Hillary: We have got to do something about gun violence in America

[2aguy]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

.01%

?

30.000 deaths caused by 300.000.000 guns

.01%

Less, cut out about 21,000 suicides, they don't count toward that total.

 

[2aguy]

The laws she comes up with, will only be obeyed by law-abiding people. And they aren't the ones causing the problems.

Gun owners are law abiding up until the point they no longer are

You may be pefectly law abiding up until the point you shoot your wife
Adam Lanza was law abiding up until he killed his mother and shot up the school

Stupid reactionary paranoid garbage. Typical of you moron.

Our problem as a nation is that we are not reactionary

We watch as 30,000 Americans are killed by guns and shrug.......nothing we can do about it
We watch as 9 churchgoers are gunned down and shrug....nothing we can do about it
We watch as 20 first graders are slaughtered and shrug....nothing we can do about it

We watch as thousands are killed in car crashes and we do nothing about it.
We watch as hundreds of thousands fall off ladders and are killed or injured and do nothing about it.
We watch as thousands of kids drown in private pools and do nothing about it.

What do you propose to do about hte plethora of injuries due to ladders?

Actually we have done quite a bit about it

We have licensing of drivers, strict insurance requirements, registration of vehicles (Why can't we do the same with guns?)
We have made cars safer, required seat belts and air bags
We have made roads safer
We have toughened laws against drunk driving

All have contributed to slash the number of automotive fatalities....yet when we try to propose the same for guns all we hear is....That won't work

Guns are one of the most regulated products in the world. And after you require a license to vote, require a tax to vote and have a property requirement to vote..then we can talk about guns.

And again..you never explained why we need to register guns, or license gun owners……what will that do that can't already be done?


I know, you won't answer…..

 

[Brain357]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

.01%

?

30.000 deaths caused by 300.000.000 guns

.01%

Less, cut out about 21,000 suicides, they don't count toward that total.

They count toward total deaths. It's interesting a gun owner is like 100x more likely to shoot and kill himself than a criminal.

 

[Auld Phart]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

.01%

?

30.000 deaths caused by 300.000.000 guns

.01%

Less, cut out about 21,000 suicides, they don't count toward that total.

I was using his numbers

 

[2aguy]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

.01%

?

30.000 deaths caused by 300.000.000 guns

.01%

Less, cut out about 21,000 suicides, they don't count toward that total.

They count toward total deaths. It's interesting a gun owner is like 100x more likely to shoot and kill himself than a criminal.

Because law abiding people aren't out to shoot people, so they scare off or capture them before they shoot them to the tune of 2 million times a year...far more than the 505 accidental gun deaths in 2013.

 

[2aguy]

Obama, Hillary Clinton Speak Out on Gun Violence After Virginia TV Shootings
Good to see Hillary isn't above using the blood of innocents to push her mindless agenda.

Tell us: what "preventive measures" would have stopped this crime?
Surely, you're smart enough and compassionate enough, to figure it out. Right?

Stop it? Probably not

We are a second amendment nation. We have 300 million guns ready for you to resolve any grievance or conflict you may have. We are also a nation raised in a gun culture. Cowboys shooting it out in the street. Gangsters spraying machine guns.

Pissed at your boss? Heres a gun
Had it with your wife? Heres a gun
Guy cut you off in traffic? Heres a gun
Want to kill a bunch of first graders? Heres an AR-15

We need to admit that we prefer being an armed society than a safe society. People getting killed is a price we willingly pay

Gee, I've been pissed at my boss and I own a gun. I never shot him.
I've had it with my wife and I own a gun. I've never shot her.
I've had guys cut me off in traffic and I own a gun. I've never shot one.
I have no desire to kill anyone. And I own an AR15.
It's not the gun, idiot. It's the idiot.

Very true

The challenge is how do we keep the guns away from the idiots?
We can start with keeping them away from criminals....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of crazies....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of wife beaters...background checks

But we cant have effective licensing or background checks because the gun nuts insist on.......except for gun shows, except for private sales

How do we keep cars away from drunk drivers?
We license drivers
We tax cars.
Guess what: we still have drunks getting into cars and driving.
Background checks do not keep guns from anyone's hands except law abiding people. How often does this need to be stated before you understand this?

Doesn't that apply to any law?
We have laws against rape but people are still raped, laws against robbery but still have robberies does that mean we should not have laws at all?

