How do the non-spiritual explain it?

[Hollie]

Life comes from organic organisms. There are a number of pathways that science has discovered whereby the elements of life that are abundant in the universe could spark life.

Identify how your gawds suddenly *poofed* life into existence.

organic chemicals are not organic organisms.....if it is an organism it is already alive.....organic chemicals are called the building blocks of life....they are never called the builders of life.......

Your Sunday school lessons are a poor substitute for formal biology classes.

and your posts are a poor substitute for debate......do you deny that an organism is already alive?.....

Your posts are a poor representation of a thinking human. Nowhere does "the gawds did it" answer anything.

do you deny that an organism is already alive......

I deny you're capable of even pretending to be a thinking human.

 

[Boss]

Where are these "immutable facts of a find tuned universe".

You're getting quite desperate, bossy. Your "because I say so", arguments have that odor of desperation that defines the arguments of the hyper-religious.

*sigh* How many times do I need to post these?

Coupling constant for the strong nuclear force.
Cosmological constant, which acts to accelerate the expansion of the universe.
The initial density of the universe relative to the critical density.
Universal gravitational constant.
Mass of a proton relative to the mass of a neutron.
Fine structure constant.
Speed of light.

Those are the main ones, there are about 30 more. If the physical universe had not hit the lotto on these, nailing the one in a trillion, trillion, trillion, trillion value it needed on each one precisely, the physical universe could not, and would not exist.

*sigh*

How many more times are you going to fail in your attempts to use natural forces as a blanket "pwoof" for your gawds?

It really is a desperate and dishonest tactic to suggest that completely natural phenomenon somehow prove your spirit realms.

Well maybe that has something to do with your insisting that spiritual nature is supernatural? The forces of nature are finely tuned, that is our debate here. Regardless of a God or the nature of spiritual nature, the forces of physical nature are finely tuned or physical nature couldn't exist.

I'm not trying to prove my spirit realms, you don't have to believe spiritual nature exists. Your point is proven, so why are you still arguing? I can't show you physical proof of spiritual things. I won't be able to do that tomorrow or the next day. Physical science doesn't understand how to examine or observe spiritual nature, just like it doesn't understand the finely tuned universe, dark matter and dark energy, what's inside of a black hole, how quantum entanglement works, what gravity is!

Actually, it is you who has configured your religion of spirit realms as supernatural. It's convenient that you configured your new fangled religion be exempt from investigation by rational science but that's typical for all religions. You just copied the template in the creation of your Religion of Magical Spirit Realms.

And no, science, at least legitimate science doesn't buy in to the religious fundamentalist conception of your gawdly tuned universe because it's a silly notion that is unsupportable.

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

 

[Hollie]

Where are these "immutable facts of a find tuned universe".

You're getting quite desperate, bossy. Your "because I say so", arguments have that odor of desperation that defines the arguments of the hyper-religious.

*sigh* How many times do I need to post these?

Coupling constant for the strong nuclear force.
Cosmological constant, which acts to accelerate the expansion of the universe.
The initial density of the universe relative to the critical density.
Universal gravitational constant.
Mass of a proton relative to the mass of a neutron.
Fine structure constant.
Speed of light.

Those are the main ones, there are about 30 more. If the physical universe had not hit the lotto on these, nailing the one in a trillion, trillion, trillion, trillion value it needed on each one precisely, the physical universe could not, and would not exist.

*sigh*

How many more times are you going to fail in your attempts to use natural forces as a blanket "pwoof" for your gawds?

It really is a desperate and dishonest tactic to suggest that completely natural phenomenon somehow prove your spirit realms.

Well maybe that has something to do with your insisting that spiritual nature is supernatural? The forces of nature are finely tuned, that is our debate here. Regardless of a God or the nature of spiritual nature, the forces of physical nature are finely tuned or physical nature couldn't exist.

