our main forces and the objective should be the Valle of the PO. In no other area could we so well threaten the whole German structure including France, the Balkans and the Reich itself. Here also our air would be closer to vital objectives in Germany."
FRUS: The conferences at Cairo and Tehran, 1943, p.359-361
That report was published in "Foreign Relations of the United States" in 1961


4. Eisenhower, the military expert, favored a limited probe via France and the real attack elsewhere, and Hanson Baldwin, long-time military editor of the New York Times, thought the the western attack 'fantastic,' and Churchill was opposed as well.

But Stalin favored it....so, therefore did his agent, Harry Hopkins.


5. FDR....ever loyal to Stalin, nixes the attack via Italy.....and followed Stalin's instructions.





Notice how I prove and document everything I post.

 

[Moonglow]

2. Stalin demanded 'a second front' be opened in Europe, to hinder Hitler's attacks on Russia....and a major question was whether it would be via Italy, or from northern France, i.e., Normandy.

Since Stalin's agenda had always been to occupy Eastern Europe, he ordered that it be via France, leaving the middle of Europe to the occupation by the Red Army.

FDR's first move was to invade Northern Africa and drive out the Nazi's there, then on to Sicily then Italy, putting them out of the war early..A strategy by FDR not endorsed by Stalin, he was livid about it...So disproving Polislick's notions.

 

[rightwinger]

Many Allied leaders agreed with General Wedemeyer, that Roosevelt's 'unconditional surrender' announcement unified and stiffened Germany's resolve not to surrender, ....they knew that it would prolong the war. Included with Wedermeyer were Winston Churchill, Brit foreign minister Anthony Eden, Secretary of State Cordell Hull, Ambassador to Moscow Averell Harriman, and others.
" The Memoirs of Cordell Hull in two volumes," 1570, 1575

Those were of course, not the military tacticians, Generals and Admirals and experts FDR listened to for forming his own doctrines and strategies which won the war quickly and with minimal casualties to US forces. Remember, Churchill's campaigns had been dismal failures until British forces combined with American forces under the leadership of Marshall and Eisenhower. The rest of the names on that list are diplomats. FDR didn't win the war by listening to diplomats.

'FDR didn't win the war by listening to diplomats.'

Watch me eviscerate you again.
1. FDR listened to his lord and master, Joseph Stalin

2. Stalin demanded 'a second front' be opened in Europe, to hinder Hitler's attacks on Russia....and a major question was whether it would be via Italy, or from northern France, i.e., Normandy.

Since Stalin's agenda had always been to occupy Eastern Europe, he ordered that it be via France, leaving the middle of Europe to the occupation by the Red Army.

3. How about Eisenhower's assessment at the time?

"Italy was the correct place in which to deploy our main forces and the objective should be the Valle of the PO. In no other area could we so well threaten the whole German structure including France, the Balkans and the Reich itself. Here also our air would be closer to vital objectives in Germany."
FRUS: The conferences at Cairo and Tehran, 1943, p.359-361
That report was published in "Foreign Relations of the United States" in 1961


4. Eisenhower, the military expert, favored a limited probe via France and the real attack elsewhere, and Hanson Baldwin, long-time military editor of the New York Times, thought the the western attack 'fantastic,' and Churchill was opposed as well.

But Stalin favored it....so, therefore did his agent, Harry Hopkins.


5. FDR....ever loyal to Stalin, nixes the attack via Italy.....and followed Stalin's instructions.





Notice how I prove and document everything I post.

The US did invade Italy and our forces were bogged down in mountainous terrain suffering massive casualties

They never did achieve that breakout that PC brags would have been so easy

 

[PoliticalChic]

10. Lest any be mislead into believing that American lives were a priority to Roosevelt and his coterie, he let Stalin….his erstwhile ally….. Stalin keep some 25,000 American soldiers as prisoners after the war.




