Gaza Students: Clean the World of Jews

[SherriMunnerlyn]

Hannukah and Operation Cast Lead: One year later

Posted by rabbibrian on December 18, 2009

Tomorrow is Shabbat Hannukah, the Sabbath that occurs during Hannukah. Exactly one year ago, on Shabbat Hannukah (Saturday December 27, 2008), Israel launched Operation Cast Lead. On that day, Saturday December 27, 2008, at 11:30 in the morning, a time when schoolchildren were still in school, 88 Israeli aircraft simultaneously attacked 100 preplanned targets in Gaza within a span of 4 minutes. This initial attack was followed by another attack and by the end of that Sabbath day, at least 230 Palestinians were killed and more than 700 injured. Shabbat Hannukah last year, was the day with the highest one day death toll in the history of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

A Reuters report from that day reads as follows: “Black smoke billowed over Gaza City, where the dead and wounded lay on the ground after Israel bombed more than 40 security compounds, including two where Hamas was hosting graduation ceremonies for new recruits. At the main Gaza City graduation ceremony, uniformed bodies lay in a pile and the wounded writhed in pain.” Our traditional greeting for Shabbat is Shabbat Shalom/ A Sabbath of Peace. That day was far from a Sabbath of Peace

Hannukah and Operation Cast Lead: One year later « Rabbibrian's Blog

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore; et al,

Wait! May be you want to restate this point.

Of course those confrontations happen when Israel goes into Palestinian neighborhoods to attack them.

(COMMENT)

This presupposes that the IDF just got-up one day and said: "Today would be a good day to attack some defenseless Palestinians." (SARCASM: Yeah, like everyone is going to believe that!)​

I contend that nearly every confrontation is a response to something the HoAP did.

Occupation is a response to contain and suppress a threat from a culture that has openly told the world that it will not recognize the legitimacy of Israel. This threat is aligned itself with multiple regional threats to the Middle East and Persian Gulf.

Most Respectfully,
R

Wait! May be you want to restate this point.

I don't.

I am correct.

 

[50_RiaL]

. . . And Israel is expected to make peace with these thugs?

 

[Hossfly]

. . . And Israel is expected to make peace with these thugs?

Plus releasing all the murderous terrorists in Israeli prisons. That's one of Abu Mazen's condition for peace talks.

 

[Hossfly]

I think I shall be forever haunted by the story of one particular child killed who lived in an orphanage. His mother sent him there because she could not afford to take care of him. He was walking to or from school when he was killed by Israeli airstrikes unlawfully targeting municipal buildings. For this child, I could not even find a photo, I searched all over the internet for a photo, to no avail. His mother was interviewed, she said soon she was going to send another child to the orphanage. Heartbreaking stories of childrens lives needlessly cut short by an Occupiers unlawful targeting of civilians, which includes children. Sherri

Don't you think there are others haunted by the deaths of children? How do you think the parents of children felt when they saw the blood running out of their children as a result of car bombings by your friends in Pakistan? Are you haunted by all the innocent children whose lives have been cut short in Syria? Maybe the Drama Queen can tell us her feelings about these dead children.

 

[Hossfly]

I identified 16 children Israel killed on Day 1 of Cast Lead and discussed their killings in a prior thread. They were all killed unlawfully. Most were walking to and from school. They were killed in unlawful targeted killings of civilian and civilian objects. DCI Palestine addresses each child killed in CL in quiet a bit of detail on their website. They investigated each fatality incident. They are an intl childrens human rights organization. Operation Cast Lead: 352 children killed during Israeli offensive | Defence for Children International Palestine

Can you tell us which group is identifying the dead children who have been murdered by your friends all over the Muslim world, or don't they or you care about these children that it would be a waste of time to identify them? Plus of course if they actually did take the time, the list would go on and on and on.

 

[P F Tinmore]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kjzv9Mp3CEE&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUshhje-uO8]CodePink reporting on Gaza March 23, 2009 - Part 2 - YouTube[/ame]

 

[RoccoR]

SherriMunnerlyn; et al,

Oh come now. You are only telling half the story.

P F Tinmore; et al,

Wait! May be you want to restate this point.

Of course those confrontations happen when Israel goes into Palestinian neighborhoods to attack them.