Much like no single automobile safety law or requirement has ended ALL fatalities, collectively they have greatly decreased the number of people killed on our roads

We have laws against using guns to commit crimes...just like against murder and rape...so what is your problem?

 

[2aguy]

Stupid reactionary paranoid garbage. Typical of you moron.

Our problem as a nation is that we are not reactionary

We watch as 30,000 Americans are killed by guns and shrug.......nothing we can do about it
We watch as 9 churchgoers are gunned down and shrug....nothing we can do about it
We watch as 20 first graders are slaughtered and shrug....nothing we can do about it

We watch as thousands are killed in car crashes and we do nothing about it.
We watch as hundreds of thousands fall off ladders and are killed or injured and do nothing about it.
We watch as thousands of kids drown in private pools and do nothing about it.

What do you propose to do about hte plethora of injuries due to ladders?

Actually we have done quite a bit about it

We have licensing of drivers, strict insurance requirements, registration of vehicles (Why can't we do the same with guns?)
We have made cars safer, required seat belts and air bags
We have made roads safer
We have toughened laws against drunk driving

All have contributed to slash the number of automotive fatalities....yet when we try to propose the same for guns all we hear is....That won't work

Do you favor equipping guns with airbags?

Sensors where only the registered owner can fire it would be nice. Somebody steals your gun and it is useless to them. Your kid is playing with your gun and he can't fire it

As if criminals won't get around that. And so you get shot and your wife needs to use the gun ....she can't....

 

[2aguy]

Obama, Hillary Clinton Speak Out on Gun Violence After Virginia TV Shootings
Good to see Hillary isn't above using the blood of innocents to push her mindless agenda.

Tell us: what "preventive measures" would have stopped this crime?
Surely, you're smart enough and compassionate enough, to figure it out. Right?

Stop it? Probably not

We are a second amendment nation. We have 300 million guns ready for you to resolve any grievance or conflict you may have. We are also a nation raised in a gun culture. Cowboys shooting it out in the street. Gangsters spraying machine guns.

Pissed at your boss? Heres a gun
Had it with your wife? Heres a gun
Guy cut you off in traffic? Heres a gun
Want to kill a bunch of first graders? Heres an AR-15

We need to admit that we prefer being an armed society than a safe society. People getting killed is a price we willingly pay

Gee, I've been pissed at my boss and I own a gun. I never shot him.
I've had it with my wife and I own a gun. I've never shot her.
I've had guys cut me off in traffic and I own a gun. I've never shot one.
I have no desire to kill anyone. And I own an AR15.
It's not the gun, idiot. It's the idiot.

Very true

The challenge is how do we keep the guns away from the idiots?
We can start with keeping them away from criminals....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of crazies....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of wife beaters...background checks

But we cant have effective licensing or background checks because the gun nuts insist on.......except for gun shows, except for private sales

How do we keep cars away from drunk drivers?
We license drivers
We tax cars.
Guess what: we still have drunks getting into cars and driving.
Background checks do not keep guns from anyone's hands except law abiding people. How often does this need to be stated before you understand this?

Doesn't that apply to any law?
We have laws against rape but people are still raped, laws against robbery but still have robberies does that mean we should not have laws at all?

Much like no single automobile safety law or requirement has ended ALL fatalities, collectively they have greatly decreased the number of people killed on our roads

There are more people killed in car accidents than are murdered with guns.

 

[Brain357]

.01%

?

30.000 deaths caused by 300.000.000 guns

.01%

Less, cut out about 21,000 suicides, they don't count toward that total.

They count toward total deaths. It's interesting a gun owner is like 100x more likely to shoot and kill himself than a criminal.

Because law abiding people aren't out to shoot people, so they scare off or capture them before they shoot them to the tune of 2 million times a year...far more than the 505 accidental gun deaths in 2013.

2 million isn't even mathematically possible.

 

[2aguy]

Gee, I've been pissed at my boss and I own a gun. I never shot him.
I've had it with my wife and I own a gun. I've never shot her.
I've had guys cut me off in traffic and I own a gun. I've never shot one.
I have no desire to kill anyone. And I own an AR15.
It's not the gun, idiot. It's the idiot.

Very true


The challenge is how do we keep the guns away from the idiots?
We can start with keeping them away from criminals....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of crazies....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of wife beaters...background checks

But we cant have effective licensing or background checks because the gun nuts insist on.......except for gun shows, except for private sales

How do we keep cars away from drunk drivers?
We license drivers
We tax cars.
Guess what: we still have drunks getting into cars and driving.
Background checks do not keep guns from anyone's hands except law abiding people. How often does this need to be stated before you understand this?