For Eisenhower, following orders was more important than either swiftly winning the war, or even preserving the lives of his troops.
.... he was selected because he passed the big test: he was OK'd by Stalin. Evidence here:


" By May 15, 1945, the Pentagon believed 25,000 American POWs "liberated" by the Red Army were still being held hostage to Soviet demands that all "Soviet citizens" be returned to Soviet control, "without exception" and by force if necessary, as agreed to at the Yalta Conference in February 1945.

When the U.S. refused to return some military formations composed of Soviet citizens, such as the First Ukrainian SS Division, Stalin retaliated by returning only 4,116 of the [25,000] hostage American POWs.

On June 1, 1945, the United States Government issued documents, signed by General Dwight D. Eisenhower, explaining away the loss of approximately 20,000 POWs remaining under Stalin's control."
http://www.nationalalliance.org/wwii/wwii.htm
National Alliance of Families





This is not idle conversation.....this is 20,000 American boys left to die in Stalin's gulags by the Roosevelt administration.

Left by Roosevelt, Hopkins, Marshall.....
....and Eisenhower.





11. Five day after V-E Day, the AP filed a startling news report from SHAEF: "Nearly half of the estimated 200,000 British and 76,000 American prisoners of war still in Germany are believed to be within the Russian zone of occupation and Supreme Headquarters has twice requested a meeting or arrangement to arrange their return."
Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 39."SHAEF Asks Russians About Freed PW's", AP Dispatch, ADVANCE HEADQUARTERS, Reims, France, May 12, 1945

a. On May 19, 1945, Eisenhower signed a cable stating "Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000"


b. Americans in Soviet custody were "in effect being held hostage"; "we may find a reluctance to return them all..." The realization began to dawn that they may never come home at all.
Major R.W. Barker, 'Report on Conference With Russian Officials Relative to Repatriation of Prisoners of War, May 23, 1945, See Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 41.



Behind the scenes, on May 19, 1945, Supreme Commander Eisenhower himself signed a cable stating, “Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000.”

What happened? The Senate report goes on to assemble the relevant record of subsequent statements, memos, tallies and the like to arrive at its bottom line: between 12,500 and 20,000 U.S. servicemen were left behind after World.







"I can’t think of anything that puts a more American face on this uniquely twentieth-century record of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons, Americans of successive generations beginning back before the so-called Greatest Generation, all the way up to the baby boomers. Along with their long-suffering families, they would become the uniquely American sacrifice to the conspiracy of silence that improbably held the Free World and the Un-Free World together, partners in crime, over the course of the twentieth century. Sacrifices, all, to American betrayal."
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter 11
The Death of the Grown-Up | Diana West > Home - Memorial




“…of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons…”




Let's hear those Roosevelt fluffers defend this.

 

[Moonglow]

Many Allied leaders agreed with General Wedemeyer, that Roosevelt's 'unconditional surrender' announcement unified and stiffened Germany's resolve not to surrender, ....they knew that it would prolong the war. Included with Wedermeyer were Winston Churchill, Brit foreign minister Anthony Eden, Secretary of State Cordell Hull, Ambassador to Moscow Averell Harriman, and others.
" The Memoirs of Cordell Hull in two volumes," 1570, 1575

Those were of course, not the military tacticians, Generals and Admirals and experts FDR listened to for forming his own doctrines and strategies which won the war quickly and with minimal casualties to US forces. Remember, Churchill's campaigns had been dismal failures until British forces combined with American forces under the leadership of Marshall and Eisenhower. The rest of the names on that list are diplomats. FDR didn't win the war by listening to diplomats.

'FDR didn't win the war by listening to diplomats.'

Watch me eviscerate you again.
1. FDR listened to his lord and master, Joseph Stalin

2. Stalin demanded 'a second front' be opened in Europe, to hinder Hitler's attacks on Russia....and a major question was whether it would be via Italy, or from northern France, i.e., Normandy.

Since Stalin's agenda had always been to occupy Eastern Europe, he ordered that it be via France, leaving the middle of Europe to the occupation by the Red Army.

