If God doesn't exist...

[ding]

Why Did So Many Christians Support Slavery?

I am asking if your morals are relative, not anyone else's.

My morals are my own. What are you trying to find out?

I don't have a religion that dictates what my morals are. I make them up as I think is right. And that is an evolutionary trait. Not a religious one.

So rather than trying to trap someone into your straw-man argument, why don't you say what you think about the morality of slavery?

Is slavery moral to you? And why or why not?

I couldn't be happier for you, but that wasn't even close to explaining the inconsistency of your previous comments. Never mind.

I have given you my answer to the question you posed. And yet you stand by, and don't answer it when asked of you.

Typical religious dude...

You must have a point, otherwise you wouldn't have asked the question. So now it is back on your lap!

It's your turn.

You didn't even come close to answering it. If the answer had been a pussy, you wouldn't have even gotten a sniff of it.

Not so, I am an uncommon religious dude. But given that you have dismissed your incongruity, you are a typical atheist dude.

My point is that morals are not relative. Yours are.

 

[RWS]

Really? Would you care to go back? You sound like a real religious zealot.

Here's my answer 3 pages back, that you chose to ignore...

And btw, slavery is not moral when it comes to humans. Because we are using other humans for financial gain.

In the insect world, slavery is rampant, but it is done so for the good of the population, and is how they survive.

Humans use slavery so they can be lazy and make money, based on other people's efforts. Just like religion does.

Religion is just a colony of human slaves, donating their money and lives for the benefit of individuals who get richer and more powerful.

The problem, unlike insects, is that it is not good for the rest of the population.

There's my answer to your straw-man question. I asked you for your answer. Are you afraid to answer the question you asked?

Or did you just bite off more than you can chew?

 

[ding]

Let me explain something really simple-wise...

If the God theory never existed, and all these religions didn't pop up around him/her/it, and destroy societies and knowledge throughout history, we would probably be travelling to other star systems by now.

We would be soooooo far advanced it not for the purge of religion, and burning of knowledge.... and having to start all over again every so often...

Really kicks my ass when i think about that... the religious purges... friggin jerks!

We would probably have figured everything out by now, if not for the constant religious reboots that our crazy beliefs have caused us to do.

So get your butts back to your private faiths, and stop trying to change the world, for something that has no more evidence than Santa Claus... You're ruining it all for the future of mankind!

Geez....Louise....

Man is hardwired to worship. Therefore, he will worship something. The only choice he has in the matter is what he will worship.

You are like almost every other atheist I have met, you only see the bad that men have committed, you don't weight the good. It is not the fault of religion or God. You are literally throwing the baby out with the bathwater. You a vague rosy notion of goodness of life without out religion or belief in a Supreme Being. You don't have to imagine what the world would look like, we have ample examples of the 20th century of what a society without God looks like. Your logic is flawed to say the least.

Here is how I imagine a world without God or religion would look like... their religion would be socialism. They would worship big government and social policy. It would be based on atheism and the deification of man. It would proceed in almost all of its manifestations from the assumption that the basic principles guiding the life of the individual and of mankind in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs or primitive instincts. They would have no distinction between good and evil, no morality or any other kind of value, save pleasure. Their doctrine would be abolition of private property, abolition of family and communality or equality. They would practice moral relativity, indiscriminate indiscriminateness, multiculturalism, cultural marxism and normalization of deviance. They would be identified by an external locus of control. They would worship science but would be the first to argue against it when it did not suit their cause. They would force everyone to believe the same things and think the same way. There would be no diversity of thought, only homogenization of thought.

Here is my proof that that is what that world would look like...

"...boundless materialism; freedom from religion and religious responsibility (which under Communist regimes attains the stage of antireligious dictatorship); concentration on social structures with an allegedly scientific approach. (This last is typical of both the Age of Enlightenment and of Marxism.) It is no accident that all of communism's rhetorical vows revolve around Man (with a capital M) and his earthly happiness. At first glance it seems an ugly parallel: common traits in the thinking and way of life of today's West and today's East? But such is the logic of materialistic development.

The interrelationship is such, moreover, that the current of materialism which is farthest to the left, and is hence the most consistent, always proves to be stronger, more attractive, and victorious. Humanism which has lost its Christian heritage cannot prevail in this competition. Thus during the past centuries and especially in recent decades, as the process became more acute, the alignment of forces was as follows: Liberalism was inevitably pushed aside by radicalism, radicalism had to surrender to socialism, and socialism could not stand up to communism.

