If God doesn't exist...

[BreezeWood]

10/4, thanks you give me hope they may not all be the same ... history dictates otherwise, that your "loud minority" will not have it their way. think of A H (Hitler) and who he enabled.

it will be interesting the maturity of our nation and whether it will stand fast against the coming storm.

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History shows our nation has weathered storms far more severe than anything we're facing today. In fact, the old farts on this forum like myself can remember the 1960s were far worse than today's issues.

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the disparity was different in the 60's, that is what will be interesting in the coming events. I remember Nixon's epitaph, " there's little chance putting the paste back in the tube ". it will be their mission.

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[Divine Wind]

10/4, thanks you give me hope they may not all be the same ... history dictates otherwise, that your "loud minority" will not have it their way. think of A H (Hitler) and who he enabled.

it will be interesting the maturity of our nation and whether it will stand fast against the coming storm.

.

History shows our nation has weathered storms far more severe than anything we're facing today. In fact, the old farts on this forum like myself can remember the 1960s were far worse than today's issues.

.

the disparity was different in the 60's, that is what will be interesting in the coming events. I remember Nixon's epitaph, " there's little chance putting the paste back in the tube ". it will be their mission.

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That's my point. The 60s were much worse than we see today. A lot of people were dying both stateside and abroad, the threat of WWIII was real and the country was in actual turmoil, not just annoyed.

 

[BreezeWood]

10/4, thanks you give me hope they may not all be the same ... history dictates otherwise, that your "loud minority" will not have it their way. think of A H (Hitler) and who he enabled.

it will be interesting the maturity of our nation and whether it will stand fast against the coming storm.

.

History shows our nation has weathered storms far more severe than anything we're facing today. In fact, the old farts on this forum like myself can remember the 1960s were far worse than today's issues.

.

the disparity was different in the 60's, that is what will be interesting in the coming events. I remember Nixon's epitaph, " there's little chance putting the paste back in the tube ". it will be their mission.

.

That's my point. The 60s were much worse than we see today. A lot of people were dying both stateside and abroad, the threat of WWIII was real and the country was in actual turmoil, not just annoyed.

.

That's my point. The 60s were much worse than we see today. A lot of people were dying both stateside and abroad, the threat of WWIII was real and the country was in actual turmoil, not just annoyed.

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your optimism is refreshing even if misguided as the coming onslaught against women in particular may not be a concern of yours it will materially affect the lives of many people unnecessarily and directed by your "vocal minority" for some time to come. and the "annoyance" of withholding the Constitutionally mandated choice for the Supreme Court as a supplement for the religious minority by politicians is unjustified by any measure you may offer.

but I agree the demographics are forever changed by the election in 2008 and the ensuing 8 years even with the sever polarized political climate that resulted. also my posts were directed particularly at those polarized individuals though your position has decidedly altered my perspective regarding Christianity. again thanks.

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[Divine Wind]

your optimism is refreshing even if misguided as the coming onslaught against women in particular may not be a concern of yours it will materially affect the lives of many people unnecessarily and directed by your "vocal minority" for some time to come. and the "annoyance" of withholding the Constitutionally mandated choice for the Supreme Court as a supplement for the religious minority by politicians is unjustified by any measure you may offer.

but I agree the demographics are forever changed by the election in 2008 and the ensuing 8 years even with the sever polarized political climate that resulted. also my posts were directed particularly at those polarized individuals though your position has decidedly altered my perspective regarding Christianity. again thanks..

Insult all you want, claim conspiracy theories and "The END IS NEAR" all day long, but the fact remains the world is getting better even if some people only see the negative in it. Human nature hasn't changed for over tens generations, if not tens of thousands of years. Homo Sapiens see many being negative, a few being positive and some just seeing things the way they are. If you want to be in the negative crowd, go for it since it's both easy and common. I lean toward optimism but am enough of a realist to know, that certain things take time to happen.