3. How about Eisenhower's assessment at the time?

"Italy was the correct place in which to deploy our main forces and the objective should be the Valle of the PO. In no other area could we so well threaten the whole German structure including France, the Balkans and the Reich itself. Here also our air would be closer to vital objectives in Germany."
FRUS: The conferences at Cairo and Tehran, 1943, p.359-361
That report was published in "Foreign Relations of the United States" in 1961


4. Eisenhower, the military expert, favored a limited probe via France and the real attack elsewhere, and Hanson Baldwin, long-time military editor of the New York Times, thought the the western attack 'fantastic,' and Churchill was opposed as well.

But Stalin favored it....so, therefore did his agent, Harry Hopkins.


5. FDR....ever loyal to Stalin, nixes the attack via Italy.....and followed Stalin's instructions.





Notice how I prove and document everything I post.

The US did invade Italy and our forces were bogged down in mountainous terrain suffering massive casualties

They never did receive that breakout that PC brags would have been so easy

Why it's easy to sit on one's pimpled ass and play general from a chair..Yet, reality is another creature that Polislick has never encountered...Yet knows all about.

 

[Moonglow]

10. Lest any be mislead into believing that American lives were a priority to Roosevelt and his coterie, he let Stalin….his erstwhile ally….. Stalin keep some 25,000 American soldiers as prisoners after the war.




For Eisenhower, following orders was more important than either swiftly winning the war, or even preserving the lives of his troops.
.... he was selected because he passed the big test: he was OK'd by Stalin. Evidence here:


" By May 15, 1945, the Pentagon believed 25,000 American POWs "liberated" by the Red Army were still being held hostage to Soviet demands that all "Soviet citizens" be returned to Soviet control, "without exception" and by force if necessary, as agreed to at the Yalta Conference in February 1945.

When the U.S. refused to return some military formations composed of Soviet citizens, such as the First Ukrainian SS Division, Stalin retaliated by returning only 4,116 of the [25,000] hostage American POWs.

On June 1, 1945, the United States Government issued documents, signed by General Dwight D. Eisenhower, explaining away the loss of approximately 20,000 POWs remaining under Stalin's control."
http://www.nationalalliance.org/wwii/wwii.htm
National Alliance of Families





This is not idle conversation.....this is 20,000 American boys left to die in Stalin's gulags by the Roosevelt administration.

Left by Roosevelt, Hopkins, Marshall.....
....and Eisenhower.





11. Five day after V-E Day, the AP filed a startling news report from SHAEF: "Nearly half of the estimated 200,000 British and 76,000 American prisoners of war still in Germany are believed to be within the Russian zone of occupation and Supreme Headquarters has twice requested a meeting or arrangement to arrange their return."
Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 39."SHAEF Asks Russians About Freed PW's", AP Dispatch, ADVANCE HEADQUARTERS, Reims, France, May 12, 1945

a. On May 19, 1945, Eisenhower signed a cable stating "Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000"


b. Americans in Soviet custody were "in effect being held hostage"; "we may find a reluctance to return them all..." The realization began to dawn that they may never come home at all.
Major R.W. Barker, 'Report on Conference With Russian Officials Relative to Repatriation of Prisoners of War, May 23, 1945, See Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 41.



Behind the scenes, on May 19, 1945, Supreme Commander Eisenhower himself signed a cable stating, “Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000.”

What happened? The Senate report goes on to assemble the relevant record of subsequent statements, memos, tallies and the like to arrive at its bottom line: between 12,500 and 20,000 U.S. servicemen were left behind after World.







"I can’t think of anything that puts a more American face on this uniquely twentieth-century record of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons, Americans of successive generations beginning back before the so-called Greatest Generation, all the way up to the baby boomers. Along with their long-suffering families, they would become the uniquely American sacrifice to the conspiracy of silence that improbably held the Free World and the Un-Free World together, partners in crime, over the course of the twentieth century. Sacrifices, all, to American betrayal."
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter 11
The Death of the Grown-Up | Diana West > Home - Memorial




“…of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons…”




Let's hear those Roosevelt fluffers defend this.