The communist regime in the East could endure and grow due to the enthusiastic support from an enormous number of Western intellectuals who (feeling the kinship!) refused to see communism's crimes, and when they no longer could do so, they tried to justify these crimes. The problem persists: In our Eastern countries, communism has suffered a complete ideological defeat; it is zero and less than zero. And yet Western intellectuals still look at it with considerable interest and empathy, and this is precisely what makes it so immensely difficult for the West to withstand the East.

I am not examining the case of a disaster brought on by a world war and the changes which it would produce in society. But as long as we wake up every morning under a peaceful sun, we must lead an everyday life. Yet there is a disaster which is already very much with us. I am referring to the calamity of an autonomous, irreligious humanistic consciousness.

It has made man the measure of all things on earth — imperfect man, who is never free of pride, self-interest, envy, vanity, and dozens of other defects. We are now paying for the mistakes which were not properly appraised at the beginning of the journey. On the way from the Renaissance to our days we have enriched our experience, but we have lost the concept of a Supreme Complete Entity which used to restrain our passions and our irresponsibility.

We have placed too much hope in politics and social reforms, only to find out that we were being deprived of our most precious possession: our spiritual life. It is trampled by the party mob in the East, by the commercial one in the West. This is the essence of the crisis: the split in the world is less terrifying than the similarity of the disease afflicting its main sections.

If, as claimed by humanism, man were born only to be happy, he would not be born to die. Since his body is doomed to death, his task on earth evidently must be more spiritual: not a total engrossment in everyday life, not the search for the best ways to obtain material goods and then their carefree consumption. It has to be the fulfillment of a permanent, earnest duty so that one's life journey may become above all an experience of moral growth: to leave life a better human being than one started it.

It is imperative to reappraise the scale of the usual human values; its present incorrectness is astounding. It is not possible that assessment of the President's performance should be reduced to the question of how much money one makes or to the availability of gasoline. Only by the voluntary nurturing in ourselves of freely accepted and serene self-restraint can mankind rise above the world stream of materialism.

Today it would be retrogressive to hold on to the ossified formulas of the Enlightenment. Such social dogmatism leaves us helpless before the trials of our times.

Even if we are spared destruction by war, life will have to change in order not to perish on its own. We cannot avoid reassessing the fundamental definitions of human life and society. Is it true that man is above everything? Is there no Superior Spirit above him? Is it right that man's life and society's activities should be ruled by material expansion above all? Is it permissible to promote such expansion to the detriment of our integral spiritual life?

If the world has not approached its end, it has reached a major watershed in history, equal in importance to the turn from the Middle Ages to the Renaissance. It will demand from us a spiritual blaze; we shall have to rise to a new height of vision, to a new level of life, where our physical nature will not be cursed, as in the Middle Ages, but even more importantly, our spiritual being will not be trampled upon, as in the Modern Era.

The ascension is similar to climbing onto the next anthropological stage. No one on earth has any other way left but — upward." Solzhenitsyn

 

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Is slavery moral to you? And why or why not?

I did answer your question, dickweed. You were too stupid to understand it. Slavery is not moral. Slavery has never been moral. Slavery will never be moral. That's what absolute morals look like. None of your what's best for the population bullshit. That's Marxists shit right there, comrade.

 

[RWS]

LOL! What does "God" think about your use of curses?

Is that approved? Actually it's probably suggested. So if you're ok with curses, I will have a field day with you going forward....

You go against your religion, in your morals about slavery...

 

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Because it's gonna happen again.

We'll have taken 1 step forward, and 1000 steps back.

And it's going to be because of religion. Again.

Again I will say that your vague rosy notion of goodness is total bullshit. You only see the bad and none of the good. By any objective measure, religion has been a force for good. Furthermore, your supposed utopia has already been tried and failed, but hey, they only murdered 200 million people in the 20th century, so maybe we should give that another try.

 

[ding]

Really? Would you care to go back? You sound like a real religious zealot.

Here's my answer 3 pages back, that you chose to ignore...

And btw, slavery is not moral when it comes to humans. Because we are using other humans for financial gain.

In the insect world, slavery is rampant, but it is done so for the good of the population, and is how they survive.

