Gun control vs. Terrorism (Dem hypocrisy)

[Ray From Cleveland]

Too bad for you we have the internet and actual facts.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 16.3 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...

-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.




Hard Data, Hollow Protests

The reason for the current increase is what I have called the Ferguson Effect.

Cops are backing off of proactive policing in high-crime minority neighborhoods, and criminals are becoming emboldened.

Having been told incessantly by politicians, the media, and Black Lives Matter activists that they are bigoted for getting out of their cars and questioning someone loitering on a known drug corner at 2 AM, many officers are instead just driving by. Such stops are discretionary; cops don’t have to make them. And when political elites demonize the police for just such proactive policing, we shouldn’t be surprised when cops get the message and do less of it.

Seventy-two percent of the nation’s officers say that they and their colleagues are now less willing to stop and question suspicious persons, according to a Pew Research poll released in January. The reason is the persistent anti-cop climate.

Four studies came out in 2016 alone rebutting the charge that police shootings are racially biased. If there is a bias in police shootings, it works in favor of blacks and against whites. That truth has not stopped the ongoing demonization of the police—including, now, by many of the country’s ignorant professional athletes. The toll will be felt, as always, in the inner city, by the thousands of law-abiding people there who desperately want more police protection.

FBI: Violent crime increases for second straight year

Yes....you guys keep attacking the police and we get them not proactively policing the criminals...

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 16.3 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...
-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.




Hard Data, Hollow Protests

The reason for the current increase is what I have called the Ferguson Effect.

Cops are backing off of proactive policing in high-crime minority neighborhoods, and criminals are becoming emboldened.

Having been told incessantly by politicians, the media, and Black Lives Matter activists that they are bigoted for getting out of their cars and questioning someone loitering on a known drug corner at 2 AM, many officers are instead just driving by. Such stops are discretionary; cops don’t have to make them. And when political elites demonize the police for just such proactive policing, we shouldn’t be surprised when cops get the message and do less of it.

Seventy-two percent of the nation’s officers say that they and their colleagues are now less willing to stop and question suspicious persons, according to a Pew Research poll released in January. The reason is the persistent anti-cop climate.

Four studies came out in 2016 alone rebutting the charge that police shootings are racially biased. If there is a bias in police shootings, it works in favor of blacks and against whites. That truth has not stopped the ongoing demonization of the police—including, now, by many of the country’s ignorant professional athletes. The toll will be felt, as always, in the inner city, by the thousands of law-abiding people there who desperately want more police protection.

FBI: Violent crime increases for second straight year

Thanks to the Ferguson effect caused by people like you....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 16.3 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...
-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.




Hard Data, Hollow Protests

The reason for the current increase is what I have called the Ferguson Effect.

Cops are backing off of proactive policing in high-crime minority neighborhoods, and criminals are becoming emboldened.

Having been told incessantly by politicians, the media, and Black Lives Matter activists that they are bigoted for getting out of their cars and questioning someone loitering on a known drug corner at 2 AM, many officers are instead just driving by. Such stops are discretionary; cops don’t have to make them. And when political elites demonize the police for just such proactive policing, we shouldn’t be surprised when cops get the message and do less of it.

Seventy-two percent of the nation’s officers say that they and their colleagues are now less willing to stop and question suspicious persons, according to a Pew Research poll released in January. The reason is the persistent anti-cop climate.

Four studies came out in 2016 alone rebutting the charge that police shootings are racially biased. If there is a bias in police shootings, it works in favor of blacks and against whites. That truth has not stopped the ongoing demonization of the police—including, now, by many of the country’s ignorant professional athletes. The toll will be felt, as always, in the inner city, by the thousands of law-abiding people there who desperately want more police protection.

Ferguson is because of too many guns obviously. Our police shoot a lot of people because they are shot a lot. This doesn't happen with gun control.

In Ferguson, nobody had a gun except the police officer, or are you trying to say they should be disarmed too?

 

[Rustic]

I am looking at annual totals.

Personally I don't think a murder that occurs in a mass shooting is any different from a murder that occurs any other time with any other weapon.

So a mass murderer isn't worse than just a single murder? Right...

criminals murder more people than all of the mass shooters combined since 1982........so no, mass shooters are not the same problem....knives murder over 1,500 people every single year.....yet banning knives doesn't seem to be on your agenda, even though they are used to murder more people every year than all of the mass shootings since 1982...

What is the worst mass knifing?

