Idaho toddler shoots mother dead in Walmart store.

[Iceweasel]

It certainly isn't illegal to leave a gun or knife around children.

Stupid ? Yes . Illegal? No

That's reckless endangerment pretty much anywhere. Never heard of anywhere where it wasn't.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

What legislation are you proposing as a result of that 2 year old killing his mother? If your answer is nothing then you are proving my point

I would propose legislation to require unattended guns be child proofed/locked up to prevent access by children. Some sort of child proof safety should be engaged on all unattended guns when a child has access. Examples, of ways to child proof a gun would span from any sort of child safe latch on a container for the gun, such as a turn and press latch on a purse, to a bio trigger lock on the gun.

It's illegal to leave a gun, knife, explosives, poison, etc. around children.

It certainly isn't illegal to leave a gun or knife around children.

Stupid ? Yes . Illegal? No

That's reckless endangerment pretty much anywhere. Never heard of anywhere where it wasn't.[/QUOTE]


It certainly isn't . It CAN be, if the child does something with the gun they shouldn't have. that's true. But just having a gun out where a child can et used to being around them and such isn't illegal. IMO it's stupid though.

 

[Iceweasel]

Child proofing does not require making it hard to open for an adult.

It adds complexity by definition. It could slow you down, you don't know that. The simple solution would be to keep your weapon on you instead of laying around in a shopping cart. Which may not even have been legal.

Not necessarily. It only adds complexity by your particular understanding. There is no specific reason why child proofing has to add complexity or slow you down.

My particular understanding? How can you add a safety device that doesn't add complexity? Instead of blowing wind out of your ass explain it.

 

[Iceweasel]

It certainly isn't . It CAN be, if the child does something with the gun they shouldn't have. that's true. But just having a gun out where a child can et used to being around them and such isn't illegal. IMO it's stupid though.

That doesn't even make sense. There is no such law about anything like that. It doesn't matter if a child is used to it or not. The charges would happen if the kid did do something because that's how they would find out about it.

 

[Coyote]

There's no such thing as a "responsible" gun owner. One horrible incident can change a life forever.

Toddler shoots kills mother inside Idaho Walmart Local News - Home

HAYDEN, Idaho -

2-year-old boy accidentally shot and killed his mother after he reached into her purse at a northern Idaho Wal-Mart and her concealed gun fired, authorities said Tuesday.

Kootenai County sheriff's spokesman Stu Miller told The Associated Press the woman was shopping with her son and three other children. Her family had come to the area to visit relatives, he said.

The woman, whose identity was not released, had a concealed weapons permit. Miller said the young boy was left in a shopping cart, reached into the victim's purse and grabbed a small caliber handgun, which discharged one time.

The Mom was an idiot who failed to follow a very basic set of safety rules.

The problem is - people don't have to show that they are aware of safe handling of guns or anything to get a permit. There's something wrong there in my opinion.

 

[Iceweasel]

The problem is - people don't have to show that they are aware of safe handling of guns or anything to get a permit. There's something wrong there in my opinion.

People DO have to do that to drive around and they do lethally stupid shit every day. I'll bet she did know proper safety but just chose to be lazy about it. At least she won't be reproducing any more.

 

[Yurt]

howey says there are no responsible gun owners, yet, doesn't say that winterborn is an irresponsible gun owner....

typical dishonest howey frothing at the mouth

 

[Yurt]

There's no such thing as a "responsible" gun owner. One horrible incident can change a life forever.

Toddler shoots kills mother inside Idaho Walmart Local News - Home

HAYDEN, Idaho -

2-year-old boy accidentally shot and killed his mother after he reached into her purse at a northern Idaho Wal-Mart and her concealed gun fired, authorities said Tuesday.

Kootenai County sheriff's spokesman Stu Miller told The Associated Press the woman was shopping with her son and three other children. Her family had come to the area to visit relatives, he said.

The woman, whose identity was not released, had a concealed weapons permit. Miller said the young boy was left in a shopping cart, reached into the victim's purse and grabbed a small caliber handgun, which discharged one time.

The Mom was an idiot who failed to follow a very basic set of safety rules.

The problem is - people don't have to show that they are aware of safe handling of guns or anything to get a permit. There's something wrong there in my opinion.

that is not accurate for utah and a few other states i know of....

New Applicants Utah Department of Public Safety

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

Please understand that I do NOT care.

there is a compromise that can be made that both allows you to carry your penis replacement as safely as possible.

If you are not willing to make that compromise, you can just leave your gun at home.

Penis replacement? WTF? You protect yourself with your penis? No one needs to compromise with you. I can open carry my 1911 cocked if I wanted but choose not tond. I do carry cocked and locked but the thumb safety only takes a second.

You sir are an idiot, and deserve to have your weapons taken from you

 

[hazlnut]

Wow, this one even made the BBC 10pm news. Surprised no one here has posted this one yet, or are these stories so common that no one here bothers with them anymore? Or maybe I am on the wrong forum?

Idaho toddler shoots and kills his mother inside Walmart US news The Guardian

You may now proceed to slag me off, or educate me as to why so many American adults have a level of common sense like that of little children.