Humans use slavery so they can be lazy and make money, based on other people's efforts. Just like religion does.

Religion is just a colony of human slaves, donating their money and lives for the benefit of individuals who get richer and more powerful.

The problem, unlike insects, is that it is not good for the rest of the population.

There's my answer to your straw-man question. I asked you for your answer. Are you afraid to answer the question you asked?

Or did you just bite off more than you can chew?

Stop flattering yourself. Your answer sounds like something Karl Marx would have written. Let me say this again because you seem to be too stupid to understand... your answer was a textbook example of what moral relativity is. If there was a picture next to it in the dictionary, they would have your picture there. Moral relativity is a cornerstone of communism where every single proclamation begins with Man with a capital "M." Your bullshit deification of man and man's earthly happiness is exactly that... bullshit. It was for good reason that Karl Marx said that communism is naturalized humanism.

 

[ding]

LOL! What does "God" think about your use of curses?

Is that approved? Actually it's probably suggested. So if you're ok with curses, I will have a field day with you going forward....

You go against your religion, in your morals about slavery...

He thinks it is Ok when I am dealing with dumbfucks who are too stupid to recognize that the utopia they are asking for has already been tried.

 

[RWS]

Wow, who put salt in your Cheerios this morning?

Do you realize the bullshit you're saying?

Do you realize that people like me think you're the #1 problem in this world? You just believe something and are willing to kill and die for it. Because you were born into that religion!!!

What if you were born into a different religion? Huh? Wow, what if you were born into Hinduism? Would you still argue Christian bullshit? Or would you be arguing Hindu bullshit?

Your belief in your religion is rooted as far as your parents. It is not because it is true. It is because you were brainwashed from birth... you ignorant slut...

 

[ding]

Wow, who put salt in your Cheerios this morning?

Do you realize the bullshit you're saying?

Do you realize that people like me think you're the #1 problem in this world? You just believe something and are willing to kill and die for it. Because you were born into that religion!!!

What if you were born into a different religion? Huh? Wow, what if you were born into Hinduism? Would you still argue Christian bullshit? Or would you be arguing Hindu bullshit?

Your belief in your religion is rooted as far as your parents. It is not because it is true. It is because you were brainwashed from birth... you ignorant slut...

Your militant atheist buddies last night. I'm not playing let's have fun with the believer bullshit anymore.

Of course I realize that is what you believe. Do you realize that I believe that dipshits who imagine a world without religion are idiots because that has already been tried and that reason and logic tell us that freedom and liberty cannot exist without virtue and morality and that religion is how that is taught because if we leave that up to the government we are royally fucked.

Can you show me where I have argued Christianity in all of this?

 

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George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796

“Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports...In vain would that man claim the tribute of patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens...”

The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

 

[ding]

George Washington
Farewell Address, Sept 17, 1796

“…And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion...reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.”

The Will of the People: Readings in American Democracy (Chicago: Great Books Foundation, 2001), 38.

 

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Alexander Solzhenitsyn

“More than half a century ago, while I was still a child, I recall hearing a number of older people offer the following explanation for the great disasters that had befallen Russia: ‘Men have forgotten God; that's why all this has happened.’” “Since then I have spent well-nigh fifty years working on the history of our Revolution; in the process I have read hundreds of books, collected hundreds of personal testimonies, and have already contributed eight volumes of my own toward the effort of clearing away the rubble left by that upheaval...But if I were asked today to formulate as concisely as possible the main cause of the ruinous Revolution that swallowed up some sixty million of our people, I could not put it more accurately than to repeat: "Men have forgotten God; that's why all this has happened.’”

“Templeton Lecture, May 10, 1983,” in The Solzhenitsyn Reader: New and Essential Writings, 1947-2005, eds. Edward E. Ericson, Jr. and Daniel J. Mahoney (Wilmington, DE: Intercollegiate Studies Institute, 2006), 577

 

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Communism is naturalized humanism. Karl Marx

The propaganda of atheism is necessary for our programs. Vladimir Lenin

 

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Throughout our nation's history, churches have done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility. Moral and civil individuals are largely governed by their own sense of right and wrong, and hence have little need for external government. This is the real reason the collectivist Left hates religion: Churches as institutions compete with the state for the people's allegiance, and many devout people put their faith in God before putting their faith in the state. Knowing this, the secularists wage an ongoing war against religion, chipping away bit by bit at our nation's Christian heritage.
Dr. Ron Paul

 

[ding]

The Khmer Rouge abolished all religion and dispersed minority groups, forbidding them to speak their languages or to practice their customs. These policies had been implemented in less severe forms for many years prior to the Khmer Rouge's taking power.