FDR was dead by May 1945. Thus destroying another story of intrique made up by an America hating Asian immigrant. You and Unk make quite the pair.

 

[rightwinger]

10. Lest any be mislead into believing that American lives were a priority to Roosevelt and his coterie, he let Stalin….his erstwhile ally….. Stalin keep some 25,000 American soldiers as prisoners after the war.




For Eisenhower, following orders was more important than either swiftly winning the war, or even preserving the lives of his troops.
.... he was selected because he passed the big test: he was OK'd by Stalin. Evidence here:


" By May 15, 1945, the Pentagon believed 25,000 American POWs "liberated" by the Red Army were still being held hostage to Soviet demands that all "Soviet citizens" be returned to Soviet control, "without exception" and by force if necessary, as agreed to at the Yalta Conference in February 1945.

When the U.S. refused to return some military formations composed of Soviet citizens, such as the First Ukrainian SS Division, Stalin retaliated by returning only 4,116 of the [25,000] hostage American POWs.

On June 1, 1945, the United States Government issued documents, signed by General Dwight D. Eisenhower, explaining away the loss of approximately 20,000 POWs remaining under Stalin's control."
http://www.nationalalliance.org/wwii/wwii.htm
National Alliance of Families





This is not idle conversation.....this is 20,000 American boys left to die in Stalin's gulags by the Roosevelt administration.

Left by Roosevelt, Hopkins, Marshall.....
....and Eisenhower.





11. Five day after V-E Day, the AP filed a startling news report from SHAEF: "Nearly half of the estimated 200,000 British and 76,000 American prisoners of war still in Germany are believed to be within the Russian zone of occupation and Supreme Headquarters has twice requested a meeting or arrangement to arrange their return."
Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 39."SHAEF Asks Russians About Freed PW's", AP Dispatch, ADVANCE HEADQUARTERS, Reims, France, May 12, 1945

a. On May 19, 1945, Eisenhower signed a cable stating "Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000"


b. Americans in Soviet custody were "in effect being held hostage"; "we may find a reluctance to return them all..." The realization began to dawn that they may never come home at all.
Major R.W. Barker, 'Report on Conference With Russian Officials Relative to Repatriation of Prisoners of War, May 23, 1945, See Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 41.



Behind the scenes, on May 19, 1945, Supreme Commander Eisenhower himself signed a cable stating, “Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000.”

What happened? The Senate report goes on to assemble the relevant record of subsequent statements, memos, tallies and the like to arrive at its bottom line: between 12,500 and 20,000 U.S. servicemen were left behind after World.







"I can’t think of anything that puts a more American face on this uniquely twentieth-century record of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons, Americans of successive generations beginning back before the so-called Greatest Generation, all the way up to the baby boomers. Along with their long-suffering families, they would become the uniquely American sacrifice to the conspiracy of silence that improbably held the Free World and the Un-Free World together, partners in crime, over the course of the twentieth century. Sacrifices, all, to American betrayal."
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter 11
The Death of the Grown-Up | Diana West > Home - Memorial




“…of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons…”




Let's hear those Roosevelt fluffers defend this.

Political Chic twisted logic

By May 15, 1945, the Pentagon believed 25,000 American POWs "liberated" by the Red Army were still being held hostage to Soviet demands that all "Soviet citizens" be returned to Soviet control, "without exception" and by force if necessary, as agreed to at the Yalta Conference in February 1945.


Note to PC.....FDR Died in April 1945

 

[Unkotare]

PoliticalChic has been on her anti FDR Crusade here at USMB for years. Same old nonsense year after year. She is losing her Crusade. FDR's popularity has actually improved to the point where he has been rated #1 Greatest President a couple of times. Imagine, rated Greater than Washington or Lincoln.

And yet YOU cannot defend him.

I defend him just fine.....

You never even try to. You just repeat logical fallacies over and over.

 

[PoliticalChic]

I was hoping to trick one of the dunces into finding Roosevelt innocent based on the date of his death.

I got two of the dunces.


