How did Birth Control become a right?

[Ray From Cleveland]

Going back to birth control, why should employers have the right to pick and choose which kinds of medial care an employee should or should not receive?

As a childless employer, should I have the right to deny medical care to those employees who choose to have children?

As a vegan employer, should I have the right to deny medical care to those employees who eat meat?

As a fit employer, should I have the right to deny medical care to employees who are fat?

Why should any employer have the right to choose whether or not an employee has access to a certain kind of health care?

Because they are the ones paying for it?

What right does a government have forcing an employer to pay for specific care they may not want to pay for? That makes about as much sense as the government forcing employers to give their employees company stocks for free.

The employee pays as well, a good bit. Don't they have a say?

No, they really don't. They make their say when they accept or decline the job.

 

[Shusha]

If you're "in need" you probably made bad choices...in the real world we pay for own mistakes and bad choices...stay out of my wallet and make better choices. TA-DA!
This is simple shit for third graders.

And the real problem with this is that American culture says that the employer has the "right" to decide what choices are "bad" and therefore which should not be funded.

Not having children is "bad" so birth control should not be funded.

Having too many children is "bad" so medical care for children beyond two should not be funded.

Being fat is "bad" so medical care relating to obesity should not be funded.

Sexual relationships are "bad" so medical treatment relating to sexual relationships should not be funded.

Sports are "bad" so medical treatments relating to sports medicine should not be funded.


Again, why should the employer get to decide which decisions are "bad"?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

What right does a government have forcing an employer to pay for specific care they may not want to pay for?

That is not actually the question. The question was whether or not an employer should have the right to choose to deny specific care for things they are opposed to.

Think about what you are saying. Why should your employer have the right to deny you a specific type of care (by denying equal funding for certain types of care)? If you have a basic right to "health care" in its broadest terms, why should your employer be able to pick and choose from the health care menu? Why isn't that YOUR decision?

I'm a truck driver, and my employer provides me with a truck to do my job. I don't get to pick out which truck I want and which one I don't. He's paying for the truck, so he decides what kind of truck I am to drive

All benefits are provided at the mercy of the employer. They get to decide what benefits they will provide because they are the ones who are paying for those benefits.

But that truck has to meet certain minimum standards even then.

Also, it isn't really comparable is it? You don't put in any of your own money to the purchase of that truck do you? It's not part of your wages and compensation package? It's wholly owned by your employer and provided for your use so you can do your job.

Benefits are negotiated for, as part of the entire compensation package for your labor. When a monetary figure is attached to it it includes wages and benefits. Mercy has nothing to do with it. Now I don't know about you but part of my salary pays for my health insurance, so yes I pay for it too.

Indirectly, yes you do. You also indirectly pay for your employer matching your SS contributions and Medicare. You also indirectly pay for those sick days, holidays, vacation days. You indirectly pay for unemployment and workman's compensation insurance. Indirectly, you pay for all your employers business costs that it takes to have you as an employee.

Yes, our trucks do have to meet government standards, but that doesn't mean my employer has to provide those trucks. There are plenty of outfits that hire owner-operators where the driver owns his own truck. He pays for the repairs and maintenance. He has to replace the truck when he deems necessary.

If you don't like that comparison, take sick pay for example. We don't get sick pay at our company and my employer is not under any obligation to offer it. If you get sick, you have the option of no pay or take a vacation day if you have any left. Sick pay is a benefit that's quickly disappearing from many companies. Profit sharing is another benefit that's not readily available in most companies. It's not required that companies offer that benefit.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Being fat is "bad" so medical care relating to obesity should not be funded.

Obese patients and smokers banned from routine surgery in 'most severe ever' rationing in the NHS

 

[Shusha]

If you're "in need" you probably made bad choices...in the real world we pay for own mistakes and bad choices...stay out of my wallet and make better choices. TA-DA!
This is simple shit for third graders.

Yep. Typical American cultural bullshit. If you are in "need" you must have made a bad decision. You know, like to have a baby, which happens to have been born with cystic fibrosis or autism or a heart defect or leukemia. Or you get run over by a drunk driver. Or you are ten and get raped by your father or uncle and get pregnant. Or you get bit by your neighbor's dog. etc.