 

[RWS]

Wow, who put salt in your Cheerios this morning?

Do you realize the bullshit you're saying?

Do you realize that people like me think you're the #1 problem in this world? You just believe something and are willing to kill and die for it. Because you were born into that religion!!!

What if you were born into a different religion? Huh? Wow, what if you were born into Hinduism? Would you still argue Christian bullshit? Or would you be arguing Hindu bullshit?

Your belief in your religion is rooted as far as your parents. It is not because it is true. It is because you were brainwashed from birth... you ignorant slut...

Your militant atheist buddies last night. I'm not playing let's have fun with the believer bullshit anymore.

Of course I realize that is what you believe. Do you realize that I believe that dipshits who imagine a world without religion are idiots because that has already been tried and that reason and logic tell us that freedom and liberty cannot exist without virtue and morality and that religion is where that is taught because if we leave that up to the government we are royally fucked.

Can you show me where I have argued Christianity in all of this?

Virtue and morality is taught by religion?!?

Wow, you're seriously fucked dude. See my previous post about birth-right religion.

You're a part of the problem, and not part of any solution. You are the type we need to study so we don't do that again in the future...

Your solution is destruction. Everyone has to be like you, and since that won't happen, you have to assimilate.

Realize that there are very more possibilities in the world, and the assumptions you roll with are wrong based on science and logic. We don't want more people like you on this planet. We want people who accept others as equals regardless of personal faith.

You certainly do not qualify based on the stuff you have said...

 

[ding]

Wow, who put salt in your Cheerios this morning?

Do you realize the bullshit you're saying?

Do you realize that people like me think you're the #1 problem in this world? You just believe something and are willing to kill and die for it. Because you were born into that religion!!!

What if you were born into a different religion? Huh? Wow, what if you were born into Hinduism? Would you still argue Christian bullshit? Or would you be arguing Hindu bullshit?

Your belief in your religion is rooted as far as your parents. It is not because it is true. It is because you were brainwashed from birth... you ignorant slut...

Your militant atheist buddies last night. I'm not playing let's have fun with the believer bullshit anymore.

Of course I realize that is what you believe. Do you realize that I believe that dipshits who imagine a world without religion are idiots because that has already been tried and that reason and logic tell us that freedom and liberty cannot exist without virtue and morality and that religion is where that is taught because if we leave that up to the government we are royally fucked.

Can you show me where I have argued Christianity in all of this?

Virtue and morality is taught by religion?!?

Wow, you're seriously fucked dude. See my previous post about birth-right religion.

You're a part of the problem, and not part of any solution. You are the type we need to study so we don't do that again in the future...

Your solution is destruction. Everyone has to be like you, and since that won't happen, you have to assimilate.

Realize that there are very more possibilities in the world, and the assumptions you roll with are wrong based on science and logic. We don't want more people like you on this planet. We want people who accept others as equals regardless of personal faith.

You certainly do not qualify based on the stuff you have said...

Hey... dumbfuck... you are arguing against the Founding Fathers of freedom and liberty and agreeing with the founding fathers of communism.

 

[RWS]

Wow... you're a dumb motherfucker.

And you're drunk.

Which makes you a dumb, drunk, motherfucker... And you should not be posting stuff in that state, you fucking redneck.

Why don't you go try to find your parents somewhere in the backwoods?

And when you do, ask them what religion they are. And compare that to yours.

And see if the apple fell far from the tree.

Or if you're an original brilliant person that thinks outside of the box...

 

[ding]

Wow... you're a dumb motherfucker.

And you're drunk.

Which makes you a dumb, drunk, motherfucker... And you should not be posting stuff in that state, you fucking redneck.

Why don't you go try to find your parents?

Nope. Just tired of arguing with dumbfucks who argue against our Founding Fathers of liberty and freedom and agree with the dumbfuck fathers of communism who don't know how to look at religion objectively and have some bullshit vague and rosy notion of goodness of what life would be like without religion even though history has proven that their bullshit view of that world is completely fucked up. How's that? You want more? Keep coming back because I have all day.