“The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones.”
Shakespeare




Even after Roosevelt’s death, his policies continued.


On March 26, 1945, Army Chief of Staff George C. Marshall issued the following order: "Censor all stories, delete criticism Russian treatment." This was aimed at those Americans who had been POWs of the Red Army. Note that some 20,000 US soldiers were never returned.


a. FDR died April 12th..but, based on the date of Marshall's order, the White House clearly knew of the following prior to that:

b. " By May 15, 1945, the Pentagon believed 25,000 American POWs "liberated" by the Red Army were still being held hostage to Soviet demands that all "Soviet citizens" be returned to Soviet control, "without exception" and by force if necessary, as agreed to at the Yalta Conference in February 1945.

When the U.S. refused to return some military formations composed of Soviet citizens, such as the First Ukrainian SS Division, Stalin retaliated by returning only 4,116 of the hostage American POWs. On June 1, 1945, the United States Government issued documents, signed by General Dwight D. Eisenhower, explaining away the loss of approximately 20,000 POWs remaining under Stalin's control." http://www.nationalalliance.org/wwii/wwii.html





BTW.....who were the Russians who declined to return to Stalin after the war?

More than a million Soviet citizens joined the Nazis. Ask yourself this: why was it that the USSR, of all the Allies, had provided the enemy with thousands of recruits? Nearly one million Russian and other anti-Soviet men joined the enemy of their Soviet Army. "The Secret Betrayal"byNikolai Tolstoy, p. 19-20.



Russians would do anything not to return to Roosevelt's pal's 'paradise.'
The 850,000 strong army of Gen. Andrei Andreyevich Vlasov, having gone to the other side, Germany, "to save their country from Stalin" and having later surrendered to US forces, "formed the core of those forcebly repatritated between 1944 and 1947."
"Operation Keelhaul; The Story of Forced Repatriation from 1944 to the Present.by Julius Epstein p.27, 53.


a. Gen. Deniken, former commanding general of the White Russian armies which were supported by the USA in 1917-1920, explained that none of these men served in the Nazi army out of love for Germany..."they hated the Germans" he wrote....rather, they knew what awaited them in the 'Soviet paradise.'



Roosevelt knew, too.

 

[Unkotare]

10. Lest any be mislead into believing that American lives were a priority to Roosevelt and his coterie, he let Stalin….his erstwhile ally….. Stalin keep some 25,000 American soldiers as prisoners after the war.




For Eisenhower, following orders was more important than either swiftly winning the war, or even preserving the lives of his troops.
.... he was selected because he passed the big test: he was OK'd by Stalin. Evidence here:


" By May 15, 1945, the Pentagon believed 25,000 American POWs "liberated" by the Red Army were still being held hostage to Soviet demands that all "Soviet citizens" be returned to Soviet control, "without exception" and by force if necessary, as agreed to at the Yalta Conference in February 1945.

When the U.S. refused to return some military formations composed of Soviet citizens, such as the First Ukrainian SS Division, Stalin retaliated by returning only 4,116 of the [25,000] hostage American POWs.

On June 1, 1945, the United States Government issued documents, signed by General Dwight D. Eisenhower, explaining away the loss of approximately 20,000 POWs remaining under Stalin's control."
http://www.nationalalliance.org/wwii/wwii.htm
National Alliance of Families





This is not idle conversation.....this is 20,000 American boys left to die in Stalin's gulags by the Roosevelt administration.

Left by Roosevelt, Hopkins, Marshall.....
....and Eisenhower.





11. Five day after V-E Day, the AP filed a startling news report from SHAEF: "Nearly half of the estimated 200,000 British and 76,000 American prisoners of war still in Germany are believed to be within the Russian zone of occupation and Supreme Headquarters has twice requested a meeting or arrangement to arrange their return."
Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 39."SHAEF Asks Russians About Freed PW's", AP Dispatch, ADVANCE HEADQUARTERS, Reims, France, May 12, 1945

a. On May 19, 1945, Eisenhower signed a cable stating "Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000"


b. Americans in Soviet custody were "in effect being held hostage"; "we may find a reluctance to return them all..." The realization began to dawn that they may never come home at all.
Major R.W. Barker, 'Report on Conference With Russian Officials Relative to Repatriation of Prisoners of War, May 23, 1945, See Senate Minority POW/MIA Report, 41.