Dumb ass....

33 Dead, 130 Injured in China Knife-Wielding Spree - NBC News

Fifty killed in a knife attack at a Chinese colliery | MINING.com

Twenty-nine people were killed and 130 were injured Saturday night when 10 men armed with long knives stormed the station in the southwest Chinese city of Kunming, the state news agency Xinhua reported.

Imagine the numbers if they had rifles.

Imagine if they had bombs dumbass...
Firearms have nothing to do with people’s behavior you dumb fucker

 

[Rustic]

It would be bad since none of the law abiding people would have guns....just like in France...where fully automatic rifles are completely, and utterly, illegal........and terrorists, on government terrorists watch lists got a bunch of these completely illegal rifles, along with 30 round magazines, pistols and grenades...and murdered 142 people.....

In a country where fully automatic rifles are completely illegal........

You mean like that?

When the weapons are illegal they can be stopped before people die.
Man charged in mass shooting plot at Milwaukee Masonic center seeks release

Again....in France, terrorists, on government terrorist watch lists got weapons that are completely illegal...fully automatic rifles with 30 round magazines, and just as illegal pistols and grenades....and murdered 142 unarmed people....in a country that bans fully automatic military rifles, 30 round magazines, pistols and grenades....

And here he was stopped before killing anyone.

Man charged in mass shooting plot at Milwaukee Masonic center seeks release

So.........you are getting lazy and weak.....that is really lame...

I like people not dying.

Ok, I’d like people not projecting their hurt feelings on the situations they don’t understand.

 

[Rustic]

It would be bad since none of the law abiding people would have guns....just like in France...where fully automatic rifles are completely, and utterly, illegal........and terrorists, on government terrorists watch lists got a bunch of these completely illegal rifles, along with 30 round magazines, pistols and grenades...and murdered 142 people.....

In a country where fully automatic rifles are completely illegal........

You mean like that?

So it takes 15-20 knife wielding killers to do the damage of one guy with a rifle. Yeah too much firepower.

Yeah......everyone noticed that you ignored the point about the French terrorists getting completely illegal, fully automatic military rifles and murdering 142 people.........here, I'll repeat it...

It would be bad since none of the law abiding people would have guns....just like in France...where fully automatic rifles are completely, and utterly, illegal........and terrorists, on government terrorists watch lists got a bunch of these completely illegal rifles, along with 30 round magazines, pistols and grenades...and murdered 142 people.....

In a country where fully automatic rifles are completely illegal........

Man charged in mass shooting plot at Milwaukee Masonic center seeks release

So what is this supposed to prove?

If the weapon is illegal they can be stopped before people die.

How? Criminals are going to obey that type a deal? What kind of fucked up world do you live in or want to live in?

 

[danielpalos]

I think there are a few more factors involved. I don't think citizens should be able to walk into walmart and buy a fully automatic uzi, so I think limitations on available firepower make sense. I think every honest citizen should be able to get a pistol or riffle to defend themselves, but all this high power stuff, I'm fine with regulating. I'm fine with harsh punishments for gun violence offenders but it is very situational and I don't think a teenager who got caught up with the wrong crowd should go to jail till they are 50 for making a stupid mistake... Again, it all depends on the case.

In other words, you like the way the gun laws are now. There is no place in the US where you can LEGALLY walk in and buy a full auto UZI. If you want to own one legally, prepare for a long process.

Yes, I think it makes sense to regulate the firepower that citizens own. Everybody deserves basic protection but it shouldn’t be quick and easy for somebody to get a weapon capable of killing dozens of people in the matter of just a few seconds. Those “tools” as they’ve been called pose a great danger to society and deserve to be regulated.

The other side of the conversation that seems to get lost is the motivation, indicators, mental process, and conditions etc that drive people to kill in the way that they do because ultimately there is a person behind every trigger pull.

so when is your legislation coming out to take illegal guns off the streets? You legislate that and then you may get attention. otherwise you have zip.

What is wrong with gun lovers automatically being registered in a posse registry for their State and county?

Firearm registration is unconstitutional

Not for registered posse.

 

[danielpalos]

In other words, you like the way the gun laws are now. There is no place in the US where you can LEGALLY walk in and buy a full auto UZI. If you want to own one legally, prepare for a long process.