Doesn't that apply to any law?
We have laws against rape but people are still raped, laws against robbery but still have robberies does that mean we should not have laws at all?

Much like no single automobile safety law or requirement has ended ALL fatalities, collectively they have greatly decreased the number of people killed on our roads

We have laws against murder and people still murder.
Now you're getting the idea: Criminals are not deterred by laws.

But we need a framework of laws to establish criminality

Criminals are deterred by laws, some still break them
They know if they are on probation and get found with a gun they will go back to jail. Incentive for most not to have a gun
They know if they are found with an automatic weapon their sentence will be much worse

You realize if a criminal is found with a gun now...they are arrested and go back to jail...right? Already exists. Felons and other criminals cannot use guns of any kind to commit crime....laws already exist for that.

What deters criminals....long prison sentences....but prosecutors and judges do not put them away for gun crimes. That is the problem.

 

[2aguy]

Obama, Hillary Clinton Speak Out on Gun Violence After Virginia TV Shootings
Good to see Hillary isn't above using the blood of innocents to push her mindless agenda.

Tell us: what "preventive measures" would have stopped this crime?
Surely, you're smart enough and compassionate enough, to figure it out. Right?

Stop it? Probably not

We are a second amendment nation. We have 300 million guns ready for you to resolve any grievance or conflict you may have. We are also a nation raised in a gun culture. Cowboys shooting it out in the street. Gangsters spraying machine guns.

Pissed at your boss? Heres a gun
Had it with your wife? Heres a gun
Guy cut you off in traffic? Heres a gun
Want to kill a bunch of first graders? Heres an AR-15

We need to admit that we prefer being an armed society than a safe society. People getting killed is a price we willingly pay

Gee, I've been pissed at my boss and I own a gun. I never shot him.
I've had it with my wife and I own a gun. I've never shot her.
I've had guys cut me off in traffic and I own a gun. I've never shot one.
I have no desire to kill anyone. And I own an AR15.
It's not the gun, idiot. It's the idiot.

Very true

The challenge is how do we keep the guns away from the idiots?
We can start with keeping them away from criminals....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of crazies....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of wife beaters...background checks

But we cant have effective licensing or background checks because the gun nuts insist on.......except for gun shows, except for private sales

We have background checks idiot. They don't work.

Especially when they don't apply to private sales or gun shows

I love it when gun nuts insist on exceptions and loopholes to the laws and then use those exceptions as proof that the laws don't work

You realize that guns are stolen or bought by straw purchasers right...and both of those practices are already illegal...right? There is no gun show loophole, that is a myth created by anti gun extremists, no felon can buy a gun legally from anyone.....no loophole.

 

[2aguy]

Gee, I've been pissed at my boss and I own a gun. I never shot him.
I've had it with my wife and I own a gun. I've never shot her.
I've had guys cut me off in traffic and I own a gun. I've never shot one.
I have no desire to kill anyone. And I own an AR15.
It's not the gun, idiot. It's the idiot.

Very true

The challenge is how do we keep the guns away from the idiots?
We can start with keeping them away from criminals....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of crazies....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of wife beaters...background checks

But we cant have effective licensing or background checks because the gun nuts insist on.......except for gun shows, except for private sales

We have background checks idiot. They don't work.

Especially when they don't apply to private sales or gun shows

I love it when gun nuts insist on exceptions and loopholes to the laws and then use those exceptions as proof that the laws don't work

Background checks apply to gun shows, Nutwinger. Really.
And how do you propose to stop private sales between two criminals?

Easy

If I find Rabbi has sold a gun to a criminal who should not have a weapon, I send Rabbi to jail

Yes. If he knowingly sold the gun send him to prison...but the widow...who sells her husbands gun to a relative...send her fucking ass up the river for life.......right?

 

[The Rabbi]

We have background checks idiot. They don't work.

Especially when they don't apply to private sales or gun shows

I love it when gun nuts insist on exceptions and loopholes to the laws and then use those exceptions as proof that the laws don't work

Background checks apply to gun shows, Nutwinger. Really.
And how do you propose to stop private sales between two criminals?