Behind the scenes, on May 19, 1945, Supreme Commander Eisenhower himself signed a cable stating, “Numbers of US prisoners estimated in Russian control 25,000.”

What happened? The Senate report goes on to assemble the relevant record of subsequent statements, memos, tallies and the like to arrive at its bottom line: between 12,500 and 20,000 U.S. servicemen were left behind after World.







"I can’t think of anything that puts a more American face on this uniquely twentieth-century record of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons, Americans of successive generations beginning back before the so-called Greatest Generation, all the way up to the baby boomers. Along with their long-suffering families, they would become the uniquely American sacrifice to the conspiracy of silence that improbably held the Free World and the Un-Free World together, partners in crime, over the course of the twentieth century. Sacrifices, all, to American betrayal."
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter 11
The Death of the Grown-Up | Diana West > Home - Memorial




“…of perfidy [by Roosevelt and his administration] than the betrayal of our own fighting fathers, brothers, husbands, and sons…”




Let's hear those Roosevelt fluffers defend this.

....


Note to PC.....FDR Died in April 1945

Just like Hitler.

 

[PoliticalChic]

PoliticalChic has been on her anti FDR Crusade here at USMB for years. Same old nonsense year after year. She is losing her Crusade. FDR's popularity has actually improved to the point where he has been rated #1 Greatest President a couple of times. Imagine, rated Greater than Washington or Lincoln.

And yet YOU cannot defend him.

I defend him just fine.....

You never even try to. You just repeat logical fallacies over and over.

....out of fear of the truth.

 

[PoliticalChic]

With whom could the Allies have conspired to end Nazi control of Germany, and end the war?
How about the head of the Nazis Military Intelligence???



13. . One of the highest anti-Nazi Germans was the chief of Nazi Germany's military intelligence division, the Abwehr, Admiral Wm. Canaris. Try as he might, the Allies would not open communications channels with Canaris .

He led the anti-Nazi resistance, and from the late 30s he tried to get Britain...and,later, America, to support them in overthrowing Hitler and the Nazis.

And Roosevelt knew this!
But FDR didn't dare disobey Stalin!!!


"Archival evidence indicates that the Soviet’s wanted the war to continue long enough for them to conquer Eastern Europe and in order for Germany to be utterly destroyed or “pastoralized” which was called for in the Morgenthau Plan which was actually written by Soviet spy Harry Dexter White. The Soviets were also clamoring for a “second front” in France in order to deflect the allies out of Italy and the Balkans which was too close to Russia."
Chuck Morse Speaks: The Canaris Cover-up





14. "Admiral Wilhelm Canaris. The head of the German Secret Service told Earle there were many sensible German people feeling that Hitler was leading their nation down a destructive path. Admiral Canaris continued that an honorable surrender from the German army to the American forces could be arranged."
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/canaris.html


a. "Wilhelm Franz Canaris (1 January 1887 – 9 April 1945) was a German admiral, and chief of the Abwehr, the German military intelligence service, from 1935 to 1944. During the Second World War, he was among the military officers involved in the clandestine opposition to Adolf Hitler and the Nazi regime.... "
Wilhelm Canaris - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


b. A few weeks before the war ended, Canaris was hanged by he Nazis. Hanged twice: They hung him...then revived him, and hung him again,,,, "once to show him what death tasted like."
“Canaris Hanging Related,” New York Times, October 11, 1952.



Roosevelt literally left him hung out to dry.

 

[rightwinger]

I was hoping to trick one of the dunces into finding Roosevelt innocent based on the date of his death.

I got two of the dunces.


“The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones.”
Shakespeare




Even after Roosevelt’s death, his policies continued.