Yes, I think it makes sense to regulate the firepower that citizens own. Everybody deserves basic protection but it shouldn’t be quick and easy for somebody to get a weapon capable of killing dozens of people in the matter of just a few seconds. Those “tools” as they’ve been called pose a great danger to society and deserve to be regulated.

The other side of the conversation that seems to get lost is the motivation, indicators, mental process, and conditions etc that drive people to kill in the way that they do because ultimately there is a person behind every trigger pull.

The point is, the militia is best for the common defense.

especially in cities like chicago. let's get these gang bangers and their illegal guns off the street.

We need to improve the ratio of well regulated militia to unorganized militia.

You got to read those words in context of that era, it doesn’t mean the same now as it did then.
Enforce the current laws, and don’t allow any new frivolous laws

The context hasn't changed. It means the same now as it did then.

 

[Rustic]

In other words, you like the way the gun laws are now. There is no place in the US where you can LEGALLY walk in and buy a full auto UZI. If you want to own one legally, prepare for a long process.

Yes, I think it makes sense to regulate the firepower that citizens own. Everybody deserves basic protection but it shouldn’t be quick and easy for somebody to get a weapon capable of killing dozens of people in the matter of just a few seconds. Those “tools” as they’ve been called pose a great danger to society and deserve to be regulated.

The other side of the conversation that seems to get lost is the motivation, indicators, mental process, and conditions etc that drive people to kill in the way that they do because ultimately there is a person behind every trigger pull.

so when is your legislation coming out to take illegal guns off the streets? You legislate that and then you may get attention. otherwise you have zip.

What is wrong with gun lovers automatically being registered in a posse registry for their State and county?

Firearm registration is unconstitutional

Not for registered posse.

For the average citizen it is unconstitutional to require firearm registration… Fact

 

[Slade3200]

YOu are right, criminals will break laws and there is no solution that will eliminate crime and murder. That isnt really the point. But if we can limit access to weapons capable of mass distraction then that could saves lives in some cases, wouldn’t you agree? A guy using a pistol is less dangerous than a guy with a Uzi. So making it difficult to get uzis is a good thing right? Makes us a little safer, and isn’t a tremendous violation of our rights.

A fully automatic Uzi is already a restricted firearm.

Do you support that restriction?

I really have no issue with the automatic weapon restrictions in place.

But I do have an issue with the move to ban semiautomatic weapons

I think it is a fine debate to have. The merits behind the auto restrictions are the same merits for those that argue for further restrictions. Of course there are always going to be those who push for more and there are going to be those who want none and then there is the middle majority whose limitations vary, thus the debate.

The Virginia Tech shooter murdered 32 people with pistols...so now, according to you, we can't have pistols either....right?

Absolutely not, you don’t seem to understand the opposing arguement. Or are you intentionally trying to distort it?

 

[danielpalos]

Yes, I think it makes sense to regulate the firepower that citizens own. Everybody deserves basic protection but it shouldn’t be quick and easy for somebody to get a weapon capable of killing dozens of people in the matter of just a few seconds. Those “tools” as they’ve been called pose a great danger to society and deserve to be regulated.

The other side of the conversation that seems to get lost is the motivation, indicators, mental process, and conditions etc that drive people to kill in the way that they do because ultimately there is a person behind every trigger pull.

so when is your legislation coming out to take illegal guns off the streets? You legislate that and then you may get attention. otherwise you have zip.

What is wrong with gun lovers automatically being registered in a posse registry for their State and county?

Firearm registration is unconstitutional

Not for registered posse.

For the average citizen it is unconstitutional to require firearm registration… Fact

Not sure why. Well regulated militia is declared necessary to the security of a free State.

 

[Rustic]

Yes, I think it makes sense to regulate the firepower that citizens own. Everybody deserves basic protection but it shouldn’t be quick and easy for somebody to get a weapon capable of killing dozens of people in the matter of just a few seconds. Those “tools” as they’ve been called pose a great danger to society and deserve to be regulated.

The other side of the conversation that seems to get lost is the motivation, indicators, mental process, and conditions etc that drive people to kill in the way that they do because ultimately there is a person behind every trigger pull.

The point is, the militia is best for the common defense.

especially in cities like chicago. let's get these gang bangers and their illegal guns off the street.

We need to improve the ratio of well regulated militia to unorganized militia.

You got to read those words in context of that era, it doesn’t mean the same now as it did then.
Enforce the current laws, and don’t allow any new frivolous laws

The context hasn't changed. It means the same now as it did then.