I'm not trying to prove my spirit realms, you don't have to believe spiritual nature exists. Your point is proven, so why are you still arguing? I can't show you physical proof of spiritual things. I won't be able to do that tomorrow or the next day. Physical science doesn't understand how to examine or observe spiritual nature, just like it doesn't understand the finely tuned universe, dark matter and dark energy, what's inside of a black hole, how quantum entanglement works, what gravity is!

Actually, it is you who has configured your religion of spirit realms as supernatural. It's convenient that you configured your new fangled religion be exempt from investigation by rational science but that's typical for all religions. You just copied the template in the creation of your Religion of Magical Spirit Realms.

And no, science, at least legitimate science doesn't buy in to the religious fundamentalist conception of your gawdly tuned universe because it's a silly notion that is unsupportable.

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

In spite of your religious extremist views, no, science does not recognize your religious conception of what you call a "finely tuned universe".

You won't learn science at the iCR.

 

[edthecynic]

He actually states his idiotic non-point on the cover, BEFORE page one, in the title of the book!

The Fallacy of Fine-Tuning Why the Universe Is Not Designed for Us

Now I don't fucking know who God fine tuned the universe for. It may have been for us, it may have been because God was bored, it may have been some reason only God knows. Maybe God is just extremely fucking lucky? --My argument is the universe is finely tuned. (not by who or for what) Stenger cannot avoid this fact so he tacks on the caveat of "for us" and proceeds to give his opinion why that's not the case.

No, he says the universe is NOT fine tuned, PERIOD. You are a pathological liar.

Here is a quote:

"I have made a modest attempt to obtain some feeling for what a universe with different constants would be like. Press and Lightman (1983) have shown that the physical properties of matter, from the dimensions of atoms to the order of magnitude of the lengths of the day and year, can be estimated from the values of just four fundamental constants (this analysis is slightly different from Carr and Rees [1979 ]). Two of these constants are the strengths of the electromagnetic and strong nuclear interactions. The other two are the masses of the electron and proton. Although the neutron mass does not enter into these calculations, it would still have a limited range for there to be neutrons in stars, as discussed earlier. I find that long-lived stars that could make life more likely will occur over a wide range of these parameters. For example, if we take the electron and proton masses to be equal to their values in our universe, an electromagnetic force strength having any value greater than its value in our universe will give a stellar lifetime of more than 680 million years. The strong interaction strength does not enter into this calculation. If we had an electron mass 100,000 times lower, the proton mass could be as much as 1,000 times lower to achieve the same minimum stellar lifetime. This is hardly fine-tuning."

In NONE of his assertions is there ANY evidence. He is merely taking the constants apart with speculative analysis that can't be tested. His argument against a fine tuned universe amounts to "nuh uh, is not!"

As I correctly pointed out, he does not bother to deny these irrefutable constants. He admits these exist, he just thinks they aren't all that important in the scheme of things, but he isn't offering ANY evidence other than his opinion, as far as I can tell.

He makes statements about what "could be" if the values are different but there is not even a formula shown to see where he came to this conclusion. I don't believe he is a 'clairvoyant psychic' physicist, so where the hell are his mathematical formulas to support his theory?

If you had actually read the book as you falsely claimed, you would know he does have many formulas backing his conclusions. He completely disproves fine tuning by showing that there is a wide range of values that will produce the same result.

Again, from the previous quote:

"If we had an electron mass 100,000 times lower, the proton mass could be as much as 1,000 times lower to achieve the same minimum stellar lifetime. This is hardly fine-tuning."

 

[edthecynic]

What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

Just because you are stupid does not mean "rational science" is as stupid as you!

Nothing happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, we simply lose sight of it because its light can't escape the gravity of the black hole to reach our observational instruments. It still physically exists but is invisible to an outside observer.

 

[BreezeWood]

I can't show you physical proof of spiritual things. I won't be able to do that tomorrow or the next day. Physical science doesn't understand how to examine or observe spiritual nature, just like it doesn't understand the finely tuned universe, dark matter and dark energy, what's inside of a black hole, how quantum entanglement works, what gravity is!

.

b: I can't show you physical proof of spiritual things

.