(COMMENT)

This presupposes that the IDF just got-up one day and said: "Today would be a good day to attack some defenseless Palestinians." (SARCASM: Yeah, like everyone is going to believe that!)​

I contend that nearly every confrontation is a response to something the HoAP did.

Occupation is a response to contain and suppress a threat from a culture that has openly told the world that it will not recognize the legitimacy of Israel. This threat is aligned itself with multiple regional threats to the Middle East and Persian Gulf.

Most Respectfully,
R

That is exactly what Israel did, Israel launched tbe first attack in CL as Students were changing shifts at their schools, it was 11:35 am. The streets were filled with children.

(COMMENT)

Prior to the initiation of Operation Cast Lead, HAMAS was launching an average of 60 to 70 rockets into Israel each day; some 122-mm Grad-type Katyusha and some Qassam Rockets. That is called provocation.

I stand by my analysis, that it was a consequence of of HoAP incitement.

This was clearly an Article 51 response.

Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security.

SOURCE: Charter of the United Nations: Chapter VII: Action with Respect to Threats to the Peace, Breaches of the Peace and Acts of Agression

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[SherriMunnerlyn]

SherriMunnerlyn; et al,

Oh come now. You are only telling half the story.

P F Tinmore; et al,

Wait! May be you want to restate this point.


(COMMENT)

This presupposes that the IDF just got-up one day and said: "Today would be a good day to attack some defenseless Palestinians." (SARCASM: Yeah, like everyone is going to believe that!)​

I contend that nearly every confrontation is a response to something the HoAP did.

Occupation is a response to contain and suppress a threat from a culture that has openly told the world that it will not recognize the legitimacy of Israel. This threat is aligned itself with multiple regional threats to the Middle East and Persian Gulf.

Most Respectfully,
R

That is exactly what Israel did, Israel launched tbe first attack in CL as Students were changing shifts at their schools, it was 11:35 am. The streets were filled with children.

(COMMENT)

Prior to the initiation of Operation Cast Lead, HAMAS was launching an average of 60 to 70 rockets into Israel each day; some 122-mm Grad-type Katyusha and some Qassam Rockets. That is called provocation.

I stand by my analysis, that it was a consequence of of HoAP incitement.

This was clearly an Article 51 response.

Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security.

SOURCE: Charter of the United Nations: Chapter VII: Action with Respect to Threats to the Peace, Breaches of the Peace and Acts of Agression

Most Respectfully,
R

Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children.

 

[P F Tinmore]

SherriMunnerlyn; et al,

Oh come now. You are only telling half the story.

P F Tinmore; et al,

Wait! May be you want to restate this point.


(COMMENT)

This presupposes that the IDF just got-up one day and said: "Today would be a good day to attack some defenseless Palestinians." (SARCASM: Yeah, like everyone is going to believe that!)​

I contend that nearly every confrontation is a response to something the HoAP did.

Occupation is a response to contain and suppress a threat from a culture that has openly told the world that it will not recognize the legitimacy of Israel. This threat is aligned itself with multiple regional threats to the Middle East and Persian Gulf.

Most Respectfully,
R

That is exactly what Israel did, Israel launched tbe first attack in CL as Students were changing shifts at their schools, it was 11:35 am. The streets were filled with children.

(COMMENT)

Prior to the initiation of Operation Cast Lead, HAMAS was launching an average of 60 to 70 rockets into Israel each day; some 122-mm Grad-type Katyusha and some Qassam Rockets. That is called provocation.

I stand by my analysis, that it was a consequence of of HoAP incitement.

This was clearly an Article 51 response.

Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security.

SOURCE: Charter of the United Nations: Chapter VII: Action with Respect to Threats to the Peace, Breaches of the Peace and Acts of Agression

Most Respectfully,
R

Reaffirming also the inalienable right to self-determination and independence of all peoples under colonial and racist regimes and other forms of alien domination and foreign occupation, and upholding the legitimacy of their struggle, in particular the struggle of national liberation movements, in accordance with the purposes and principles of the Charter and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Cooperation among States in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations,

SOURCE: A/RES/46/51. Measures to eliminate international terrorism

A blockade is an act of war. The Palestinians were defending themselves as international law allows.

 

[MHunterB]

"Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children."

That's exactly right: no 'resistance to occupation' justifies the targeting of Israeli civilians and children - let alone the targeting of citizens of other nations! - by HAMAS and the PLO/PA

Just the way OBL's fan club targeted so many completely innocent civilians on 9/11- completely and irrevocably WRONG, no excuse.

