Healthcare: The Free Market vs. the ACA

[NYcarbineer]

A free market in healthcare simply means that those who can't afford it go without.

Those who cannot afford healthcare do not go without. You made a false statement, Carbineer.

They do if there's a free market. It's like a free market in new cars. How many people who cannot afford the market price of a new car get a new car in a free market?

None.

It just burns you up if somebody has more and better stuff than you, doesn't it? Leftist ideology appeals to the most base levels of humans. It is disgusting. It is as if the leftist scum is willfully un-evolved feral animals.

lol, you sure ran away from the subject with that one.

Tell us,

how does the free market provide healthcare for those who can't afford to pay the market prices for it?

You and your hick clan can go to a publicly funded hospital 24/7 and get health care. You then fill out a financial statement for indigence and get the debt forgiven. This has always been the case. In addition, I have said nothing about repealing Medicaid or a Medicare.

Your problem (aside from the obvious personality calamities) is that you have an unfairly biased view of capitalism. It is one of your triggers, as it is for all the leftist scum.

So now you admit you DON"T want a free market in healthcare.

 

[Rob37]

Those who cannot afford healthcare do not go without. You made a false statement, Carbineer.

They do if there's a free market. It's like a free market in new cars. How many people who cannot afford the market price of a new car get a new car in a free market?

None.

It just burns you up if somebody has more and better stuff than you, doesn't it? Leftist ideology appeals to the most base levels of humans. It is disgusting. It is as if the leftist scum is willfully un-evolved feral animals.

lol, you sure ran away from the subject with that one.

Tell us,

how does the free market provide healthcare for those who can't afford to pay the market prices for it?

You and your hick clan can go to a publicly funded hospital 24/7 and get health care. You then fill out a financial statement for indigence and get the debt forgiven. This has always been the case. In addition, I have said nothing about repealing Medicaid or a Medicare.

Your problem (aside from the obvious personality calamities) is that you have an unfairly biased view of capitalism. It is one of your triggers, as it is for all the leftist scum.

So now you admit you DON"T want a free market in healthcare.

Poor baby. You are just confused. Want some Apple juice?

 

[NYcarbineer]

They do if there's a free market. It's like a free market in new cars. How many people who cannot afford the market price of a new car get a new car in a free market?

None.

It just burns you up if somebody has more and better stuff than you, doesn't it? Leftist ideology appeals to the most base levels of humans. It is disgusting. It is as if the leftist scum is willfully un-evolved feral animals.

lol, you sure ran away from the subject with that one.

Tell us,

how does the free market provide healthcare for those who can't afford to pay the market prices for it?

You and your hick clan can go to a publicly funded hospital 24/7 and get health care. You then fill out a financial statement for indigence and get the debt forgiven. This has always been the case. In addition, I have said nothing about repealing Medicaid or a Medicare.

Your problem (aside from the obvious personality calamities) is that you have an unfairly biased view of capitalism. It is one of your triggers, as it is for all the leftist scum.

So now you admit you DON"T want a free market in healthcare.

Poor baby. You are just confused. Want some Apple juice?

And with that, you lose the argument.

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

People don't realize that Obama care was setup to fail. Its a means to a end, that end being single payer health care. If you want a model for that look at Veterans healthcare.

 

[NYcarbineer]

We cannot wait to repeal the ACA until we have a replacement bill. This approach will doom our effort because the Dems will fight us every step of the way on every measure we propose, and this process will go on forever. Ultimately, nothing will really get done and we will be stuck with Obama's healthcare abortion of a law.

As an aside, one has to wonder why we even need the ACA or a replacement. The fact is that the market will take care of health care. Prior to the ACA nobody was denied Healthcare if they were poor and lacked insurance. If you went to a publicly funded hospital they were required to treat you.

Taking a page out of the Alinsky playbook, this is what we should do. Repeal, with no fallback except for the free market. This itself is the end result for me. The market will adapt and fall all over itself to offer health care products to the consumer. It will be a niche market in the sense that it is newly opened and it needs to be filled. Hell, given how large the healthcare market is in terms of dollars, the sudden capitalistic surge of interest and investment into this sector will probably cause macro-economic numbers to soar and our overall economy to prosper. There will be a health care "bubble". It would be huge.

