Zone1 If a follower of Judaism simply cannot keep Shabbat, is there a way to make amends?

[irosie91]

Just interpreting your words.

D <<< needs improvement

 

[Man of Ethics]

Surely not everyone has Saturdays off from work. Or, they absolutely must refrain from rest for any number of reasons. any practitioners (or simply those in the know) have a recourse plan if you fail to properly rest during Shabbat? Maybe fast, ask for forgiveness etc. Thank you for your time.

All observant Jews manage to keep Sabbath.

 

[Woodznutz]

Again, I am addressing you and your situation, not the exceptions you looked for and found. Has it occurred to you that even looking for exceptions speaks about how serious one is about practicing a particular faith?

I say this as a Catholic Christian who is not at all disturbed by reports that come along saying American citizens aren't going to church/practicing their faith as much? Why have people join one in church/worship of God who aren't serious? Churches/denominations will be a lot stronger once the chaff blows away.

Ask yourself: Are you chaff looking for another home? If so, you won't be any more comfortable--or welcome--in Judaism.

Shockedcandadian, I know what I truly am trying to say gently must be coming across as harsh--even cruel--and I hope you will accept my word that I am speaking hard truths out of gentle concern. I would convert to Judaism before I would ever convert to a non-Catholic Christian denomination (which I often think of as Christianity Lite). It was Jesus and the Catholic faith that deposited me into the lap of God, and I cannot turn my back on that. I am where I am by God's Holy Spirit, and I very much trust that God's Spirit will lead you (and others) as well. I am not--in any way--trying to dissuade you, just noting that isn't it the hard narrow way we should follow, not the wide, easy path? May God bless your journey.

Protestantism: Christianity without the rituals, beads, and statues.

 

[rosends]

You are wrong. Any scholar knows this

Did you have any specific point which you would try to refute or are you just going to leave it as a general dismissal without any evidence to substantiate your statement?

Fact is, I am right. Any scholar knows this. Also, any Jew who studies Judaism and knows at least biblical Hebrew. We rabbis tend to be informed about such things, and we work as and with scholars in the field.

 

[Lisa558]

Did you have any specific point which you would try to refute or are you just going to leave it as a general dismissal without any evidence to substantiate your statement?

Fact is, I am right. Any scholar knows this. Also, any Jew who studies Judaism and knows at least biblical Hebrew. We rabbis tend to be informed about such things, and we work as and with scholars in the field.

I find it quite distasteful that a Jew decides to abandon his religion, converts to Christianity, and then proceeds to tell Jews about Judaism and its followers.

 

[Cougarbear]

Did you have any specific point which you would try to refute or are you just going to leave it as a general dismissal without any evidence to substantiate your statement?

Fact is, I am right. Any scholar knows this. Also, any Jew who studies Judaism and knows at least biblical Hebrew. We rabbis tend to be informed about such things, and we work as and with scholars in the field.

I already shared the facts and the information. If you can't understand your own history, then don't blame me.

 

[rosends]

I already shared the facts and the information. If you can't understand your own history, then don't blame me.

and I already showed you it is wrong. If you want to keep your fingers in your ears so you don't hear information that undercuts your beliefs, be my guest.

 

[Cougarbear]

and I already showed you it is wrong. If you want to keep your fingers in your ears so you don't hear information that undercuts your beliefs, be my guest.

You didn’t show anything. You just said so. Show any true historical evidence that before 400 AD that the Sabbath was not lunar?

 

[rosends]

You didn’t show anything. You just said so. Show any true historical evidence that before 400 AD that the Sabbath was not lunar?

I used actual knowledge of Hebrew to inform my position. If you think that somehow I'm inventing a language as part of a conspiracy to make you look wrong, you'd be in error.

The Talmud, which dates back to well before 400 discusses the computation of the day as Saturday. How's your Aramaic?

 

[Cougarbear]

I used actual knowledge of Hebrew to inform my position. If you think that somehow I'm inventing a language as part of a conspiracy to make you look wrong, you'd be in error.

The Talmud, which dates back to well before 400 discusses the computation of the day as Saturday. How's your Aramaic?

That’s nonsense. It has nothing to do with Hebrew. It’s all about history and what calendars people used. And you just aren’t getting it either.