"things"


* there is a definitive, visible distinction between the physical universe and the variably distinct Spiritual nature ...

.

 

[Boss]

*sigh* How many times do I need to post these?

Coupling constant for the strong nuclear force.
Cosmological constant, which acts to accelerate the expansion of the universe.
The initial density of the universe relative to the critical density.
Universal gravitational constant.
Mass of a proton relative to the mass of a neutron.
Fine structure constant.
Speed of light.

Those are the main ones, there are about 30 more. If the physical universe had not hit the lotto on these, nailing the one in a trillion, trillion, trillion, trillion value it needed on each one precisely, the physical universe could not, and would not exist.

*sigh*

How many more times are you going to fail in your attempts to use natural forces as a blanket "pwoof" for your gawds?

It really is a desperate and dishonest tactic to suggest that completely natural phenomenon somehow prove your spirit realms.

Well maybe that has something to do with your insisting that spiritual nature is supernatural? The forces of nature are finely tuned, that is our debate here. Regardless of a God or the nature of spiritual nature, the forces of physical nature are finely tuned or physical nature couldn't exist.

I'm not trying to prove my spirit realms, you don't have to believe spiritual nature exists. Your point is proven, so why are you still arguing? I can't show you physical proof of spiritual things. I won't be able to do that tomorrow or the next day. Physical science doesn't understand how to examine or observe spiritual nature, just like it doesn't understand the finely tuned universe, dark matter and dark energy, what's inside of a black hole, how quantum entanglement works, what gravity is!

Actually, it is you who has configured your religion of spirit realms as supernatural. It's convenient that you configured your new fangled religion be exempt from investigation by rational science but that's typical for all religions. You just copied the template in the creation of your Religion of Magical Spirit Realms.

And no, science, at least legitimate science doesn't buy in to the religious fundamentalist conception of your gawdly tuned universe because it's a silly notion that is unsupportable.

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

In spite of your religious extremist views, no, science does not recognize your religious conception of what you call a "finely tuned universe".

You won't learn science at the iCR.

Science doesn't recognize ANY religious concept, that's why I don't talk about them when I am presenting scientific facts like the fine tuned universe.

 

[Boss]

He actually states his idiotic non-point on the cover, BEFORE page one, in the title of the book!

The Fallacy of Fine-Tuning Why the Universe Is Not Designed for Us

Now I don't fucking know who God fine tuned the universe for. It may have been for us, it may have been because God was bored, it may have been some reason only God knows. Maybe God is just extremely fucking lucky? --My argument is the universe is finely tuned. (not by who or for what) Stenger cannot avoid this fact so he tacks on the caveat of "for us" and proceeds to give his opinion why that's not the case.

No, he says the universe is NOT fine tuned, PERIOD. You are a pathological liar.

Here is a quote:

"I have made a modest attempt to obtain some feeling for what a universe with different constants would be like. Press and Lightman (1983) have shown that the physical properties of matter, from the dimensions of atoms to the order of magnitude of the lengths of the day and year, can be estimated from the values of just four fundamental constants (this analysis is slightly different from Carr and Rees [1979 ]). Two of these constants are the strengths of the electromagnetic and strong nuclear interactions. The other two are the masses of the electron and proton. Although the neutron mass does not enter into these calculations, it would still have a limited range for there to be neutrons in stars, as discussed earlier. I find that long-lived stars that could make life more likely will occur over a wide range of these parameters. For example, if we take the electron and proton masses to be equal to their values in our universe, an electromagnetic force strength having any value greater than its value in our universe will give a stellar lifetime of more than 680 million years. The strong interaction strength does not enter into this calculation. If we had an electron mass 100,000 times lower, the proton mass could be as much as 1,000 times lower to achieve the same minimum stellar lifetime. This is hardly fine-tuning."

In NONE of his assertions is there ANY evidence. He is merely taking the constants apart with speculative analysis that can't be tested. His argument against a fine tuned universe amounts to "nuh uh, is not!"