I compare this approach to an Alinsky tactic because the idea is that first you create a crisis. Then you implement a solution. Most of the pussies in today's America lack the stomach for true, unfettered capitalism. Unfortunately, this is what happens when you let the common man have too much influence on governing. Consumers will demand "protections" and all sorts of nonsense that will diminish investment returns and, therefore, quell capital investment.

So, instead of spending years arguing over replacing the ACA, let's just kill it now. Then with the impending and fictitious Armageddon out there, we can force the Dems to the table to work out something. In other words, they will have to co-own any bullshit enacted to replace the ACA.

Obviously, we do not have 60 seats in the Senate, yet. We need to pass a law through budget reconciliation that deletes the ACA. We could save a couple of things in order to provide political shelter to members, like allowing kids to stay on parents' policies until 26. Then, after we euthanize the ACA we start debating what, if any, replacement law we need.

Again, my preference is for the market to govern healthcare. That is, in fact, what will govern unless the government takes that away from us. What will most likely happen upon the demise of the ACA is that there will be a massive rush into the healthcare sector by capital investors to take advantage of this new and wide-open market. The results would be spectacular. Hell, I would make it a part of the repeal bill that all capital gains in the healthcare industry will be taxed at only 2%. The money will literally POUR into the healthcare sector.

All of the horror tales of what will happen if the ACA is repealed is pure fiction. These projections are flawed because repeal will not take place in a vacuum. They assume no replacement regime. However, something WILL replace the ACA as the healthcare regulatory regime. The default, and the best, is the market.

Moreover, remember that these same people touting these end of times projections are the ones that said the stock market would crash if Trump was elected. In fact, these people could not have been more work. The Dow, for example, is surging wildly to new highs since Trump was elected.

Right now our Republican representatives are being cowards. They don't want to do anything that will cause them to lose their seats. Further, they cannot openly debate the possibility of having no replacement for the ACA because the Democrats are just too good at whipping up the people in a panic. Honestly, the Dems are just better at politics than we are. It has been This ways for years now, partly because they have no problem with being backstabbing liars. But that is what we are dealing with.

We need to sneak this repeal into the budget reconciliation process that is coming up shortly and ram that fucker through with no debate. Once the "crisis" is in place with the ACA gone, then we can pass some bipartisan stop-gap measures for the short time between the death of the ACA and the market forces taking hold. It will be a very short time, by the way.

This is one of the pieces to the puzzle we must put together if we are going to save America. Electing Trump and Republican reps, Senators, and others is not enough. We need BOLD moves. If we do not take these bold moves then we will never get rid of this clusterfuck ACA and will most likely end up with a single-payer system when the ACA collapses, which is the intended result sought by ACA proponents (and a very Alinsky scheme).


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Health care is a necessity. The "free market " does not act the in the traditional sense when it comes to a necessary good/service .

They would litterally let people die on the street and gouge the rest of us .

The market will not "literally let people die". Lol!

In addition, your scumbag people can jump up and down on the safety net all they want. We would still have Medicaid, Medicare, and indigent care.

You are just like that dirty prick, Carbineer: when you hear that trigger you turn-off your brains and default to installed leftist responses. You ought to be thankful that most of us on the right are good, God-fearing people, because if it were up to me I would enslave you mindless fuckers and send you to the Gulags.

Medicaid alone is enough to prove that healthcare is not a free market. With Medicaid, healthcare becomes a government/taxpayer subsidized market,

therefore NOT a free market,

and since you have endorsed Medicaid, you have rejected the free market solution for healthcare.

 

[Rob37]

It just burns you up if somebody has more and better stuff than you, doesn't it? Leftist ideology appeals to the most base levels of humans. It is disgusting. It is as if the leftist scum is willfully un-evolved feral animals.

lol, you sure ran away from the subject with that one.

Tell us,

how does the free market provide healthcare for those who can't afford to pay the market prices for it?

You and your hick clan can go to a publicly funded hospital 24/7 and get health care. You then fill out a financial statement for indigence and get the debt forgiven. This has always been the case. In addition, I have said nothing about repealing Medicaid or a Medicare.