On March 26, 1945, Army Chief of Staff George C. Marshall issued the following order: "Censor all stories, delete criticism Russian treatment." This was aimed at those Americans who had been POWs of the Red Army. Note that some 20,000 US soldiers were never returned.


a. FDR died April 12th..but, based on the date of Marshall's order, the White House clearly knew of the following prior to that:

b. " By May 15, 1945, the Pentagon believed 25,000 American POWs "liberated" by the Red Army were still being held hostage to Soviet demands that all "Soviet citizens" be returned to Soviet control, "without exception" and by force if necessary, as agreed to at the Yalta Conference in February 1945.

When the U.S. refused to return some military formations composed of Soviet citizens, such as the First Ukrainian SS Division, Stalin retaliated by returning only 4,116 of the hostage American POWs. On June 1, 1945, the United States Government issued documents, signed by General Dwight D. Eisenhower, explaining away the loss of approximately 20,000 POWs remaining under Stalin's control." http://www.nationalalliance.org/wwii/wwii.html





BTW.....who were the Russians who declined to return to Stalin after the war?

More than a million Soviet citizens joined the Nazis. Ask yourself this: why was it that the USSR, of all the Allies, had provided the enemy with thousands of recruits? Nearly one million Russian and other anti-Soviet men joined the enemy of their Soviet Army. "The Secret Betrayal"byNikolai Tolstoy, p. 19-20.



Russians would do anything not to return to Roosevelt's pal's 'paradise.'
The 850,000 strong army of Gen. Andrei Andreyevich Vlasov, having gone to the other side, Germany, "to save their country from Stalin" and having later surrendered to US forces, "formed the core of those forcebly repatritated between 1944 and 1947."
"Operation Keelhaul; The Story of Forced Repatriation from 1944 to the Present.by Julius Epstein p.27, 53.


a. Gen. Deniken, former commanding general of the White Russian armies which were supported by the USA in 1917-1920, explained that none of these men served in the Nazi army out of love for Germany..."they hated the Germans" he wrote....rather, they knew what awaited them in the 'Soviet paradise.'



Roosevelt knew, too.

Ready to blame FDR for 9-11?

 

[PoliticalChic]

15. As per the OP, Erich Remarque was considered the enemy of Hitler and the Nazis. There were many such opponents of Hitler, especially in the military officer’s corp.
Anti-Nazi Germans who would have displaced Hitler, and helped win the war years earlier.
But Roosevelt would hear none of that!

Funny, because post-war, the US made lots of deals with former Nazis, for help in our space program, and forming our CIA, for example.



The Nazis would have killed Remarque if they had captured him….but his fame took him out of Germany.

“…Remarque’s departure from Germany left his family in immediate danger his sister, Elfriede Scholz, would pay for her brother’s safety.
Elfriede was arrested after her landlord turned her over to the Nazi Party …

Immediately, Elfriede was found guilty. … the reason Remarque’s sister was found guilty was the author’s easy escape from Hitler’s reach. Upon sentencing, Court President Roland Freisler announced to Elfriede that “Ihr Bruder ist uns leider entwischt—Sie aber werden uns nicht entwischen” (“Your brother is unfortunately beyond our reach—you, however, will not escape us”). …

Elfriede was executed by beheading on December 16, 1943, …” Why The Nazis Beheaded a Famous Author’s Sister – Then Sent His Family the Execution Bill

 

[PoliticalChic]

16.And yet another irrefutable thread about the Democrat’s god, Franklin Roosevelt…..this god, the man who wasted no efforts at saving the lives of American service men…..

Further:
1. Roosevelt offered up the lives of everyone in Eastern Europe to his lord and master, Joseph 'Koba' Stalin


2. He made certain that Stalin's plans continued after his death: the creation of the United Nations


3. He extended the Depression by years.


4. He disposed of the Constitution


5. He imposed Mussolini's Fascist policies and called it 'the New Deal


6. He turned over command of our military actions in WWII to Stalin, and cost multiple thousands of US soldiers' deaths.


7. He made certain that communism survived the war, and thrived afterwards.


8. Without his efforts, there would be no Red China, no Korean War, and no Vietnamese War


9. ...and he is the proximate explanation for the cultural Marxism prevalent in society today.