As I correctly pointed out, he does not bother to deny these irrefutable constants. He admits these exist, he just thinks they aren't all that important in the scheme of things, but he isn't offering ANY evidence other than his opinion, as far as I can tell.

He makes statements about what "could be" if the values are different but there is not even a formula shown to see where he came to this conclusion. I don't believe he is a 'clairvoyant psychic' physicist, so where the hell are his mathematical formulas to support his theory?

If you had actually read the book as you falsely claimed, you would know he does have many formulas backing his conclusions. He completely disproves fine tuning by showing that there is a wide range of values that will produce the same result.

Again, from the previous quote:

"If we had an electron mass 100,000 times lower, the proton mass could be as much as 1,000 times lower to achieve the same minimum stellar lifetime. This is hardly fine-tuning."

Second time you've posted it-- still no formula appearing. Should I chant?

 

[Boss]

What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

Just because you are stupid does not mean "rational science" is as stupid as you!

Nothing happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, we simply lose sight of it because its light can't escape the gravity of the black hole to reach our observational instruments. It still physically exists but is invisible to an outside observer.

First of all, my usage of "rational science" was to mock the idiot Hollie who used it first. And I am sorry, science does not know what happens beyond the event horizon. Guarantee you, it's not something simple.

I watched a documentary on black holes recently. It was on NOVA or Discovery, but they had the usual panel of talking head physicists they always have, interjecting commentary here and there. They asked them the question: What is a black hole made of? The result was stunning. Without exception, each of these science experts sat there dumbfounded, searching for something to say. They each stuttered around and finally admitted they have no idea.

See... I have a little different theory of why you can't see beyond the event horizon and it has nothing to do with gravity. While we know gravity can bend light waves, I don't believe gravity affects the speed of light or the speed of light would vary depending on presence of gravity and we all know speed of light is constant. I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

 

[Hollie]

*sigh*

How many more times are you going to fail in your attempts to use natural forces as a blanket "pwoof" for your gawds?

It really is a desperate and dishonest tactic to suggest that completely natural phenomenon somehow prove your spirit realms.

Well maybe that has something to do with your insisting that spiritual nature is supernatural? The forces of nature are finely tuned, that is our debate here. Regardless of a God or the nature of spiritual nature, the forces of physical nature are finely tuned or physical nature couldn't exist.

I'm not trying to prove my spirit realms, you don't have to believe spiritual nature exists. Your point is proven, so why are you still arguing? I can't show you physical proof of spiritual things. I won't be able to do that tomorrow or the next day. Physical science doesn't understand how to examine or observe spiritual nature, just like it doesn't understand the finely tuned universe, dark matter and dark energy, what's inside of a black hole, how quantum entanglement works, what gravity is!

Actually, it is you who has configured your religion of spirit realms as supernatural. It's convenient that you configured your new fangled religion be exempt from investigation by rational science but that's typical for all religions. You just copied the template in the creation of your Religion of Magical Spirit Realms.

And no, science, at least legitimate science doesn't buy in to the religious fundamentalist conception of your gawdly tuned universe because it's a silly notion that is unsupportable.

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

In spite of your religious extremist views, no, science does not recognize your religious conception of what you call a "finely tuned universe".

You won't learn science at the iCR.

Science doesn't recognize ANY religious concept, that's why I don't talk about them when I am presenting scientific facts like the fine tuned universe.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

You comments are literally drenched in religious connotations: the gawds you claim to have daily communications with, spirit realms, etc.

You're reciting the mantras that are spewed by the ICR. It's become as creepy as watching the kids in a Pakistani Madrassah rocking back and forth in endless recitations of religious verses. You are behaving in similar fashion with your endlessly repeated verses of some silly finely tuned universe, which doesn't exist.

 

[Hollie]

What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

Just because you are stupid does not mean "rational science" is as stupid as you!

Nothing happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, we simply lose sight of it because its light can't escape the gravity of the black hole to reach our observational instruments. It still physically exists but is invisible to an outside observer.

First of all, my usage of "rational science" was to mock the idiot Hollie who used it first. And I am sorry, science does not know what happens beyond the event horizon. Guarantee you, it's not something simple.