No, not at all.
the second amendment gives every citizen the right to own guns, free of federal regulations, to protect themselves in the face of danger. The amendment's militia clause was never meant to restrict each citizen's rights to bear arms.

 

[Rustic]

so when is your legislation coming out to take illegal guns off the streets? You legislate that and then you may get attention. otherwise you have zip.

What is wrong with gun lovers automatically being registered in a posse registry for their State and county?

Firearm registration is unconstitutional

Not for registered posse.

For the average citizen it is unconstitutional to require firearm registration… Fact

Not sure why. Well regulated militia is declared necessary to the security of a free State.

What Did “Bear Arms” Mean in the Second Amendment?

 

[danielpalos]

The point is, the militia is best for the common defense.

especially in cities like chicago. let's get these gang bangers and their illegal guns off the street.

We need to improve the ratio of well regulated militia to unorganized militia.

You got to read those words in context of that era, it doesn’t mean the same now as it did then.
Enforce the current laws, and don’t allow any new frivolous laws

The context hasn't changed. It means the same now as it did then.

No, not at all.
the second amendment gives every citizen the right to own guns, free of federal regulations, to protect themselves in the face of danger. The amendment's militia clause was never meant to restrict each citizen's rights to bear arms.

No, it doesn't. Arms are declared socialized for the militia in Article 1, Section 8. Any more reading comprehension issues?

 

[danielpalos]

What is wrong with gun lovers automatically being registered in a posse registry for their State and county?

Firearm registration is unconstitutional

Not for registered posse.

For the average citizen it is unconstitutional to require firearm registration… Fact

Not sure why. Well regulated militia is declared necessary to the security of a free State.

What Did “Bear Arms” Mean in the Second Amendment?

It does not mean, acquire and possess, that is a natural right not found in our Second Amendment.

 

[sakinago]

Most of the sellers at gun shows are licensed and run background checks.

"Most'? "most" implies that are some who don't run background checks.

And the crooks know who those guys are, which TOTALLY DEFEATS THE PURPOSE OF A BACKGROUND CHECK!

95% at least use background checks, the others are private sellers. In almost every gun show, it’s all made up of gun dealers, who use background checks. There are some private sellers in some gun shows, not at all a lot of them. Should a grandpa giving his son an old shotgun have to run a background check doing it? And why the fuck are criminals going to run a background check!?!!? Do you not realize that the background check laws we do have are actually racist, and deny innocent blacks the right to buy a gun. here’s a secret you don’t know, FELONS KNOW THEY ARE FELONS, THEY KNOW THEY WONT PASS A BACKGROUND CHECK. So why have 12 million been denied?? Well it turns out they just happen to share the same name as a felon (this is 99% of cases), and sadly in a world where 30% of African American males wind up felons, and since similar names are common in different ethnic groups, background checks effect innocent blacks trying to exercise their constitutionally protected right.

 

[sakinago]

especially in cities like chicago. let's get these gang bangers and their illegal guns off the street.

We need to improve the ratio of well regulated militia to unorganized militia.

You got to read those words in context of that era, it doesn’t mean the same now as it did then.
Enforce the current laws, and don’t allow any new frivolous laws

The context hasn't changed. It means the same now as it did then.

No, not at all.
the second amendment gives every citizen the right to own guns, free of federal regulations, to protect themselves in the face of danger. The amendment's militia clause was never meant to restrict each citizen's rights to bear arms.

No, it doesn't. Arms are declared socialized for the militia in Article 1, Section 8. Any more reading comprehension issues?

Not at all, do you see the word common defense? That’s an entirely different meaning than the one you’re trying to do backflips with, mr. reading comprehension. Especially in the context of article one section 8, the LEGISLATIVE powers. Maybe you should take another class?

Especially when you are still completely (and conveniently) ignoring “the right of the PEOPLE to KEEP and BEAR arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED” not the right of the militia, not the right of the government, but the people. Yea that part where you throw all reading comprehension out the window, into a pit, set it ablaze, bury it, re-dig it up, dismember it, put it into separate duffle bags, weigh down the bags, drive 10 miles out in the ocean, and then throw it over board.