Of course, since the whores for HAMAS/PLO/Pa/whatever keep telling the Big Lie of claiming Israel 'deliberately targets' civilians, they don't have an iota of credibility remaining.

 

[Coyote]

SherriMunnerlyn; et al,

Oh come now. You are only telling half the story.

That is exactly what Israel did, Israel launched tbe first attack in CL as Students were changing shifts at their schools, it was 11:35 am. The streets were filled with children.

(COMMENT)

Prior to the initiation of Operation Cast Lead, HAMAS was launching an average of 60 to 70 rockets into Israel each day; some 122-mm Grad-type Katyusha and some Qassam Rockets. That is called provocation.

I stand by my analysis, that it was a consequence of of HoAP incitement.

This was clearly an Article 51 response.

Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security.

SOURCE: Charter of the United Nations: Chapter VII: Action with Respect to Threats to the Peace, Breaches of the Peace and Acts of Agression

Most Respectfully,
R

Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children.

I agree.

What do you think when Hamas targets civilians and children?

 

[Coyote]

"Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children."

That's exactly right: no 'resistance to occupation' justifies the targeting of Israeli civilians and children - let alone the targeting of citizens of other nations! - by HAMAS and the PLO/PA

Just the way OBL's fan club targeted so many completely innocent civilians on 9/11- completely and irrevocably WRONG, no excuse.

Of course, since the whores for HAMAS/PLO/Pa/whatever keep telling the Big Lie of claiming Israel 'deliberately targets' civilians, they don't have an iota of credibility remaining.

Targeting civilian centers seems to me to be targeting civilians or, at best - not much caring that civilians get killed in the process.

 

[P F Tinmore]

"Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children."

That's exactly right: no 'resistance to occupation' justifies the targeting of Israeli civilians and children - let alone the targeting of citizens of other nations! - by HAMAS and the PLO/PA

Just the way OBL's fan club targeted so many completely innocent civilians on 9/11- completely and irrevocably WRONG, no excuse.

Of course, since the whores for HAMAS/PLO/Pa/whatever keep telling the Big Lie of claiming Israel 'deliberately targets' civilians, they don't have an iota of credibility remaining.

Even when the definition of protected persons is set out in this way, it may seem rather complicated. Nevertheless, disregarding points of detail, it will be seen that there are two main classes of protected person: (1) ' enemy nationals ' within the national territory of each of the Parties to the conflict and (2) ' the whole population ' of occupied territories (excluding nationals of the Occupying Power).

</title> <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="/xsp/.ibmxspres/.mini/css/@Da&@Ib&2Tfxsp.css&2TfxspLTR.css.css"> <script type="text/javascript" src="/xsp/.ibmxspres/dojoroot-1.6.1/dojo/dojo.js" djConfig="locale: 'fr-ch'"></script> <script type=

International law excludes Israeli citizens from the "civilian" category.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Ah, yes. The "blockade." One might ask, what purpose does it serve? Is it a lawful purpose? What is the intent and does it have in basis in customary law and history.

We need to examine the whole story.

Reaffirming also the inalienable right to self-determination and independence of all peoples under colonial and racist regimes and other forms of alien domination and foreign occupation, and upholding the legitimacy of their struggle, in particular the struggle of national liberation movements, in accordance with the purposes and principles of the Charter and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Cooperation among States in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations,

SOURCE: A/RES/46/51. Measures to eliminate international terrorism

A blockade is an act of war. The Palestinians were defending themselves as international law allows.

(REFERENCES)

(a) To prevent the preparation and organization in their respective territories, for commission within or outside their territories, of terrorist and subversive acts directed against other States and their citizens;

SOURCE: A/RES/46/51. Measures to eliminate international terrorism

22. Resolve therefore to prevent, combat and eradicate the illicit trade in small arms and light weapons in all its aspects by:

(a) Strengthening or developing agreed norms and measures at the global, regional and national levels that would reinforce and further coordinate efforts to prevent, combat and eradicate the illicit trade in small arms and light weapons in all its aspects;

(b) Developing and implementing agreed international measures to prevent, combat and eradicate illicit manufacturing of and trafficking in small arms and light weapons;

(c) Placing particular emphasis on the regions of the world where conflicts come to an end and where serious problems with the excessive and destabilizing accumulation of small arms and light weapons have to be dealt with urgently;

(d) Mobilizing the political will throughout the international community to prevent and combat illicit transfers and manufacturing of small arms and light weapons in all their aspects, to cooperate towards these ends and to raise awareness of the character and seriousness of the interrelated problems associated with the illicit manufacturing of and trafficking in these weapons;

(e) Promoting responsible action by States with a view to preventing the illicit export, import, transit and retransfer of small arms and light weapons.