Your problem (aside from the obvious personality calamities) is that you have an unfairly biased view of capitalism. It is one of your triggers, as it is for all the leftist scum.

So now you admit you DON"T want a free market in healthcare.

Poor baby. You are just confused. Want some Apple juice?

And with that, you lose the argument.

Right. This from the hick who is a loser from the moment he opens his eyes in the morning. Lol!


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

 

[Vandalshandle]

Can't be done, sorry. The laws regarding insurance in the individual states require the filing of the plans about a year in advance. The law does not allow for instantaneous creation of plans.

Interesting bit of news, especially since in my career, I was VP of Underwriting and Compliance for health insurers and HMO's, and it typically took me about 75 days to obtain approval for news health plans by the various state insurance commissioners.

 

[Rob37]

We cannot wait to repeal the ACA until we have a replacement bill. This approach will doom our effort because the Dems will fight us every step of the way on every measure we propose, and this process will go on forever. Ultimately, nothing will really get done and we will be stuck with Obama's healthcare abortion of a law.

As an aside, one has to wonder why we even need the ACA or a replacement. The fact is that the market will take care of health care. Prior to the ACA nobody was denied Healthcare if they were poor and lacked insurance. If you went to a publicly funded hospital they were required to treat you.

Taking a page out of the Alinsky playbook, this is what we should do. Repeal, with no fallback except for the free market. This itself is the end result for me. The market will adapt and fall all over itself to offer health care products to the consumer. It will be a niche market in the sense that it is newly opened and it needs to be filled. Hell, given how large the healthcare market is in terms of dollars, the sudden capitalistic surge of interest and investment into this sector will probably cause macro-economic numbers to soar and our overall economy to prosper. There will be a health care "bubble". It would be huge.

I compare this approach to an Alinsky tactic because the idea is that first you create a crisis. Then you implement a solution. Most of the pussies in today's America lack the stomach for true, unfettered capitalism. Unfortunately, this is what happens when you let the common man have too much influence on governing. Consumers will demand "protections" and all sorts of nonsense that will diminish investment returns and, therefore, quell capital investment.

So, instead of spending years arguing over replacing the ACA, let's just kill it now. Then with the impending and fictitious Armageddon out there, we can force the Dems to the table to work out something. In other words, they will have to co-own any bullshit enacted to replace the ACA.

Obviously, we do not have 60 seats in the Senate, yet. We need to pass a law through budget reconciliation that deletes the ACA. We could save a couple of things in order to provide political shelter to members, like allowing kids to stay on parents' policies until 26. Then, after we euthanize the ACA we start debating what, if any, replacement law we need.

Again, my preference is for the market to govern healthcare. That is, in fact, what will govern unless the government takes that away from us. What will most likely happen upon the demise of the ACA is that there will be a massive rush into the healthcare sector by capital investors to take advantage of this new and wide-open market. The results would be spectacular. Hell, I would make it a part of the repeal bill that all capital gains in the healthcare industry will be taxed at only 2%. The money will literally POUR into the healthcare sector.

All of the horror tales of what will happen if the ACA is repealed is pure fiction. These projections are flawed because repeal will not take place in a vacuum. They assume no replacement regime. However, something WILL replace the ACA as the healthcare regulatory regime. The default, and the best, is the market.

Moreover, remember that these same people touting these end of times projections are the ones that said the stock market would crash if Trump was elected. In fact, these people could not have been more work. The Dow, for example, is surging wildly to new highs since Trump was elected.

Right now our Republican representatives are being cowards. They don't want to do anything that will cause them to lose their seats. Further, they cannot openly debate the possibility of having no replacement for the ACA because the Democrats are just too good at whipping up the people in a panic. Honestly, the Dems are just better at politics than we are. It has been This ways for years now, partly because they have no problem with being backstabbing liars. But that is what we are dealing with.

We need to sneak this repeal into the budget reconciliation process that is coming up shortly and ram that fucker through with no debate. Once the "crisis" is in place with the ACA gone, then we can pass some bipartisan stop-gap measures for the short time between the death of the ACA and the market forces taking hold. It will be a very short time, by the way.