Easy

If I find Rabbi has sold a gun to a criminal who should not have a weapon, I send Rabbi to jail

How do you prove Rabbi knew the guy was a criminal? How do you prove Rabbi sold the gun to begin with?
See, with 1 minute's worth of thought you could have eliminated this post as stupid. This is your probloem.

Not my problem Rabbi

It is your gun....you sell to a criminal ...you go to jail

Your defeat on this one is acknowledged and accepted.
Without any effective enforcement mechanism it is just feel-goodism.

 

[2aguy]

Very true

The challenge is how do we keep the guns away from the idiots?
We can start with keeping them away from criminals....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of crazies....background checks
We can keep them out of the hands of wife beaters...background checks

But we cant have effective licensing or background checks because the gun nuts insist on.......except for gun shows, except for private sales

We have background checks idiot. They don't work.

Especially when they don't apply to private sales or gun shows

I love it when gun nuts insist on exceptions and loopholes to the laws and then use those exceptions as proof that the laws don't work

Background checks apply to gun shows, Nutwinger. Really.
And how do you propose to stop private sales between two criminals?

Easy

If I find Rabbi has sold a gun to a criminal who should not have a weapon, I send Rabbi to jail

How do you prove Rabbi knew the guy was a criminal? How do you prove Rabbi sold the gun to begin with?
See, with 1 minute's worth of thought you could have eliminated this post as stupid. This is your probloem.

Officer...he said he wasn't a felon.....or.......I didn't sell it to him, it was stolen.

All they have to do is watch any episode of crime drama where the guy calls in his car stolen after he hits someone with it....

 

[2aguy]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

Guns in the hands of law abiding people stop violent criminals, on average, 2 million times a year….so yes, we value our safety which why we use guns for protection. And those nations you praise, were less violent to begin with long before they gave up their right to self defense, in fact, Britain is 2 times as violent as the U.S., and now the other countries in Europe are importing violent people to commit the gun crimes Europeans don't do……..see Charlie Hebdo, the shootings in Denmark, Sweden, and the recent one on the train…..

Those children who were murdered were in a gun free zone, legally mandated by people like you….so the entire building was defenseless when the killer chose it. Had a staff member been armed, the guy would have committed suicide at the first sign of resistance, how d we know? Because as soon as he heard the police sirens, about 5 minutes into his killing, he killed himself.

2 milion isn't mathematically possible based on crime rates and gun ownership. Give it up already.

That is the average of the studies brain, you can lie about the numbers all you want. I posted the studies, anyone interested can see the actual numbers…and those are actual gun studies, they didn't pull the numbers out of their asses….

Your biggest study you can't prove exists. Next biggest wasnt national. And you leave off any without crazy numbers like the 108k for the ncvs.

Show how 2 million is mathematically possible.

Brain....dipshit.....the National Crime Victimization Survey is not a gun self defense study...in fact...it doesn't use the word gun in any of the questions...

And from the Daily Kos...the super left wing nut site....

The Daily Kos on why the NCVS is wrong...
Defensive Gun Use Part III - The National Crime Victimization Study

The disadvantages of this study design are:
1) the study is not specifically designed to measure DGUs;

2) the study does not track every type of crime;

3) the study does not ask every interviewee about episodes of DGU;

4) interviewees are not specifically asked about defending themselves with a gun;

5) follow-up studies have demonstrated that the incidence of assault (and especially assaults by relatives and non-strangers) in the NCVS is under-reported, and if crime is under-reported then so too will DGUs be under-reported;

6) respondents’ anonymity is not preserved, and some interviewees may therefore feel wary or unwilling to discuss gun use with federal government employees.

 

[2aguy]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

Yes, Comrade Big Guy, we want guns because we don't care about being safe. Thank you for that significant contribution to the discussion

30,000 gun deaths a year is not keeping us safe

The rest of the civilized world shudders at our murder rate, massacres and assasinations

We just lookat the numbers and smirk

Liar…….there are only 8,454 gun murders, 505 accidental gun deaths, and the rest are suicides….you assholes have to add suicides into the mix just to get your number up.

Of course, half the suicides in the country happened without guns….so if we didn't have guns those people would simply use the same method as the other half….

And countries, Japan, China, South Korea, with almost 0 civilian gun ownership have 2 times the rate of suicide as we do……

The number one method of suicide around the world…hanging….



Don't worry, I shudder to think that the most civilized countries in the world rounded up and murdered 12 million innocent men, women, and children in death camps….and they were disarmed.

And only a little over 200 criminals shot and killed. Sounds more anti people than anti crime.