I watched a documentary on black holes recently. It was on NOVA or Discovery, but they had the usual panel of talking head physicists they always have, interjecting commentary here and there. They asked them the question: What is a black hole made of? The result was stunning. Without exception, each of these science experts sat there dumbfounded, searching for something to say. They each stuttered around and finally admitted they have no idea.

See... I have a little different theory of why you can't see beyond the event horizon and it has nothing to do with gravity. While we know gravity can bend light waves, I don't believe gravity affects the speed of light or the speed of light would vary depending on presence of gravity and we all know speed of light is constant. I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

Rational science is demonstrated by the scientific method. It's a logical and rational progression of ideas, theories and experimentation. It's a process of discovery which is absent in your world of religious fundamentalism wherein the world is governed by magical gawds in your version of magical spirit realms.

You ICR groupies are a strange lot.

 

[Hollie]

What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

Just because you are stupid does not mean "rational science" is as stupid as you!

Nothing happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, we simply lose sight of it because its light can't escape the gravity of the black hole to reach our observational instruments. It still physically exists but is invisible to an outside observer.

First of all, my usage of "rational science" was to mock the idiot Hollie who used it first. And I am sorry, science does not know what happens beyond the event horizon. Guarantee you, it's not something simple.

I watched a documentary on black holes recently. It was on NOVA or Discovery, but they had the usual panel of talking head physicists they always have, interjecting commentary here and there. They asked them the question: What is a black hole made of? The result was stunning. Without exception, each of these science experts sat there dumbfounded, searching for something to say. They each stuttered around and finally admitted they have no idea.

See... I have a little different theory of why you can't see beyond the event horizon and it has nothing to do with gravity. While we know gravity can bend light waves, I don't believe gravity affects the speed of light or the speed of light would vary depending on presence of gravity and we all know speed of light is constant. I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

Your event horizon theorem is interesting... in a comic book kind of way.

Is that what they teach you at the ICR Summer Fundie Fest?

 

[Boss]

Well maybe that has something to do with your insisting that spiritual nature is supernatural? The forces of nature are finely tuned, that is our debate here. Regardless of a God or the nature of spiritual nature, the forces of physical nature are finely tuned or physical nature couldn't exist.

I'm not trying to prove my spirit realms, you don't have to believe spiritual nature exists. Your point is proven, so why are you still arguing? I can't show you physical proof of spiritual things. I won't be able to do that tomorrow or the next day. Physical science doesn't understand how to examine or observe spiritual nature, just like it doesn't understand the finely tuned universe, dark matter and dark energy, what's inside of a black hole, how quantum entanglement works, what gravity is!

Actually, it is you who has configured your religion of spirit realms as supernatural. It's convenient that you configured your new fangled religion be exempt from investigation by rational science but that's typical for all religions. You just copied the template in the creation of your Religion of Magical Spirit Realms.

And no, science, at least legitimate science doesn't buy in to the religious fundamentalist conception of your gawdly tuned universe because it's a silly notion that is unsupportable.

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

In spite of your religious extremist views, no, science does not recognize your religious conception of what you call a "finely tuned universe".

You won't learn science at the iCR.

Science doesn't recognize ANY religious concept, that's why I don't talk about them when I am presenting scientific facts like the fine tuned universe.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

You comments are literally drenched in religious connotations: the gawds you claim to have daily communications with, spirit realms, etc.

You're reciting the mantras that are spewed by the ICR. It's become as creepy as watching the kids in a Pakistani Madrassah rocking back and forth in endless recitations of religious verses. You are behaving in similar fashion with your endlessly repeated verses of some silly finely tuned universe, which doesn't exist.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

Oh, I know.. I've been saying this all my life, where have you been? Why do you keep thinking I've made such a ridiculous statement? There is no scientific fact of any gawds doing anything. Or anything else spiritual, for that matter. Hell science has enough trouble establishing facts for physical science. Some would even say there are no scientific "facts."