 

[BreezeWood]

your optimism is refreshing even if misguided as the coming onslaught against women in particular may not be a concern of yours it will materially affect the lives of many people unnecessarily and directed by your "vocal minority" for some time to come. and the "annoyance" of withholding the Constitutionally mandated choice for the Supreme Court as a supplement for the religious minority by politicians is unjustified by any measure you may offer.

but I agree the demographics are forever changed by the election in 2008 and the ensuing 8 years even with the sever polarized political climate that resulted. also my posts were directed particularly at those polarized individuals though your position has decidedly altered my perspective regarding Christianity. again thanks..

Insult all you want, claim conspiracy theories and "The END IS NEAR" all day long, but the fact remains the world is getting better even if some people only see the negative in it. Human nature hasn't changed for over tens generations, if not tens of thousands of years. Homo Sapiens see many being negative, a few being positive and some just seeing things the way they are. If you want to be in the negative crowd, go for it since it's both easy and common. I lean toward optimism but am enough of a realist to know, that certain things take time to happen.

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Insult all you want, claim conspiracy theories and "The END IS NEAR" all day long, but the fact remains the world is getting better even if some people only see the negative in it. Human nature hasn't changed for over tens generations, if not tens of thousands of years. Homo Sapiens see many being negative, a few being positive and some just seeing things the way they are. If you want to be in the negative crowd, go for it since it's both easy and common. I lean toward optimism but am enough of a realist to know, that certain things take time to happen.

the followers of literary works including the biased 4th century bible have little to reward themselves for why " the world is getting better " and far more to do with why it has taken so long if not the cause of what needed to be rectified - and yes the present attempt to role back the clock will not be easy for them as the pendulum is decidedly far stronger today than at any other time in history.

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[Divine Wind]

the followers of literary works including the biased 4th century bible have little to reward themselves for why " the world is getting better " and far more to do with why it has taken so long if not the cause of what needed to be rectified - and yes the present attempt to role back the clock will not be easy for them as the pendulum is decidedly far stronger today than at any other time in history.

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Hmmmm.....not quite following your personal agenda, except the negative part, of course. Lots of Christians I know are happy and look forward to raising happy children.

 

[BreezeWood]

the followers of literary works including the biased 4th century bible have little to reward themselves for why " the world is getting better " and far more to do with why it has taken so long if not the cause of what needed to be rectified - and yes the present attempt to role back the clock will not be easy for them as the pendulum is decidedly far stronger today than at any other time in history.

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Hmmmm.....not quite following your personal agenda, except the negative part, of course. Lots of Christians I know are happy and look forward to raising happy children.

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Hmmmm.....not quite following your personal agenda, except the negative part, of course. Lots of Christians I know are happy and look forward to raising happy children.

your agenda not mine, the past obsessions of your religion and instead working for the betterment of all beings than proselytizing about a few without cause.

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[ding]

Ding is suggesting believing in God makes him a better person.

Believing in God did make me a better person.

 

[ding]

All three of them are atheists who are ashamed of admitting they are atheists so they claim to be agnostics or humanists but argue against belief in God at every turn.

Is that what you believe? I thought were smarter than that.

For one, so what if I don't believe in God? Does it make me a bad person? Am I going to hell? Why do you believe belief is important?

And I don't believe a God exists. Nothing wrong with believing that, is there? Also nothing wrong with you believing there is as long as it's not hurting anyone. I believe religion is a lie that's holding us back.

So I'm not ashamed to admit I don't believe. Calling myself an agnostic atheist means I've recognized that in order for me to know a God doesn't exist I would have to be one myself. So anyone who says they are agnostic is just admitting there is no way to know.

So in a way, if you were being honest too, you'd admit you are an agnostic theist because you don't know either.

Unless you believe a religion that claims God visited. Then you might believe God literally wrote the bible. We have members here who believe that.

Yes, I believe that you are afraid or embarrassed to unconditionally admit that you are an atheist even though all you ever do is argue against belief in God. You don't act like an agnostic atheist. You act like an atheist. You don't believe in God. Face it, you are an atheist.