Law abiding people do not execute criminals, they drive them off or hold them for police unless the criminal is really stupid and presses the attack, then they get shot...and out of 2 million defensive uses of guns, on average, each year.....law abiding people only have to kill about 238, and that number is a little low...

 

[Brain357]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

Guns in the hands of law abiding people stop violent criminals, on average, 2 million times a year….so yes, we value our safety which why we use guns for protection. And those nations you praise, were less violent to begin with long before they gave up their right to self defense, in fact, Britain is 2 times as violent as the U.S., and now the other countries in Europe are importing violent people to commit the gun crimes Europeans don't do……..see Charlie Hebdo, the shootings in Denmark, Sweden, and the recent one on the train…..

Those children who were murdered were in a gun free zone, legally mandated by people like you….so the entire building was defenseless when the killer chose it. Had a staff member been armed, the guy would have committed suicide at the first sign of resistance, how d we know? Because as soon as he heard the police sirens, about 5 minutes into his killing, he killed himself.

2 milion isn't mathematically possible based on crime rates and gun ownership. Give it up already.

That is the average of the studies brain, you can lie about the numbers all you want. I posted the studies, anyone interested can see the actual numbers…and those are actual gun studies, they didn't pull the numbers out of their asses….

Your biggest study you can't prove exists. Next biggest wasnt national. And you leave off any without crazy numbers like the 108k for the ncvs.

Show how 2 million is mathematically possible.

Brain....dipshit.....the National Crime Victimization Survey is not a gun self defense study...in fact...it doesn't use the word gun in any of the questions...

And from the Daily Kos...the super left wing nut site....

The Daily Kos on why the NCVS is wrong...
Defensive Gun Use Part III - The National Crime Victimization Study

The disadvantages of this study design are:
1) the study is not specifically designed to measure DGUs;

2) the study does not track every type of crime;

3) the study does not ask every interviewee about episodes of DGU;

4) interviewees are not specifically asked about defending themselves with a gun;

5) follow-up studies have demonstrated that the incidence of assault (and especially assaults by relatives and non-strangers) in the NCVS is under-reported, and if crime is under-reported then so too will DGUs be under-reported;

6) respondents’ anonymity is not preserved, and some interviewees may therefore feel wary or unwilling to discuss gun use with federal government employees.

It is a crime study. You need a crime for a LEGAL dgu. That might be the problem with your surveys.

I can show 108k is mathematically possible. Let's see you show your 2 million is possible.

 

[Brain357]

Lets face it....we cherish our guns more than we cherish our safety

With 300 million guns out there, there is not much we can do. We love our guns and have grown up looking at guns as a solution to our problems. Our heroes all used guns to shoot up the bad guys and save the day. We have our gun fantasies about facing down a bad guy and blowing him away

So, in order to maintain our fantasies we are willing to put up with 30,000 gun deaths a year. We are willing to have a murder rate four or five times that of other industrialized countries. We are willing to watch a news reporter assasinated on live TV, watch as a racist slaughters nine people praying.....shit, we even did nothing when twenty first graders were slaughtered

This is America and this is the life we have chosen

Yes, Comrade Big Guy, we want guns because we don't care about being safe. Thank you for that significant contribution to the discussion

30,000 gun deaths a year is not keeping us safe

The rest of the civilized world shudders at our murder rate, massacres and assasinations

We just lookat the numbers and smirk

Liar…….there are only 8,454 gun murders, 505 accidental gun deaths, and the rest are suicides….you assholes have to add suicides into the mix just to get your number up.

Of course, half the suicides in the country happened without guns….so if we didn't have guns those people would simply use the same method as the other half….

And countries, Japan, China, South Korea, with almost 0 civilian gun ownership have 2 times the rate of suicide as we do……

The number one method of suicide around the world…hanging….



Don't worry, I shudder to think that the most civilized countries in the world rounded up and murdered 12 million innocent men, women, and children in death camps….and they were disarmed.

And only a little over 200 criminals shot and killed. Sounds more anti people than anti crime.

Law abiding people do not execute criminals, they drive them off or hold them for police unless the criminal is really stupid and presses the attack, then they get shot...and out of 2 million defensive uses of guns, on average, each year.....law abiding people only have to kill about 238, and that number is a little low...

Yes I wouldn't call 100x more likely to kill yourself than a criminal anti crime.