Now-- a finely tuned universe does exist and virtually every physicist agrees it exists. Including people like Newton, Einstein and Hawking. Why or How are up for debate. Nothing is proven, no evidence exists for any solution, except something metaphysical.

 

[sealybobo]

What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

Just because you are stupid does not mean "rational science" is as stupid as you!

Nothing happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, we simply lose sight of it because its light can't escape the gravity of the black hole to reach our observational instruments. It still physically exists but is invisible to an outside observer.

First of all, my usage of "rational science" was to mock the idiot Hollie who used it first. And I am sorry, science does not know what happens beyond the event horizon. Guarantee you, it's not something simple.

I watched a documentary on black holes recently. It was on NOVA or Discovery, but they had the usual panel of talking head physicists they always have, interjecting commentary here and there. They asked them the question: What is a black hole made of? The result was stunning. Without exception, each of these science experts sat there dumbfounded, searching for something to say. They each stuttered around and finally admitted they have no idea.

See... I have a little different theory of why you can't see beyond the event horizon and it has nothing to do with gravity. While we know gravity can bend light waves, I don't believe gravity affects the speed of light or the speed of light would vary depending on presence of gravity and we all know speed of light is constant. I think the reason we cannot see beyond the event horizon is because time stops. There is no time space for the light to exist in, therefore nothing is seen.

Rational science is demonstrated by the scientific method. It's a logical and rational progression of ideas, theories and experimentation. It's a process of discovery which is absent in your world of religious fundamentalism wherein the world is governed by magical gawds in your version of magical spirit realms.

You ICR groupies are a strange lot.

And they couldnt stand it that they had no evidence so they lied and said he visited.

 

[sealybobo]

Actually, it is you who has configured your religion of spirit realms as supernatural. It's convenient that you configured your new fangled religion be exempt from investigation by rational science but that's typical for all religions. You just copied the template in the creation of your Religion of Magical Spirit Realms.

And no, science, at least legitimate science doesn't buy in to the religious fundamentalist conception of your gawdly tuned universe because it's a silly notion that is unsupportable.

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

In spite of your religious extremist views, no, science does not recognize your religious conception of what you call a "finely tuned universe".

You won't learn science at the iCR.

Science doesn't recognize ANY religious concept, that's why I don't talk about them when I am presenting scientific facts like the fine tuned universe.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

You comments are literally drenched in religious connotations: the gawds you claim to have daily communications with, spirit realms, etc.

You're reciting the mantras that are spewed by the ICR. It's become as creepy as watching the kids in a Pakistani Madrassah rocking back and forth in endless recitations of religious verses. You are behaving in similar fashion with your endlessly repeated verses of some silly finely tuned universe, which doesn't exist.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

Oh, I know.. I've been saying this all my life, where have you been? Why do you keep thinking I've made such a ridiculous statement? There is no scientific fact of any gawds doing anything. Or anything else spiritual, for that matter. Hell science has enough trouble establishing facts for physical science. Some would even say there are no scientific "facts."

Now-- a finely tuned universe does exist and virtually every physicist agrees it exists. Including people like Newton, Einstein and Hawking. Why or How are up for debate. Nothing is proven, no evidence exists for any solution, except something metaphysical.

But most theists say he came and visited. Why do you think they lied?

 

[Boss]

Rational science is demonstrated by the scientific method. It's a logical and rational progression of ideas, theories and experimentation. It's a process of discovery which is absent in your world of religious fundamentalism wherein the world is governed by magical gawds in your version of magical spirit realms.

It's also absent in the world of quantum entanglement, singularities, inside black holes, or regarding dark matter and dark energy... not to mention the everlasting question of origin of life. Oh, there are plenty of theories and ideas but all the experimentation keeps pointing to a creator. If you don't believe in a creator then it has to be magic, there's not another option.

 

[Boss]

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

In spite of your religious extremist views, no, science does not recognize your religious conception of what you call a "finely tuned universe".

You won't learn science at the iCR.