Yes thank you! It's theists that make me have to admit I can't know so I can't truly be an atheist. In that sense I'm just being honest and admitting I don't know. When I say I'm an agnostic atheist I'm being nice and giving in. I'm not being stubborn or acting like I know there isn't a creator.

But everything tells me there is no God. And if there is he didn't visit. He isn't the character that visited Mary mo Jo or moses. He doesn't care if you believe and doesn't send people who don't believe Mary Jo mo or mo to hell. That I'm certain as can be

You don't act like you don't know.

You would have to be a God yourself because God could be anywhere in our universe or even outside our universe tending to his other potatoes in his garden of universes.

The point I want to make is it doesn't matter if you believe because that kind of petty God is soooo man made. If there's a god be nice and you'll have a conversation with him in the end.

Funny thing is I will confidently defend myself when I meet your God. You'll be embarrassed for jacking off not me.

And I'm not a thief murderer or liar.

Well, I've lied. 2 out of 3 ain't bad

No. You would not have to be a god yourself. You just need to be objective.

I don't believe in that kind of a petty God. That's how you see God.

Trust me, when your time comes, you will be singing a different tune. When everyone fails you and you fail yourself, you will have no where else to turn.

 

[Divine Wind]

your agenda not mine, the past obsessions of your religion and instead working for the betterment of all beings than proselytizing about a few without cause..

Now you are running from your own comments. Interesting.

Okay, let's go in this new direction you seek to go: What is my agenda and my "religion"? Please quote me where you claim I've proselytized.

 

[ding]

More links?!?

Did you take the time to read them this time, to make sure they're not falsifying your argument? I sure ain't gonna click 'em anymore...

Of course I did. I wouldn't expect you to be able stomach reading them and even if you could I wouldn't expect you to comprehend them.

But your reply is EXACTLY what Christianity did. Minus the God part... Think Puritanism and Calvinism as easy examples. I'm not promoting Socialism either, it is equally bad due to coercing people to do bad things in the name of their "God" (god being government in Socialism). And Socialists killed millions of people due to their religion in the 20th century. Just showing you that Socialism is a religion, just as bad as Christianity.

Don't be silly, Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind. You just can't be objective about it because you don't believe you can be wrong. Your righteous indignation was only made possible by the high standards established by Judea/Christianity. You are like the dog who bites the hand that feeds it. You are like the goat who believes the other pasture is greener. Path not taken. Grow up in India or China and see how you would have been treated.

But atheists are not Socialists! Geez...

Just because people are atheist/agnostic, does not make them part of mother Russia! You sound like McCarthy at his peak!

People that are atheist/agnostic simply haven't been fooled by the snake-oil salesmen that have tried to embed themselves into our psyche from birth.

We're rational people, looking at an irrational society of religious lemmings killing each other over supernatural beings, and wondering where this craziness is going to lead us...

And I don't see it leading anywhere "good" for humanity, as it stands right now. I think the Earth could definitely use an "intervention".

First of all, you are not agnostic. You are an atheist. Maybe a borderline militant atheist. Secondly, history and reason tells us the MILITANT atheism leads to communism.

 

[ding]

That "intervention" could very well be "God" popping his face onto the worldwide sky and saying "Here I am! Now you know! Believe in <insert religion here> or I will smite you all!"

That would certainly work!!

But a bit more likely would be... aliens arriving and teaching us far more advanced concepts of spirituality and the universe, before we blow ourselves up over petty lies.

You have been given the rarest gift of all. It is sad that you don't appreciate it more.

 

[BreezeWood]

your agenda not mine, the past obsessions of your religion and instead working for the betterment of all beings than proselytizing about a few without cause..

Now you are running from your own comments. Interesting.

Okay, let's go in this new direction you seek to go: What is my agenda and my "religion"? Please quote me where you claim I've proselytized.

.