17. As per the OP, there were many anti-Nazi Germans to whom FDR could have turned to to end the war years earlier than he did.

And, Erich Remarque’s anti-Nazi reputation was due to his book, ‘All Quiet On The Western Front.’

The book was made into a movie…..twice.

 

[Toronado3800]

1. While some may believe that the English language is of the Romance or Latinate, it is actually Teutonic, like German.
Some years ago I decided to read Erich Remarque’s book…

….in the original German. Took a long time, sitting with a German-English dictionary, but I did read it. Today, sometimes I can still get the gist of a written German news story.
The popularity of the novel proves how mistaken Franklin Roosevelt was in his worldview.

a.“Erich Maria Remarque[1] (born Erich Paul Remark; 22 June 1898 – 25 September 1970) was a German novelist who created many works about the horrors of war. His best known novel All Quiet on the Western Front (1928), about German soldiers in the First World War, was made into an Oscar-winning film. His book made him an enemy of the Nazis, who burned many of his works.” Erich Maria Remarque - Wikipedia



3.“His book made him an enemy of the Nazis,…”

Remarque was hardly the only German who was anti-Nazi.

“Approximately 77,000 German citizens were killed for one or another form of resistance…” German resistance to Nazism - Wikipedia


Let's look at a primary source, Allen Dulles, first civilian to head the CIA, and its longest serving director. In "Germany's Underground: The Anti-Nazi Resistance," Dulles wrote of that the German was the only anti-Nazi underground not supported by the United States. (p.22).
On page 140, Dulles states "The plotters (anti-Nazi German resistance)....were told clearly and repeatedly that we had made common cause with Russia...." as the reason they were frozen out.

The NYTimes told the same story, March 18, 1946: "Full Story of Anti-Hitler Plot Shows That Allies Refused To Assist."




Why do you suppose FDR refused to use the anti-Nazi Germans in his battle against Hitler?



4. Here’s the point: Franklin Roosevelt refused to work with anti-Hitler Germans because of his undying love of ‘Uncle Joe’ Stalin. Government school will never teach that Roosevelt could have defeated Hitler and ended the war, years earlier than he did, with the concomitant savings in American lives and treasure, if he did not bend to every one of Communist Stalin’s orders.


The result is explained in the title of this thread.
It will be irrefutably proven in the thread itself.





5. If you believe that FDR functioned totally in the interests of America, and Americans, that he did a wonderful job in pursuing victory in WWII, that he had any sort of moral compass…..


….then you probably voted for Hillary.

You seem to be saying one of two things....

FDR did not try to get us into WWII against the Germans by every crazy pro-England idea he could cook up and against the wishes (not necessarily 100% wrong) of the Charles Lindbergh group according to your version of history?

Or are you saying Hitler was not the greatest threat at the time?

Or are you saying FDR should have sought war with Hitler and Stalin in 1941 because both were madmen?

Or are you saying Trump has no moral compass since he met with the monster Kim Jong Un? Which to speed things along I was ok with despite the cries from the "proconditions" crowds of past years.

Frau Braun PC is still moaning that the Nazis lost

oh, I did not realize that was her angle.

Hatred of Stalin is easy enough to explain. Heck, Churchill nearly got the Brits into a war with Russia. I think at the time I would have been all hands on deck against Germany hopefully not to the point that when the Japanese came to bomb Pearl Harbor there would have been an empty shipyard and a welcoming beach. All the ships would have been in the Med stopping Rommell's supplies. Man our Dec 1941 entry date into the war is a national embarrassment.

What are you embarrassed about?

I think we should have been involved in the war earlier. by Dec 1941 the Germans and Russians were battling for Moscow, the Holocaust should have been obvious, the Battle of Britain was a year old, the invasion of France was May 1940, the war had been going on for some time.

I GUESS we needed time to ramp up production but man.