GOA to Sue the ATF's Bump Stock Ban

[progressive hunter]

This all or nothing thing is going to end up with nothing or me owning an atomic weapon.

Let's not be ridiculous.

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

I'm thinking thats an boldfaced lie crepe, a pawnshop has an FFL and is subject to the same as any other FFL rules

 

[martybegan]

This all or nothing thing is going to end up with nothing or me owning an atomic weapon.

Let's not be ridiculous.

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

Why is the wait not an issue? What are they waiting for? The whole purpose isn't to do a check, its to make the process so onerous people just quit.

How about we put a 10 day waiting period on abortions?

 

[progressive hunter]

YOU CANT BE A 2nd supporter and be OK with any ban,,,its like banning hate speech and being a 1st supporter

This all or nothing thing is going to end up with nothing or me owning an atomic weapon.

Let's not be ridiculous.

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

What I keep asking is what are those reasonable regulations? What are they? Everyone who is OK with the banning of the Bump stocks all say that it is a Reasonable Regulation. I see it as a Constitutional Violation.

Why? Not just the Second Amendment. You can not be deprived of Life, Liberty, or Property without due process of law. Due Process of law is not an announcement of turn it in and lose the money, or destroy it yourself, or go to jail. If we handled any other items that way the people would be outraged.

We object to Judges legislating from the Bench, why should we accept a man who is not even a Judge deciding what the law says, and announcing that we will have tens of thousands, or even hundreds of thousands of new criminals based upon his whim?

If you want to ban them, then you have to pass a law doing so. Not just make an announcement and tell anyone who objects to shut the hell up. There will be a Stay in place by some Federal Judge before the New Year is here.

This is actually the sort of thing that Trump said was wrong with Washington.

there are already regs,,,SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED

 

[progressive hunter]

This all or nothing thing is going to end up with nothing or me owning an atomic weapon.

Let's not be ridiculous.

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

What I keep asking is what are those reasonable regulations? What are they? Everyone who is OK with the banning of the Bump stocks all say that it is a Reasonable Regulation. I see it as a Constitutional Violation.

Why? Not just the Second Amendment. You can not be deprived of Life, Liberty, or Property without due process of law. Due Process of law is not an announcement of turn it in and lose the money, or destroy it yourself, or go to jail. If we handled any other items that way the people would be outraged.

We object to Judges legislating from the Bench, why should we accept a man who is not even a Judge deciding what the law says, and announcing that we will have tens of thousands, or even hundreds of thousands of new criminals based upon his whim?

If you want to ban them, then you have to pass a law doing so. Not just make an announcement and tell anyone who objects to shut the hell up. There will be a Stay in place by some Federal Judge before the New Year is here.

This is actually the sort of thing that Trump said was wrong with Washington.

Bump stocks are toys. Only fools spent money in them to start with.

IF THEY ARE JUST TOYS THEN WHY THE BAN???

 

[Crepitus]

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

I'm thinking thats an boldfaced lie crepe, a pawnshop has an FFL and is subject to the same as any other FFL rules

They have to run me through the background check, last time I purchased it took about an hour. That's it.

 

[progressive hunter]

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

I'm thinking thats an boldfaced lie crepe, a pawnshop has an FFL and is subject to the same as any other FFL rules

They have to run me through the background check, last time I purchased it took about an hour. That's it.

THATS DIFFERENT THAN WHAT YOU JUST SAID

 

[rightwinger]

No, you said you support the Second Amendment. But you have no problem with banning bump stocks. So what would you have a problem with being banned. Come on, give us an example. How about bolt action rifles that fire a .50 BMG round that can penetrate four inches of reinforced concrete?

Get a grip fellow. ....

A bump stock isn't required in order to fire any weapon that I know of, nor will banning it stop anyone from shooting their favorite gun whenever they please.

I’m asking where you draw the line? What would you object to? How about interstate reciprocity for Concealed Weapons Permits? Any objection for people from Wyoming carrying guns in New York City?

People from Wyoming aren't stupid enough to go to New York City.

They couldnt figure out the subway system

 

[Sunni Man]

WHEN YOU CANT REFUTE go to personal attacks

You talk like a 10 year old that is mad because his cute little toy bump stock is being taken away. ... ...

 

[Crepitus]

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

Why is the wait not an issue? What are they waiting for? The whole purpose isn't to do a check, its to make the process so onerous people just quit.

How about we put a 10 day waiting period on abortions?