Please quote me where you claim I've proselytized.

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Lots of Christians I know are happy and look forward to raising happy children.

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[Divine Wind]

your agenda not mine, the past obsessions of your religion and instead working for the betterment of all beings than proselytizing about a few without cause..

Now you are running from your own comments. Interesting.

Okay, let's go in this new direction you seek to go: What is my agenda and my "religion"? Please quote me where you claim I've proselytized.

.

Please quote me where you claim I've proselytized.

+

Lots of Christians I know are happy and look forward to raising happy children.

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LOL. Can't do it, can you? No worries. Please continue with your misconceptions.

 

[sealybobo]

Is that what you believe? I thought were smarter than that.

For one, so what if I don't believe in God? Does it make me a bad person? Am I going to hell? Why do you believe belief is important?

And I don't believe a God exists. Nothing wrong with believing that, is there? Also nothing wrong with you believing there is as long as it's not hurting anyone. I believe religion is a lie that's holding us back.

So I'm not ashamed to admit I don't believe. Calling myself an agnostic atheist means I've recognized that in order for me to know a God doesn't exist I would have to be one myself. So anyone who says they are agnostic is just admitting there is no way to know.

So in a way, if you were being honest too, you'd admit you are an agnostic theist because you don't know either.

Unless you believe a religion that claims God visited. Then you might believe God literally wrote the bible. We have members here who believe that.

Yes, I believe that you are afraid or embarrassed to unconditionally admit that you are an atheist even though all you ever do is argue against belief in God. You don't act like an agnostic atheist. You act like an atheist. You don't believe in God. Face it, you are an atheist.

Yes thank you! It's theists that make me have to admit I can't know so I can't truly be an atheist. In that sense I'm just being honest and admitting I don't know. When I say I'm an agnostic atheist I'm being nice and giving in. I'm not being stubborn or acting like I know there isn't a creator.

But everything tells me there is no God. And if there is he didn't visit. He isn't the character that visited Mary mo Jo or moses. He doesn't care if you believe and doesn't send people who don't believe Mary Jo mo or mo to hell. That I'm certain as can be

You don't act like you don't know.

You would have to be a God yourself because God could be anywhere in our universe or even outside our universe tending to his other potatoes in his garden of universes.

The point I want to make is it doesn't matter if you believe because that kind of petty God is soooo man made. If there's a god be nice and you'll have a conversation with him in the end.

Funny thing is I will confidently defend myself when I meet your God. You'll be embarrassed for jacking off not me.

And I'm not a thief murderer or liar.

Well, I've lied. 2 out of 3 ain't bad

No. You would not have to be a god yourself. You just need to be objective.

I don't believe in that kind of a petty God. That's how you see God.

Trust me, when your time comes, you will be singing a different tune. When everyone fails you and you fail yourself, you will have no where else to turn.

I've seen atheists die and I've seen how theists react to people dying. As much as I'll be afraid and want there to be a heaven, I just don't believe.

If I meet God I'll thank him for the wonderful life

 

[Divine Wind]

I've seen atheists die and I've seen how theists react to people dying. As much as I'll be afraid and want there to be a heaven, I just don't believe.

If I meet God I'll thank him for the wonderful life

How do atheists react to people dying? Soylent Green? A wood chipper and a compost pile?

Since there are about 5 Billion "theists", and that's not counting those who simply have "spiritual" beliefs of an afterlife, you're cutting a very broad brush in claiming to know what "theists" think about people dying.

What's amusing to me is that it takes the same amount of energy to "disbelieve" as it does to believe. Both are based on faith and there is no scientific test (yet!) to prove either way. IMHO, atheists are akin to a HS student working extra hard to cheat on a test in order to avoid studying for it.

The Global Religious Landscape

 

[sealybobo]

I've seen atheists die and I've seen how theists react to people dying. As much as I'll be afraid and want there to be a heaven, I just don't believe.