 

[Taz]

What makes you think that I want (or need) your money? So tell us, what is it that you have against contraceptives?

huh?

Well, since your taxes pay for all kinds of things that you won't personally use, what is it about contraceptives that makes you go apeshit?

it's called stopping the freebie mobile.

Not sure what that means, but wouldn't it be better to freely distribute contraceptives so that employees don't have so many unplanned pregnancies, and wouldn't that be better for the company's bottom line?

That would be fine as long as it's the employer who makes that decision and not the government.

What do you have against birth control? Health plans cover lots of things, why not bc?

 

[Dr Grump]

[
What do you have against birth control? Health plans cover lots of things, why not bc?

It's not a health issue. It is a recreational issue. Can you pay for my boat? I love fishing....

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

huh?

Well, since your taxes pay for all kinds of things that you won't personally use, what is it about contraceptives that makes you go apeshit?

it's called stopping the freebie mobile.

Not sure what that means, but wouldn't it be better to freely distribute contraceptives so that employees don't have so many unplanned pregnancies, and wouldn't that be better for the company's bottom line?

That would be fine as long as it's the employer who makes that decision and not the government.

What do you have against birth control? Health plans cover lots of things, why not bc?

I have nothing against that. I have nothing against anybody owning their own car either, but I don't think it's the responsibility of the employer to provide that car.

 

[Shusha]

It's not a health issue. It is a recreational issue. Can you pay for my boat? I love fishing....

The decision to have a child or not is absolutely a health issue. And a societal issue.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It's not a health issue. It is a recreational issue. Can you pay for my boat? I love fishing....

The decision to have a child or not is absolutely a health issue. And a societal issue.

The decision to have others pay for that birth is a social issue.

 

[BrokeLoser]

If you're "in need" you probably made bad choices...in the real world we pay for own mistakes and bad choices...stay out of my wallet and make better choices. TA-DA!
This is simple shit for third graders.

Yep. Typical American cultural bullshit. If you are in "need" you must have made a bad decision. You know, like to have a baby, which happens to have been born with cystic fibrosis or autism or a heart defect or leukemia. Or you get run over by a drunk driver. Or you are ten and get raped by your father or uncle and get pregnant. Or you get bit by your neighbor's dog. etc.

We already did this...you Libs concoct these beautiful stories and situations and use the two percentile to sell your twisted bullshit...the problem for you is, sane people aren't buying it as we consider the greater percentages of who you think "deserves" my money.
Stop being shy...Let's be honest...You really want to champion unemployed, highschool dropouts Guadalupe, Juan and their five children. You honestly believe they have a right to my money don't you?
This may be the point where you run away or conveniently "overlook" this post. Your turn.

 

[Taz]

[
What do you have against birth control? Health plans cover lots of things, why not bc?

It's not a health issue. It is a recreational issue. Can you pay for my boat? I love fishing....

Having a baby is a health issue, if the mother doesn't stay in good health, the baby suffers. And bc cost peanuts, whereas maternity leave and sick days to take care of your kid will cost at least as much as your boat, and probably more, because you sound like a cheap bastard who has his eye on a dingy.

 

[Taz]

Well, since your taxes pay for all kinds of things that you won't personally use, what is it about contraceptives that makes you go apeshit?

it's called stopping the freebie mobile.

Not sure what that means, but wouldn't it be better to freely distribute contraceptives so that employees don't have so many unplanned pregnancies, and wouldn't that be better for the company's bottom line?

That would be fine as long as it's the employer who makes that decision and not the government.

What do you have against birth control? Health plans cover lots of things, why not bc?

I have nothing against that. I have nothing against anybody owning their own car either, but I don't think it's the responsibility of the employer to provide that car.

The cost of birth control to a company is thousands of times smaller than what a pregnant, possibly single mother would. So looking at their bottom line, it makes sense to include this in your health plan. Those who object because of some make believe invisible guy in the sky are fucking retards, and their opinions should be discarded out of hand.

 

[sealybobo]

The Trump administration is rolling back the Obama-era requirement that employer-provided health insurance policies cover birth control methods at no cost to women.