It's not to make people quit, it's to put a cooling off period between buying a pistol in a fit of anger/depression and offing yourself and you significant other.

And sure, put a ten day wait in abortions, I got not problem with that.

 

[Crepitus]

This all or nothing thing is going to end up with nothing or me owning an atomic weapon.

Let's not be ridiculous.

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

What I keep asking is what are those reasonable regulations? What are they? Everyone who is OK with the banning of the Bump stocks all say that it is a Reasonable Regulation. I see it as a Constitutional Violation.

Why? Not just the Second Amendment. You can not be deprived of Life, Liberty, or Property without due process of law. Due Process of law is not an announcement of turn it in and lose the money, or destroy it yourself, or go to jail. If we handled any other items that way the people would be outraged.

We object to Judges legislating from the Bench, why should we accept a man who is not even a Judge deciding what the law says, and announcing that we will have tens of thousands, or even hundreds of thousands of new criminals based upon his whim?

If you want to ban them, then you have to pass a law doing so. Not just make an announcement and tell anyone who objects to shut the hell up. There will be a Stay in place by some Federal Judge before the New Year is here.

This is actually the sort of thing that Trump said was wrong with Washington.

there are already regs,,,SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED

Blah blah blah I know. Now fuck off over there for a while ok kid, we're having an actual discussion here.

 

[progressive hunter]

It's eventually going to end up with nothing because reasonable people will be forced to go that way by the gun wackos.

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

What I keep asking is what are those reasonable regulations? What are they? Everyone who is OK with the banning of the Bump stocks all say that it is a Reasonable Regulation. I see it as a Constitutional Violation.

Why? Not just the Second Amendment. You can not be deprived of Life, Liberty, or Property without due process of law. Due Process of law is not an announcement of turn it in and lose the money, or destroy it yourself, or go to jail. If we handled any other items that way the people would be outraged.

We object to Judges legislating from the Bench, why should we accept a man who is not even a Judge deciding what the law says, and announcing that we will have tens of thousands, or even hundreds of thousands of new criminals based upon his whim?

If you want to ban them, then you have to pass a law doing so. Not just make an announcement and tell anyone who objects to shut the hell up. There will be a Stay in place by some Federal Judge before the New Year is here.

This is actually the sort of thing that Trump said was wrong with Washington.

there are already regs,,,SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED

Blah blah blah I know. Now fuck off over there for a while ok kid, we're having an actual discussion here.

if you dont understand the original intent of the 2nd you should STFU until you do

 

[martybegan]

I'm not totally sure which way you mean that.

Funny thing is your statement is so correct it will work either way.

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

Why is the wait not an issue? What are they waiting for? The whole purpose isn't to do a check, its to make the process so onerous people just quit.

How about we put a 10 day waiting period on abortions?

It's not to make people quit, it's to put a cooling off period between buying a pistol in a fit of anger/depression and offing yourself and you significant other.

And sure, put a ten day wait in abortions, I got not problem with that.

No, it's to make people quit the process. Will NYPD give me 24 hour protection while I am waiting for my revolver?

The whole process is to deny a right de jure if they can't deny it de facto.

And most abortion rights people go ballistic when I use that counter, have to admit, did not expect your response.

 

[progressive hunter]

WHEN YOU CANT REFUTE go to personal attacks

You talk like a 10 year old that is mad because his cute little toy bump stock is being taken away. ... ...

sorry dont own one and have no desire too

but you are a closet commie that wants the people defenseless against its government

 

[Crepitus]

I'm ok with nothing. I am ok with private gun ownership, but if we can't put some reasonable regulations in place then we will just have to do without.

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

Why is the wait not an issue? What are they waiting for? The whole purpose isn't to do a check, its to make the process so onerous people just quit.

How about we put a 10 day waiting period on abortions?

It's not to make people quit, it's to put a cooling off period between buying a pistol in a fit of anger/depression and offing yourself and you significant other.

And sure, put a ten day wait in abortions, I got not problem with that.

No, it's to make people quit the process. Will NYPD give me 24 hour protection while I am waiting for my revolver?

The whole process is to deny a right de jure if they can't deny it de facto.

And most abortion rights people go ballistic when I use that counter, have to admit, did not expect your response.

Why do you need 24 hours protection? And what harm could a ten day wait possibly do in either case?

What if exceptions could be made? Say for medical reasons on abortions and if you can show you are in immediate danger of the handgun.