If I meet God I'll thank him for the wonderful life

How do atheists react to people dying? Soylent Green? A wood chipper and a compost pile?

Since there are about 5 Billion "theists", and that's not counting those who simply have "spiritual" beliefs of an afterlife, you're cutting a very broad brush in claiming to know what "theists" think about people dying.

What's amusing to me is that it takes the same amount of energy to "disbelieve" as it does to believe. Both are based on faith and there is no scientific test (yet!) to prove either way. IMHO, atheists are akin to a HS student working extra hard to cheat on a test in order to avoid studying for it.

The Global Religious Landscape

I can't help but to believe the truth is better than fiction.

Its OK you believe there's a creator. Is that all you believe? Seems benign enough.

And I'm just telling you what I believe. Can't I be passionate about what I believe? What harm am I causing telling people what I think? Are you afraid of opposing views?

 

[ding]

Yes, I believe that you are afraid or embarrassed to unconditionally admit that you are an atheist even though all you ever do is argue against belief in God. You don't act like an agnostic atheist. You act like an atheist. You don't believe in God. Face it, you are an atheist.

Yes thank you! It's theists that make me have to admit I can't know so I can't truly be an atheist. In that sense I'm just being honest and admitting I don't know. When I say I'm an agnostic atheist I'm being nice and giving in. I'm not being stubborn or acting like I know there isn't a creator.

But everything tells me there is no God. And if there is he didn't visit. He isn't the character that visited Mary mo Jo or moses. He doesn't care if you believe and doesn't send people who don't believe Mary Jo mo or mo to hell. That I'm certain as can be

You don't act like you don't know.

You would have to be a God yourself because God could be anywhere in our universe or even outside our universe tending to his other potatoes in his garden of universes.

The point I want to make is it doesn't matter if you believe because that kind of petty God is soooo man made. If there's a god be nice and you'll have a conversation with him in the end.

Funny thing is I will confidently defend myself when I meet your God. You'll be embarrassed for jacking off not me.

And I'm not a thief murderer or liar.

Well, I've lied. 2 out of 3 ain't bad

No. You would not have to be a god yourself. You just need to be objective.

I don't believe in that kind of a petty God. That's how you see God.

Trust me, when your time comes, you will be singing a different tune. When everyone fails you and you fail yourself, you will have no where else to turn.

I've seen atheists die and I've seen how theists react to people dying. As much as I'll be afraid and want there to be a heaven, I just don't believe.

If I meet God I'll thank him for the wonderful life

Is There One Sound/valid Syllogistic Argument For The Existence Of God?

Why waste your life trying to fight and argue with Almighty God?

"Do you believe in a personal God?"

Christian values

Has science proved there is no God?

How do the non-spiritual explain it?

Why do the God-haters persist?

Is There One Sound/valid Syllogistic Argument For The Existence Of God?

Is There One Sound/valid Syllogistic Argument For The Existence Of God?

Christian values

Do gods exist?

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen. For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless. Though they know God's righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them. (Romans 1:18-32 ESV)

 

[Tuatara]

Don't be silly, Christianity has been the greatest force for good in the history of mankind.

Greatest force for good??? The religion that promotes slavery, bigotry, racism, witch burnings, the crusades, the holy wars, the inquisition... I could go on. Christianity also homophobic, misogynistic, anti-scientific and anti-intellectual, it preys on the ignorant, the innocent. It encourages acceptance of truly bad things while focusing on imaginary evils. There is way to many more to list. I will acknowledge that Christianity has done some good things for some individuals but as a whole it has done more harm.

 

[Tuatara]

That "intervention" could very well be "God" popping his face onto the worldwide sky and saying "Here I am! Now you know! Believe in <insert religion here> or I will smite you all!"

That would certainly work!!

But a bit more likely would be... aliens arriving and teaching us far more advanced concepts of spirituality and the universe, before we blow ourselves up over petty lies.

You have been given the rarest gift of all. It is sad that you don't appreciate it more.

What gift is that ? Please explain?