This is one of the pieces to the puzzle we must put together if we are going to save America. Electing Trump and Republican reps, Senators, and others is not enough. We need BOLD moves. If we do not take these bold moves then we will never get rid of this clusterfuck ACA and will most likely end up with a single-payer system when the ACA collapses, which is the intended result sought by ACA proponents (and a very Alinsky scheme).


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Health care is a necessity. The "free market " does not act the in the traditional sense when it comes to a necessary good/service .

They would litterally let people die on the street and gouge the rest of us .

The market will not "literally let people die". Lol!

In addition, your scumbag people can jump up and down on the safety net all they want. We would still have Medicaid, Medicare, and indigent care.

You are just like that dirty prick, Carbineer: when you hear that trigger you turn-off your brains and default to installed leftist responses. You ought to be thankful that most of us on the right are good, God-fearing people, because if it were up to me I would enslave you mindless fuckers and send you to the Gulags.

Medicaid alone is enough to prove that healthcare is not a free market. With Medicaid, healthcare becomes a government/taxpayer subsidized market,

therefore NOT a free market,

and since you have endorsed Medicaid, you have rejected the free market solution for healthcare.

Did I ever say pure free market? Carbineer, stop wasting my time. Yes, the market should control substantially all of healthcare. But we won't let you genetically challenged mongrels go without.

So, if it makes you feel better, I will called it a modified free market approach in that you will keep your Medicare, Medicaid, and indigent care. Nothing I said in the op excluded this, Honey. You are just not good with logic and nuance.




Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

 

[Vandalshandle]

We cannot wait to repeal the ACA until we have a replacement bill. This approach will doom our effort because the Dems will fight us every step of the way on every measure we propose, and this process will go on forever. Ultimately, nothing will really get done and we will be stuck with Obama's healthcare abortion of a law.

As an aside, one has to wonder why we even need the ACA or a replacement. The fact is that the market will take care of health care. Prior to the ACA nobody was denied Healthcare if they were poor and lacked insurance. If you went to a publicly funded hospital they were required to treat you.

Taking a page out of the Alinsky playbook, this is what we should do. Repeal, with no fallback except for the free market. This itself is the end result for me. The market will adapt and fall all over itself to offer health care products to the consumer. It will be a niche market in the sense that it is newly opened and it needs to be filled. Hell, given how large the healthcare market is in terms of dollars, the sudden capitalistic surge of interest and investment into this sector will probably cause macro-economic numbers to soar and our overall economy to prosper. There will be a health care "bubble". It would be huge.

I compare this approach to an Alinsky tactic because the idea is that first you create a crisis. Then you implement a solution. Most of the pussies in today's America lack the stomach for true, unfettered capitalism. Unfortunately, this is what happens when you let the common man have too much influence on governing. Consumers will demand "protections" and all sorts of nonsense that will diminish investment returns and, therefore, quell capital investment.

So, instead of spending years arguing over replacing the ACA, let's just kill it now. Then with the impending and fictitious Armageddon out there, we can force the Dems to the table to work out something. In other words, they will have to co-own any bullshit enacted to replace the ACA.

Obviously, we do not have 60 seats in the Senate, yet. We need to pass a law through budget reconciliation that deletes the ACA. We could save a couple of things in order to provide political shelter to members, like allowing kids to stay on parents' policies until 26. Then, after we euthanize the ACA we start debating what, if any, replacement law we need.

Again, my preference is for the market to govern healthcare. That is, in fact, what will govern unless the government takes that away from us. What will most likely happen upon the demise of the ACA is that there will be a massive rush into the healthcare sector by capital investors to take advantage of this new and wide-open market. The results would be spectacular. Hell, I would make it a part of the repeal bill that all capital gains in the healthcare industry will be taxed at only 2%. The money will literally POUR into the healthcare sector.

All of the horror tales of what will happen if the ACA is repealed is pure fiction. These projections are flawed because repeal will not take place in a vacuum. They assume no replacement regime. However, something WILL replace the ACA as the healthcare regulatory regime. The default, and the best, is the market.

Moreover, remember that these same people touting these end of times projections are the ones that said the stock market would crash if Trump was elected. In fact, these people could not have been more work. The Dow, for example, is surging wildly to new highs since Trump was elected.