My heart goes out to her family.

I can't imagine the day when they have to sit the kid down and explain what happened to his mother.

 

[Yurt]

ooops, i cited utah and not idaho

 

[Vandalshandle]

The event caused me to take a serious and sober reflection on the issue of gun nuts packing heat in crowded urban type environments. I am forced to admit that this story does not, in itself, cause me to be outraged. This story is a prime example of the Darwin principle in action. Woman packs loaded automatic in her purse, almost certainly with a bullet in the chamber. Leaves purse unattended with her 2 year old, who pulls out gun and shoots her dead in the middle of a crowded Walmart. The woman was a walking time bomb. Anyone this careless would also be stupid enough to reach for a plugged in hair dryer while in a full bathtub. I would only have been really outraged if the kid had killed himself or somebody else. As for what happened to the mother. Meh.

 

[Yurt]

found idaho:

Do I have to take any classes to obtain a concealed weapons license in Idaho?

You may demonstrate familiarity with the firearm. Usually, one of the following courses is required:

1. A hunter education or hunter safety course approved by the Idaho Department of Fish and Game or a similar agency of another state;
   
   
   
2. A National Rifle Association firearms safety or training course or any National Rifle Association hunter education course;
   
   
   
3. A firearms safety or training course or class offered by a law enforcement agency, community college, college, university, or private or public school or firearms training school. You may wish to utilize instructors certified by the National Rifle Association or the Idaho State Police;
   
   
   
4. A law enforcement firearms safety or training course or class offered for security guards, investigators, special deputies, law enforcement agencies or security enforcement agencies.
   
   

A county sheriff may grant you a license without completing one of the courses if:

1. You present evidence of equivalent experience with a firearm through your participation in an organized shooting competition or military service; or
   
   
   
2. You are licensed or have been licensed to carry a firearm in Idaho or an Idaho county or city, unless the license has been revoked for cause.

http://www.ag.idaho.gov/concealedWe...ml#May I carry a weapon on my person in Idaho

 

[RKMBrown]

Child proofing does not require making it hard to open for an adult.

It adds complexity by definition. It could slow you down, you don't know that. The simple solution would be to keep your weapon on you instead of laying around in a shopping cart. Which may not even have been legal.

Not necessarily. It only adds complexity by your particular understanding. There is no specific reason why child proofing has to add complexity or slow you down.

My particular understanding? How can you add a safety device that doesn't add complexity? Instead of blowing wind out of your ass explain it.

Properties of a baby/child hand: short fingers, low strength.
Solutions drawn from requirements: use an amount of force or finger length that is beyond a typical child's capability to access the device.

A purse with a magnetic clasp on a flap, use a magnet strong enough to prevent a small child from pulling the flap open. Same purse use a push button on a strong spring for the clasp, use a pull latch with a heavy force requirement, ...

A holster for the gun with a strap ... see above ways to make it just hard enough to pull off that a child can't get it off without using a lever.

Adult too weak to out pull a baby? Ok instead of putting the latch for the purse on the outside put a hole in the top of the purse big enough for a finger, and move the latch to the inside of the purse.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

Child proofing does not require making it hard to open for an adult.

It adds complexity by definition. It could slow you down, you don't know that. The simple solution would be to keep your weapon on you instead of laying around in a shopping cart. Which may not even have been legal.

Not necessarily. It only adds complexity by your particular understanding. There is no specific reason why child proofing has to add complexity or slow you down.

My particular understanding? How can you add a safety device that doesn't add complexity? Instead of blowing wind out of your ass explain it.

Properties of a baby/child hand: short fingers, low strength.
Solutions drawn from requirements: use an amount of force or finger length that is beyond a typical child's capability to access the device.

A purse with a magnetic clasp on a flap, use a magnet strong enough to prevent a small child from pulling the flap open. Same purse use a push button on a strong spring for the clasp, use a pull latch with a heavy force requirement, ...

A holster for the gun with a strap ... see above ways to make it just hard enough to pull off that a child can't get it off without using a lever.

Adult too weak to out pull a baby? Ok instead of putting the latch for the purse on the outside put a hole in the top of the purse big enough for a finger, and move the latch to the inside of the purse.

So now the responsibility is not on the on parent, nor the gun manufacturer, but is instead on a company that makes purses.

take a look at this handgun

German-designed smart guns rerouted after cultural backlash in U.S. - The Globe and Mail

That could be on every new hand gun sold in this country.

problem solved

 

[RKMBrown]

Child proofing does not require making it hard to open for an adult.

It adds complexity by definition. It could slow you down, you don't know that. The simple solution would be to keep your weapon on you instead of laying around in a shopping cart. Which may not even have been legal.

Not necessarily. It only adds complexity by your particular understanding. There is no specific reason why child proofing has to add complexity or slow you down.

My particular understanding? How can you add a safety device that doesn't add complexity? Instead of blowing wind out of your ass explain it.

Properties of a baby/child hand: short fingers, low strength.
Solutions drawn from requirements: use an amount of force or finger length that is beyond a typical child's capability to access the device.