SOURCE: Programme of Action - Implementation Support System

(COMMENT)

The supplying of small arms and light weapons (SA/LW) to terrorist organizations such as Hamas and Hezbollah are prime to the target. And since the general population supports these terrorist organizations (providing material support), there will be other materials that are blocked.

Iran will preside over the United Nations arms control forum this month, despite the fact that it is under U.N. sanctions for illicit nuclear activities and routinely supplies arms to the terrorist organization Hezbollah in violation of international law.
... ... ...
&#8220;Iran is an international outlaw state that illegally supplies rockets to Syria, Hezbollah, and Hamas, aiding and abetting mass murder and terrorism. To make this rogue regime head of world arms control is simply an outrage. Abusers of international norms should not be the public face of the U.N.&#8221;

SOURCE: Iran to chair U.N. arms control forum | Washington Free Beacon

None of this is new. It has been long known that the IRGC-QF (Quds Force) has been deeply involved in the covert and clandestine shipment of SA/LW and rocket to both Hamas and Hezbollah.

U.S. and Israeli intelligence have learned of an ongoing debate in the Iranian leadership. The more radical leaders, who control the Revolutionary Guard, and the al Quds force, want to equip Hamas (in Gaza) and Hezbollah (in southern Lebanon) with more lethal weapons, and goad Israel into another war. The Iranian radicals have been trying to get anti-aircraft and anti-tank missiles to Hamas, as these weapons can be used immediately against Israeli helicopters, F-16s and UAVs that regularly operate over Gaza, and the armored vehicles that come in with raids and patrol the security fence. So far, none of these weapons have gotten through.

SOURCE: Counter-Terrorism: The Hamas And Hezbollah House Of Horrors

So far, such weapons haven't gotten through, but --- it requires vigilance. Most recently, the Egyptians have taken steps to assist in the quarantine effort by blocking tunnels used for smuggling, including SA/LW and rockets. The blockade is an essential part to the vigilance; remembering that Hamas is an HoAP element.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Hossfly]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kjzv9Mp3CEE&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUshhje-uO8]CodePink reporting on Gaza March 23, 2009 - Part 2 - YouTube[/ame]

Looks like Tinnie loves those Code Pink Ladies. Maybe he can invite one of them out for dinner when he gets away from his magic computer that really isn't there.

Jewish Bubba: Anti-Israel: Code Pink Ladies

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

There is some truth to this.

"Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children."

That's exactly right: no 'resistance to occupation' justifies the targeting of Israeli civilians and children - let alone the targeting of citizens of other nations! - by HAMAS and the PLO/PA

Just the way OBL's fan club targeted so many completely innocent civilians on 9/11- completely and irrevocably WRONG, no excuse.

Of course, since the whores for HAMAS/PLO/Pa/whatever keep telling the Big Lie of claiming Israel 'deliberately targets' civilians, they don't have an iota of credibility remaining.

Even when the definition of protected persons is set out in this way, it may seem rather complicated. Nevertheless, disregarding points of detail, it will be seen that there are two main classes of protected person: (1) ' enemy nationals ' within the national territory of each of the Parties to the conflict and (2) ' the whole population ' of occupied territories (excluding nationals of the Occupying Power).

</title> <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="/xsp/.ibmxspres/.mini/css/@Da&@Ib&2Tfxsp.css&2TfxspLTR.css.css"> <script type="text/javascript" src="/xsp/.ibmxspres/dojoroot-1.6.1/dojo/dojo.js" djConfig="locale: 'fr-ch'"></script> <script type=

International law excludes Israeli citizens from the "civilian" category.

(COMMENT)

It would be true to say, that the Israeli Settlers (non-IDF) in the West Bank (Occupied Territory) are in a "gray area." But clearly they are non-combatants.

Israeli Citizens inside the sovereignty of the State of Israel are covered as protected persons. There is no question of that, except in the minds of the HoAP.