Right now our Republican representatives are being cowards. They don't want to do anything that will cause them to lose their seats. Further, they cannot openly debate the possibility of having no replacement for the ACA because the Democrats are just too good at whipping up the people in a panic. Honestly, the Dems are just better at politics than we are. It has been This ways for years now, partly because they have no problem with being backstabbing liars. But that is what we are dealing with.

We need to sneak this repeal into the budget reconciliation process that is coming up shortly and ram that fucker through with no debate. Once the "crisis" is in place with the ACA gone, then we can pass some bipartisan stop-gap measures for the short time between the death of the ACA and the market forces taking hold. It will be a very short time, by the way.

This is one of the pieces to the puzzle we must put together if we are going to save America. Electing Trump and Republican reps, Senators, and others is not enough. We need BOLD moves. If we do not take these bold moves then we will never get rid of this clusterfuck ACA and will most likely end up with a single-payer system when the ACA collapses, which is the intended result sought by ACA proponents (and a very Alinsky scheme).


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Health care is a necessity. The "free market " does not act the in the traditional sense when it comes to a necessary good/service .

They would litterally let people die on the street and gouge the rest of us .

The market will not "literally let people die". Lol!

In addition, your scumbag people can jump up and down on the safety net all they want. We would still have Medicaid, Medicare, and indigent care.

You are just like that dirty prick, Carbineer: when you hear that trigger you turn-off your brains and default to installed leftist responses. You ought to be thankful that most of us on the right are good, God-fearing people, because if it were up to me I would enslave you mindless fuckers and send you to the Gulags.

Wrong again, Rob. In my 50 years of turning people down for health insurance as an underwriter, hundreds, if not thousands, of them died for lack of critical care. When people accused me of being callous, I reminded them that insurance was a private profit making endeavor, not a welfare agency. My responsibility was strictly to the shareholders.

 

[Timmy]

We cannot wait to repeal the ACA until we have a replacement bill. This approach will doom our effort because the Dems will fight us every step of the way on every measure we propose, and this process will go on forever. Ultimately, nothing will really get done and we will be stuck with Obama's healthcare abortion of a law.

As an aside, one has to wonder why we even need the ACA or a replacement. The fact is that the market will take care of health care. Prior to the ACA nobody was denied Healthcare if they were poor and lacked insurance. If you went to a publicly funded hospital they were required to treat you.

Taking a page out of the Alinsky playbook, this is what we should do. Repeal, with no fallback except for the free market. This itself is the end result for me. The market will adapt and fall all over itself to offer health care products to the consumer. It will be a niche market in the sense that it is newly opened and it needs to be filled. Hell, given how large the healthcare market is in terms of dollars, the sudden capitalistic surge of interest and investment into this sector will probably cause macro-economic numbers to soar and our overall economy to prosper. There will be a health care "bubble". It would be huge.

I compare this approach to an Alinsky tactic because the idea is that first you create a crisis. Then you implement a solution. Most of the pussies in today's America lack the stomach for true, unfettered capitalism. Unfortunately, this is what happens when you let the common man have too much influence on governing. Consumers will demand "protections" and all sorts of nonsense that will diminish investment returns and, therefore, quell capital investment.

So, instead of spending years arguing over replacing the ACA, let's just kill it now. Then with the impending and fictitious Armageddon out there, we can force the Dems to the table to work out something. In other words, they will have to co-own any bullshit enacted to replace the ACA.

Obviously, we do not have 60 seats in the Senate, yet. We need to pass a law through budget reconciliation that deletes the ACA. We could save a couple of things in order to provide political shelter to members, like allowing kids to stay on parents' policies until 26. Then, after we euthanize the ACA we start debating what, if any, replacement law we need.

Again, my preference is for the market to govern healthcare. That is, in fact, what will govern unless the government takes that away from us. What will most likely happen upon the demise of the ACA is that there will be a massive rush into the healthcare sector by capital investors to take advantage of this new and wide-open market. The results would be spectacular. Hell, I would make it a part of the repeal bill that all capital gains in the healthcare industry will be taxed at only 2%. The money will literally POUR into the healthcare sector.