 

[2aguy]

Guns in the hands of law abiding people stop violent criminals, on average, 2 million times a year….so yes, we value our safety which why we use guns for protection. And those nations you praise, were less violent to begin with long before they gave up their right to self defense, in fact, Britain is 2 times as violent as the U.S., and now the other countries in Europe are importing violent people to commit the gun crimes Europeans don't do……..see Charlie Hebdo, the shootings in Denmark, Sweden, and the recent one on the train…..

Those children who were murdered were in a gun free zone, legally mandated by people like you….so the entire building was defenseless when the killer chose it. Had a staff member been armed, the guy would have committed suicide at the first sign of resistance, how d we know? Because as soon as he heard the police sirens, about 5 minutes into his killing, he killed himself.

2 milion isn't mathematically possible based on crime rates and gun ownership. Give it up already.

That is the average of the studies brain, you can lie about the numbers all you want. I posted the studies, anyone interested can see the actual numbers…and those are actual gun studies, they didn't pull the numbers out of their asses….

Your biggest study you can't prove exists. Next biggest wasnt national. And you leave off any without crazy numbers like the 108k for the ncvs.

Show how 2 million is mathematically possible.

Brain....dipshit.....the National Crime Victimization Survey is not a gun self defense study...in fact...it doesn't use the word gun in any of the questions...

And from the Daily Kos...the super left wing nut site....

The Daily Kos on why the NCVS is wrong...
Defensive Gun Use Part III - The National Crime Victimization Study

The disadvantages of this study design are:
1) the study is not specifically designed to measure DGUs;

2) the study does not track every type of crime;

3) the study does not ask every interviewee about episodes of DGU;

4) interviewees are not specifically asked about defending themselves with a gun;

5) follow-up studies have demonstrated that the incidence of assault (and especially assaults by relatives and non-strangers) in the NCVS is under-reported, and if crime is under-reported then so too will DGUs be under-reported;

6) respondents’ anonymity is not preserved, and some interviewees may therefore feel wary or unwilling to discuss gun use with federal government employees.

It is a crime study. You need a crime for a LEGAL dgu. That might be the problem with your surveys.

I can show 108k is mathematically possible. Let's see you show your 2 million is possible.

Of course, as a lefty and an anti gun extremist you can't grasp the truth...you cite a study that isn't a gun self defense study, doesn't even ask about gun use and has all of the following flaws on top of that......

The Daily Kos on why the NCVS is wrong...
Defensive Gun Use Part III - The National Crime Victimization Study

The disadvantages of this study design are:
1) the study is not specifically designed to measure DGUs;

2) the study does not track every type of crime;

3) the study does not ask every interviewee about episodes of DGU;

4) interviewees are not specifically asked about defending themselves with a gun;

5) follow-up studies have demonstrated that the incidence of assault (and especially assaults by relatives and non-strangers) in the NCVS is under-reported, and if crime is under-reported then so too will DGUs be under-reported;

6) respondents’ anonymity is not preserved, and some interviewees may therefore feel wary or unwilling to discuss gun use with federal government employees.

 

[2aguy]

Yes, Comrade Big Guy, we want guns because we don't care about being safe. Thank you for that significant contribution to the discussion

30,000 gun deaths a year is not keeping us safe

The rest of the civilized world shudders at our murder rate, massacres and assasinations

We just lookat the numbers and smirk

Liar…….there are only 8,454 gun murders, 505 accidental gun deaths, and the rest are suicides….you assholes have to add suicides into the mix just to get your number up.

Of course, half the suicides in the country happened without guns….so if we didn't have guns those people would simply use the same method as the other half….

And countries, Japan, China, South Korea, with almost 0 civilian gun ownership have 2 times the rate of suicide as we do……

The number one method of suicide around the world…hanging….



Don't worry, I shudder to think that the most civilized countries in the world rounded up and murdered 12 million innocent men, women, and children in death camps….and they were disarmed.

And only a little over 200 criminals shot and killed. Sounds more anti people than anti crime.

Law abiding people do not execute criminals, they drive them off or hold them for police unless the criminal is really stupid and presses the attack, then they get shot...and out of 2 million defensive uses of guns, on average, each year.....law abiding people only have to kill about 238, and that number is a little low...

Yes I wouldn't call 100x more likely to kill yourself than a criminal anti crime.

And I would call law abiding people using their guns to stop or prevent crime 2 million times a year, on average really stopping crime....expecially future crime since the criminals go to jail....