According to senior officials with the Department of Health and Human Services, the goal of the new rule is to allow any company or nonprofit group to exclude the coverage for contraception if it has a religious or moral objection.

The change fulfills a promise President Trump made in May to the Catholic religious order The Little Sisters of the Poor in a ceremony in the White House Rose Garden. The nuns had sued the Obama administration over the birth control requirement.

It also sets up a fight between advocates of religious freedom and those of equal rights for women. The American Civil Liberties Union sued the Trump Administration within hours of the rule being published, claiming it violated the 14th Amendment's Equal Protection Clause, which ensures that all people receive equal protection under the law.

Longer-acting contraception, like an intrauterine device, can cost more than $1,000, says Sarah Lipton-Lubet, a vice president at the National Partnership for Women and Families. She says the new rule is a tool for discrimination against women.

"Women shouldn't be denied access to basic health care based on their employers' religious beliefs," she says. "We all have the right to our religious beliefs. But the way that this rule treats religion is really an excuse to discriminate."

In addition to the ACLU, Massachusetts Attorney General Maura Healey, and California Attorney General Javier Becerra announced they too plan to file suit opposing the new rule.

Trump Guts Requirement That Employer Health Plans Pay For Birth Control

Maybe some of you leftists can help me out here. How in the world can you say not forcing employers to provide birth control is a violation of equal protection? What's not equal about it? And how is not paying for it "denying access" to birth control? Is there some law that states you can't buy birth control for yourself, and that only your employer can buy it for you?

Who here believes that when the founders wrote the Constitution, that they had forcing employers to provide things for their employees in mind?

When our population became 353 million. When it hits 400 maybe birth control will become a requirement

 

[hadit]

A lot of people take medications that keep them alive. Where are their advocates to force everyone else to pay for that?


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[Taz]

A lot of people take medications that keep them alive. Where are their advocates to force everyone else to pay for that?


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Public medication plans are starting to happen more and more in the Western world. But here we're talking about employers who already have health plans who don't want to include birth control because they think their invisible friend will disapprove, as though that's the only strike they'd have against them for getting into a non-existant invisible paradise.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

The gov did that is who. Sure beats having abortions. I don't want to pay for prostate checks but we do.

when they wrote the constitution , we had single shot muzzle loaders, who said everyone should carry a semi auto pistol.

Want to go back to the writing of the constitution , lets do it.

Lets do it. Lets get rid of all the social programs and trim govt across the board 80 percent. Lets do it. And by the way, we'll keep the guns.

 

[Fang]

By passing legislation in the liberal media that's how. Its called propaganda, can't muster the support of the American people, can't get actual laws passed, then use propaganda in the schools and media to faux pass it.

I get that. What I don't get is how anybody can file a lawsuit over it. Employers provide (or should be allowed to provide) whatever benefits they desire. No government should force any industry to provide anything but a safe workplace and reasonable demands of an employee.

What's even more disturbing is that some liberal court will actually rule employees have the right to free birth control by their employers.

Who gave the white men in the house, (the GOP) the right to decide when human life begins?

Who gave you the right to murder that life?

 

[Penelope]

By passing legislation in the liberal media that's how. Its called propaganda, can't muster the support of the American people, can't get actual laws passed, then use propaganda in the schools and media to faux pass it.

I get that. What I don't get is how anybody can file a lawsuit over it. Employers provide (or should be allowed to provide) whatever benefits they desire. No government should force any industry to provide anything but a safe workplace and reasonable demands of an employee.

What's even more disturbing is that some liberal court will actually rule employees have the right to free birth control by their employers.

Who gave the white men in the house, (the GOP) the right to decide when human life begins?

Who gave you the right to murder that life?

Answer the question, who gave white GOP men in the House the right to decide when a life is viable??

 

[Penelope]

The gov did that is who. Sure beats having abortions. I don't want to pay for prostate checks but we do.

when they wrote the constitution , we had single shot muzzle loaders, who said everyone should carry a semi auto pistol.

Want to go back to the writing of the constitution , lets do it.

Lets do it. Lets get rid of all the social programs and trim govt across the board 80 percent. Lets do it. And by the way, we'll keep the guns.

No you have to go back to the guns at the time before the constitution.