 

[Sunni Man]

but you are a closet commie that wants the people defenseless against its government

So you're saying that a bump stock is a citizens only defense against a rogue government, and that owning one proves that you are not a commie?

I'm beginning to think that you really are 10 years old. ....

 

[progressive hunter]

but you are a closet commie that wants the people defenseless against its government

So you're saying that a bump stock is a citizens only defense against a rogue government, and that owning one proves that you are not a commie?

I'm beginning to think that you really are 10 years old. ....

all the BS in the world wont change the fact the 2nd says...SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED...
NOR WILL IT CHANGE THE FACT those that oppose it are closet commies that want the people subservient to the government

and if im a 10 yr old that makes you dumber than a 10 yr old because I understand words have meanings

 

[busybee01]

Bump stocks are a silly accessory, and only wannabe military types own them.

I am a stanch supporter of the 2 Amendment and love guns.

But have no problem with them being banned. ...

Yeah, but that's just a foot in the door.

You do know the LV shooter had real automatic weapons, correct?

Several of them, and 1 of the ARs barrel melted.

I say don't give them an inch, no ban on anything!

I say you are cuckoo. There is no reason to own a bump stock.

its not about your feelings

I could say there is no reason for you to be allowed to speak in public

It is a fact. A bump stock is not required to use a rifle.

 

[progressive hunter]

Bump stocks are a silly accessory, and only wannabe military types own them.

I am a stanch supporter of the 2 Amendment and love guns.

But have no problem with them being banned. ...

Yeah, but that's just a foot in the door.

You do know the LV shooter had real automatic weapons, correct?

Several of them, and 1 of the ARs barrel melted.

I say don't give them an inch, no ban on anything!

I say you are cuckoo. There is no reason to own a bump stock.

its not about your feelings

I could say there is no reason for you to be allowed to speak in public

It is a fact. A bump stock is not required to use a rifle.

SO WHAT, THAT CHANGES NOTHING

 

[martybegan]

NYC makes me wait 3-6 months and pay around $500 in fees just to keep a revolver in my own apartment legally.

How reasonable is that?

The fees are a bit restrictive, but the wait makes no difference as far as I'm concerned.

On the other end of things here in kansas I can walk into a pawn shop, sign the papers, and walk out concealed carrying with no phone or fees required. I can also have a compete arsenal in my basement. Again no permits or fees.

Some middle ground is needed.

Why is the wait not an issue? What are they waiting for? The whole purpose isn't to do a check, its to make the process so onerous people just quit.

How about we put a 10 day waiting period on abortions?

It's not to make people quit, it's to put a cooling off period between buying a pistol in a fit of anger/depression and offing yourself and you significant other.

And sure, put a ten day wait in abortions, I got not problem with that.

No, it's to make people quit the process. Will NYPD give me 24 hour protection while I am waiting for my revolver?

The whole process is to deny a right de jure if they can't deny it de facto.

And most abortion rights people go ballistic when I use that counter, have to admit, did not expect your response.

Why do you need 24 hours protection? And what harm could a ten day wait possibly do in either case?

What if exceptions could be made? Say for medical reasons on abortions and if you can show you are in immediate danger of the handgun.

Again, to me the wait is just a way to discourage people from going through with the process.

And if someone is really angry enough to go out and buy a gun and use it right away, one can easily get an illegal one.

 

[busybee01]

Ok. What do you have a problem with being banned?

No need to muddy the waters.

This thread ain't about me. It's about the bump stock ban. ...

No, you said you support the Second Amendment. But you have no problem with banning bump stocks. So what would you have a problem with being banned. Come on, give us an example. How about bolt action rifles that fire a .50 BMG round that can penetrate four inches of reinforced concrete?

The Second Amendment covers guns not bump stocks. Reasonable regulation does not violate the Constitution.

The definition of reasonable regulation is what we are trying to define. What is reasonable? It was reasonable to have blue laws covering among other things free speech, and those laws were struck down by the Supreme Court as a violation of the First Amendment. It was reasonable to “encourage” via physical means in order to get a man to confess, until it was struck down by the Supreme Court as a violation of the Cruel and Unusual punishment and the right not to testify against yourself.

A lot of things were reasonable. And now they aren’t. So what I am trying to find out is what everyone thinks is reasonable regulation. For the anti gunners, the reasonable restriction is a complete ban on private ownership. Is that going to be a mere reasonable restriction in the near future?

A bump stock is not a gun nor is it required to fire a weapon. It is not covered by the Second Amendment.