A purse with a magnetic clasp on a flap, use a magnet strong enough to prevent a small child from pulling the flap open. Same purse use a push button on a strong spring for the clasp, use a pull latch with a heavy force requirement, ...

A holster for the gun with a strap ... see above ways to make it just hard enough to pull off that a child can't get it off without using a lever.

Adult too weak to out pull a baby? Ok instead of putting the latch for the purse on the outside put a hole in the top of the purse big enough for a finger, and move the latch to the inside of the purse.

So now the responsibility is not on the on parent, nor the gun manufacturer, but is instead on a company that makes purses.

take a look at this handgun

German-designed smart guns rerouted after cultural backlash in U.S. - The Globe and Mail

That could be on every new hand gun sold in this country.

problem solved

Not all purses.. I was talking about an opportunity for someone to sell baby proof holsters/purses.

I'd rather have a palm print scanner or such on the gun than a proximity/rfid device.

 

[SmarterThanTheAverageBear]

It adds complexity by definition. It could slow you down, you don't know that. The simple solution would be to keep your weapon on you instead of laying around in a shopping cart. Which may not even have been legal.

Not necessarily. It only adds complexity by your particular understanding. There is no specific reason why child proofing has to add complexity or slow you down.

My particular understanding? How can you add a safety device that doesn't add complexity? Instead of blowing wind out of your ass explain it.

Properties of a baby/child hand: short fingers, low strength.
Solutions drawn from requirements: use an amount of force or finger length that is beyond a typical child's capability to access the device.

A purse with a magnetic clasp on a flap, use a magnet strong enough to prevent a small child from pulling the flap open. Same purse use a push button on a strong spring for the clasp, use a pull latch with a heavy force requirement, ...

A holster for the gun with a strap ... see above ways to make it just hard enough to pull off that a child can't get it off without using a lever.

Adult too weak to out pull a baby? Ok instead of putting the latch for the purse on the outside put a hole in the top of the purse big enough for a finger, and move the latch to the inside of the purse.

So now the responsibility is not on the on parent, nor the gun manufacturer, but is instead on a company that makes purses.

take a look at this handgun

German-designed smart guns rerouted after cultural backlash in U.S. - The Globe and Mail

That could be on every new hand gun sold in this country.

problem solved

Not all purses.. I was talking about an opportunity for someone to sell baby proof holsters/purses.

I'd rather have a palm print scanner or such on the gun than a proximity/rfid device.

I'd be fine with either. If they proved reliable; both in terms of safety and in terms of fired every time a person wanted them to.

 

[saveliberty]

I'm convinced intelligence is a constant, more guns are being sold....

 

[Coyote]

There's no such thing as a "responsible" gun owner. One horrible incident can change a life forever.

Toddler shoots kills mother inside Idaho Walmart Local News - Home

HAYDEN, Idaho -

2-year-old boy accidentally shot and killed his mother after he reached into her purse at a northern Idaho Wal-Mart and her concealed gun fired, authorities said Tuesday.

Kootenai County sheriff's spokesman Stu Miller told The Associated Press the woman was shopping with her son and three other children. Her family had come to the area to visit relatives, he said.

The woman, whose identity was not released, had a concealed weapons permit. Miller said the young boy was left in a shopping cart, reached into the victim's purse and grabbed a small caliber handgun, which discharged one time.

The Mom was an idiot who failed to follow a very basic set of safety rules.

The problem is - people don't have to show that they are aware of safe handling of guns or anything to get a permit. There's something wrong there in my opinion.

that is not accurate for utah and a few other states i know of....

New Applicants Utah Department of Public Safety

I agree - the requirements vary per state, some have no requirements whatsoever. That doesn't seem good. I don't get why we have to jump through hoops for a drivers license but in some locales anyone can get a concealed or open carry permit.

 

[Howey]

There's no such thing as a "responsible" gun owner. One horrible incident can change a life forever.

Toddler shoots kills mother inside Idaho Walmart Local News - Home

HAYDEN, Idaho -

2-year-old boy accidentally shot and killed his mother after he reached into her purse at a northern Idaho Wal-Mart and her concealed gun fired, authorities said Tuesday.

Kootenai County sheriff's spokesman Stu Miller told The Associated Press the woman was shopping with her son and three other children. Her family had come to the area to visit relatives, he said.

The woman, whose identity was not released, had a concealed weapons permit. Miller said the young boy was left in a shopping cart, reached into the victim's purse and grabbed a small caliber handgun, which discharged one time.

The Mom was an idiot who failed to follow a very basic set of safety rules.

The problem is - people don't have to show that they are aware of safe handling of guns or anything to get a permit. There's something wrong there in my opinion.

that is not accurate for utah and a few other states i know of....

New Applicants Utah Department of Public Safety

I agree - the requirements vary per state, some have no requirements whatsoever. That doesn't seem good. I don't get why we have to jump through hoops for a drivers license but in some locales anyone can get a concealed or open carry permit.

Gosh. Looks like something we should have federal regulations to well, regulate!