In relation to the firing of rockets and mortars into southern Israel by Palestinian armed groups operating in the Gaza Strip, the Mission finds that the Palestinian armed groups fail to distinguish between military targets and the civilian population and civilian objects in southern Israel. The launching of rockets and mortars which cannot be aimed with sufficient precisions at military targets breaches the fundamental principle of distinction. Where there is no intended military target and the rockets and mortars are launched into civilian areas, they constitute a deliberate attack against the civilian population. These actions would constitute war crimes and may amount to crimes against humanity.

SOURCE: http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/hrcouncil/docs/12session/A-HRC-12-48_ADVANCE2.pdf

If, what the Israelis did is a crime, then too, what the HoAP has done is so as well.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Ah, yes. The "blockade." One might ask, what purpose does it serve? Is it a lawful purpose? What is the intent and does it have in basis in customary law and history.

We need to examine the whole story.

Reaffirming also the inalienable right to self-determination and independence of all peoples under colonial and racist regimes and other forms of alien domination and foreign occupation, and upholding the legitimacy of their struggle, in particular the struggle of national liberation movements, in accordance with the purposes and principles of the Charter and the Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Cooperation among States in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations,

SOURCE: A/RES/46/51. Measures to eliminate international terrorism

A blockade is an act of war. The Palestinians were defending themselves as international law allows.

Most Respectfully,
R

That linked document is titled "Measures to eliminate international terrorism."

Hamas does not operate outside Palestine's borders and does not attack protected persons as defined by the Fourth Geneva Convention. They do, however, defend their country from occupation that they have the right to do.

Please explain how international terrorism fits into the picture.

 

[MHunterB]

"Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children."

That's exactly right: no 'resistance to occupation' justifies the targeting of Israeli civilians and children - let alone the targeting of citizens of other nations! - by HAMAS and the PLO/PA

Just the way OBL's fan club targeted so many completely innocent civilians on 9/11- completely and irrevocably WRONG, no excuse.

Of course, since the whores for HAMAS/PLO/Pa/whatever keep telling the Big Lie of claiming Israel 'deliberately targets' civilians, they don't have an iota of credibility remaining.

Targeting civilian centers seems to me to be targeting civilians or, at best - not much caring that civilians get killed in the process.

Which explains HAMAS continually shooting at Sderot, exactly as the Syrians shelled Jewish towns INside Israel for months on end.

Don't forget, Coyote: even a hospital or orphanage loses its 'civilian' status after its roof is used to launch missiles or shells, whether at civilians or at military.

 

[RoccoR]

SherriMunnerlyn; et al,

Collateral damage describes casualties and damage suffered incidental to the intended target.

SherriMunnerlyn; et al,

Oh come now. You are only telling half the story.

That is exactly what Israel did, Israel launched tbe first attack in CL as Students were changing shifts at their schools, it was 11:35 am. The streets were filled with children.

(COMMENT)

Prior to the initiation of Operation Cast Lead, HAMAS was launching an average of 60 to 70 rockets into Israel each day; some 122-mm Grad-type Katyusha and some Qassam Rockets. That is called provocation.

I stand by my analysis, that it was a consequence of of HoAP incitement.

This was clearly an Article 51 response.

Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security.

SOURCE: Charter of the United Nations: Chapter VII: Action with Respect to Threats to the Peace, Breaches of the Peace and Acts of Agression

Most Respectfully,
R

Nothing justifies targeting of civilians and children.

(COMMENT)

Hamas, and the general population that aids and abets Hamas, are just as responsible for the collateral damage and causalities to "civilians and children" as is the ordnance that falls on the legitimate Hamas targeted activity.

The question becomes how responsible is a general public when it provides material support, political endorsement, and actively acts to cover and conceal efforts by Hamas to undermine the territorial integrity and security of the sovereign State of Israel?

Hamas are terrorist and insurgents engaged in activities that make them subject to attack at any moment. HoAP (Hostile Arab/Palestinian) parents know this and should teach their children to run away from Hamas activities that, by mere proximity, may be hazardous, dangerous and deadly. Just as Hamas should not operate in the vicinity of "civilians and children" to minimize collateral damage and casualties. The HoAP does not hold any special status when they conduct operations that threaten Israeli sovereignty and security. They become targetable, and anyone in proximity is in danger.

Most Respectfully,
R