All of the horror tales of what will happen if the ACA is repealed is pure fiction. These projections are flawed because repeal will not take place in a vacuum. They assume no replacement regime. However, something WILL replace the ACA as the healthcare regulatory regime. The default, and the best, is the market.

Moreover, remember that these same people touting these end of times projections are the ones that said the stock market would crash if Trump was elected. In fact, these people could not have been more work. The Dow, for example, is surging wildly to new highs since Trump was elected.

Right now our Republican representatives are being cowards. They don't want to do anything that will cause them to lose their seats. Further, they cannot openly debate the possibility of having no replacement for the ACA because the Democrats are just too good at whipping up the people in a panic. Honestly, the Dems are just better at politics than we are. It has been This ways for years now, partly because they have no problem with being backstabbing liars. But that is what we are dealing with.

We need to sneak this repeal into the budget reconciliation process that is coming up shortly and ram that fucker through with no debate. Once the "crisis" is in place with the ACA gone, then we can pass some bipartisan stop-gap measures for the short time between the death of the ACA and the market forces taking hold. It will be a very short time, by the way.

This is one of the pieces to the puzzle we must put together if we are going to save America. Electing Trump and Republican reps, Senators, and others is not enough. We need BOLD moves. If we do not take these bold moves then we will never get rid of this clusterfuck ACA and will most likely end up with a single-payer system when the ACA collapses, which is the intended result sought by ACA proponents (and a very Alinsky scheme).


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Health care is a necessity. The "free market " does not act the in the traditional sense when it comes to a necessary good/service .

They would litterally let people die on the street and gouge the rest of us .

The market will not "literally let people die". Lol!

In addition, your scumbag people can jump up and down on the safety net all they want. We would still have Medicaid, Medicare, and indigent care.

You are just like that dirty prick, Carbineer: when you hear that trigger you turn-off your brains and default to installed leftist responses. You ought to be thankful that most of us on the right are good, God-fearing people, because if it were up to me I would enslave you mindless fuckers and send you to the Gulags.

Medicaid alone is enough to prove that healthcare is not a free market. With Medicaid, healthcare becomes a government/taxpayer subsidized market,

therefore NOT a free market,

and since you have endorsed Medicaid, you have rejected the free market solution for healthcare.

Did I ever say pure free market? Carbineer, stop wasting my time. Yes, the market should control substantially all of healthcare. But we won't let you genetically challenged mongrels go without.

So, if it makes you feel better, I will called it a modified free market approach in that you will keep your Medicare, Medicaid, and indigent care. Nothing I said in the op excluded this, Honey. You are just not good with logic and nuance.




Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Nice plan , LOL! Here's what would happen. The "free market" would care for you until you got sick and expensive. They'd dump your ass in a hot minute . Not you have a pre condition. Now no one will pick you up.

Ohh but that's ok. Medicare to the rescue ! All sick people end up on the taxpayer rolls!

 

[Rob37]

Typical leftist default blabber.

 

[Doc1]

Can't be done, sorry. The laws regarding insurance in the individual states require the filing of the plans about a year in advance. The law does not allow for instantaneous creation of plans.

Interesting bit of news, especially since in my career, I was VP of Underwriting and Compliance for health insurers and HMO's, and it typically took me about 75 days to obtain approval for news health plans by the various state insurance commissioners.

Not here. A new plan must be filed by at least May WITH rates.

 

[danielpalos]

A free market in healthcare simply means that those who can't afford it go without.

Those who cannot afford healthcare do not go without. You made a false statement, Carbineer.

They do if there's a free market. It's like a free market in new cars. How many people who cannot afford the market price of a new car get a new car in a free market?

None.

It just burns you up if somebody has more and better stuff than you, doesn't it? Leftist ideology appeals to the most base levels of humans. It is disgusting. It is as if the leftist scum is willfully un-evolved feral animals.

simple, equal protection of the law for the poor, will do; under our form of Capitalism.

Equal protection does not mandate that everyone is entitled to the same degree of healthcare. Healthcare would have to be made into a legal right FIRST. This is an absurd idea that will diminish the quality of our healthcare.

Given your leftist sensibilities, maybe you would be happier living in Cuba?

equal protection of the law, is just that. we could be solving simple poverty on an at-will basis in our at-will employment States.