Science doesn't recognize ANY religious concept, that's why I don't talk about them when I am presenting scientific facts like the fine tuned universe.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

You comments are literally drenched in religious connotations: the gawds you claim to have daily communications with, spirit realms, etc.

You're reciting the mantras that are spewed by the ICR. It's become as creepy as watching the kids in a Pakistani Madrassah rocking back and forth in endless recitations of religious verses. You are behaving in similar fashion with your endlessly repeated verses of some silly finely tuned universe, which doesn't exist.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

Oh, I know.. I've been saying this all my life, where have you been? Why do you keep thinking I've made such a ridiculous statement? There is no scientific fact of any gawds doing anything. Or anything else spiritual, for that matter. Hell science has enough trouble establishing facts for physical science. Some would even say there are no scientific "facts."

Now-- a finely tuned universe does exist and virtually every physicist agrees it exists. Including people like Newton, Einstein and Hawking. Why or How are up for debate. Nothing is proven, no evidence exists for any solution, except something metaphysical.

But most theists say he came and visited. Why do you think they lied?

Do you have proof they lied?

 

[sealybobo]

Rational science is demonstrated by the scientific method. It's a logical and rational progression of ideas, theories and experimentation. It's a process of discovery which is absent in your world of religious fundamentalism wherein the world is governed by magical gawds in your version of magical spirit realms.

It's also absent in the world of quantum entanglement, singularities, inside black holes, or regarding dark matter and dark energy... not to mention the everlasting question of origin of life. Oh, there are plenty of theories and ideas but all the experimentation keeps pointing to a creator. If you don't believe in a creator then it has to be magic, there's not another option.

So you think the only 2 options or possible answers are a creator or magic? Lol

 

[Boss]

So you think the only 2 options or possible answers are a creator or magic? Lol

Yup!

 

[Hollie]

Actually, it is you who has configured your religion of spirit realms as supernatural. It's convenient that you configured your new fangled religion be exempt from investigation by rational science but that's typical for all religions. You just copied the template in the creation of your Religion of Magical Spirit Realms.

And no, science, at least legitimate science doesn't buy in to the religious fundamentalist conception of your gawdly tuned universe because it's a silly notion that is unsupportable.

I've not configured anything and I've repeatedly told you that I am not religious. Rational science has no explanation for a finely tuned universe but it can't deny one exists. That's okay, there are plenty of things at the subatomic level that rational science can't explain. 96% of our universe is comprised of dark energy and dark matter that our rational science can't explain. What happens when something physical crosses the event horizon of a black hole, rational science can't explain.

In spite of your religious extremist views, no, science does not recognize your religious conception of what you call a "finely tuned universe".

You won't learn science at the iCR.

Science doesn't recognize ANY religious concept, that's why I don't talk about them when I am presenting scientific facts like the fine tuned universe.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

You comments are literally drenched in religious connotations: the gawds you claim to have daily communications with, spirit realms, etc.

You're reciting the mantras that are spewed by the ICR. It's become as creepy as watching the kids in a Pakistani Madrassah rocking back and forth in endless recitations of religious verses. You are behaving in similar fashion with your endlessly repeated verses of some silly finely tuned universe, which doesn't exist.

There is no scientific fact of any gawds creating a finely tuned universe.

Oh, I know.. I've been saying this all my life, where have you been? Why do you keep thinking I've made such a ridiculous statement? There is no scientific fact of any gawds doing anything. Or anything else spiritual, for that matter. Hell science has enough trouble establishing facts for physical science. Some would even say there are no scientific "facts."

Now-- a finely tuned universe does exist and virtually every physicist agrees it exists. Including people like Newton, Einstein and Hawking. Why or How are up for debate. Nothing is proven, no evidence exists for any solution, except something metaphysical.

I wasn't aware that virtually every physicist agrees with your assigning to them your religious belief of the finely tuned universe.

Your delusions have become a pathology wherein you believe what the voices in your head are telling you.

And, just to rock your world, Hawking has never stated the universe is finely tuned. Really dude, your desperate attempts to press your fundamentalist religious agenda really is a pathology.