I already gave you a history lesson, that should be unnecessary (dear god what has our education system become), into the context of what the militia was back then, a locally sourced group, lead by civilians (not regulated by USG in the sense that you like to use the word regulated, but regulated as in maintained and up-kept by the people), and here’s the most important part...a non USG or state government controlled military that could stand up to the USG if need be. That’s what made the militia necessary to a free people. Not the common defense which was charged with congress as you so clearly misrepresented in article 1 sections 8. Does it really make sense that they put in the 2nd amendment for common defense, and decided to circle back and put it in again but give the powers to the legislative branch without repealing the 2nd amendment???? No use a little critical thinking every once In a while.

I will say this one last time to you crazy pants, our founders wrote extensively about this (they wrote a lot of shit back then, this is what they did for fun, believe it or not they didn’t have social media or tv) so go look up what they actually meant by the second amendment, since you couldn’t use reading comprehension on The Very Hungry Caterpillar to save your life.

 

[easyt65]

Snowflakes / liberals 'know' an American exercising his/her Constitutional right to own a gun is more dangerous than an Islamic Extremist with an airplane, a truck, a suicide vest, ...

 

[2aguy]

A fully automatic Uzi is already a restricted firearm.

Do you support that restriction?

I really have no issue with the automatic weapon restrictions in place.

But I do have an issue with the move to ban semiautomatic weapons

I think it is a fine debate to have. The merits behind the auto restrictions are the same merits for those that argue for further restrictions. Of course there are always going to be those who push for more and there are going to be those who want none and then there is the middle majority whose limitations vary, thus the debate.

The Virginia Tech shooter murdered 32 people with pistols...so now, according to you, we can't have pistols either....right?

Absolutely not, you don’t seem to understand the opposing arguement. Or are you intentionally trying to distort it?

No....you don't seem to understand...you stated that Americans should not have access to weapons that can kill a lot of people in a few seconds.....and yet the Virginia Tech shooter murdered 32 people with pistols.....following your logic, we won't be allowed to have pistols either....

I have already seen one journalist who commented on being in a restaurant in Texas where he saw people openly carrying guns...he wrote about the guy with the revolver...and the other guy with the military pistol...by which he meant the semi-auto pistol that had a magazine.....the anti gunners are not going to let those pistols be owned if they get any real power.....

 

[whitehall]

NY Governor Cuomo actually said in public that "Conservatives are not welcome in New York". Meanwhile jihadist terrorists are not only welcome but recruited to live in NY thanks to an insane law called the "diversity lottery" promoted by Chuckie Schumer.

 

[jillian]

It made me think about how the "Left" typically reacts to gun violence, something we heard a lot of after Vegas, and I noticed that the messaging is quite different. After a shooting event the Left seems quick and adamant to try and change our laws to make communities safer. I've heard it communicated as a negligence of duty to not talk about gun control after a shooting. In the same spirit, why isn't there a reaction to legislate a way to keep us safer from terrorism after a terror attack by the Left? Its a rhetorical question, i know why, hence the hypocrisy. But if anybody would like to try to rationalize it then please go ahead!

Simple.

Home Depot Trucks aren't designed to kill people.

Guns are.

But I will bet you'll find out that this guy had a harder time renting a truck from the Home Depot than that other nut had building up a small arsenal.

but they don't like talking about Vegas, do they? nooooo, it's always too soon to talk about getting guns away from people who shouldn't have them.

then they turn around and call normal people "hypocrites"

 

[2aguy]

It made me think about how the "Left" typically reacts to gun violence, something we heard a lot of after Vegas, and I noticed that the messaging is quite different. After a shooting event the Left seems quick and adamant to try and change our laws to make communities safer. I've heard it communicated as a negligence of duty to not talk about gun control after a shooting. In the same spirit, why isn't there a reaction to legislate a way to keep us safer from terrorism after a terror attack by the Left? Its a rhetorical question, i know why, hence the hypocrisy. But if anybody would like to try to rationalize it then please go ahead!

Simple.

Home Depot Trucks aren't designed to kill people.

Guns are.

But I will bet you'll find out that this guy had a harder time renting a truck from the Home Depot than that other nut had building up a small arsenal.

but they don't like talking about Vegas, do they? nooooo, it's always too soon to talk about getting guns away from people who shouldn't have them.

then they turn around and call normal people "hypocrites"

You assholes started this....every shooting and the bodies will still be warm and your democrat politicians will be calling for gun control on law abiding citizens.......you started it....now you get to experience it.....if you want to stop it...you go first....the next mass shooting, how about you morons don't say word one about gun control...you do that, and then we will stop calling out muslim terrorists right after they murder innocent people......let's try that first...till then...you assholes started it...