 

[irosie91]

All observant Jews manage to keep Sabbath.

depends upon what YOU call "keep Sabbath"----when necessary----no matter what they teach in Jelly bean school----orthodox jewish surgeons OPERATE on Saturday

You didn’t show anything. You just said so. Show any true historical evidence that before 400 AD that the Sabbath was not lunar?

the discussions of the calendar are actually in the Talmud---Hillel was a significant player. The month was always lunar---NOT the sabbath----the issues under discussion were the corrections necessary for justifying lunar and solar-----PRIOR to the development of the
Gregorian calendar

 

[AsherN]

depends upon what YOU call "keep Sabbath"----when necessary----no matter what they teach in Jelly bean school----orthodox jewish surgeons OPERATE on Saturday

the discussions of the calendar are actually in the Talmud---Hillel was a significant player. The month was always lunar---NOT the sabbath----the issues under discussion were the corrections necessary for justifying lunar and solar-----PRIOR to the development of the
Gregorian calendar

And in that the Jewish calendar is not ubique. The Chinese calendar is remarquably similar. It is a way to keep Holidays relatively close to the same time each year while still maintaining a lunar calendar.

 

[irosie91]

And in that the Jewish calendar is not ubique. The Chinese calendar is remarquably similar. It is a way to keep Holidays relatively close to the same time each year while still maintaining a lunar calendar.

yes----the history of CORRECTION between lunar months and solar calendar is fascinating------I wonder how they KNEW

 

[BreezeWood]

what possibly would be heavenly about proclaiming their day off from work to be a holy event they must honor or be punished ... if nothing else pure neuroticism.

to think they've had it wrong for thousands of years is certainly testimony for all 10 of the phony, 10 commandments ...

- what was meant to be kept holy was the judgement made by them for the creation they had just completed.

* the true meaning being completely ignored by all three - desert religions.

 

[irosie91]

what possibly would be heavenly about proclaiming their day off from work to be a holy event they must honor or be punished ... if nothing else pure neuroticism.

to think they've had it wrong for thousands of years is certainly testimony for all 10 of the phony, 10 commandments ...

- what was meant to be kept holy was the judgement made by them for the creation they had just completed.

* the true meaning being completely ignored by all three - desert religions.

they did not get it wrong----you did

 

[Cougarbear]

depends upon what YOU call "keep Sabbath"----when necessary----no matter what they teach in Jelly bean school----orthodox jewish surgeons OPERATE on Saturday

the discussions of the calendar are actually in the Talmud---Hillel was a significant player. The month was always lunar---NOT the sabbath----the issues under discussion were the corrections necessary for justifying lunar and solar-----PRIOR to the development of the
Gregorian calendar

The Sabbath was always the 7th day. But the first day started on different days each month. This, even though they would call the 1st day the 1st day, it was a different day each month. I know you can’t understand with that concrete mind mindset and linear thinking. But the rest of us get it. They followed Lunar - Solar calendar just like the article stated. If the called the days in our English some months the first day would be in a Wednesday that the 7th on a Tuesday. Get it!

 

[rosends]

That’s nonsense. It has nothing to do with Hebrew. It’s all about history and what calendars people used. And you just aren’t getting it either.

Sure it does. Words were used to explain the world and define practice. If it has nothing to do with Hebrew then why did the web page you cited try to make an argument relying on Hebrew?

 

[BreezeWood]

they did not get it wrong----you did

- as no more work was left for them to complete what they had accomplished is what the heavens deemed to be holy. and is the purpose behind the festivities, otherwise their celebration would not be warranted.

is every saturday a day of (holy) completion. a sabbath ...

then again fitting for the desert to celebrate without a purpose as they have done for centuries. for themselves.

 

[Cougarbear]

Sure it does. Words were used to explain the world and define practice. If it has nothing to do with Hebrew then why did the web page you cited try to make an argument relying on Hebrew?

If it did then then you would know that ancient Israel used lunar-solar calendaring. To continue to ignore the history is really ignorance at its core.

 

[rosends]

If it did then then you would know that ancient Israel used lunar-solar calendaring. To continue to ignore the history is really ignorance at its core.

Of course it used lunar solar calendaring -- I have already said this. You have lost track of what you are even arguing. You should try and pay more attention. Linguistically, textually and historically the solar adjusted lunar calendar included elements such as the solar week, the lunar month and the solar seasons.